[clarkgoble]

OK, the dog days of August are here. Threads have been kind of slow of late. i.e. nothing too interesting while we await benchmarks on the G5 that are actually meaningful.

I must admit that I've played around with Panther and am very excited. Nearly all the things I'd hoped would be there are. The Finder is now a joy to use and the best file manager of any platform.

So, now that all the various previews of Panther have been out and feature sets are basically fixed, what is still not in it? Some, we might expect in 10.3.1 or 10.3.2. Some might wait a year and a half for 10.4.


My list:

1. Meta-data We all thought it would be in 10.3 but really wasn't to any large extent. (Beyond labels) I'm still awaiting BeOS like fairly arbitrary metadata. I think a lot still think this is coming. Although HFS+ supports a lot of metadata like stuff, many think that a new file system is around the corner and that this will be included then. If so, here's hoping complex searches like BeOS or the smart playlist feature for iTune's metadata is in it.

How is the metadata useful? Well here is a screenshot of a "Finder" window in BeOs. Notice all the extra columns? Basically the Finder would have most of the features of a database. Further you could search on this and have "smart folders" the way that iTunes does. In BeOS you .jpg]could associate custom "attributes" (basically database fields or tags) with different file types.

2. Better dock/folder integration Perhaps I'm not running the right build, but dragging a folder to the dock really still isn't as nice in functionality as it ought to be. Right clicking seems to have to build everything then - nothing is buffered. Thus there is a delay if you try to have a folder of frequently used files or applications. Ideally you'd have popup folder functionality ala Sys9 for folders in the dock. Don't get me wrong. I don't see popup folders as important as a few zealots do. I'd be happy with a cached folder content in the dock for right-clicking.

3. Hierachal playlists in iTunes Probably my last remaining issue with iTunes. When you start having more than about 15 playlists, managing them becomes a tad unweldly. I'd really like to have nested playlists.

4. Better MPEG-4 handling Apple's been working on improving the guts of Quicktime, which is rather dated compared to the rest of the OS. However their MPEG-4 handling is still weak, especially for encoding files. You're far better off with 3rd party encoders. Further Quicktime plays relatively few formats. A few, like Real's formats and Microsoft's formats, we can expect left out. But there are many other formats that Apple doesn't support. I'd also like Ogg files to be in the system. It is open source software so it doesn't hurt anyone. Yeah I know you can install it yourself. But Apple really ought to make it more of a team player with Quicktime, iTunes and so forth.

5. Fix Project Builder Yes XCode is very cool, even if many of its features are "catch-up." But please, improve the debugger. I beg of you. At least make it as good as Visual Studio. The more you help your programmers the more you'll get in return.

6. Applescript support Many Apple applications have crappy Applescript support (Mail for instance). Few, if any, are recordable. Recordability makes it easy for people to create Applescripts and more importantly write them. The guts of Applescript are there and you've really improved things the past few years. Why can't you get your application teams on board?

7. Scheduler Make anacron standard and then put a nice front end on it so regular users can schedule things. Yes this is more advance than the typical user. And yes more advance users can use cron directly. But a nice Apple friendly front end would be wonderful. Windows has had this for years. And yes I know you can use Calendar for some of these things. But I think keeping it separate would be far better.

8. Backup Some standard backup programs really ought to be part of the system. Yes there are some new things Apple is adding, especially with .Mac. However a more general solution including DVDs, CDs, or tapes ought to be in order.

[blackbird_1.0]

good job, i hope you're submitting this to apple feedback?

[zachs]

Here's what I want:

- VCD support in DVD Player!
- Virtual Desktops (I know you can imitate it with fast user switching...but that requires making a bunch of users)
- Ability to update apps in SW Update that are not in the Applications folder
- Clock in login screen
- Spring-loaded folders in Dock
- "Click-and-a-half" support
- Favorites in Finder managed like Safari bookmarks
- "Arrange by:" in contextual menus
- Multiple clipboards
- Ability to set a pic as the desktop background from contextual menu
- Services in contextual menus
- "Smart folders" in Finder
- Terminal "man" pages in Help Viewer
- A public API for *real* menu extras (as opposed to non-movable Status Items)
- Customizable Apple menu
- Platinum theme for the OS 9 lovers
- WindowShade

Of course going to Apple Feedback.

