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mikeini · Jun 4, 2004, 01:58 PM

As the subject says - Panther just wont shut down. I have run virex (the beta ) .. it hasnt caught anything although it has problems with certain filse ...

ran cocktails ..

threw programs away .. files

and still ntihg! i even ran disk utility ..

but still nothing

everythign is up to date on panther - (and btw - its just 1.5 weeks old .. :-D)

mike

gorickey · Jun 4, 2004, 02:01 PM

Any USB devices (are you using the Apple mouse/keyboard?) attached to the computer? If so, disconnect those and try shutting down...

mikeini · Jun 4, 2004, 02:20 PM

nope. im just using the ac adapter and internet .. (no external devices at all).

gorickey · Jun 4, 2004, 02:26 PM

Originally posted by mikeini:
nope. im just using the ac adapter and internet .. (no external devices at all).

So you are using a PowerBook/iBook? Have you added any extra fonts since you've had it?

Repaired permissions?

mikeini · Jun 4, 2004, 04:18 PM

i havent added any fonts by myslef.. maybe office 2004 did when i installed it .. or somethign like that.

im using the new rev c powerbook 12".

ihave repiared the permissions (i used cocktail as well as disk utility to do that)....

mike

btw - i have a bio psych class and i used the disk for the first time on a mac on tuesday and when it loaded it required os9 .. think that coudl be it? it asked to update somethign before it could continue and beucaes i needed to use it i clicked yes .. this could be the problem ..

mikeini · Jun 8, 2004, 02:26 AM

bump .. i think it might be due to 10.3.4 update .. anyone having the same problems???

CharlesS · Jun 8, 2004, 02:28 AM

Does anything get logged to console.log or system.log when you try to shut down?

Semantic Mike · Jun 8, 2004, 04:02 AM

I had a problem where every time I tried to shut the computer down it immediately restarted. I fixed this by selecting a restart and letting it run through. After login, I was then able to shut down properly. Could your problem be related?

Ω · Jun 8, 2004, 04:07 AM

What processes are running?

If os9 is running it will have an pid something like trueblueenvelope.

I always go on rampant kill sprees of processes to isolate the problem.

mikeini · Jun 8, 2004, 11:33 AM

i'm running panther .. with the latest update 10.3.4 ....

becuase im a newbie im not sure how to check the log to see if the shutdown is getting 'logged'.

hope this helps ...

MacGallant · Jun 8, 2004, 11:47 AM

Here's a solution I gave someone at the PowerMac section of this forum. He was experiencing a "stalled shutdown."

See if this helps (it always worked for me with stalled shutdowns)

Launch System Preferences>Under System, click accounts>Then click the Startup items tab>see if there are any startup programs that weren't there before and click on them to select them and click the minus button the remove them.

Sometimes when you install software, a program component of the newly installed software would be placed in the startup items tab (like the Epson Scanner software) that causes shutdown to lag or stall and removing it would remedy the stalled shutdown.

Adam Betts · Jun 8, 2004, 12:40 PM

For me, iDisk is usually the one to blame for stalling the Shut Down process. When there's no internet connection, iDisk is just too dumb to realize that.

Perhaps you could force-quit all iDisk-related in Activity Monitor and try Shut Down again.

mikeini · Jun 8, 2004, 12:58 PM

macgallant - i did what you said - there was only ical schedular thingy and then ms au daemon or osmething ... but i removed both of them...

lets say under acct i go to enable fast user swtiching .. and i go to the log on screen ... the shut down/restar tbutton are dim while the sleep button is "activated" .. if tha tmakes sense .. so i cannot use the shut down/restart button.

is there something i can do with the log's?

thanks guys for the help! i REALLY appreciate it

Big Mac · Jun 8, 2004, 04:48 PM

If you are using Fast User Switching you won't be able to shut down until only one user is logged in. If that's what the problem is, switch to a user and select Log Out <username> from the Apple menu. Do that for the other users until you either have only one user logged in or you're back at the login screen. Then you'll be able to restart. It is helpful to be as descriptive as possible about the problem that is occurring, so that others may be able to assist properly. It wasn't clear from your posts exactly what is happening when you select Restart (does it say another application wouldn't shut down, does it not register the command at all, etc.) Btw, when you use Classic (Mac OS 9 in OS X) for the first time after a system update, it may ask you to update some Classic components. That is a normal thing to see.

mikeini · Jun 8, 2004, 05:03 PM

bigmac - thanks .. esp for the comments - i will def take that to heart and MAKE IT EASY FOR YOU GUYS TO HELP ME

as for fast user swithcing - i am the only user (there is no other account but mine) .. i will try to log otu and see what happens.

