[undotwa]

In Mac OS 9, the Finder was treated as if it was the mother of all applications. In fact it was treated as if it wasn't an application, rather 'part of the system'.

Mac OS X takes a more liberal approach, however there still is the thinking that programs spawn off the desktop.

What would the advantages of making the Finder just a simple Cocoa browser application? Programmed like any other application, quittable. Auto-launch settings determined by Login Items. Finder placed in Applications. Finder icon movable in Dock.

Finder and Terminal applications both meriting special status like System Preferences with a place in the Apple Menu.

Finder will have the role of 'File Manager', local and network, and Safari will have the role of 'Dynamic Page Viewer', local, and network. That would define clear differences between the web browser and the file browser.

So what ideas do you have for a 'Finder Browser'? What kind of file view do you think it should have? Columns, Windows Explorer like? Should it have a 'shelf'? How should the program be implemented?

[Xeo]

Wouldn't matter to me, so long as it works. I would use it so I'd have it launch at login.

I think that idea might scare of newcomers. For example, how do you make it simple enough so that people don't freak out when their desktop disappears? What if the Finder isn't in their Dock and they quit it? Will they know enough to go to the Apple menu into recent items? You can't just navigate to it since you quit your navigation app.

There are problems with the idea but technically it would work. Hell, the Finder basically acts like that now (or it did, I'm not sure if you can still add "Quit" to the Finder menu, I haven't tried in a while). The only difference is that the Finder isn't in Applications.

[Zadian]

Originally posted by undotwa:
What would the advantages of making the Finder just a simple Cocoa browser application?

There wouldn't be any advantage.
Non-Geek Users would accidentally quit the finder be lost, or the finder crashes and doesn't restart.
You can already quit the finder in OS X and you can replace it by an other file browser.

It's the philosophy behind Mac OS, that the Finder and the Desktop seem to be part of the System - for most users they are the System.

So I think the finder should remain a special app, like it is today.

But that doesn't mean that i don't want to see some improvements in the near future.

Just open rBrowser and you will see what i want:
a shelf and stacks (multiple Items represented by one icon). OK, i want most of the things the NeXT Filemanager had.
A way to sort items in Column View.

I'm still trying to figure out how a good database front end for file system metadata could be integrated into the finder.
All ways i can imagine would be a departure from the desktop metaphor. I don't think Apple would make such a big step in the near future.

[970]

Originally posted by undotwa:
In Mac OS 9, the Finder was treated as if it was the mother of all applications. In fact it was treated as if it wasn't an application, rather 'part of the system'.

Mac OS X takes a more liberal approach, however there still is the thinking that programs spawn off the desktop.

What would the advantages of making the Finder just a simple Cocoa browser application? Programmed like any other application, quittable. Auto-launch settings determined by Login Items. Finder placed in Applications. Finder icon movable in Dock.

Finder and Terminal applications both meriting special status like System Preferences with a place in the Apple Menu.

Finder will have the role of 'File Manager', local and network, and Safari will have the role of 'Dynamic Page Viewer', local, and network. That would define clear differences between the web browser and the file browser.

So what ideas do you have for a 'Finder Browser'? What kind of file view do you think it should have? Columns, Windows Explorer like? Should it have a 'shelf'? How should the program be implemented?

These Finder characteristics like quittable, movable, and optional are all possible now under 10.2. You can replace the entire Finder just by typing in Terminal.

defaults write com.apple.loginwindow Finder '/path/to/application'

Your system will no longer start up finder after this automatically upon boot up.

The dock is also optional like the Finder and you can kill it by simply renaming it in /System/Library/CoreServices. But as I found out, it seemingly takes away the ability to have a desktop background.

I think the finder should be the designed for the most basic user, should be incredibly fast, and with the utmost convienience. It should just be a way of looking at and organizing files with the ease of use that Apple has come to provide.

[DeathMan]

I would like it if my icons didn't move around. (I think this might have something to do with the way the HD mounts, cause it seems to not always be in the same place)

I would also like it if I drag a file to the desktop from a web browser, that the file would show up 1) in the spot where I dragged it to, and 2) be visible without having to click on the desktop. These are a couple things that I'm "embarrassed" about with the finder.

The finder is a special application. It should be given more attention than it has been given.