[allap]

Well I downloaded the Apple branded X11 yesterday thinking I'd now be able to run The Gimp, OpenOffice and so on. Is X11 all I need to run these programs or do I need something else as well? I read in the OpenOffice thread that it wasn't updated for use with X11 yet so will we need an updated version of Gimp etc.. as well? (Be gentle my *nix knoledge is minimal)

Thanks.

[Scifience]

Many UNIX programs require other dependencies (such as qt, sound libraries, etc.). Use Fink (fink.sourceforge.net) to download KDE or GNOME. These will include many of the packages you need.

Also, be sure you downloaded the public beta and not the SDK (it is slightly confusing to figure out which is which, at least it was for me).

[MacGorilla]

Downloading X11 is a good start but you need more to run those programs, such as backend libraries and such.

If you are new to this, I heartily point you to fink. http://fink.sourceforge.net.

Fink downloads and installs unix packages for you. Just follow the instructions and you'll be up and running in 20 minutes.

[asmodeus]

You can also download some easily installable packages here: http://www.opendarwin.org/projects/d...rts/en/x11.php.

From Terminal.app you can also use open-x11 <command>, so you won't need to do 'setenv DISPLAY :0.0' before opening them there.

[calimehtar]

A: Not very easily.

I suppose they didn't publicize the X11 much app because if you aren't looking for it, you probably don't need it or won't know how to use it.

Fink is definitely the place to start, but expect it to take a few months getting used to the interface, environment and philosphy. You may find, as I did, that most of the gui apps available have interfaces so poorly-designed you're happier without them.

A lot of terminal apps are very handy, though. I'm constantly using find and grep in place of Sherlock, for example, because they are more straightforward and powerful.

[kman42]

Originally posted by asmodeus:

From Terminal.app you can also use open-x11 <command>, so you won't need to do 'setenv DISPLAY :0.0' before opening them there.

Can you explain this? I've just recently started learning about X11 as I've been trying to get matlab up and running. Any new info is helpful.

kman

[hudson1]

Originally posted by allap:
I read in the OpenOffice thread that it wasn't updated for use with X11 yet so will we need an updated version of Gimp etc.. as well? (Be gentle my *nix knoledge is minimal)

Thanks.

I can run OpenOffice just fine via X11. I have a feeling that what you read was that the application 'Start OpenOffice' hasn't been updated to point to X11 yet. That's just a clickable script in that in essence will launch OpenOffice without typing a command.

In the Applications menu of X11, you can add the path to OpenOffice with a title (entered under 'Name'). For me, the path (entered under 'Command') is...

/Applications/OpenOffice.org1.0.1/program/soffice

OpenOffice will launch straight from the X11 Applications menu now.

[King Bob On The Cob]

I was quite pleased with how easy that opendarwin page made it to get the gimp running. Download gtk and the fink install packages, run them, then open x11.app and in xterm run

Code:
% cd /usr/local/bin/
% ./gimp-1.2

surprisingly simple compared to some of the fink packages I've tried to do in the past. *shudder*

[asmodeus]

Originally posted by kman42:
Can you explain this? I've just recently started learning about X11 as I've been trying to get matlab up and running. Any new info is helpful.

kman

Even if you've got X11 running in the background, and are using Terminal.app, running a command like 'gimp' that requires X11 will have it complain like:

[athena:~] asmodeus% gimp

Gdk-WARNING **: locale not supported by C library

Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display:
[athena:~] asmodeus%

if you use 'setenv DISPLAY :0.0' you can then run apps by typing their command. You could put this in ~/.tcshrc I suppose.

As an alternative, you could also just type 'open-x11 gimp', which seems to function similarly to the old 'open' command.

[wreks]

I highly recommend http://www.opendarwin.org/projects/d...rts/en/x11.php over fink. I had gimp, gtk and x11 installed and open in like 5 minutes.

In prenative photoshop days when I first installed The Gimp to try out, I had to compile the darn thing under fink and futz around in the terminal, install window managers, fix fink errors, download libraries... and it took me a weekend.

Just download and install x11, gtk and the gimp packages from apple servers and opendarwin then type "/usr/local/bin/gimp-1.2" in xterm and gimp opens.

[DaGuy]

In my case, Installing Gimp was also effortless. All that is need, are some conventions on where to put things.

I'm still trying to find out where the hell the OpenMosaic installation went; assuming it worked at all. This package is also available at opendarwin.org. Anyone shares my grief? I really don't care about it that much but it would be fun to see it run.