[HotSoup]

^ I'd like Spring loaded folders in the dock. The rest of your features just seem useless, impractical, to unexplained and do-able with 3rd party apps.

Originally posted by blackbird_1.0:
good job, i hope you're submitting this to apple feedback?

lol, like they care They never seem to listen to most of their customers.

[Catfish_Man]

Originally posted by HotSoup:
^ I'd like Spring loaded folders in the dock. The rest of your features just seem useless, impractical, to unexplained and do-able with 3rd party apps.



lol, like they care They never seem to listen to most of their customers.

lol. 3 of my 5 top feature requests were implemented in 10.3. The 4th is impractical, and the 5th is virtual desktops, which most of their target market wouldn't understand. The eMac was designed by asking a whole bunch of educators what they needed in a comp. Now what was that about them not listening?

[arekkusu]

Originally posted by HotSoup:
lol, like they care They never seem to listen to most of their customers.

Sometime they listen... I sent feedback asking for system wide smooth scrolling, and surprise! Likewise, some of my important RADAR bugs were actually fixed, albeit 6 months later.

Sometimes they don't listen... looks like we're stuck with the stupid metal Finder... >

When in doubt, send feedback. Repeat.

[iFix Rene]

Originally posted by HotSoup:
^ I'd like Spring loaded folders in the dock. The rest of your features just seem useless, impractical, to unexplained and do-able with 3rd party apps.



lol, like they care They never seem to listen to most of their customers.

never seem to listen?
complete BS, Mac OS X contains numerous
thing derived from feedback. If you do not
realize this your head must have been in the
sand for the past years.
Apple does listen, if its a good idear yes,
and even if it's not so important...
before 10.2 came out a guy submitted feed-
back that he wanted a shadow under the
cursor.. we have it now etc etc

[JLL]

Originally posted by clarkgoble:
3. Hierachal playlists in iTunes Probably my last remaining issue with iTunes. When you start having more than about 15 playlists, managing them becomes a tad unweldly. I'd really like to have nested playlists.

iTunes is developed separately from Mac OS X.

Originally posted by clarkgoble:
Further Quicktime plays relatively few formats. A few, like Real's formats and Microsoft's formats, we can expect left out. But there are many other formats that Apple doesn't support. I'd also like Ogg files to be in the system. It is open source software so it doesn't hurt anyone. Yeah I know you can install it yourself. But Apple really ought to make it more of a team player with Quicktime, iTunes and so forth.

Developers of the formats you wish to see supported by QuickTime can make a plug-in and have it automatically downloaded and installed through QT's update functionality.

AFAIK 3IVX plans to do that when the plug-in is finished.

[clarkgoble]

Ability to update apps in SW Update that are not in the Applications folder

Is that still "broken" in Panther? I'd have thought Apple would have updated their installer by now.

"Click-and-a-half" support

What is that? I've never heard of it.

Multiple clipboards

Hmm. I'm not sure I want that standard. MS Office XP has it and it annoys me to no end. Plus I can never figure out how to turn it off and when it is annoying me I'm typically too busy to look up how. And the rest of the time I forget. Plus I now do most writing on my Mac, not my PC.

Services in contextual menu

Actually I want the ability to hide services from the service menu both on a system wide level and an application level. The service menu is very unweldly right now.

Terminal "man" pages in Help Viewer

I don't know about Help Viewer, which has had a major makeover using Safari's webcore. But you can do this with a bit of a hack using Project Builder. Personally I aliased man to manopen which is a great little GUI for man pages. But I agree, Apple's man pages kind of suck and are primitive.

Platinum theme for the OS 9 lovers

They'll never do this. You can get part way there with one of the 3rd party theme managers. But the widgets are fixed in place.


