[DGFilm]

Hi all,
I have two G4s, a TiPB 550MHz, and a G4 Tower 466MHz.
The PowerBook is running 10.4.9 and the Tower is running 10.3.9.
Both machines have different, somewhat easily resolved, but consistent & annoying issues after every OS update.
They definitely happen after each security update, can't remember for sure if they happen after version updates.
The lap top's issue is the easiest to explain, and resolve, so I'll start there.
On restart after update, it hangs on the startup screen - the grey screen w/ apple and spinning sun-like symbol.
I've left it for as long as 20 minutes to see if it would resolve itself - it doesn't.
If I hold down the power button to force shut-down, and then restart, all is well.
Obviously, I can live with this problem, but it's annoying. I'd like to know if anyone can tell me why it happens, and if I can stop it.
As for the Tower-
On restart after update, I get no internet access. If I try to open Internet Connect, I get spinning beach ball - again, I have waited at least 20 minutes for that to resolve - it doesn't - I have to force it to quit.
What I've learned, by chance, is that when I tell the machine to restart (or shutdown, I suppose), just before it shuts down, a keychain access dialog appears.
(the one that asks "deny - allow once - always allow")
This dialog only stays for a moment, before the machine shuts down - so if I'm not ready for it, I can miss the opportunity.
Then, once I've caught that and clicked "always allow", I get a different dialog after reboot.
Unfortunately, I don't recall that dialog exactly, but, I think it says something about keychain access to more than one version of the airport application, and if I want to allow access to the newer version (again, not sure about the accuracy of my memory of this).
Anyway, after I get past that step, all is well.
Again, I can live with this, but this one is more difficult to correct and even more annoying than the PowerBook's issue.
In searching for an answer before posting the question, I discovered a post about the Keychain Access Utility, which I didn't realize existed. So I will try Keychain First Aid on the Tower, but I won't know if it fixes anything until the next update.
I really just want to know if there's anyone out there who can say "oh, I know exactly why that's happening - here's how you fix it..."
If not, no big deal.
But thanks for reading, and thanks in advance for any insight & help you can offer.
-Dennis

[mfbernstein]

To see what's happening on bootup in detail, hold down 'option v' when booting. Often a filesystem check can account for long reboots, although in the case of your TiBook, that's likely not the explanation.

As to the crashing Internet Connect app, opening up the Console application when you're doing this may provide specific error messages. Look at both the console and system logs for clues.

[kick52]

Originally Posted by mfbernstein 

To see what's happening on bootup in detail, hold down 'option v' when booting. Often a filesystem check can account for long reboots, although in the case of your TiBook, that's likely not the explanation.

As to the crashing Internet Connect app, opening up the Console application when you're doing this may provide specific error messages. Look at both the console and system logs for clues.

'command v' actualy.

[DGFilm]

Thanks for the replies.
It's not just a long reboot, it's more like a stuck reboot.
What will I be looking for when I hold down cmd V?

re: Internet Connect freezing - I was under the impression that was just a symptom, the actual problem seemed to be a keychain issue.
Although I did run Keychain First Aid, and it found no problems.
In any case, what will I be looking for in the console & system logs?
Usually those logs just look like greek to me.
Thanks again,
-Dennis

[kick52]

just note down anything interesting and errory.

screenshots might be helpful

[JKT]

When you upgraded from each major version of OS X, did you do a simple upgrade or an archive and install (or a wipe clean and install)? If you did a simple upgrade*, chances are that you carried something over that is causing problems with the new system and the easiest way to try and solve this (rather than attempting to hunt for the needle in the haystack) is to perform an Archive and Install to see if it corrects the problems on each machine.

FWIW, a longer reboot after a security update seems to be very typical (not 20 minutes long though, so yours do still appear to be abnormal) with a prolonged stall at the "grey Apple" screen.

* Fwiw, for many people this causes no problems, but for some it does.

[DGFilm]

Thanks guys,
I'm pretty sure I've just done simple upgrades.
I'll wait until the next security update and check the logs and do the cmd v thing, and see what I can see.
As for the archive and (re)install option, that does sound like the most logical 1st step.
However, when you add up hunting down my install disks, doing the archive and installs and performing all the updates, the (possible) solution begins to seem like more of a hassle than the problems.
I really appreciate the input, and I really don't know what I expected to hear - I guess I was just hoping for a simple, 5 minute fix.
If I find myself with nothing to do on a rainy day, I may decide to attempt the re-install.
If so, I'll let you guys know what happens.
In any case, I'm planning on replacing the tower with a top-of-the-line iMac as soon as the new designs come out - which hopefully will be sooner rather than later.
Thanks again,
-Dennis

[JKT]

Originally Posted by DGFilm 

...and performing all the updates...

For the system, you will only need to do one major update to go from 10.4.0 to 10.4.9 using the combo updater (Software Update will do it automatically), and any updates that have occurred subsequently to the release of 10.4.9 and that would be it (of which there is only the last security update at present). Admittedly, software updates to iTunes etc. might need to be installed as well, but it isn't a process of going 10.4.0 to 10.4.1 to 10.4.2 etc.

However, if you don't wish to do it for 10.4, just make sure you do it for 10.5 when it is released.