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You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac OS X > Why isn't anyone so excited about Yosemite?

Why isn't anyone so excited about Yosemite?
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Jul 22, 2014, 08:17 AM
 
Hey,

where's the 10.10 excitement? Just asking... Isn't this amazingly big news? Just wondering... What's the best feature? The interface is hilarious - is it? Where is all the noise?

Greetings,
Pete
     
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Jul 22, 2014, 08:40 AM
 
It is big news, but so was Mavericks, and that wasn't that long ago. I personally think that an announced but as yet not finalized or released new OS version isn't something for me to get excited about. Not yet anyway. When the final version hist the streets, and when people start having real experience with it, then I might get excited.

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Jul 23, 2014, 07:32 PM
 
I'm ecstatic.

I was ecstatic about 10.9... had to watch the keynote for it twice.
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Jul 24, 2014, 11:34 AM
 
Unless a newer version of the OS makes a radical, significant impact on my processing, I don't get excited about OS updates.
     
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Jul 24, 2014, 05:47 PM
 
Yosemite is...eh. Mostly the interface is a shift in the right direction, but it doesn't really matter all that much. Why is great is Swift, but that will take some time before the average user sees a real benefit from.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
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Jul 25, 2014, 12:06 PM
 
I'm quite excited, but having worked with OS X betas a lot, I don't want to install it on my work machine. So I'll wait patiently until 10.10.0 is released to the public. I don't know how much I'll like the new look (some things are great and elegant while others look a bit stark), though. What I am looking forward to the most, though, is the updated Mail (in my experience, Mail is the big sore point in Mavericks to me, other than that, Mavericks is a rock solid release).
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Jul 25, 2014, 02:22 PM
 
I haven't even moved from Snow Leopard on my work machine, so Yosemite isn't all that of an attraction at all. I have the installers for ML and Mavericks, but just haven't had a reason to install one or the other.
     
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Jul 25, 2014, 02:55 PM
 
Not sure, but the Public Beta has been rock solid since I installed it last night. Everything works as far as I can tell and 1Password even has a Yosemite Beta out already.

Still putting it through its paces today but I have yet to find any bugs.

Really liking the new interface - seems more elegant and minimalistic.

That said, I don't use my Macs for productivity. My iMac is in my office and is home to my iTunes library that is streamed to AppleTV and synched with our iDevices. I use it when I'm teleworking from home to browse the internet, check email, manage checkbook, etc. when I take breaks.

I wish they would allow one Apple ID to have more than one Beta key. I got my key and installed it on my iMac. When I went to download and install on my MBP it said the key was used and there were no options I could find to obtain a new one.
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Jul 25, 2014, 04:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by Thorzdad View Post
I haven't even moved from Snow Leopard on my work machine, so Yosemite isn't all that of an attraction at all. I have the installers for ML and Mavericks, but just haven't had a reason to install one or the other.
You have a desktop, right? Otherwise, Mavericks gave me an instant battery life upgrade.
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Jul 25, 2014, 04:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
You have a desktop, right? Otherwise, Mavericks gave me an instant battery life upgrade.
Yes. A late 2009 iMac. I think it's one of the oldest models that can run Mavericks and Yosemite, because it can boot into 64 bit mode.
     
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Jul 25, 2014, 05:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by Thorzdad View Post
I haven't even moved from Snow Leopard on my work machine, so Yosemite isn't all that of an attraction at all. I have the installers for ML and Mavericks, but just haven't had a reason to install one or the other.
Ditto... If it ain't broke (later os some have indicated) so the devil I know - and the digital assets of past (ppc era) that research & content creation depends are not a question mark or make work project - exhausted & burned out on even the thought of annual upgrades, including the overhead and uncertainty of the bleeding edge, and I still love my 2010 i7 imac - 4k might tempt me, and ibooks author, but beyond that all has been working rather well, and I don't have to worry about time & money for tech support & training...
     
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Jul 25, 2014, 07:00 PM
 
I have been testing "Yosemite" Sam for a while now and all I can say is I long for Snow Leopard... but with a 64bit back end. To be frank I find the "new" interface really tired and Apple's new focus on ordering the user around a bit more like M$ the the Apple I new a loved (when Steve ran the show)

Just my humble opinion..

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Jul 25, 2014, 08:04 PM
 
You're pining for the PRE-Jobs Apple.

Jobs was the guy who was all about restricting options.
     