Oh a few more I noticed when looking at a page about Next. A lot of Panther features actually look like simple ports of software that was in NeXTStep but for some reason never were ported to OSX. (i.e. font handling, fax handling)

I'd love the bookshelf. Remember how it would index rtf files and came with the complete works of Shakespeare? That was, to me, the coolest thing about the original NeXT after Mathematica. (Our math department had a full lab full of NeXt workstations I used to do physics homework on) The other thing was similar. I WANT Digital Webster. Yeah I know they have Sherlock and this will probably never happen. But Sherlock is a bit too much of a pain. I just want a small window like the NeXT used to have. I have an old Sys7.5 Webster's dictionary I use occasionally. But I almost never run classic now and nothing has been ported. On my PC I have an old version of MS Bookshelf that I keep on the server's CD. It is amazingly useful and I wish something like that was available for OSX.

Addition: Someone pointed me to OmniDictionary. It doesn't quite have the nice formatting of Digital Webster but it is otherwise just what I was looking for.

[JKT]

Originally posted by clarkgoble:
[B]"Click-and-a-half" support

What is that? I've never heard of it.

In the Classic finder, if you double clicked (but held the second click, hence the half) a folder it would become spring-loaded so you could barrel down through many folder depths without leaving several windows open.

[lookmark]

Originally posted by JKT:
In the Classic finder, if you double clicked (but held the second click, hence the half) a folder it would become spring-loaded so you could barrel down through many folder depths without leaving several windows open.

Struggle your way through many folder depths, was more like it.

Click-and-a-half IMO never really caught on. It was a good attempt, but not a widely successful one. Spring-loaded folders are great when dragging and dropping files, but column view and browse-in-place leave it in the dust for speeding through hierarchies in file navigation.

[nebben123]

i'd like to see support for UDF 2.0 file systems so that the CDs from my Sony MVC-CD400 digital camera would work. come on Apple... Windows XP has supported this from the beginning!

[lookmark]

Oh, great list BTW.

re:

Services in contextual menu

Actually I want the ability to hide services from the service menu both on a system wide level and an application level. The service menu is very unweldly right now.

Totally. I'd like both actually.

In the meantime, have you tried this? Check out the bottom of the thread.

[blackbird_1.0]

i'd like to see an annual osx update w/ like at least 200 new features, a more dramatic change yearly...

I definately want to see some more next stuff in osx, along with the infamous tabbed dock that was in development for openstep...

...and some themes...at least some accnets like in OS 9...

...nested playlists would be good in itunes...

and quicktime would do good to look in itunes direction for a new interface (fullscreen would be nice too)...

and mail, if not metal, should get rid of the
side-drawer thing, and get a divide window like itunes...

[HotSoup]

Originally posted by iFix Rene:
never seem to listen?
complete BS, Mac OS X contains numerous
thing derived from feedback. If you do not
realize this your head must have been in the
sand for the past years.
Apple does listen, if its a good idear yes,
and even if it's not so important...
before 10.2 came out a guy submitted feed-
back that he wanted a shadow under the
cursor.. we have it now etc etc

Chill out. Stop spouting BS. Just because Jobs says tis' true, doesn't mean it is. I've read Applecare boards over the years and a lot of good features aren't implemented.

Just can it and stick your flames to yourself.

[Millennium]

Originally posted by HotSoup:
Chill out. Stop spouting BS. Just because Jobs says tis' true, doesn't mean it is. I've read Applecare boards over the years and a lot of good features aren't implemented.

Just because they're listening doesn't mean they'll slavishly implement every single thing they're asked to implement.

In the end, it's still Apple's operating system, and they decide what goes in and what doesn't. I don't work for Apple, but I do work for another company that gets a lot of user feedback, including feature requests. What people request, we do listen to, and we do consider implementing these things. But sometimes, we decide that the answer is no, that for any number of reasons, we won't implement a given request.

