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Official Leopard GUI discussion thread (Page 7)
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Oct 25, 2007, 07:33 PM
 
Originally Posted by .Neo View Post
A latest 24" 2.8 GHz iMac. So it's highly unlikely a performance issue.

There's no movie playback in the Dock period. Regardless if you use the 3D or 2D Dock.
Well, damn, that stinks. Not that I used it as an important feature, but I found it occasionally useful when listening to talks or shows and watching it in the Dock periodically. It'd be nice if they brought it back.

Edit: Pwnd page 7.
     
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Oct 25, 2007, 07:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post
What about iTunes video playback?
What about it?

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Oct 25, 2007, 07:42 PM
 
Does it play in the Dock? Yes? No?
     
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Oct 25, 2007, 07:51 PM
 
Nope.

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Oct 25, 2007, 08:00 PM
 
Bummer.
     
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Oct 25, 2007, 10:54 PM
 
Don't bash on me for being too lazy to go back and look...

But, you know how the menus in Leopard have the blurry glass effect that Vista has? Did Apple rip that off from M$ or did M$ steal it from one of the early Leopard betas?
     
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Oct 25, 2007, 11:51 PM
 
The blurry glass effect, I forgot exactly what it's called, had been in betas of Vista for quite a while. However, if I recall correctly, it is only used for window borders and not for anything else (a bit retarded in my opinion).
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 12:25 AM
 
Microsoft invented light refraction, you meant to say.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 12:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
The blurry glass effect, I forgot exactly what it's called, had been in betas of Vista for quite a while. However, if I recall correctly, it is only used for window borders and not for anything else (a bit retarded in my opinion).
Alright, so from the sound of it, Apple jacked it (albeit a different implementation)? I like it. I just don't like all the self-righteous talk that we got about holding back features so M$ couldn't copy.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 12:51 AM
 
Originally Posted by osxpinot View Post
Don't bash on me for being too lazy to go back and look...

But, you know how the menus in Leopard have the blurry glass effect that Vista has? Did Apple rip that off from M$ or did M$ steal it from one of the early Leopard betas?
MS stole it from IE5

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Oct 26, 2007, 12:54 AM
 
And it's not the only thing Apple "borrowed" from IE5 either:

MacWorld Expo San Francisco 2001 - Page 3 - (01/2001)


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Oct 26, 2007, 02:39 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
The blurry glass effect, I forgot exactly what it's called, had been in betas of Vista for quite a while. However, if I recall correctly, it is only used for window borders and not for anything else (a bit retarded in my opinion).
It's used by Windows Vista behind basically every transparent object: Taskbar, Sidebar, window borders, Start Menu etc.

I think it's an embarrassment that Apple clearly copied this after making such a big deal out of Microsoft copying them all the time.

It's also a bit stupid the 2D Dock doesn't do the same blur effect. At least Microsoft has been consistent with it in Windows Vista.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 04:50 AM
 
Well I think this thread has lasted as long as it's gonna go. Got Leopard, and now I am going to be modifying the GUI. And that topic is for discussion for another forum. Not this one.

Cheers.

Feel free to continue your discussion.

And if you want the link to the GUI modification discussion I just started

http://forums.macnn.com/94/gui-custo...d/#post3515075
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 06:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by .Neo View Post
It's used by Windows Vista behind basically every transparent object: Taskbar, Sidebar, window borders, Start Menu etc.

I think it's an embarrassment that Apple clearly copied this after making such a big deal out of Microsoft copying them all the time.

It's also a bit stupid the 2D Dock doesn't do the same blur effect. At least Microsoft has been consistent with it in Windows Vista.
I guess that's because the 2d dock was a last-minute thing, along with the non-transluscent menubar - and now we'll have to wait a year or two to see what might be on the horizon next time. Yet another "minimise-in-place" phenomenon .
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 07:20 AM
 
Originally Posted by MartiNZ View Post
along with the non-transluscent menubar
Like I posted in the Leopard bug thread:



Maybe your GPU card isn't good enough.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 07:35 AM
 
n.m.
( Last edited by Kevin; Oct 26, 2007 at 08:37 AM. )
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 07:59 AM
 
I too like the transparency in the menubar.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 09:34 AM
 
I don't if it only works on certain machines.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 09:42 AM
 
Only because it won't work on yours.