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Jul 25, 2014, 08:10 PM
 
Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa View Post
Not sure, but the Public Beta has been rock solid since I installed it last night.
^ This.


I've only found (and politely reported) one very minor bug, and that's with the iTunes 12 beta... but everything I've tested for "normal use" in Yosemite is at least better than on Mavericks.
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Jul 25, 2014, 09:43 PM
 
It is just an OS evolution. It happens every so often. Nothing to get all excited about unless you are Gates/Ballmer churning Windows versions to make big bucks.
     
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Jul 26, 2014, 02:08 AM
 
Another post & run thread by Peter. Is he doing this on purpose ?

-t
     
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Jul 26, 2014, 03:33 AM
 
Originally Posted by PeterParker View Post
Hey,

where's the 10.10 excitement? Just asking... Isn't this amazingly big news? Just wondering... What's the best feature? The interface is hilarious - is it? Where is all the noise?

Greetings,
Pete
There's a new OS every year or two. There are updates galore. There are security patches, fixes for this and that, and releases on a constant stream.

There's going to be a market burn-out eventually. Most of the people I know who use Macs are on 10.8.x, and have iPhones still on iOS 6... just like me. When I ask them why they haven't upgraded, they always tell me the same thing: no time to screw around with the equipment - it's working, it ain't broken, why muck with it?

It used to be that a major OS update took years to polish & fine tune, and it was a real event when the launch arrived. Nowadays, it's just yet another in a long & seemingly endless line of updates, and ho-hum, why get excited about something that happens all too frequently?
     
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Jul 26, 2014, 04:23 AM
 
There's nothing for me in this update. I don't use iOS devices so the hand-off thing is useless to me. The rest of it is just tweaking UI stuff to no great end or advantage. This marks four Mac OS releases in a row that I'm either indifferent to or appalled by. I guess I'm sticking with Snow Leopard until the wheels fall off.
     
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Jul 26, 2014, 11:02 AM
 
Handoff is very cool and I look forward to it since I use 5s/iPad/MBP and move among the 3 devices constantly. However I will be waiting to see iOS8 and later builds of Yosemite before actually risking my workflow on two new OS versions. Ergo no "excitement" just yet thank you.
     
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Jul 26, 2014, 11:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by matt_s View Post

It used to be that a major OS update took years to polish & fine tune, and it was a real event when the launch arrived. Nowadays, it's just yet another in a long & seemingly endless line of updates, and ho-hum, why get excited about something that happens all too frequently?
And yet everyone bitches that Apple has forgotten about the Mac when OS X or hardware product cycles get too long.
     
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Jul 26, 2014, 11:46 AM
 
The interface tweaks look good and the iOS integration is overdue but welcome -- airdrop between Macs and iOS, answering calls on OS X, and a few other things stand out for me. I'd love to use the beta but there is one key piece of software that doesn't work with Yosemite yet.
     
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Jul 26, 2014, 03:14 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
And yet everyone bitches that Apple has forgotten about the Mac when OS X or hardware product cycles get too long.
I think there's a happy medium that Apple has yet to discover. I also think that people are understanding that the reason Apple's "upgrades" are free is to lock more users into their ecosystem & generate more revenue. But mostly, I think it's about people's time.

I don't have the time I used to have when I was younger to fight with a damn computer that was hosed by a recent update. Whether that break was OS related or 3rd party application based, I don't really care... I just know that all the shit I have to do is being delayed while I waste my time fixing a frigging machine when I could be goofing off with my grand kids.

When I upgraded a test machine to Mavericks, it broke my scanner and my speakers. iTunes launched automatically and would start playing all by itself. Mail lost thousands of old emails. I was told to upgrade about a dozen applications in order to get them to work again but instead of spending that money & wasting my time working on a fix, I simply deleted that partition & went back to my business.

All this time, effort, expense and waste is supposed to be celebrated? Gimme a break.
     
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Jul 27, 2014, 11:52 AM
 
I downloaded the beta, installed it and it immediately broke my iCloud Keychain syncing with Mavericks machines. That's not good since I'm not ready to install a beta on my daily MacBook. I was able to recreate the keychain, but if I cannot test the beta alongside my other Macs, it's not worth the trouble caused to the working machines.

The other feature that cannot be tested is iCloud Drive since it too requires all machines be on the same beta - not going to happen yet.

All this means, there is limited ability to try much. Looks great though. Pretty. For me though excitement perhaps will follow with a later beta that I can really try.
     