As a case in point, the infamous "piles" GUI concept. Many people ask for this in OSX, because they saw the concept on Tog's site and think it's cool. And cool it is, though it doesn't present any real advantages over folders. Just one problem: it's totally unworkable from an interface perspective. Even Tog himself, sometimes considered The God Of User Interface, hasn't managed to figure out how to present it in a way which isn't so unwieldy that it defeats its own purpose by being totally unusable. Why should Apple, which is concerned about UI issues, implement something which can't be done without harming the interface?

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by HotSoup:
Chill out. Stop spouting BS. Just because Jobs says tis' true, doesn't mean it is. I've read Applecare boards over the years and a lot of good features aren't implemented.

Just can it and stick your flames to yourself.

Do us all a favor and install the Public Beta.

Then read the numerous forum threads from the time.

Then install 10.0.

Then read the numerous forum theads from the time.

Then install 10.1.

etc.

If you're serious about what you're saying, you *can't* have be using OS X for more than about a year.

Trust me, *so* many gripes have been fixed in response to user comments over the past few years.

Among the latest was that Address Book no longer quits when you close the window. User requests were specifically mentioned in the update read me.

-s*

[jszrules]

New version of AppleWorks, already.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by HotSoup:
Chill out. Stop spouting BS. Just because Jobs says tis' true, doesn't mean it is. I've read Applecare boards over the years and a lot of good features aren't implemented.

What Millennium said and:

Just because you think it's a good feature does not mean it's worth Apple implementing it. There's a cost vs. benefit vs. practicality equation that needs to be solved as well.

[hunkhuang]

all i want from Panther is ::::

CUT AND PASTE

[cybergoober]

Originally posted by HotSoup:
Just can it and stick your flames to yourself.

Practice what you preach.

[barbarian]

1. Metadata

2. Still not enough control over the desktop/system appearance. I want to set my font face/size. I want to control finder grid spacing. I want to control the style of text on desktop icons and on dock items.

3. Still no major dock improvements. This has been discussed ad nauseam, but my main wish is exactly clarkgobles #2.

4. Ability to choose metallic or aqua (or platinum!) interface.

5. More & smarter contextual menus.

6. Minimize in place.

7. Ability to log on as yourself from a remote machine (ie to use your user folder from a remote machine).

8. Ability to use itunes/iphoto libraries across users on the same machine. Ability to share iphoto libraries across a network

9. Better address book integration

10. Smarter software updates (it is ridiculous that moving a file causes software update to get confused).

11. Preview fonts directly in the finder.

12. Full keyboard control over the font panel... and a the ability to set a few font favorites that always appear in the font menu so you can avoid the font panel.

13. I'd like to see an "introduction to OS X" disk for newbies (maybe not included but available at the apple store for free) to walk newbies to OS X through the basics. I find that the lack of basic training is one of the biggest hurdles to adoption.

14. Extensible finder/dock. Ability to incorporate 3rd party modules for advanced functions. For example plug ins for previewing more datatypes directly in the finder.

[waffffffle]

Good lists. From what I can think of off the top of my head, I still want:

• MORE SPEED - my 2 G3 computers still crawl in 10.2
• Internet settings back in the System Preferences - Apple's applications should not have those options within themselves. What if I decide I want to delete Safari? Helper applications for ALL protocols (including SMB, AFP, FTP) and all file formats/ mime types should be available WITHIN THE OS and not as an add-on.
• Apple menu - it still sucks, and I don't want to have to pay $10 just for the ability to customize it.
• Application Menu - same as Apple menu, ASM is no longer free and this feature should be included in the OS by now.
• Ability to remove ALL .mac references from the sytem - If you don't pay for the service you shouldn't have to see it mentioned everywhere, and ideally Apple would publish a spec so that other providers can hook into OS X and provide .mac-like services with the same level of OS integration as .Mac.
• Faster iCal - its still too slow to use, which is frustrating since it is such a nice program.
• iChat enhancements - iChat is still missing so many basic features (groups, customizable buddy list fonts, basically everything Adium offers)
• Spring loaded folders in the dock.
• Stop littering SMB shares with ._files, its really ridiculous and gets in the way when I'm working on web sites.