Overall, Apple's X11 is very promising. Kudos to them, this was a most pleasant surprise. I can't get over how freaking fast it is compare to my fink X11 installation. It's that Quartz thing, I hear

[eggboons]

I can't get over how freaking fast it is compare to my fink X11 installation. It's that Quartz thing, I hear [/B]

It's fast, yup, but its pretty much the same performance as the CVS-build of XFree86 and XDarwin, which was waaay better than the official XF86 release.

[diamondsw]

Originally posted by Scifience:
Many UNIX programs require other dependencies (such as qt, sound libraries, etc.). Use Fink (fink.sourceforge.net) to download KDE or GNOME. These will include many of the packages you need.

Also, be sure you downloaded the public beta and not the SDK (it is slightly confusing to figure out which is which, at least it was for me).

Actually, you need both for fink to work with it properly. And fink will take care of dependencies - you don't need gnome or KDE unless you want them.

Fink and FinkCommander are the way to go.

[diamondsw]

Originally posted by King Bob On The Cob:
I was quite pleased with how easy that opendarwin page made it to get the gimp running. Download gtk and the fink install packages, run them, then open x11.app and in xterm run

Code:
% cd /usr/local/bin/
% ./gimp-1.2

surprisingly simple compared to some of the fink packages I've tried to do in the past. *shudder*

Or simply do:

fink install gimp

Or use Fink Commander, which lets you just click what you want and install. With binary installs I had gimp installed in under a minute.

And you don't need to cd to the directory first. You can just type:

/usr/local/bin/gimp (for OpenDarwin packages)

or

/sw/bin/gimp (for fink packages)

Or better yet, add this to your Applications menu.

[diamondsw]

Originally posted by wreks:
I highly recommend http://www.opendarwin.org/projects/d...rts/en/x11.php over fink. I had gimp, gtk and x11 installed and open in like 5 minutes.

In prenative photoshop days when I first installed The Gimp to try out, I had to compile the darn thing under fink and futz around in the terminal, install window managers, fix fink errors, download libraries... and it took me a weekend.

Just download and install x11, gtk and the gimp packages from apple servers and opendarwin then type "/usr/local/bin/gimp-1.2" in xterm and gimp opens.

And that's because you had to deal with setting up x11, not gimp. None of the problems mentioned are because of using fink to install gimp, they reflect the difficulties of getting x11 up and running at the time (which is why Apple has thankfully stepped in with their implementation).

Fink combined with FinkCommander is far more powerful and offers far more tools and updates, and is in my opinion easier - open FinkCommander, choose your package from the list, click the binary install button. Wait a minute or so (if on broadband) and you're done.

[milhous]

I'm having a problem with the gimp under Apple x11. After installing x11, I used fink to install gimp. But for some reason, ANY graphic file I try to open results in the entire image being just a black square. I have no idea what's going on. I may have to try out the opendarwin option when I get home tonight.

[engaged]

I'm having a problem with the gimp under Apple x11. After installing x11, I used fink to install gimp. But for some reason, ANY graphic file I try to open results in the entire image being just a black square. I have no idea what's going on. I may have to try out the opendarwin option when I get home tonight.

Me too. Was very pleased to get Gimp going; spent most of yesterday mucking around, but something just fell into place.

Any ideas why the black square?

[mrfrost]

Originally posted by milhous:
I'm having a problem with the gimp under Apple x11. After installing x11, I used fink to install gimp. But for some reason, ANY graphic file I try to open results in the entire image being just a black square. I have no idea what's going on. I may have to try out the opendarwin option when I get home tonight.

I have tried both the opendarwin and fink option (on 2 seperate computers) and I have the black box on both machines. I have also tried uninstalling the gtk libs and reïnstalling but it hasn't worked. If anyone finds a solution to this please post it here.

[asxless]

Originally posted by hudson1:
I can run OpenOffice just fine via X11. I have a feeling that what you read was that the application 'Start OpenOffice' hasn't been updated to point to X11 yet. That's just a clickable script in that in essence will launch OpenOffice without typing a command.

In the Applications menu of X11, you can add the path to OpenOffice with a title (entered under 'Name'). For me, the path (entered under 'Command') is...

/Applications/OpenOffice.org1.0.1/program/soffice

OpenOffice will launch straight from the X11 Applications menu now.