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Jul 27, 2014, 04:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by matt_s View Post
Mail lost thousands of old emails.
When I upgraded to 10.4 years ago, and decided that I didn't like it, I wanted to downgrade back to 10.3... and I lost all the mail that I had received... including some at-the-time heartwarming letters. That was the day that I learned not to put my trust into mail software. Since then, I have gotten myself into the habit of copying and pasting all of my important emails to individual text files (and manually typing in reference numbers, the From, the To, and the Subject lines, for every single one of these communications). These files are stored all throughout my computer and organized in individual folders by organization and/or sender. In the last 10 years, my system has yet to fail, or result in compatibility or software-dependency issues, or require internet access to reference what someone said... and searching for a random phrase in the one email that I need out of 10,000 communications has been successful over 95% of the time. All I need is a program that can read text files.
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Jul 27, 2014, 06:40 PM
 
The two most important reasons I was excited about (iCloud Drive and Handoff/Continuity) are not yet fully operational in the public beta of Yosemite. Yes, iCloud Drive exists and gives you an enormous amount of space ( 275+ GB ). However, you can only access it from machines running Yosemite or iOS 8, so I've been unable to do much with it.

Likewise, Handoff and all the Continuity features are also not operational in Public Beta 1.

I suspect that might have something to do with the relative lack of buzz associated with Yosemite so far. Anyone feel the same as I do?
     
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Jul 28, 2014, 09:43 AM
 
I'm actually really looking forward to handoff and iCloud drive, since I also use an iPad and an iPhone.

However, I'm dreading having to verify before upgrading that all the tools of my business will continue to run, figuring out which updatesi need to wait on, researching user reports on whether those updates actually DO work flawlessly, and then verifying AFTER the upgrade that they really do, for me, too...
     
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Jul 28, 2014, 04:07 PM
 
I have it installed and it took me a while to find out that there is now a dark appearance ...and I really love it!! Bye-bye "Obsidian Menu Bar"!

But with the dark appearance there is also a dark side:
- had to re-install it once already because trying to enable Trim support broke the whole system somehow (not really Apple's problem though except that they still don't support 3rd party SSDs)
- Maps doesn't show any maps (but that seems to be me only)
- Mail loads the Emails from the last 2 days over and over every time I start Mail
(- and a small graphics bug in iTunes which is not important at all and may have even been there for quite a long time - I don't know)
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Jul 28, 2014, 06:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
Another post & run thread by Peter. Is he doing this on purpose ?

-t
Does it keep you up awake at nights? Maybe you should avoid his posts?

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Jul 28, 2014, 07:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by unicast reversepath View Post
Does it keep you up awake at nights? Maybe you should avoid his posts?
No, it's just annoying.

I, for one, will not respond to him anymore, because it's most likely a waste of my time.

-t
     
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Jul 29, 2014, 10:53 AM
 
He's probably still busy downloading Yosemite but won't tell anyone
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Jul 29, 2014, 02:59 PM
 
There is something weird going on with the favorites and tab bar in safari 8.0!
They sometimes just disappear ...then , when I try to hide them, only the content disappears but not the bar itself... and they reappear even though they are still hidden...
Everything seems to be fine in fullscreen mode though!
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Jul 29, 2014, 05:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by And.reg View Post
When I upgraded to 10.4 years ago, and decided that I didn't like it, I wanted to downgrade back to 10.3... and I lost all the mail that I had received... including some at-the-time heartwarming letters. That was the day that I learned not to put my trust into mail software. Since then, I have gotten myself into the habit of copying and pasting all of my important emails to individual text files (and manually typing in reference numbers, the From, the To, and the Subject lines, for every single one of these communications). These files are stored all throughout my computer and organized in individual folders by organization and/or sender. In the last 10 years, my system has yet to fail, or result in compatibility or software-dependency issues, or require internet access to reference what someone said... and searching for a random phrase in the one email that I need out of 10,000 communications has been successful over 95% of the time. All I need is a program that can read text files.
That sounds like a lot of work. IMAP is not good enough?