[waffffffle]

I just thought of some more:

• Ability to turn off PDF previewing in Finder column view - every time I hit a PDF I have to wait forever for it to preview. Same goes for quicktime files.
• Ability to turn off ALL eye candy (shadows, font smoothing, brushed metal, aqua pinstipes) ideally a perfect copy of platium.
• A standard theming system to allow themers to really create some interesting themes that push the limits of UI (a la WindowBlinds).
• Kill the font panel - a separate window for choosing fonts is stupid. TextEdit should have fonts in the toolbar and show should most other applications.
• Control-click "Send to" in finder - with one click on a file in the Finder a new mail message opens, with the file as an attachment.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by hunkhuang:
all i want from Panther is ::::

CUT AND PASTE

It seems your wish has been granted for 20 years or so...

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by waffffffle:
I just thought of some more:

• Ability to turn off PDF previewing in Finder column view - every time I hit a PDF I have to wait forever for it to preview. Same goes for quicktime files.

Uhm. Yeah, this have also been in Mac OS X for a while. You can flip down the preview or even remove it completely if you want in view options...

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by waffffffle:
Good lists. From what I can think of off the top of my head, I still want:

• MORE SPEED - my 2 G3 computers still crawl in 10.2
• Faster iCal - its still too slow to use, which is frustrating since it is such a nice program.
• iChat enhancements - iChat is still missing so many basic features (groups, customizable buddy list fonts, basically everything Adium offers)
• Spring loaded folders in the dock.
• Stop littering SMB shares with ._files, its really ridiculous and gets in the way when I'm working on web sites.

Uhm. More speed? You should probably upgrade your processors one or two generations. Anyways, Panther is as fast as Mac OS 9 ever was... and so is iCal.
iChat, Spring Loaded folders agreed. SMB littering have seemingly stopped.

Oh, and you are NOT getting back Mac OS 9 so stop whining about Apple-menu and the useless Application Menu already

[voodoo]

Originally posted by - - e r i k - -:
It seems your wish has been granted for 20 years or so...

the meek shall inherit the earth

[sushiism]

Originally posted by waffffffle:
[*] Kill the font panel - a separate window for choosing fonts is stupid. TextEdit should have fonts in the toolbar and show should most other applications. [/list]

nah no way, anyone whos used windows apps with font controls there will disagree, the font panel is wonderful not as good as the colour one though which is the single most amazing thing on osx

[juanpacolopez]

Originally posted by waffffffle:
I just thought of some more:

• Ability to turn off PDF previewing in Finder column view - every time I hit a PDF I have to wait forever for it to preview. Same goes for quicktime files.

As others have stated.... click that little down "arrow" to the right of the file name, it should collapse the preview. This will STAY OFF until you turn it back on (click the arrow back the other way).

Aside from that... from the breif glimpses of Panther I've seen preview's rendering of PDF's is now SICKENINGLY fast. Fast enough that if you're in column view, the preview is (on a 12" PB at least) instantaneous.

[clarkgoble]

Some of the lists people are giving are already implemented in Panther. i.e. both general OS performance and especially Preview performance are improved. (In Preview's case dramatically so) So the old lame "is it snappier" comment is true for 10.3. Address book integration is dramatically improved and Address Book is largely rewritten and is actually useful now (including label printing).

I'm more curious of what isn't in Panther.

BTW - regarding piles as a GUI. I agree. It adds nothing and ends up making things worse. Apple has rejected many GUI innovations when tested in practice. Remember that in the betas for 10.2 there was minimize in place that was removed in one of the last builds prior to the public release due to user testing.

As others mentioned, a lot of interface ideas or desires simply are either "niche" or else cause more problems than the solved. Just because you want it doesn't mean it is necessarily a good idea. For instance I'd love to have a path entry field in Finder windows the way Windows Explorer has it. (i.e. a text field showing the path to the current selection and allows you to type any path to go there in the browser) I recognize though that for average users this would be more confusing and that Apple has a feature somewhat similar in it's Go to menu. I still want it for the kind of work I do in the Finder. But it realistically will never be implemented.

