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Tom C · Sep 4, 2009, 10:14 PM

Software Update showed a new update for the first time since I upgraded to Snow Leopard tonight, and I noticed...no more "install and keep package" or "download only" option, just "install." I didn't notice any hidden options when holding down command, option, etc.

Does anyone else think Apple was silly to cut these options? I don't think that they were confusing; novices would have clicked install in the main window and likely would never have found the other options in the menu bar. If I want to keep a 60MB update so I can install it on another Mac without re-downloading, now I have go through the extra step of going to Apple's web site. It's only an inconvenience, but I thought that the hallmark of the Mac OS was making things easy...

CharlesS · Sep 4, 2009, 11:17 PM

Those options didn't work in Leopard. Choosing "Install and keep package" just resulted in a regular install that didn't keep the package. Therefore, I don't think it's much of a loss.

AKcrab · Sep 4, 2009, 11:51 PM

Originally Posted by CharlesS

Those options didn't work in Leopard. Choosing "Install and keep package" just resulted in a regular install that didn't keep the package. Therefore, I don't think it's much of a loss.

I still can't believe that never got fixed.

Simon · Sep 5, 2009, 01:26 AM

Originally Posted by Tom C

Software Update showed a new update for the first time since I upgraded to Snow Leopard tonight, and I noticed...no more "install and keep package" or "download only" option, just "install." I didn't notice any hidden options when holding down command, option, etc.

Does anyone else think Apple was silly to cut these options?

I'm guessing this might have to do with the fact that SL always keeps the package as default now. When you re-install SL it can automatically install previous decimal updates and I would assume to do that it needs the original packages. IOW what used to be optional is now default and hence no more user option.

Rumor · Sep 5, 2009, 01:31 AM

What Software Update are you getting, because I do not get any.

CharlesS · Sep 5, 2009, 02:07 AM

Originally Posted by Simon

I'm guessing this might have to do with the fact that SL always keeps the package as default now. When you re-install SL it can automatically install previous decimal updates and I would assume to do that it needs the original packages. IOW what used to be optional is now default and hence no more user option.

If that's true, we should be able to find the package for Rosetta somewhere, since it gets installed by Software Update if you use the download method of installing it instead of installing it from the disc.

Simon · Sep 5, 2009, 02:32 AM

I don't know if the Rosetta on-the-fly update works the same way SU does, but I'd guess the underlying framework is the same.

CharlesS · 04:53 AM

Well, it's usually not too long after a major OS X release that the first update shows up, so we'll surely find out before too long. What I do know is that the on-the-fly Rosetta install is done by the Software Update application.

My gut feeling, though, is that they wouldn't do this, because it would take up a lot of space. More likely, when reinstalling, I would expect the installer to ignore any files that were not part of the original installation, and only overwrite what hasn't been updated. Keeping the packages would be space-consuming, and sort of against the spirit of Snow Leopard.

AKcrab · Sep 5, 2009, 04:26 AM

From a certified apple tech point of view, I'm very interested in how this will play out.

Tom C · Sep 5, 2009, 07:41 AM

Originally Posted by CharlesS

Those options didn't work in Leopard. Choosing "Install and keep package" just resulted in a regular install that didn't keep the package. Therefore, I don't think it's much of a loss.

"Download Only" worked fine. As for "Install and Keep," I was hoping that they were going to fix that.

Originally Posted by Rumor

What Software Update are you getting, because I do not get any.

Remote Desktop Client Update 3.3.1. Maybe that was a pre-SL download that I missed earlier?

Originally Posted by Simon

I'm guessing this might have to do with the fact that SL always keeps the package as default now. When you re-install SL it can automatically install previous decimal updates and I would assume to do that it needs the original packages. IOW what used to be optional is now default and hence no more user option.

If that's the case, I haven't been able to find it. I thought that SL didn't reinstall old updates, but instead was supposed to recognize updated files somehow and not replace them with the old versions on re-install?

Simon · Sep 5, 2009, 08:05 AM

Originally Posted by Tom C

If that's the case, I haven't been able to find it.

Using a tool like fseventer you should be able to find out where the downloaded package is going on your Mac. If it's just some cache area in /etc that would be a sign it's probably discarded after installation. But maybe they keep it and stash it away somewhere else.

Simon · Sep 5, 2009, 08:08 AM

Hmm. On second thought, Apple's updates are quite easy to find on their support page. Maybe they removed the option because they felt it wasn't really necessary. Again, just guessing.

mduell · Sep 5, 2009, 10:58 AM

Originally Posted by CharlesS

More likely, when reinstalling, I would expect the installer to ignore any files that were not part of the original installation, and only overwrite what hasn't been updated.

Any evidence for that? The initial install is evidence to the contrary, where newer versions on the Mac were overwritten with the version on the SL disk.

CharlesS · Sep 5, 2009, 03:11 PM

None whatsoever - just speculation on my part, based on the reports that the 10.6 installer is designed to leave any 10.6.x updates installed after doing a reinstall of the OS, in order to save users time running Software Update. There won't be any way to get any real evidence either way until 10.6.1 comes out and we can actually try it.

Rumor · Sep 5, 2009, 03:47 PM

Originally Posted by Tom C

Remote Desktop Client Update 3.3.1. Maybe that was a pre-SL download that I missed earlier?

IIRC, SL does software updates before it installs.

CharlesS · Sep 12, 2009, 02:10 PM

Well, 10.6.1 is installed, and I don't see any stored package for it anywhere. Have you been able to find anything in your file system?