But it will on mine. Therefore I love it.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 11:33 AM
 
Originally Posted by Jasoco View Post
Only because it won't work on yours.
No, I haven't said either way if it does or not, so how do you know it doesn't? There is no reason for this NOT to work on every machine supported by 10.5 is what I am saying. The fact it does not makes me believe it's a "guiltfeature" Meaning they do it to get people to buy new hardware. If it works on your friends new Intel Mac, you want it to work on yours too! (even though I couldn't care less either way, but it's lame)

Apple has been doing this since OS X's inception. Making it supportable on a lot of hardware, but only the most RECENT hardware (within a year or two) gets some special GUI feature that no one else gets.

Sometimes the hardware actually WONT support said feature. And sometimes it will, and Apple just doesn't support it for other reasons...

For example the drop shadow mouse. There was a hack to get it to work on other machines other than the ones Apple supported after said OS came out even though Apple claimed said computer's hardware wouldn't support it. They got called out and was busted for it. I am curious as to what reason the transparent menu wouldn't work on all computers. As I can get a transparent menu just like that in Tiger to work on any computer Tiger supports.

THIS is what I am calling lame. Not the actual menu being transparent.

I am sure I will get replies telling me that I don't know why Apple disabled it for certain computers (and you are right, I don't, but neither does anyone else it seems)

Either way, lame.

If I am able to hack the resources, (May not be a way, not even with SS) I will make this available to anyone that runs 10.5.

BTW expect all of your unsanity applications to no longer work anymore. And I doubt there will be a fix.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 06:13 PM
 
One thing I always change with a new version of Mac OS is the link cursor. I was browsing to change my link cursor and came across these files. I don't remember seeing them in 10.4. I may be mistaken though.

I can't seem to find where they are used. Any ideas?

     
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Oct 26, 2007, 06:17 PM
 

I wasn't sure who made it, but thanks, it's brilliant. I've been using it since I first found it on these forums a while ago. It's perfect for links.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 06:26 PM
 
Does anybody else find the color scheme a bit too... dark? I find it much harder to read the tabs when the window is active in Safari:



The screenshot doesn't really do justice since it "draws" your eyes to it. But in actual use, I just find it hard to read.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 06:31 PM
 
Yeah, the Safari tabs are hard to read.
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Oct 26, 2007, 06:33 PM
 
I don't really find that to be the case by looking at that screenshot.
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Oct 26, 2007, 06:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by ginoledesma View Post
Does anybody else find the color scheme a bit too... dark? I find it much harder to read the tabs when the window is active in Safari:



The screenshot doesn't really do justice since it "draws" your eyes to it. But in actual use, I just find it hard to read.
Looks fine to me. You need to calibrate your display. . . it looks all washed out.
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Oct 26, 2007, 07:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by cSurfr View Post
Looks fine to me. You need to calibrate your display. . . it looks all washed out.
Don't the screenshots preserve what they really look like though (and will differ based on monitor settings)? I've tried 4 different monitors (LCDs, CRTs) and they all have the same hard contrast. I'll try filddling around with color calibration to see if it helps.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 07:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by mdc View Post
One thing I always change with a new version of Mac OS is the link cursor. I was browsing to change my link cursor and came across these files. I don't remember seeing them in 10.4. I may be mistaken though.

I can't seem to find where they are used. Any ideas?

Any chance you could provide the full path to them? Wouldn't mind taking a look myself
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 09:56 PM
 
look how the aqua "Name and Size" look out of place compared to iTune's version.

