[hldan]

I have been reading the threads here and people complain about the brushed metal look in Panther's Finder and in all the iApps. I don't understand what the problem is. I think it looks cool. It doesn't have that boring typical and average computer look anymore using the brushed metal IU. Besides it looks really high tech as what we would typically expect from Apple.
I would like to hear all of your opinions as to why you don't like it and if you do like it I want to hear from those people too.

[daftpig]

The big deal, is that metal windows don't seem to portray an inactive state even if it is inactive.

If you don't select Graphite under Sys Prefs>>General, the active plastic buttons don't seem very obviously different from the inactive ones.

Furthermore, the metal surfaces don't have a grayed out effect to further differentiate between the active and inactive windows.

In consequence and conclusion, there just isn't enough "visual feedback" even though other areas of the OS may be overloaded with it.

(This is what I can understand and agree with given what I've read in Macnn Forums. I think other posters might provide you will more specifics.)


KH

[arekkusu]

Also:

The rounded bottom corners and inset resize widget in the lower right change the metrics of the window content compared to regular Aqua.

Brushed metal apps typically (not Safari) have big stupid metal borders around the content. The drop shadow is supposed to delineate windows in OS X. Borders just waste screen space.

The medium grey tone of the metal texture means there is reduced contrast between the window background (e.g. titlebar) and text, compared to regular Aqua.

Sheets expose differently than in regular Aqua windows; now a "slot" is drawn. This is in response to the complaint in Jaguar that sheets "just appeared out of nowhere." Fine, but why is the zooming behavior also different? Aqua sheets only zoom if the window is not wide enough to accommodate them.

If you look at various brushed metal applications (Quicktime Player, iTunes, Finder, Safari, iPhoto, iChat, etc) you'll see that they each treat the problems mentioned in different ways. Some of them have smaller resize widgets than others. Safari has no borders, other apps all have slightly different border widths. Some have a white emboss around the window border, some have a two pixel white line at the top, some have a one pixel white line. Some space the Aqua window widgets at top left slightly differently.

The lack of consistency (compared to regular Aqua, where there is a very definite spec) only heightens the already glaring deficiencies.

In short, Brushed Metal sucks.

[Developer]

What arekkusu said, very well summarizes it.

Also, Brushed Metal does not have a "cool high tech" look. Brushed Metal looks like a 60ies B&O device.

[arekkusu]

One more (things just getting worse in Panther...) is that the widgets used in Metal windows are a big, jumbled mess.

Take a look at e.g. iPhoto. Now, what style widgets are developers supposed to use in Metal windows?

There's normal glossy grey/blue Aqua controls.
Then there's the Apple custom grey aqua switches with the swooshy diagonal highlight.
Then there's the new flat grey "metal" button.

There's no implied functionality here, it's just arbitrary and confusing.

Add the whole "tab chiclet" deal and Panther is a big step backwards from Jaguar.




And btw, about "hi-tech", no. Brushed Metal made its debut in 1999 in Quicktime 4, which was immediately hated by everyone with a clue. It got its own special place in the Interface Hall of Shame: http://web.archive.org/web/200210161....com/qtime.htm

[hldan]

Originally posted by arekkusu:
Also:


Sheets expose differently than in regular Aqua windows; now a "slot" is drawn. This is in response to the complaint in Jaguar that sheets "just appeared out of nowhere." Fine, but why is the zooming behavior also different? Aqua sheets only zoom if the window is not wide enough to accommodate them.

In short, Brushed Metal sucks.

I don't understand about "Sheets". What exactly is that and what is meant by a slot being drawn as well as zoom?

[arekkusu]

Do this to see the difference:

AQUA:
1) Launch TextEdit.
2) New File.
3) Type something.
4) Click the close button.

Note the sheet asking if you want to save the document. It has dropped down from the window's titlebar. Cancel the sheet and try clicking the close button again after resizing the window to some different sizes. You'll see that if the window is big, the sheet just drops down, but if the window is smaller than the sheet, it "zooms" out in 3D. Compare with:

METAL:
1) Launch Safari.
2) Go to an address like "crap://0.0.0.0"

Note the sheet telling you that you can't go to that address. See behind it, there is a tiny black "slot" the sheet is coming out of? They had to add that in Panther because it looked stupid with the sheet coming out of NOTHING since Metal windows have no line under the title bar. Now OK the sheet and try again with the window different sizes. See how now the sheet always zooms even if the window is big?

It's inconsistent.

[hldan]

Originally posted by arekkusu:
Do this to see the difference:

AQUA:
1) Launch TextEdit.
2) New File.
3) Type something.
4) Click the close button.

Note the sheet asking if you want to save the document. It has dropped down from the window's titlebar. Cancel the sheet and try clicking the close button again after resizing the window to some different sizes. You'll see that if the window is big, the sheet just drops down, but if the window is smaller than the sheet, it "zooms" out in 3D. Compare with:

METAL:
1) Launch Safari.
2) Go to an address like "crap://0.0.0.0"

Note the sheet telling you that you can't go to that address. See behind it, there is a tiny black "slot" the sheet is coming out of? They had to add that in Panther because it looked stupid with the sheet coming out of NOTHING since Metal windows have no line under the title bar. Now OK the sheet and try again with the window different sizes. See how now the sheet always zooms even if the window is big?

It's inconsistent.

Wow, that's really perceptive, I never noticed that before and I have been using Macs since OS 8.5. Good to hear this feedback, however I disagree that the brushed metal isn't high tech. The brushed metal look is used on much of todays high end audio equipment though I do feel it doesn't look right on Safari but it adds flair to iMovie, iTunes, iPhoto and iSync, it makes them look more professional.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by arekkusu:
Also:

The rounded bottom corners and inset resize widget in the lower right change the metrics of the window content compared to regular Aqua.