You are absolutely correct. OOo runs fine in X11 for MacOS X but our AppleScript launchers don't work with X11 --- yet

Drop by the OOo Testing forum for instructions on using a quick and dirty hack that allows you to both launch OOo in X 11 AND open any OOo native document via the Finder's contextual menu.

asxless in iLand

[milhous]

Originally posted by engaged:
Me too. Was very pleased to get Gimp going; spent most of yesterday mucking around, but something just fell into place.

Any ideas why the black square?

Ok, gimp is finally displaying the opened images correctly. When you're at the terminal just enter gimp and hit return. It should work, at least for me it does.

[JB72]

Mmmmm. We love it toooooo

[plonkerboy]

I am a newbie in Unix and have found it complicated to set up and run Apple X11. I have been successfull but found these traps. In particular 'Nix heads know the names of the default directories in Unix, and for us GUI dumbies all these directories are invisible (such as /usr and /etc. However this waht I did.

I installed Apple X11, using the apple installer, and started it. As far as I am able to tell it uses the quartz window manager and all is OK. There have been many posts on forums about deleting or editing the .xinitrc file, but have not been able to find it.

I installed fink 0.5a and then the latest fink commander (search www.versiontracker.com/macosx)

I used fink commander to install (for example) Abiword.

I searched for abiword in the finder.

I dragged and dropped abiword onto an open terminal window (and noted the 'path' to abiword)

In Apple X11 I went to the Applications menu and customise, then add item, double clicked under the name heading, put in 'a descriptive name' and double clicked the command field and entered the path to abiword as above, clicked done.

Now Abiword is selectable in the applications menu under Apple X11 and should launch.

There are other default applications such as x calc and xclock, use the find technique to find them and add them to the applications menu.

Good luck

[msykes]

Originally posted by Scifience:

Also, be sure you downloaded the public beta and not the SDK (it is slightly confusing to figure out which is which, at least it was for me).

:-) Yes, the link for the SDK seems more prominent than the app itself... though you might want to download both since I am under the impression the SDK contains a lot of the headers that would be useful for compiling other X based programs.

My poor dad, who is usually very computer literate emailed me wondering why his X11.app install didn't work... he had downloaded the SDK.

[Eug]

Hmmmm... I get the same black square too. I tried two different JPEGs with GIMP.

Complete Unix n00b here.

[sahara]

Several people have mentioned executing X11 apps via Applescript. I don't know the best place to post this tip, but I made a double-clickable AppleScript app with the following code for each of the X11 apps I want to launch that way:

tell application "X11" to activate
do shell script "open-x11 /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm > /dev/null 2>&1 &"

(Where /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm" is the path to the X11 application you want to execute.)

Hope this helps people.

[mrfrost]

Originally posted by sahara:
Several people have mentioned executing X11 apps via Applescript. I don't know the best place to post this tip, but I made a double-clickable AppleScript app with the following code for each of the X11 apps I want to launch that way:

tell application "X11" to activate
do shell script "open-x11 /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm > /dev/null 2>&1 &"

(Where /usr/X11R6/bin/xterm" is the path to the X11 application you want to execute.)

Hope this helps people.

Thank you for the tip sahara, it's really nice to be able to make an applescript and give it a fancy icon. Nice to have the gimp in the Dock.

Now only if the Gimp would work...bleh.

[allap]

I installed fink earlier then using fink commander tried to install xchat from source. This was 3 hours ago, and it's still installing various (dependencies?)....several hundred packages...is this normal?? It seems like it will never finish installing.

[sgrup]

Originally posted by kman42:
Can you explain this? I've just recently started learning about X11 as I've been trying to get matlab up and running. Any new info is helpful.

kman

if you've got the os x matlab then it's very easy to get it to use Apple's X11 rather than the ver of X11 it comes with - just post again if you need instructions on how to do that

s

[HiDDeN]

I thought that unix was suppose to superior, but al that extra crap makes me wonder;

[Axel]

Originally posted by HiDDeN:
I thought that unix was suppose to superior, but al that extra crap makes me wonder;

Who said that unix was superior when it comes to ease of use ?

[datkinso]

Originally posted by eggboons:
It's fast, yup, but its pretty much the same performance as the CVS-build of XFree86 and XDarwin, which was waaay better than the official XF86 release.

The Apple version allow me to copy and paste text from the x11 applications into any OS X application. In XDarwin the copy & paste functions do not work. This is a huge difference. Having a powerbook that can run x11 applications well and having the ability to move things to the OSX applications instantly has increased the utility of my computer by an couple orders of magnitude.