I just don't understand their reasoning. Well because they haven't given one.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 10:15 PM
 
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Oct 26, 2007, 10:20 PM
 
Inconstancy and crappy GUI placement.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 10:22 PM
 
I'm actually being turned off of Leopard...
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Oct 26, 2007, 10:35 PM
 
Just a clarification, the menubar just reflects what is on your desktop. It's not completely transparent, just a hint. You can see what's behind it, but it's not in your face. Also the Apple logo takes on the color too. It basically blurs what's behind it.





So it does indeed require some sort of graphics hardware accelleration.

I just wish they could have made the aqua widgets ALSO match the color of the desktop. I mean the BLUE menu items and scroll bars stick out too much. Why not sample a few spots on the desktop picture and make an amalgamation of them all and use that as your main color? Or let us choose more than just freaking BLUE and GRAPHITE. We can change colors everywhere else except main widgets.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 10:37 PM
 
I like that Idea. It wouldn't be too hard to take a general hue of the image and fit some widgets to it, and if you don't like it, you can choose another set.
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Oct 26, 2007, 10:55 PM
 
It has bugged me since 10.0 that you can only choose blue and graphite for widgets while the selection color can be anything. OS X HAS the power to change the hue of a widget. It's not that hard. Why can't there be a Graphite, a "Smart" option (Which would sample the desktop) and a "Choose color" option that would give a color picker. OS 9 and OS 8 were awesome with the color choices. I loved red. I always picked red. Now I can't. My menubar is red right now, but when I click a menu it's bright blue. Or look at a scrollbar it's bright blue. Steve said "People like their desktop to look seemless" so he put in a translucent menubar. But overlooked color choices? For 7 years? I would switch to Graphite, but I actually like the stop light buttons colored. And graphite just doesn't look right. I want more choice. I want red widgets!


Now, what I want to know is why we can only see certain select info in the "Show info" option for "Icon view". For folders it's always item count. For images it's resolution, video's it's time, disks it's space. I would love to be able to show other info too. Especially for folders. Like a "Size". I mean in List view we can see size of a folders contents. Why not also "Info" too?


Next, I wish we could set certain Stacks to show the folder icon instead. My Home is in there and it shows the Desktop folder as the top. Makes no sense. Let's allow me to set that to the icon instead, please. Other stacks are fine. I love Stacks actually. Especially sorting by last added. I have it set to download to a folder I have had forever. I call it the "Off the Desktop" folder. Anything I don't have a place for goes in there. It's out of the way and I can still browse. I sort it by date added and it always shows my recent downloads in a fan with an arrow for the hundreds more.


An interface thing I have hated since 10.0 is the tollerance for dragging files into the Dock or into folders and apps in the Dock. I want there to be a delay before it splits to open a space. I rarely add stuff to the Dock, but I drag things into folders all the time down there.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 11:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by Jasoco View Post
It has bugged me since 10.0 that you can only choose blue and graphite for widgets while the selection color can be anything. OS X HAS the power to change the hue of a widget. It's not that hard. Why can't there be a Graphite, a "Smart" option (Which would sample the desktop) and a "Choose color" option that would give a color picker. OS 9 and OS 8 were awesome with the color choices. I loved red. I always picked red. Now I can't. My menubar is red right now, but when I click a menu it's bright blue. Or look at a scrollbar it's bright blue. Steve said "People like their desktop to look seemless" so he put in a translucent menubar. But overlooked color choices? For 7 years? I would switch to Graphite, but I actually like the stop light buttons colored. And graphite just doesn't look right. I want more choice. I want red widgets!
The reason is that if those liquid scrollbars were red, they'd look like blood.

And if they were green, they'd look like any one of a number of unappetizing things.

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Oct 26, 2007, 11:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by CharlesS View Post
The reason is that if those liquid scrollbars were red, they'd look like blood.

And if they were green, they'd look like any one of a number of unappetizing things.


Brilliant! Mac OS X - Chaothic Evil special edition. Mac OS X - the Ooze is loose version.

I just don't know what to pick!

V
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Oct 26, 2007, 11:11 PM
 
They wouldn't look like liquid anymore, they would be color hue shifted versions of the iTunes scroll widgets. In a perfect OS X world.

