[tritonus]

I'm having problems configuring my 17" PB AirPort Extreme with AirPort Extreme base station and Alcatel SpeedTouch Pro (Firewall, with 4-port hub) ADSL router.

My base station now lists TWICE in the admin program. I tried resetting (1 sec) and resetting to defaults (5 sec), still listing twice. I can't config either of them in AirPort admin utility! I'm still on 5.01 firmware and can't connect to config menu in order to upgrade to 5.03. AirPort software is 3.0 from AirPort base station CD.

What next?

Which port of the AirPort base station do I connect with my Alcatel router (WAN or LAN)?

DHPC or manual? (Alcatel is my DHCP server for the LAN)

Disable IP address sharing on AirPort extreme base station? Disable NAT/PAT (Alcatel does this for my ADSL line)?

Setup Guide didn't help me much. So please, all you network gurus out there.

[jtbowden]

I'm having problems configuring my 17" PB AirPort Extreme with AirPort Extreme base station and Alcatel SpeedTouch Pro (Firewall, with 4-port hub) ADSL router.

My base station now lists TWICE in the admin program. I tried resetting (1 sec) and resetting to defaults (5 sec), still listing twice. I can't config either of them in AirPort admin utility! I'm still on 5.01 firmware and can't connect to config menu in order to upgrade to 5.03. AirPort software is 3.0 from AirPort base station CD.

What next?

Which port of the AirPort base station do I connect with my Alcatel router (WAN or LAN)?

DHPC or manual? (Alcatel is my DHCP server for the LAN)

Disable IP address sharing on AirPort extreme base station? Disable NAT/PAT (Alcatel does this for my ADSL line)?

Setup Guide didn't help me much. So please, all you network gurus out there.

Your Airport WAN port should connect to your router. You should turn off IP address sharing assuming your router has DHCP serving on.

Your Airport shows up twice probably because you are also plugged into your network. The admin program will sense the Airport over Ethernet and over wireless. This shouldn't be a problem.

Assuming you have the IP sharing and DHCP all worked out, you should be able to access the basestation easily.

I'm no expert, but I set up the same deal with a few routers and switches at my parents' house. I'm pretty sure these are the settings I used.

Does this help?

[aaanorton]

You have a couple choice:

modem > WAN port of AEBS, LAN port of AEBS > uplink or LAN port of router.
In this case the AEBS should do NAT and DHCP and the router should NOT.

modem > WAN port of router, LAN port of router > LAN port of AEBS
In this case the router would do NAT and DHCP and the AEBS would NOT.

You can do it either way, but you can't have both doing NAT/DHCP. And only one WAN port (the first one) should be used as outlined above.

[tritonus]

Originally posted by jtbowden:
Your Airport WAN port should connect to your router. You should turn off IP address sharing assuming your router has DHCP serving on.

Your Airport shows up twice probably because you are also plugged into your network. The admin program will sense the Airport over Ethernet and over wireless. This shouldn't be a problem.

Assuming you have the IP sharing and DHCP all worked out, you should be able to access the basestation easily.

I'm no expert, but I set up the same deal with a few routers and switches at my parents' house. I'm pretty sure these are the settings I used.

Does this help?

Thanks! In the meantime, I managed to re-configure, ABS not attached to router. I upgraded firmware to 5.03.

Are you sure it's the WAN port? In my manual, both ports (LAN and WAN) are mentioned for Ethernet networks. What's the logic here?

You're right about the display-twice-thing.

I turned off IP sharing on ABS.

One problem seems to be that ABS has IP address 10.0.1.1, while my router is on 10.0.0.138. My PB 17" has 10.0.0.1 via DHCP (Ethernet).

Thanks so much!

[aaanorton]

Originally posted by tritonus:
Are you sure it's the WAN port? In my manual, both ports (LAN and WAN) are mentioned for Ethernet networks. What's the logic here?

WAN should be used to interface your LAN to the internet. That's it. It is not an "in" port.

One problem seems to be that ABS has IP address 10.0.1.1, while my router is on 10.0.0.138. My PB 17" has 10.0.0.1 via DHCP (Ethernet).

You've got two DHCP servers going. this is a problem. All the devices on the LAN should be in the same range/subnet. Turn off the DHCP server that is AFTER the device connected directly to your modem.