Brushed metal apps typically (not Safari) have big stupid metal borders around the content. The drop shadow is supposed to delineate windows in OS X. Borders just waste screen space.

The medium grey tone of the metal texture means there is reduced contrast between the window background (e.g. titlebar) and text, compared to regular Aqua.

Sheets expose differently than in regular Aqua windows; now a "slot" is drawn. This is in response to the complaint in Jaguar that sheets "just appeared out of nowhere." Fine, but why is the zooming behavior also different? Aqua sheets only zoom if the window is not wide enough to accommodate them.

If you look at various brushed metal applications (Quicktime Player, iTunes, Finder, Safari, iPhoto, iChat, etc) you'll see that they each treat the problems mentioned in different ways. Some of them have smaller resize widgets than others. Safari has no borders, other apps all have slightly different border widths. Some have a white emboss around the window border, some have a two pixel white line at the top, some have a one pixel white line. Some space the Aqua window widgets at top left slightly differently.

The lack of consistency (compared to regular Aqua, where there is a very definite spec) only heightens the already glaring deficiencies.

In short, Brushed Metal sucks.

perceptive!

I always felt some inconsistancy there but couldn't put my finger on it.

[Dale Sorel]

Originally posted by arekkusu:
Also:

The rounded bottom corners and inset resize widget in the lower right change the metrics of the window content compared to regular Aqua.

Brushed metal apps typically (not Safari) have big stupid metal borders around the content. The drop shadow is supposed to delineate windows in OS X. Borders just waste screen space.

The medium grey tone of the metal texture means there is reduced contrast between the window background (e.g. titlebar) and text, compared to regular Aqua.

Sheets expose differently than in regular Aqua windows; now a "slot" is drawn. This is in response to the complaint in Jaguar that sheets "just appeared out of nowhere." Fine, but why is the zooming behavior also different? Aqua sheets only zoom if the window is not wide enough to accommodate them.

If you look at various brushed metal applications (Quicktime Player, iTunes, Finder, Safari, iPhoto, iChat, etc) you'll see that they each treat the problems mentioned in different ways. Some of them have smaller resize widgets than others. Safari has no borders, other apps all have slightly different border widths. Some have a white emboss around the window border, some have a two pixel white line at the top, some have a one pixel white line. Some space the Aqua window widgets at top left slightly differently.

The lack of consistency (compared to regular Aqua, where there is a very definite spec) only heightens the already glaring deficiencies.

In short, Brushed Metal sucks.

Man, you need a life

[Nonsuch]

Originally posted by hldan:
The brushed metal look is used on much of todays high end audio equipment though I do feel it doesn't look right on Safari but it adds flair to iMovie, iTunes, iPhoto and iSync, it makes them look more professional.

Way to stick to your guns.

You'll notice that most of the complaints about brushed metal, well-articulated as they are by our members, are of a fairly niggling aesthetic variety. Sheets that slide out of a magically appearing slot may look kind of silly, but do they really get in the way of your work? That's why the whole "metal vs. aqua" feud makes so little difference to me. I don't pay attention to what style the buttons are drawn in, so long as they do what they're supposed to. And I can work with a metal Finder as easily as I can with an Aqua one.

[daftpig]

Originally posted by Nonsuch:
Way to stick to your guns.

You'll notice that most of the complaints about brushed metal, well-articulated as they are by our members, are of a fairly niggling aesthetic variety. Sheets that slide out of a magically appearing slot may look kind of silly, but do they really get in the way of your work? That's why the whole "metal vs. aqua" feud makes so little difference to me. I don't pay attention to what style the buttons are drawn in, so long as they do what they're supposed to. And I can work with a metal Finder as easily as I can with an Aqua one.

Unfortunately, if Apple hadn't stuck to an obsession with aesthetics in line with "user experience", a Mac wouldn't be any different from Windows.

It is precisely an edge of perceptiveness that engenders sensitive UI design.

[arekkusu]

Originally posted by hldan:
...it adds flair to iMovie, iTunes, iPhoto and iSync, it makes them look more professional.

That's your opinion. Apple's opinion is that it makes the interface similar to a real-world device. That is, a CONSUMER interface. Apple has (yet) another interface style for professional applications, as used in Final Cut Pro, Soundtrack, DVD Studio Pro, Shake (and maybe Logic in the next version) which is a darker flat grey. Not brushed aluminum. Browse around to see some pics: http://www.apple.com/finalcutpro/

This interface style is called "ProKit" btw.

Originally posted by Dale Sorel:
Man, you need a life

Originally posted by Nonsuch:
most of the complaints about brushed metal, well-articulated as they are by our members, are of a fairly niggling aesthetic variety.

Of course, user interface issues are of an aesthetic nature, and that generally makes them less important than, say, Quicktime breaking icon selection. Or the OpenGL video driver not supporting basic GL features. Or applications hanging, or the network freezing, or any other of the real problems that Apple still has.

But, imagine for a moment that your day is spent designing computer interfaces and the graphics for them. You'd suddenly care a lot more about tiny issues like one pixel missing, when you see it in a product coming from a company that is supposed to be a pioneer of human-computer interaction and user interface consistency.

Don't get me wrong. I like Apple. I think their UI and their products generally get things right, and are certainly better than the Windows alternatives. But some of the design decisions they've made are just plain bad. Brushed Metal is one of them.