[finknottle]

I am new to airport (and networking I suppose) so forgive me if this is a stupid/easily resolvable problem
I have a dual USB 700Mhz iBook and a 400Mhz iMac SE both with airport cards connected to an airport extreme basestation (the one with the USB port and Modem). I have cable internet so the basestation is connected via ethernet to the cable modem.
I get 5 bars on both macs but only the iBook lets me connect to the internet (I set the airport base station up on the iBook a couple of weeks before I got the adapter for the iMac).
There is probably a real obvious answer to why the iMac doesn't connect but I can't for the life of me find it :/ Both macs run OSX.2.6..
Any suggestions are appreciated!!

[aaanorton]

Really need some more specifics to offer any exact advice, but...

• Check Network pref pane. Select Airport under Show and Using DHCP server under Configure.

• Make sure you have actually joined the network in internet connect or from the Airport menu bar item.

• Turn off all security on the AEBS until all clients are connected properly. This includes WEP encryption and MAC address filtering.

Post back if you still have troubles after trying these.

[finknottle]

Checked everything you listed, thanks. Seems to be as it should be...however, not sure about the security settings - how do I turn off encryption?
Tried resetting base station and setting up from the iMac. Didn't make any difference...iBook went online, iMac did not.
Any other ideas please?
Thanks very much!

[aaanorton]

Well, I don't own an AEBS, but I know it's there somewhere. I'd concentrate on the MAC address filtering. Look for anything that controls MAC address or hardware address settings. Disable it if possible. You can then re-enable it later for security reasons.
Check the IP address on both computers in the Network pref pane of System preferences. What are they?

[NDBounce]

In theory this could be a DNS issue as well. If you know how to open a terminal window open one and try pinging some servers by IP address. If you can ping them and get a response, then you just need to check your DNS settings.

Although, to be honest, I have never had DNS problems on a mac.

Peace,

O
B unce!

[finknottle]

Okay, I am not able to ping the ISP. I didn't use terminal though, if that makes any difference (not very good with UNIX ...). As for MAC address filtering etc, I'm a new person to all this Airport stuff, can anyone tall me how to do what's suggested please?

Thanks very much!

[aaanorton]

Check the IP address on both computers in the Network pref pane of System preferences. What are they?

[finknottle]

The IP adresses are different on both macs. The iBook is something like this 217.XX.XX.XX while the iMac won't connect has the airport IP address which is 10.X.X.X

[Evinyatar]

Are you sure your ISP subscription supports multiple devices on the same connection? The best way to check is to turn off both devices, and then turn the iMac on, while leaving the iBook off. Normally, that should make the cable modem lease an IP to the iMac.
If that works, then you'll have to resort to using a router with NAT or just use Internet Connection Sharing on the iMac (in System Preferences -> Sharing Setup -> Internet). You can probably find a tutorial on that somewhere.

[finknottle]

I thought of that myself...I turned off the ibbok and set up the APBS fron the iMac, left it a few hours and came back - no go. I have treid internet sharing also and nothing. What type of router are you talking about...I am totally clueless, so please spell it out for me if you don't mind

[Evinyatar]

Any router with NAT will do (Internet Sharing included). Basically what it does is share one IP over the two machines.
Just turning off the iBook won't help if this is the situation though. The iMac needs to get a new IP from the cable modem. I forget the command for this, but rebooting the iMac will do it too. Also just turning on Internet Sharing isn't gonna do it either.
You'd have to create an alias for your AirPort connection on a fixed IP (the one you'll be using as the router interface) and then change the iBook's IP to be in the same subnet and adjust the router setting. I'm sure you can find a tutorial on this somewhere, maybe even on the forum.

[finknottle]

Thanks for your detailed answer...I'll try again later. If not I'll try and get a router like you recommended. Anyy brand/model that you'd recommend?
Thanks again!

[aaanorton]

You already have one!!! The AEBS is a full-featured router with wireless capabilities. You do NOT need any more eqpt. The AEBS can share a single IP from an ISP with multiple computers; this is exactly what these are designed for. Just make sure the Share a single IP box is checked.

