[Don Pickett]

So far TM has backed up 6.1 GB, and the only thing I "installed" was the latest Safari update.

[rickey939]

Originally Posted by Don Pickett 

So far TM has backed up 6.1 GB, and the only thing I "installed" was the latest Safari update.

Correct, it's backing up your Applications folder again and System/Library.

[Big Mac]

Why would it do that?

[TETENAL]

It doesn't. It only backs up what changed, which is parts of Safari.app and WebKit. As well as the receipts database which is 242 MB for me. Still the backup after the Safari update was 318 MB for me, not in the gigabytes according to CharlesS' TimeTracker.

[Don Pickett]

Originally Posted by rickey939 

Correct, it's backing up your Applications folder again and System/Library.

Thanks. I hope Apple gets a hand on TM soon, because when it does stupid stuff, it does REALLY stupid stuff.

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by Don Pickett 

Thanks. I hope Apple gets a hand on TM soon, because when it does stupid stuff, it does REALLY stupid stuff.

It's not backing up the entire folders again. Only what was changed.

[Tomchu]

TimeMachine only keeps track of changes to directories, not individual files. This is for performance reasons -- you wouldn't want the file system logging every file that's been changed as you change them. Instead it only logs directories.

When it comes time for a TM backup, it backs up everything in those changed directories. I could be wrong, but this is more or less the gist of what I understood from this: Mac OS X 10.5 Leopard: the Ars Technica review: Page 14

[Big Mac]

So every time one app changes in /Applications/ the whole thing gets backed up again, taking up twice as much space as before? Or is that where the hard linking comes in?

[Simon]

The idea that TM is backing up the entire /Applications directory because of a Safari update is baloney.

Even if TM would only update parent folders the parent folder in this case would be Safari.app/, and certainly not /Applications.

Using TimeTracker I verified that TM only backed up Safari, Webkit, and the receipt. A little more than 300MB.

[Big Mac]

Yeah you're right, that has to be wrong or else TM would be a total joke.

[Tomchu]

Originally Posted by Big Mac 

So every time one app changes in /Applications/ the whole thing gets backed up again, taking up twice as much space as before? Or is that where the hard linking comes in?

No, because Apps are directories. In this case, /Applications/Safari.app/ would be the top-level directory where modifications took place.

However, it makes sense that if some directories with big files were touched, then the next TM backup would be rather large.

[Don Pickett]

Originally Posted by Simon 

The idea that TM is backing up the entire /Applications directory because of a Safari update is baloney.

Even if TM would only update parent folders the parent folder in this case would be Safari.app/, and certainly not /Applications.

Using TimeTracker I verified that TM only backed up Safari, Webkit, and the receipt. A little more than 300MB.

On my machine, the backup was ~7GB.

edit: can you provide a link to TimeTracker?

[TETENAL]

Originally Posted by Tomchu 

TimeMachine only keeps track of changes to directories, not individual files. This is for performance reasons -- you wouldn't want the file system logging every file that's been changed as you change them. Instead it only logs directories.

When it comes time for a TM backup, it backs up everything in those changed directories. I could be wrong, but this is more or less the gist of what I understood from this: Mac OS X 10.5 Leopard: the Ars Technica review: Page 14

You are wrong. Time Machine backs up individual files only if that's what changed. You can easily verify this with TimeTracker. The link can be found in the following thread:

http://forums.macnn.com/90/mac-os-x/...t/#post3632517

[Don Pickett]

Originally Posted by TETENAL 

You are wrong. Time Machine backs up individual files only if that's what changed. You can easily verify this with TimeTracker. The link can be found in the following thread:

http://forums.macnn.com/90/mac-os-x/...t/#post3632517

Not true. Change the name of a directory and it will back up the entire directory.

edit: Just ran TimeTracker. TM backed up the entire /Applications directory. So, while TM is supposed to only back up changed files, it's clear it doesn't always work like it's supposed to. Once again, TM feels like a 0.9 release to me.

[TETENAL]

Originally Posted by Don Pickett 

Not true. Change the name of a directory and it will back up the entire directory.

Yes, but that's not what Tomchu claimed.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by Don Pickett 

On my machine, the backup was ~7GB.

Sure, I don't doubt that at all. But what I am saying is that that has other causes. The Safari update changed only ~300 MB of files. Anything TM is backing up in excess of that is due to other changes that occurred since the last backup.

can you provide a link to TimeTracker?

CharlesS wrote it and I guess since it was more of a "quick 'n dirty" solution he hasn't spread it widely yet. It's not on MU or VT. But CharlesS did link to it in this post.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by Don Pickett 

Not true. Change the name of a directory and it will back up the entire directory.

Yes of course it will. Because the directory has changed. But changing the name of a file within the directory will not cause TM to backup the whole directory.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by Don Pickett 

edit: Just ran TimeTracker. TM backed up the entire /Applications directory. So, while TM is supposed to only back up changed files, it's clear it doesn't always work like it's supposed to. Once again, TM feels like a 0.9 release to me.

That is clearly a bug and not the intended behavior. I have never seen TM behave like that on any of the Macs I administrate. Please report it to Apple.

[Don Pickett]

Originally Posted by Simon 

That is clearly a bug and not the intended behavior. I have never seen TM behave like that on any of the Macs I administrate. Please report it to Apple.

How? I tried to file a bug report about something else and the only thing I could find was a link on the ADC page.

[TETENAL]

Apple - Mac OS X - Feedback

Select "Bug report" as feedback type.

[tridentinecanon]

It made my whole computer crash. Needed a archive/install.

[DCJ001]

Some days, I don't create any new files. I might just surf the internet. But I've noticed that my Time Machine back ups are about 156 MB a few times per day with back ups of about 2 or 3 MB in between. When I do create new files, the back ups are a little bit larger.

I'll take a look at Charles' app, but I'm curious to know if anyone else is having back ups of this size on a regular basis. I've made this observation since the 10.5.2 update.

Thanks.

Edit:

Charles. I installed Time Tracker and it answered my question instantly. This is a great resource, I appreciate it, and I encourage anyone with any question about what is being backed up with Time Machine to download and use Charles' application: Time Tracker:

http://forums.macnn.com/90/mac-os-x/...t/#post3632517

[CharlesS]

Hehe, looks like this thing is getting popular enough that I should tidy it up for a formal release sometime instead of leaving it as a MacNN Special™.

[moep]

The update completely hosed my TM sparseimage (stored on an Infrant ReadyNAS).
All I'm getting is the dreaded "Backup failed with error 21" message in the logs and I recall TM hanging for almost 10 minutes when it was preparing the last Backup. Very frustrating, looks like it's time for another wipe.

[Don Pickett]

Originally Posted by CharlesS 

Hehe, looks like this thing is getting popular enough that I should tidy it up for a formal release sometime instead of leaving it as a MacNN Special™.

It's a great little app, Charles