[JLL]

Originally posted by waffffffle:
Good lists. From what I can think of off the top of my head, I still want:
[list][*]MORE SPEED - my 2 G3 computers still crawl in 10.2

Isn't this a thread about what's not in Panther?

[JHromadka]

Can Panther do a bit-for-bit copy of an Audio CD? Disk Copy in 10.2 won't let me do it.

[Moonray]

If Apple would listen *and* act we would have windowshade (again) since 10.1 or so.
Maybe they'll do it in 10.6 when they're out of new ideas.
Also a working Finder FTP should not be that difficult to write
And would be more useful than these visual effects for kids

-

[ambush]

Originally posted by HotSoup:
Chill out. Stop spouting BS. Just because Jobs says tis' true, doesn't mean it is. I've read Applecare boards over the years and a lot of good features aren't implemented.

Just can it and stick your flames to yourself.

And you stay on spymac.com, where you ******* belong

[blackbird_1.0]

whats the feedback site for apple

i tried apple.com/feedback

but no go

[zachs]

Originally posted by blackbird_1.0:
whats the feedback site for apple

i tried apple.com/feedback

but no go

Mac OS X Feedback

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by JHromadka:
Can Panther do a bit-for-bit copy of an Audio CD? Disk Copy in 10.2 won't let me do it.

Stupid question: Is this even possible?

AFAIK from various sites and discussions here and elsewhere, audio CDs are *always* read with errors, it is inherent in the format (as opposed to data CDs, where there is much greater redundancy).

Also, audio CDs are written in a continuous stream from beginning to end as mandated by the Red Book format. Assuming that the source CD could be read bit-perfect, the copy would *have to* be identical, no?

-s*

[JLL]

Originally posted by Moonray:
If Apple would listen *and* act we would have windowshade (again) since 10.1 or so.
Maybe they'll do it in 10.6 when they're out of new ideas.

Apple has made something better: Exposé!!

[JKT]

Bit of a niche feature request, but I'd like some form of "Log-in" Location Manager whereby pressing e.g. option-shift-enter at Log-in (as shift-enter already has the function of preventing Log-in items from launching) would pop-up a Location Manager window from which I could choose between one set of Apps to auto-launch for home use, a second set for work use, a third set for gaming, etc as well as choose different default printer or even totally different Printer (and other hardware) "sets".

Actually, GUI-wise, they could include this within the Log-in panel - a disclosure triangle next to your name would show your "locations". Highlight the one you want and it is launched as you log-in.

[:haripu:]

Originally posted by juanpacolopez:
As others have stated.... click that little down "arrow" to the right of the file name, it should collapse the preview. This will STAY OFF until you turn it back on (click the arrow back the other way).

Yes, but suppose the preview is not collapsed, and you navigate (in colum view) to where the large file lies that you want to activate (but you know that a preview would a minute to come up). Now, how do you turn off the preview column without activating the file first (which would lead to the unavoidable wait)? Tricky, that one.

Aside from that... from the breif glimpses of Panther I've seen preview's rendering of PDF's is now SICKENINGLY fast. Fast enough that if you're in column view, the preview is (on a 12" PB at least) instantaneous.

Sounds good. But let's hope that it also previews my 16 MB high resolution PDFs instantaneously in the Finder. And the 600 MB Divx AVIs.

[koffinkanser]

I've been pining for this feature for the longest time. Submitted feedback to Apple too.

It's such a simple idea. Apple has already implemented this with the Dock. There are three ways to access the Dock's menus. Right-click (for those with multiple-button mice), Ctrl-click, and click 'n' hold.

So why not implement this same idea system-wide, even third-party applications?

Those of you who say, well, it could be annoying because menus could be popping up where we don't want them to....

well, Apple can allow users to activate/deactivate it and customize it like spring-loaded folders, which allows users to set the delay time.

Chances are, people don't hold their mouse button down on one spot for too long a time. And if they do, they can make the delay longer so that menus don't pop up. If that isn't enough, then the whole click 'n' hold can be deactivated altogether.