Also, ABOUT TIME they got rid of the wasted space in QuickTime and DVD Player:
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 11:12 PM
 
Originally Posted by voodoo View Post


Brilliant! Mac OS X - Chaothic Evil special edition. Mac OS X - the Ooze is loose version.

I just don't know what to pick!
Well, I'm sure the end result would be more complaining about how the bloody thing looked.

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Oct 26, 2007, 11:14 PM
 
Originally Posted by adamfishercox View Post
The search text bubble and buttons get closer to the bottom of the menu header if you use "Small Icons." Set them to large and the spacing is more correct.

The spaces between the button clusters is a per-user setting (i.e., Customize Toolbar..."). Mine doesn't look anything like that.

     
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Oct 26, 2007, 11:15 PM
 
There are a a lot of people have been complaining about the remaining Aqua stuff not fitting in with the rest of the OS. Like I said, it doesn't make sense. iTunes looks great.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 11:18 PM
 

This one shows the blur off better.

Also, about time they added the ability to set iPhoto libraries to change at intervals when using them as your desktop. In 10.4 you could chose one pic from the Library and not have it change at all. No changing option.

Also, we can now add folders, more than one custom folder, to the Desktop Pictures source list. Finally.

Edit: Though my next complaint. What's with the ugly white border on icon previews? Not all image files are photographs, Apple!



But I do like that when you hit Return to edit a name it selects all but the extension. Finally.
     
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Oct 26, 2007, 11:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by .Neo View Post
Any chance you could provide the full path to them? Wouldn't mind taking a look myself
/System/Library/Frameworks/WebKit.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/WebCore.framework/Versions/A/Resources
     
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Oct 27, 2007, 12:00 AM
 
Am I crazy or can we not add new columns to List view when in Smart Folders? Nor can we add other stuff or change stuff like icon size in Icon view? WTF? All we get is Name, Kind and Date Opened. How SMART is that? WTF? This is a BIG WTF from me. This makes Smart Folders only 20% as cool as I thought they were. This makes no sense to not allow more columns. Size, Date Modified, Label, WHAT THE FUDGE? Where are they? HOW did they miss that?

Rather WHY DID THEY TAKE IT OUT? It was in there. You could modify a Smart Folder like a normal folder. NOW it's constrained.

Am I just crazy?

     
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Oct 27, 2007, 12:02 AM
 
Originally Posted by Cadaver View Post
The search text bubble and buttons get closer to the bottom of the menu header if you use "Small Icons." Set them to large and the spacing is more correct.

The spaces between the button clusters is a per-user setting (i.e., Customize Toolbar..."). Mine doesn't look anything like that.

Oh, GOOD!
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Oct 27, 2007, 12:20 AM
 
Originally Posted by Jasoco View Post
WTF? All we get is Name, Kind and Date Opened. How SMART is that? WTF? This is a BIG WTF from me. This makes Smart Folders only 20% as cool as I thought they were. This makes no sense to not allow more columns. Size, Date Modified, Label, WHAT THE FUDGE? Where are they? HOW did they miss that?
You're not crazy -- indeed, they are. We can only hope that this is a stopgap before Apple adds arbitrary metadata columns to list view in general, and search views in particular...
     
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Oct 27, 2007, 12:30 AM
 
I just want the customization we HAD BACK!
     
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Oct 27, 2007, 05:58 AM
 
Originally Posted by mdc View Post
/System/Library/Frameworks/WebKit.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/WebCore.framework/Versions/A/Resources
Great! Any thoughts if those cursors are used systemwide or just in Safari? The spinning beach ball isn't there for example.
     
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Oct 27, 2007, 06:15 AM
 
Originally Posted by adamfishercox View Post
Oh, GOOD!
Not quite what you were directly responding about, I don't think, but I have my Finder toolbar reduced to small size, text only, and the only thing in it is what the tooltip refers to as the "back/forward" button. Of course it still only says BACK, because having both options would be too much. And, removing that last item from the toolbar causes it to revert to default state when you open the next window ... still.
     
 
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