Your problem is that your computers are on two different subnets. They should both be getting IPs from the AEBS in the 10.x.x.x range (assuming you haven't changed the AEBS' LAN IP). Go to System Prefs, click on Network, choose the desired connection for each machine under Show (if it is connected by an ethernet cable, choose Built-in ethernet, if wireless, choose Airport). Do this on both computers. In the Configure menu choose Using DHCP. If this is already chosen, change it to ANYTHING else in that list and hit Apply. THEN change it back to Using DHCP and click Apply again. You should get an IP on both machines on the AEBS' subnet. If it says Self Assigned below it, you are not connected to the AEBS. If the wired computer is not getting a correct IP, try a different cable. And MAKE SURE it is not a cross-over cable. You should be using standard, straight through cables everywhere.
Do this and post back with the results.

[finknottle]

Thanks for the complete answer!! Glad I don't hyave to buy a router!! Thanks
The iBook is set up as follows:
Location: Airport
Show: Airport
Configure: Using DHCP
IP Address: 217.XX.XX.XX
Subnet mask:255.255.255.0
Router:217.78.11.0
DHCP Client: (blank)
Airport ID:00:30:65:0a:60:a7

The same as above until..
IP Address: 10.0.1.3 (provided by DHCP Server)....that's what I'm not supposed to see right?
Subnet Mask: Same as iBook
Router : 10.0.1.1
DHCP Client is blank
Airport ID: 00:30:65:27:d5:ed

I figured out how to turn off secutiy on the base staion through the Airport utility - no difference.

I'm not sure from your message, but just to clarify, both macs are connected to the APBS via airport cards not by cables. The cable modem is connected to the airport base station with cable supplied the company (on the cable it says STP EIA/TIA 568a CAT 5 Pan International.). Is that the right cable? The Modem is a Motorola Surfboard.

Just to say I appreciate your help..
Does this give you a better clue to whats going on? By the way, the iMac appears to be connected to the Airport network name. When I click on the 5 bars at the top of the screen showing Airport signal status, the name of the network that it should be connected to is ticked, the same as the iBook.

[aaanorton]

Originally posted by finknottle:
The iBook is set up as follows:
Location: Airport
Show: Airport
Configure: Using DHCP
IP Address: 217.XX.XX.XX
Subnet mask:255.255.255.0
Router:217.78.11.0
DHCP Client: (blank)
Airport ID:00:30:65:0a:60:a7

The same as above until..
IP Address: 10.0.1.3 (provided by DHCP Server)....that's what I'm not supposed to see right?
Subnet Mask: Same as iBook
Router : 10.0.1.1
DHCP Client is blank
Airport ID: 00:30:65:27:d5:ed

OK, something funny is definitely going on... Just to give you an idea of what we're going for, here's a quick outline:
The AEBS' IP is (probably) 10.0.1.1. It should be set to share a single public IP and distribute local IPs to connected comps using DHCP. Each connected comp will get an IP like 10.0.1.2, 10.0.1.3, 10.0.1.4 or even 10.0.1.50. It doesn't matter, really. The AEBS has a pool of IPs it can distribute and does so as needed.
The odd thing is that the iBook has the wrong IP, but is connected and the iMac has the proper IP, but is MIA.
Here's what I think is going on... Somehow you disabled the Share a single IP feature in the Airport Admin Utility. This could simply allow your public IP to pass through to your iMac and disallow any other comps access. Open AAU up and look for this option; make sure the box is checked. If there is a "Restore factory defaults" or equivalent option, try that. Let me know how this works out.

[finknottle]

Okay, I checked what you said. In the "Network" box in the AP Admin the settings are as follows...
"Distribute IP addresses" is checked
Share a single IP address (using DHCP and NAT) is checked.
That's right isn't it?
Nothing else is checked

[aaanorton]

Yes, that's all correct.
Let's try this... UNPLUG the power from the modem and the AEBS. Leave them unplugged. Now try your iBook. Are you still connected? Go to Sys Prefs > Network. Change Using DHCP to something else, apply and change back to Using DHCP and apply again. What IP do you get? Does it say self-assigned?