Steve
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Jul 29, 2014, 06:28 PM
 
What's IMAP, and how would I use IMAP for my emails?
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Jul 29, 2014, 06:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by bobolicious View Post
Ditto... If it ain't broke (later os some have indicated) so the devil I know - and the digital assets of past (ppc era) that research & content creation depends are not a question mark or make work project - exhausted & burned out on even the thought of annual upgrades, including the overhead and uncertainty of the bleeding edge, and I still love my 2010 i7 imac - 4k might tempt me, and ibooks author, but beyond that all has been working rather well, and I don't have to worry about time & money for tech support & training...
For the first time ever I actually skipped: Lion and Mtn Lion struck me as “transition” OSes, #1 because of the “unfinished” support of multiple displays, and #2, the “Save/Save As” debacle in Mtn (if I recall accurately). I hung back on Mavx until the Yosemite announcement, then ported my system to a clone partition and upgraded the clone to 10.9.4. Testing, testing . . .

Everything works.

Just a few minor tweaks, and sometimes I forget I upgraded. And this is on a “Late 2009” Mini. I had the foresight to max out the RAM to 8GB, and install a “Fusion” (aka Seagate hybrid) drive earlier this year.

And it runs a system “hack” called MaxMenus, from 2007. Who needed LaunchPad?

I also moved the spouse’s ’09 vintage MacBook to Mavx (so close to Manx!) and we’re doin’ okay so far.

Looking forward to adding NAS from WD very soon.
     
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Jul 29, 2014, 07:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by And.reg View Post
What's IMAP, and how would I use IMAP for my emails?
Internet Message Access Protocol - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

All your email is stored on the server, accessible by any client on any machine. If you want to save a message locally, you can and there will always be a copy on the server. Are you using a POP server instead of IMAP?

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Jul 29, 2014, 08:02 PM
 
And what if I have 4 different places where I check email? With IMAP that means I need to log into four different places, right?

Like I said, I shouldn't have to be online to re-visit email that I've already read in case I need it.

I have no idea if I'm using IMAP or POP. How do I tell?
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Jul 29, 2014, 08:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by And.reg View Post
And what if I have 4 different places where I check email? With IMAP that means I need to log into four different places, right?
You'll have to log into 4 different places either way.* The difference between IMAP and POP is that IMAP makes synching e-mail inboxes across devices much easier: IMAP is designed so that the »truth is on the server« while with POP you download mails and then they are removed from the server. You can leave mails on POP servers for a predetermined amount of time, but the idea is to download your mails and eventually delete them from the server. IMAP syncs things like mail read/unread, flagged/unflagged and such. And you can have different mailboxes on the server.
Originally Posted by And.reg View Post
I have no idea if I'm using IMAP or POP. How do I tell?
Open Mail's Preferences, select the Accounts tab and look below the account's name in the left column: it should read either POP, IMAP or Exchange.

* With places, do you mean accounts? I re-read your post and it's not quite clear to me.
( Last edited by OreoCookie; Jul 30, 2014 at 01:25 AM. )
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Jul 30, 2014, 12:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by And.reg View Post
And what if I have 4 different places where I check email? With IMAP that means I need to log into four different places, right?

Like I said, I shouldn't have to be online to re-visit email that I've already read in case I need it.
You don't. It's just synchronized automatically, but you get a local copy on your computer.

iOS devices will only store the latest 50 emails by default, but if you're online, you can search across all mailboxes' entire contents.
     
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Jul 30, 2014, 09:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
Open Mail's Preferences, select the Accounts tab and look below the account's name in the left column: it should read either POP, IMAP or Exchange.

* With places, do you mean accounts? I re-read your post and it's not quite clear to me.
^ I would have to log onto webpages on four different websites on the internet where I would have to enter my email information (unique for each site) to check my mail.

One of those places uses IMAP, another uses POP (because apparently IMAP would crash their server), and I haven't checked the others.


Also, Once I get this all setup in Mail.app, is there a way for me to just check email from only one of my addresses and not the others?
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Jul 30, 2014, 11:12 AM
 
Originally Posted by And.reg View Post
^ I would have to log onto webpages on four different websites on the internet where I would have to enter my email information (unique for each site) to check my mail.
Webmail is completely independent IMAP and POP.
Originally Posted by And.reg View Post
Also, Once I get this all setup in Mail.app, is there a way for me to just check email from only one of my addresses and not the others?
In Mail.app you don't care how many times you need to log in, because you give your credentials once and never need to enter them again. You can selectively check e-mail accounts in Mail if that's what you want, though.
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Jul 30, 2014, 12:29 PM
 
I found out that most of what I would access just happens to be POP-only anyway... so if it's a big email or spam it can stay on the server.

Alright, thread is getting de-railed....