I love the one-button mouse. It's simple, it's elegant, and it's not confusing for new users. if you don't agree, it's ok. but that is not the issue here. the issue here is that all of that elegance and simplicity can be preserved, YET, the one-button mouse can become so much more powerful.

And with options a la spring-loaded folders available, what's not to like? You don't like it? Turn it off and go back to ctrl-clicking! You want it to wait a little longer? Sure. You want the menu to come up almost immediately? No problem either!

This is perfect. Now, if only Apple would agree.

[Jeff Jones]

Just to add my two Cents:

1. System wide click-and-hold for context menues. Ever wondered wy Finderpop was so extremely popular? Honestly, I love the one-button-mouse! It's so simple and elegant, very Mac-like. Also on the Power- and iBooks. With click-and-hold all the downsides would be gone. And it would be very simple and very elegant solution. Give users some customisation and you're done! And they have already implemented in the dock anyway...

2. ._ files on non-HFS shares. This is really ridiculous! In every single folder I visit on our network Mac OS X leaves theses silly files. Extremely annoying! And that while Apple/the Mac is claiming to be a good Windows citizen...

3. Spring loaded folders in the dock. That's a pretty straight forward one...

4. Configurable Apple menu. This is what has always been one of the biggest advantages of Macs. Very easy to use, very straight forward and gives you what ALL computer companies have been desperately trying to give you for so long: information at your fingertips (kind of goes along with #3). And the Mac has had and then lost it...

5. Metadata. Best thing I have seen in computers, ever. Why should I care where my files are? Shouldn't the computer do this (would also solve the installer problem...). Again, OS 9 had it - a pity OS X has lost it. I guess databases are more trendy at the moment, but metadata still has its advantages (see BeOS!).

I know there are a lot of issues with #2 and #5, especially with the latter. However, it has been done, so why can't it be done again. O.K., I know that Apple has really been busy to make OS X what we all want of it. And probably the Great Minds in Cuppertino are already working on better solutions. I am just saying that they should have put at least some of this in, particularly #1, #3 and #4. Those seem like a no-brainer to me...

JJ.

Edit: Ooops, looks like someone else was faster with the click-and-hold. Gosh, I am such a slow typer...

[clarkgoble]

I believe that all those hidden files on window shares are done away with in Panther already. Am I wrong in that? I could have sworn I read that.

[waffffffle]

Originally posted by - - e r i k - -:
Uhm. More speed? You should probably upgrade your processors one or two generations. Anyways, Panther is as fast as Mac OS 9 ever was... and so is iCal.
iChat, Spring Loaded folders agreed. SMB littering have seemingly stopped.

Oh, and you are NOT getting back Mac OS 9 so stop whining about Apple-menu and the useless Application Menu already

I am not whining. I am answering the question. Those UI features are not in panther. Why shouldn't the Apple menu be customizable? Otherwise it is just a waste of space. In OS 9 it was completely customizable and now it isn't. That's retrogression. Same for the application menu. The dock isn't the perfect tool for everyone pal. Apple had some great alternatives in OS 9 and by not offering them as OPTIONS in OS X they are offering less functionality.

My iBook is 2 years old. It is NOT time for new hardware just to be able to function properly in OS X. iCal is impossible to use and iChat gives me the beachball for 10 seconds at a time. Not usable.

Originally posted by JLL:
Isn't this a thread about what's not in Panther?

Panther is just as slow on my machines.

[Chuckit]

Originally posted by waffffffle:
Why shouldn't the Apple menu be customizable?

Hell, why shouldn't the Edit menu be customizable?

[blackbird_1.0]

i have to agree with waffffffle on some of these things, by the end of the year, i'll already have to upgrade twice in a year and a half just to use osx, and apple keeps adding this eyecandy, overloading, quartz extreme crap, (NO OFFENSE)

[K++]

Originally posted by waffffffle:
I just thought of some more:[*]Ability to turn off PDF previewing in Finder column view - every time I hit a PDF I have to wait forever for it to preview. Same goes for quicktime files.

you can do this now using one of two ways.
1. you can be in column view and get view options then uncheck show preview column. problem is this mean that you have no previews no file information without get info.
2. click on the disclosure triangle next to preview, this will hide ALL previews for all file types and you still get your file info.