btu as for registering ot shutdown/restart - thats a negative ghostrider. the reason for this is that even if i run a schudule to shut down by a certain time off of the energy saver .. it sitll wont do it (the you have 600 seconds to click or it auto shuts down) .. but then i have cliked shut down as well as wait .. and it just didnt shut down. it just went back to teh desktop (finder i guess?).

i have heard a few comments about check the logs .. btu am i looking for?

just tried to log off using finder menu (the apple next to file) ...

and it wont register to log off. tried the keystorkes .. but when i use the up arrow .. it moves up from icon to icon on the desktop.

hope this helps

Big Mac · Jun 8, 2004, 05:21 PM

Once in awhile this happens to someone, and usually it cures itself spontaneously. You said you can go into Sleep mode, right? It sounds as if something just is not getting the message to quit, but the OS should be reporting that to you. If you want to check the system log, open the Console application (which is located in the Utilities folder inside Applications). Try logging out of all users, which will take you back to the login window; then try the restart button. If you're able to log out of all users there should be no problem restarting. I'm sorry I don't have a better suggestion. . .

mikeini · Jun 8, 2004, 05:26 PM

Originally posted by Big Mac:
Once in awhile this happens to someone, and usually it cures itself spontaneously. You said you can go into Sleep mode, right? It sounds as if something just is not getting the message to quit, but the OS should be reporting that to you. If you want to check the system log, open the Console application (which is located in the Utilities folder inside Applications). Try logging out of all users, which will take you back to the login window; then try the restart button. If you're able to log out of all users there should be no problem restarting. I'm sorry I don't have a better suggestion. . .

is there another way to log out (i am the only user ..so if i log out i migh tbe able ot restart .. ) .. What are the shortcut key's .. only becuase the apple menu->logout ____ isnt responding. i can put the pb to sleep by either closing the lid or at login window (with me still logged in.. ) hit sleep.

i think you are right - it is just not getting the message to shut down. as for the system log - it never says anyhting about shutdown .. only if i change a setting or come from wake ... what would i be looking for if it did register a shut down or restart?

lastly - the os shold be reporthign that to me? what does that mean? (i only get the shutdown window if i run a schedule .. but it will run down the 600 seconds and still not shut down.. just go back to the desktop. just did it 2x...

mike

Big Mac · Jun 8, 2004, 05:35 PM

You can use the Terminal to execute the "shutdown -r now" command to do a graceful restart. To read about the command, open the Terminal application and type "man shutdown". If the GUI isn't working that's the next thing to try.

mikeini · Jun 8, 2004, 06:17 PM

thanks. i just got off my lazy arse and called apple -

basically just had to reinstall panther (btu wats nice is it doesnt remove data ) ..

oding that now. jsut ogtta figure out what folder i need to delete ..

but yea .. he even said this is just a chance thing

thanks again guys!

CharlesS · Jun 8, 2004, 07:04 PM

Originally posted by mikeini:
thanks. i just got off my lazy arse and called apple -

basically just had to reinstall panther (btu wats nice is it doesnt remove data ) ..

oding that now. jsut ogtta figure out what folder i need to delete ..

but yea .. he even said this is just a chance thing

thanks again guys!

All you have to do to reinstall Panther is fire up the CD and do an Archive and Install. You don't have to move or delete anything yourself.

After everything's done, if things are working properly, you can delete the Previous System folder.

Oh, and OT:

Originally posted by Big Mac:
I never met a Mac I didn't like.

I did once... PowerBook 5300. <shudder>

mikeini · Jun 8, 2004, 11:43 PM

hahah .. well i just did it and after a prilimary trail .. IT STILL WONT SHUT DOWN!!!

i saw the archived panther .. (but how do i get sidetrack from teh old one .. )

anyhow .. im just even more lost (i offically have delted the virus programs) and just about anything else that i dont need/use .. to see what the cuprit is..

we will see.

mike

and i cannto even open the force quit window using the keystrokes .. a beep comes up .. tahts it!

CharlesS · Jun 8, 2004, 11:52 PM

Originally posted by mikeini:
hahah .. well i just did it and after a prilimary trail .. IT STILL WONT SHUT DOWN!!!

Does it do this when you are logged in as a different user, or does it happen regardless of what user you are?

mikeini · Jun 9, 2004, 03:49 PM

it wont shut down regardless of what user i am. a suggestion was made to use pacifist and take the plist from the restore cd (library) and extract .. i did. even forced a restart .. to no avial. i m back at square one .. btu this time i have delted the previous panther that was installed .. starting fresh... starting over.

when i upgraded - it loaded the window (before i dleted the "test' user .. ) that i need to log off the users to restart .. did so thorugh the window .. but it wouldnt restart. just went ot the desktop.

gonna test those geniuses at the genius bar .. cuase this one has everyone stumpteD!!!!

if i find out the problem/ solution .. will post. in the meantime, if anyone has any other suggestions - IM MROE THAN WILLING OT TRY. just be paitnet cuase im only 2 weeks old on an apple ..