Yosemite: the 4-minute reminder is now right to left, instead of flip-down. I found flip-down easier to notice and less rushed. What do you think?
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Jul 31, 2014, 12:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
Webmail is completely independent IMAP and POP.
Actually, wouldn't webmail always be like IMAP ?

The emails are still on the server after you viewed them via webmail.

-t
     
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Jul 31, 2014, 05:27 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
Actually, wouldn't webmail always be like IMAP ?

The emails are still on the server after you viewed them via webmail.

-t
Seems like I have to read a lot more about IMAP and POP since I always thought that it's the opposite??
I only use POP because I don't like when the emails disappear from the server as soon as I read them with Mail on my notebook for example - I still want them to appear on my phone as well!

I'm getting to old for this since it seems that I don't even understand the difference between such simple things anymore!?

Edit: Ok, you're right, I just googled it - it's not the opposite! Now I'm even more confused why I still receive all my Emails on my computer AND my iPhone even though I don't use IMAP?
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Jul 31, 2014, 06:00 AM
 
POP clients such as iOS or Mac Mail apps are usually set to leave messages on the server for a week after it's been checked by a client. (See for yourself in the various devices' mail settings.)

Any other POP client that checks in the meantime will see everything as "new" mail.

IMAP, by contrast, leaves the emails on the server until you move them - to the trash, or to a local folder, and mails you have read will appear on all other devices, but they won't appear as unread. And when you delete them from the mailbox on one device or move them to another folder, they will be deleted or moved for all IMAP-synced devices.

This implies that huge mailboxes are synced everywhere, including on mobile devices, where space is precious. iOS gets around this by only syncing the latest fifty or one hundred mails per IMAP mailbox. You can still search the entire mailbox, though.
     
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Jul 31, 2014, 07:05 AM
 
Thanks for the info - I want IMAP then but AFAIK yahoo and gmx don't offer it for unpaid accounts!?

It also seems that Apple Fotostream wants to be IMAP but rather is more like POP with a bug!
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Jul 31, 2014, 07:16 AM
 
GMX has offered IMAP for their free accounts for years - they don't publicize it, because they want your money. But I've had my GMX set up as IMAP for a while now.

Yahoo was the PROTOTYPE for IMAP on the iPhone, and specifically featured at the January 2007 iPhone introduction as supporting "Push" email via IMAP on all accounts.

PhotoStream has, to my knowledge, absolutely nothing to do with either protocol - they're limited to email.
     
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Jul 31, 2014, 08:23 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
GMX has offered IMAP for their free accounts for years - they don't publicize it, because they want your money. But I've had my GMX set up as IMAP for a while now.

Yahoo was the PROTOTYPE for IMAP on the iPhone, and specifically featured at the January 2007 iPhone introduction as supporting "Push" email via IMAP on all accounts.
Really, I think I have to check that again! I was sure that one of the reasons I didn't bother with IMAP was that it wasn't supported for my accounts anyway!


Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
PhotoStream has, to my knowledge, absolutely nothing to do with either protocol - they're limited to email.
I think you misunderstood me - what I meant was that Fotostream claims that you can delete a photo from the stream on one device for example and it will be deleted from the stream on every other device (just like IMAP emails) but that never worked!
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Jul 31, 2014, 09:47 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
Actually, wouldn't webmail always be like IMAP ?

The emails are still on the server after you viewed them via webmail.
POP and IMAP are different from webmail, and there are many free mail services with webmail interface that use POP. And no, webmail doesn't work like IMAP, because the point of IMAP is that your mailboxes stay in sync across devices: all mail clients ask the server for the »truth«.
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Jul 31, 2014, 09:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
GMX has offered IMAP for their free accounts for years - they don't publicize it, because they want your money. But I've had my GMX set up as IMAP for a while now.
Interesting. Do you have a link which shows how to set that up? (I was always under the impression that GMX only allows IMAP access for paying customers.)
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Jul 31, 2014, 10:47 AM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
POP and IMAP are different from webmail, and there are many free mail services with webmail interface that use POP. And no, webmail doesn't work like IMAP, because the point of IMAP is that your mailboxes stay in sync across devices: all mail clients ask the server for the »truth«.
Well, yeah, but the point is: reading an email in Webmail does NOT delete it from the server. It does NOT "download" the email.
Webmail acts a little bit like an IMAP client - the mails are retained on the server.
Doesn't matter if the sever is POP or IMAP.

(And yes, there are differences, I perfectly understand that.)

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