[*]Ability to turn off ALL eye candy (shadows, font smoothing, brushed metal, aqua pinstipes) ideally a perfect copy of platium.

And put Unsanity out of business.... perish the thought.

[b] [*] A standard theming system to allow themers to really create some interesting themes that push the limits of UI (a la WindowBlinds).[b]

MS didn't write windowblinds its a third party program as is StylesXP and a myrad of other theming solutions for windows. If you want a uniform theming system then the theming community needs to band together and make one.

[*] Kill the font panel - a separate window for choosing fonts is stupid. TextEdit should have fonts in the toolbar and show should most other applications.

When you have the stock fonts it may seem stupid, but soon as you have thousands you see the logic in seperating the fonts from a dropdown menu. What apple needs to do is show only the fonts in your favorites group in a font menu.

[*]Control-click "Send to" in finder - with one click on a file in the Finder a new mail message opens, with the file as an attachment.

This is not windows we don't need to be babied through everything. Just as easy as it is to use a contextual Menu that says Send to, we could launch Mail and compose a message and then finally place our atachment in using drag and drop. If apple were to ever start adding these 'stupidity" features I would be the signal of death to the simplicity and flexibility of the Apple UI in every way.

[K++]

Originally posted by waffffffle:
I am not whining. I am answering the question. Those UI features are not in panther. Why shouldn't the Apple menu be customizable? Otherwise it is just a waste of space. In OS 9 it was completely customizable and now it isn't. That's retrogression. Same for the application menu. The dock isn't the perfect tool for everyone pal. Apple had some great alternatives in OS 9 and by not offering them as OPTIONS in OS X they are offering less functionality.

Why should the Apple Menu be customizable? You can put anything you want in the Finders toolbar, anything you put in your Favorites folder ends up in a drop down menu in the Go menu, there is always the dock, and if you really want to you can even dump your entire HD or any folder on it into the Dock. I almost forgot about the recent items menu which lists your recent apps, documents, and servers. The Apple menu is for certain functions and the Application is for others. System wide functionality is all the belongs in the apple menu. Startup/Shutdown/Logout/force quit those you can use no matter where you are or what your doing. The application menu replaced File because somtimes file was just inappropriate for example all internet apps have no file metaphor so why should there be a file menu?

My iBook is 2 years old. It is NOT time for new hardware just to be able to function properly in OS X. iCal is impossible to use and iChat gives me the beachball for 10 seconds at a time. Not usable.

Panther is just as slow on my machines.

I have a PowerMac Cube and both iChat and iCal work fine for me, matter of fact my iCal is ALWAYS open, and i urn php iCalendar to get at it when im away from my machine. My cube is near three years old, so it aint about age. Its about hardware. Panther is just as slow because you can only squeeze so much out of the resources in a machine. i doubt Panther is just as slow as you say it but rather than the speed difference isn't great enough for you. If so well new hardware isn't going to kill you.

By your logic the 604s should be supported too, I mean they may be a little old but in 9 they fly.

[K++]

Originally posted by :haripu::
Yes, but suppose the preview is not collapsed, and you navigate (in colum view) to where the large file lies that you want to activate (but you know that a preview would a minute to come up). Now, how do you turn off the preview column without activating the file first (which would lead to the unavoidable wait)? Tricky, that one.

You can use contextual menus on things without selecting them. Go try it.

Sounds good. But let's hope that it also previews my 16 MB high resolution PDFs instantaneously in the Finder. And the 600 MB Divx AVIs.

See above. Also if you have them divx doctored, avi2mov-ed, or mplayer -idx ed, or in some way optimized for Quicktime they are near instantaneous on my cube. And of course there is the activating a contextal menu without clicking it, dragging it to the application you want use in the dock, which also doesnt select it or a good old open command through the terminal.