thanks again guys.
mike

edit - sorry for the delay.. the server was down or something .. i was getting an error with teh forums ...

mikeini · Jun 9, 2004, 03:49 PM

it wont shut down regardless of what user i am. a suggestion was made to use pacifist and take the plist from the restore cd (library) and extract .. i did. even forced a restart .. to no avial. i m back at square one .. btu this time i have delted the previous panther that was installed .. starting fresh... starting over.

when i upgraded - it loaded the window (before i dleted the "test' user .. ) that i need to log off the users to restart .. did so thorugh the window .. but it wouldnt restart. just went ot the desktop.

gonna test those geniuses at the genius bar .. cuase this one has everyone stumpteD!!!!

if i find out the problem/ solution .. will post. in the meantime, if anyone has any other suggestions - IM MROE THAN WILLING OT TRY. just be paitnet cuase im only 2 weeks old on an apple ..

thanks again guys.
mike

timmyH · Jun 10, 2004, 04:14 AM

i had a similar problem yesterday, went through all the crap of deleting fonts, downloads, reinstalling panther etc. It turned out that my brother had switched the computer off with the power button instead of in the finder. I had some files open at the time (word and excel) which became corrupted. Once i had removed these files on to a zip and trashed those on the computer everything sorted itself out. I then copied and pasted my important files onto new docs and everything was back to normal. Hope this may have been of assistance, it took me two whole days to figure it all out.

mikeini · Jun 10, 2004, 12:44 PM

a little. how did you find out which files were corrupted?

and the onyl way that i can turn it off is through terminal - use the kill the loginwindow .. and which nets me off of my account, go to login window screen, and shut down..

that is definitly a possible option .. but how do you figure out what file is corrupted?

thanks again.

timmyH · Jun 10, 2004, 06:13 PM

i just tried to think logically, and i narrowed it down to those files that were actively open when the computer was switched off by my brother. I don't know if you had any files open last time you switched the computer off? Anyhow, by switching the computer off while these files were active must have corrupted them cos thats what was messing it up, and it worked okay once i had removed them. Also, this happened twice before too on different machines and that was down to fonts. Any fonts you may have installed that aren't on there already can definitely cause this problem. I guess just try and think about what you were doing on the computer last time before it actuall did shut down normally.

mikeini · Jun 10, 2004, 06:35 PM

For fonts - the only fonts installed would be due to Office 2004 and the like (p-shop, etc).

As for opened files - im tempted ot just remove all of my files (they are backed up by now anyhow) and see if that helps.

So if i remove those corrupted files ... (i can obvoiusly put it back later .. an uncorrupted version) .... it will just automatically shut down or will i have to force restart .. etc..

Thanks timmy!

mike

Big Mac · Jun 10, 2004, 08:05 PM

Originally posted by timmyH:
i just tried to think logically, and i narrowed it down to those files that were actively open when the computer was switched off by my brother. I don't know if you had any files open last time you switched the computer off? Anyhow, by switching the computer off while these files were active must have corrupted them cos thats what was messing it up, and it worked okay once i had removed them. Also, this happened twice before too on different machines and that was down to fonts. Any fonts you may have installed that aren't on there already can definitely cause this problem. I guess just try and think about what you were doing on the computer last time before it actuall did shut down normally.

That is exceptionally weird and something I've never heard of before, timmy. You're lucky you were able to figure out the problem. How could these files possibly cause problems if they weren't loaded into memory? Quite strange.

Oh, Charles, I like the 5300s too - it's not their fault their batteries were faulty

. Actually, I never got to use one (thankfully, I suppose), but anyway...

mikeini · Jun 10, 2004, 08:09 PM

well my hd is rid of all my files ... music etc... only thing left are just apps.

according to your theroy, what if i had safari open (which is MORE than likely as an update) ...

would i need to delete and hten reinstall?

edit: after removing all the files ... it strill wont shut down or log off .. i have to do it through terminal .. hence the safari quesiton .. (im basically better off just doing a reformat ) .. tahts where this is goign anyhow

Big Mac · Jun 10, 2004, 08:12 PM

If you have good backups (which you seem to have), perhaps it's time to reformat the drive and start de novo.

CharlesS · Jun 10, 2004, 09:37 PM

Okay, I've got a question. Your machine won't shut down. Will it also not log out or restart, or is it only the process of shutting down that fails?

mikeini · Jun 11, 2004, 11:56 AM

Originally posted by CharlesS:
Okay, I've got a question. Your machine won't shut down. Will it also not log out or restart, or is it only the process of shutting down that fails?

you got it. it will not shut down, restart nor log off (regardless of what acct you are in).

the only way i can shut down right now is by going thru terminal and killnig the loginwindow .. and then i get to basically the login screen and shut down from there. ...

its wierd.