[jtbowden]

Yeah, sorry - LAN port. WAN on your router should connect to your modem and your router should have DHCP serving turned on.

LAN on the base station should connect to the router and DHCP serving should be off.

The reason the base station has both WAN and LAN ports is that when it is acting as a firewall, it has to isolate the WAN from the LAN. In other words, it has to know which side is the outside world so that it can prevent it from unauthorized access. Other than that, both ports are similar. That is, the base station can broadcast connections from either the WAN or the LAN over wireless.

[tritonus]

Originally posted by aaanorton:
WAN should be used to interface your LAN to the internet. That's it. It is not an "in" port.

You've got two DHCP servers going. this is a problem. All the devices on the LAN should be in the same range/subnet. Turn off the DHCP server that is AFTER the device connected directly to your modem.

Hmm, I'm not so sure. "Alcatel SpeedTouch Pro with Firewall" manual says "ADSL modem" on the front page but says "DSL router including DHCP server, DNS server, NAT/PAT, CIDR and VLSM" on the inside. What gives, router or modem? I don't have a WAN port on my Alcatel, just a line out (to DSL) and a 4-port hub. So maybe it's WAN port after all. I tried with WAN port now, seems to work better.

I told ABS to disable IP sharing and set ABS manually to 10.0.0.137, subnet 255.0.0.0, router 10.0.0.138. Correct?

Thanks aaanorton!

[tritonus]

Originally posted by jtbowden:
Yeah, sorry - LAN port. WAN on your router should connect to your modem and your router should have DHCP serving turned on.

LAN on the base station should connect to the router and DHCP serving should be off.

The reason the base station has both WAN and LAN ports is that when it is acting as a firewall, it has to isolate the WAN from the LAN. In other words, it has to know which side is the outside world so that it can prevent it from unauthorized access. Other than that, both ports are similar. That is, the base station can broadcast connections from either the WAN or the LAN over wireless.

See my reply to aaanorton (above). You may have been right after all.

[tritonus]

Sorry for the Modem/Router confusion!

[tritonus]

Here's what I was talking about...

http://www.alcateldsl.com/prodprofw.htm

[aaanorton]

Ah, OK, so this is an all-in-one unit: modem and router? I thought we were talking about a modem, a router and an ABS.
Well, if you leave the Alcatel doing the DHCP and NAT work (your choice) then plug it into the LAN port of the ABS. If you want, turn off the router features of the Alcatel, plug it into the WAN port on the ABS and enable DHCP and NAT on the ABS. Doesn't really matter.

I told ABS to disable IP sharing and set ABS manually to 10.0.0.137, subnet 255.0.0.0, router 10.0.0.138. Correct?

Depends. What is the range of the DHCP pool? Generally, your router will be x.x.x.1. If your DHCP pool is then x.x.x.100-200, then you would not want to assign a static IP inside this range. Start with deciding which you want to serve IPs. This will be your router. make it x.x.x.1. After that, let DHCP do the rest. The ABS will get an IP automatically, as well as the connected computers.
It may end up being easiest to just figure out how to turn all the routing features of the modem/router off. Then you both physically and logically have a modem and a router, two separate items. Then just let the ABS do all the work. Follow?

[tritonus]

Originally posted by aaanorton:
Ah, OK, so this is an all-in-one unit: modem and router? I thought we were talking about a modem, a router and an ABS.
Well, if you leave the Alcatel doing the DHCP and NAT work (your choice) then plug it into the LAN port of the ABS. If you want, turn off the router features of the Alcatel, plug it into the WAN port on the ABS and enable DHCP and NAT on the ABS. Doesn't really matter.

Depends. What is the range of the DHCP pool? Generally, your router will be x.x.x.1. If your DHCP pool is then x.x.x.100-200, then you would not want to assign a static IP inside this range. Start with deciding which you want to serve IPs. This will be your router. make it x.x.x.1. After that, let DHCP do the rest. The ABS will get an IP automatically, as well as the connected computers.
It may end up being easiest to just figure out how to turn all the routing features of the modem/router off. Then you both physically and logically have a modem and a router, two separate items. Then just let the ABS do all the work. Follow?

