[KeyLimePi]

Okay, sorry if I'm a networking idiot, but I'm trying to move the files from my sister's old Rev.B iMac (OS 9.2) onto the shiny new LCD iMac I got her for Christmas (Jag). I bought a crossover cable and thought I could just connect the two with it and move the files via AppleTalk.

But I tried for almost two hours with no luck. I do use a crossover cable, right? That will work with Appletalk? I don't think I want to use TCP/IP, do I.

Basically I made sure AppleTalk was active on both machines, and was set for the Ethernet. On the old machine I would try to see the connection either by going to the Chooser or by using Network Browser. On the new machine I tried to see the other Mac by just going down to 'Connect to Server..'

Any idea what I'm doing wrong? Or can someone offer a step-by-step for getting an OS 9 and an OSX machine to talk?

[dreilly1]

New Macs don't explicitly need a crossover cable, as the ethernet ports are auto-sensing and will crossover internally if needed.

I haven't done a point-to-point ethernet network in a while, but in all likelihood you'll have to make sure that both machines have different IP addresses (on the same subnet). 10.0.0.1 and 10.0.0.2 are good to use. Also, make sure that the machine that you want to use actually has file sharing turned on in the OS X Sharing control panel, or the equivalent OS 9 panel. I imagine that would work. (I don't think you can use Appletalk directly without TCP/IP anymore)

Does the Rev. B iMac have firewire? Because you can connect the two machines via firewire and initiate Target Disk Mode. Shut one of the machines down, and connect them via the firewire cable. While you turn the machine back on, hold down the "t" key at the same time. That machine's screen will switch to displaying the firewire logo, and its drive will appear on the other Mac's desktop. Copy all the needed files over, and then to stop sharing, throw the drive into the trash to unmount it, then turn off the other machine.

Much easier than Ethernet....

[KeyLimePi]

Oh man do I wish it had Firewire. That would be great, since I have a little 25GB Firewire external drive (and an iPod)...but no luck. Just USB, so I figure Ethernet was my best option.

Good advice about the IP addresses and the subnet mask. I never mess with that stuff because I don't know what any of it means. But I guess I should configure each machine manually with a simple IP and all first. I was kind of hoping that Appletalk would be as simple as Rendezvous but I guess not.

Anyway, thanks for the advice.

[superlarry]

Originally posted by dreilly1:
New Macs don't explicitly need a crossover cable, as the ethernet ports are auto-sensing and will crossover internally if needed.

both computers have to be autosensing for the autosensing to work, i believe.
and right - make sure to set manual IP addresses (making sure they're not set up for DHCP because they won't find a DHCP server nor their resulting addresses). things *should* work after that. just remember to switch it back if you're hooked up to broadband.

[wulf]

Originally posted by superlarry:
both computers have to be autosensing for the autosensing to work, i believe.

I think only one machine needs to be auto-sensing. Seem to remember connecting an old PowerBook with a newer G4 using a standard cable. Was a while ago though, so could be mistaken...

[christ]

Remember the subnet mask - I can't remember the subnet mask for 10.0.0.x (255.0.0.0?) but if you use 192.168.0.x, the subnet mask is 255.255.255.0

[KeyLimePi]

Many thanks for all the good advice. I finally did get it to work, but it was the weirdest thing...

After trying for nearly an hour with still no luck I wanted to make sure there wasn't a problem with the crossover cable, so I opened up my iBook (running Jag) and connected it to the iMac (also Jag) and, of course they saw each other immediately.

Then on a whim I booted my iBook into OS9, turned on AppleTalk, Filesharing, etc. and sure enough the iMac saw the iBook again, no problem.

And as soon as I pulled the cable out of the iBook and plugged it into the older iMac, it showed up on the new iMac! Didn't change a single setting from what I'd been using for the last hour. Didn't even reboot. I can't understand it. I'm sure I was doing something wrong, but I still don't know what.

But, I got it to work...pulled about 2GB off the old iMac in about 20 minutes, which will live out the rest of its life as gaming machine for my neice & nephew.

Thanks again for all the good info.

[dreilly1]

Originally posted by christ:
Remember the subnet mask - I can't remember the subnet mask for 10.0.0.x (255.0.0.0?) but if you use 192.168.0.x, the subnet mask is 255.255.255.0

You're right that the "proper" netmask for 10.x.x.x is 255.0.0.0 .
But the subnet mask only really needs to be set to "0" for the part of the IP that changes from computer to computer.

So, if all of your address fit the pattern 10.0.0.x , then a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0 will still work.

(Remember that real IP addresses and masks are really binary-oriented, and the netmask indicates which binary bits in the IP address stays the same in the local network. Real networks do all sorts of tricks with the netmask - if you have more than 255 computers on a single ethernet network, then a mask of 255.255.255.0 is not sufficient. But a mask of 255.255.0.0 occupies 64K addresses, which is most likely way too big. The solution is to make the netmask go partway through the third byte: a netmask of 255.255.254.0 can handle 510 addresses, and IP's like 10.0.0.1 and 10.0.1.1 will be on the same network, but not 10.0.2.1...)