Just read your help, thanks. I left it with the following config yesterday night:

- Alcatel static IP 10.0.0.138 (Alcatel default IP)
- AEBS static IP 10.0.0.137
- AEBS connected to Alcatel using WAN port
- Alcatel does DHCP/NAT/PAT
- DHCP IP range 10.0.0.1 to 10.0.0.100
- PB 17" AirPort on DHCP
- PB 17" Ethernet on DHCP

Yes, Alcatel is an all-in-one unit, see link above. But I'm not sure if it's really a router. The term is "DSL router". When is a unit a "real" router? Is AEBS a router, too?

Works nicely so far, but you're saying LAN port would be correct?

What would be the advantage of letting AEBS do all the work, compared to Alcatel?

[aaanorton]

Originally posted by tritonus:
- Alcatel static IP 10.0.0.138 (Alcatel default IP)
- AEBS static IP 10.0.0.137
- AEBS connected to Alcatel using WAN port
- Alcatel does DHCP/NAT/PAT
- DHCP IP range 10.0.0.1 to 10.0.0.100
- PB 17" AirPort on DHCP
- PB 17" Ethernet on DHCP

Yes, Alcatel is an all-in-one unit, see link above. But I'm not sure if it's really a router. The term is "DSL router".

It is.

When is a unit a "real" router?

For our purposes, when it performs NAT and DHCP serving.

Is AEBS a router, too?

Yes. Unless you disable NAT and DHCP serving on it.

Works nicely so far, but you're saying LAN port would be correct?

What would be the advantage of letting AEBS do all the work, compared to Alcatel?

Actually, I'm saying that I have no clear idea what is going on. Is your ABS serving DHCP? What would happen if you added another device to the Alcatel? To the ABS? You see, this is the advantage of delegating ALL routing work to the ABS. Then you'd know: you have a modem that does modem stuff, and you have an ABS (router) that does router stuff. This would be much simpler to trouble-shoot as well.
But if you don't want to do that, then make sure that the ABS is not doing NAT & DHCP too. Your PB should be in the same subnet (10.0.0.x) as the other devices.
As you have it now, you've got the DSL line feeding into the WAN port (despite what it is labeled as on the unit) of the Alcatel. Since this is doing routing work, the Alcatel should get plugged into the LAN port of the ABS. This is because once the signal gets behind your router (the Alcatel in your case) it is no longer a WAN connection. It is part of your LAN.

[tritonus]

Originally posted by aaanorton:
Actually, I'm saying that I have no clear idea what is going on. Is your ABS serving DHCP? What would happen if you added another device to the Alcatel? To the ABS? You see, this is the advantage of delegating ALL routing work to the ABS. Then you'd know: you have a modem that does modem stuff, and you have an ABS (router) that does router stuff. This would be much simpler to trouble-shoot as well.
But if you don't want to do that, then make sure that the ABS is not doing NAT & DHCP too. Your PB should be in the same subnet (10.0.0.x) as the other devices.
As you have it now, you've got the DSL line feeding into the WAN port (despite what it is labeled as on the unit) of the Alcatel. Since this is doing routing work, the Alcatel should get plugged into the LAN port of the ABS. This is because once the signal gets behind your router (the Alcatel in your case) it is no longer a WAN connection. It is part of your LAN.

Okay, thanks again. So I've got two (possible) routers.

AEBS is currently not serving DHCP, Alcatel is.
I have only my 17" PB to add on the WLAN.
If I add the 17" PB on the LAN (Alcatel ports), it gets a new IP in 10.0.0.x from Alcatel DHCP.

I thought Alcatel would be the "better" router, as it has built-in firewall. So my feeling was Alcatel should do the WAN/LAN bordering.

I switched to the LAN port of AEBS like you said. Works fine until now. When I first had it on the LAN port, I couldn't reach SOME servers and had to enter DNS server IPs in OS X manually. With WAN port, that wasn't the case. Let's see. I saw it as part of my LAN at first, too, but became unsure when the DNS problems occured.

[tritonus]

Apple support told me I have to use the WAN port of AEBS for my DSL router. So I'm trying this again.

LAN port worked too, but had some dropouts when not using AEBS/DSL for half a day or so.

[tritonus]

No problems with WAN port of AEBS whatsoever. Better experience than LAN port (DNS dropouts).

Thanks for participating.