[finknottle]

I also reset the APBS from the back of the base station (can't find how to do this via APAdmin except to "restore default software" which I did anyway..)..
Thansk again

[aaanorton]

After leaving both unplugged for a minute, plug them back in starting with the modem. Wait til its lights are back on as normal. Watch them. When it's back up, plug the AEBS back in and try both comps.

[finknottle]

Okay that woked in so far as the Ip address has changed on the iBook from what itwas to 10.0.1.2 and the iMac to 10.0.1.3. However neither mac will connect to the internet now (reason for delay - looking for cell phone in order to write back to you!).
WHere do I go from here?

[aaanorton]

Make sure you've joined the network on each (I believe you have, but...). The name should be checked in the list from the Airport signal strength menu.
Go back to AAU. Look for the AEBS' WAN or public IP. It should look like 217.x.x.x. Or it will say self-assigned or unavailable or something. Try to find that and let me know what you see.

[finknottle]

Okay, the IP address is 169.254.230.84 and the subnet mask is 255.255.0.0

This IP address showed up in the airport admin on the iMAc since before we did anything. But I was unable to access the Airport Admin from the iBook - nowI can...gives the same as the iMac.

[aaanorton]

And you still have no internet?

Are there any other networks listed in the menu bar?

[finknottle]

No internet ....no other networks listed. I remember before I got AIrport, that if I changed computers attached to the cable modem, it would take several hours for the internet to go online again...would this be a similiar case do you think?

[aaanorton]

It's possible, but that's why I had you unplug the modem and AEBS... You did unplug them, right?
The strange thing is that your public IP is now 169.x.x.x, where before you were getting a 217.x.x.x IP. I'm curious as to why the different subnets. That's why I asked you to look for other networks. I thought that maybe you were connected to a neighbor's LAN.
Well, short of waiting it out, you can try unplugging both again, but for longer. Try 5-10 minutes. I'd also be interested in seeing what happens if you plug one of the comps directly into the modem.

[finknottle]

I'll wait the few hours and see....if I unplug from the airport and plug into one of the macs, then it will take hours for the internet to work on one of these.
This is Ireland, if someone else is using an airport base station in my town or anything like it, I'll faint - I am only one of ten that has broadband!! The chances of someone joining someone elses network is slim then
I'll get back tomorrow and tell you what happens...it's very late here and work tomorrow
But thanks again!!

[aaanorton]

Actually, did you get your cable internet installed before you owned an AEBS?
If so, go back to AAU and look for the AEBS' MAC or hardware address or ID. Look for a way to edit this. Put in this address:

00:30:65:0a:60:a7

That's your iBook's Airport card's MAC address that you listed before. ISPs can restrict internet connections to only one MAC address to thwart home LANs (kinda like the problem you're having). To get around this, you can tell the AEBS to mimic and broadcast a different MAC address than its' own, namely the one your ISP has on file. This fools the ISP's servers into thinking it is still connected to the original computer as during install. This is called MAC address cloning. Give this a shot. It may very well solve your problems.

[finknottle]

Yes I got the Cable Modem weeks before the base station. It was connected to both the iMac and iBook (iBook was in for repair to keyboard..).
When I got the BS, I set it up on the iBook only (incorrectly from what you showed me last night since the wrong IP address wasshowing up). Whe I got the adapter for the airport card for the iMac, I installed it and that's when I started posting here.
Phew! I tried putting in the AIrport Mac address into a window in the APAdmin called "WDS". I checked the box that said "Enable this base station as a WDS main base station" - it was the only way I could put in the Airport Mac address. I updated the APBS, then powered down the modem for two minutes and the same with the APBS before plugging them in as told last night..
Still have no internet (by the way, this morning I plugged the cable directly into the ethernet port of the iMac and when I came home from work, it was online....I should have left well enough alone ).
What do I do now....putting the Airport Mac address didn't seem to work, I tried putting it in on both AP ADmins (in case that made a difference...it didn't).
Have you any other ideas? Please??

[aaanorton]

WDS has to do with bridging two AEBSes wirelessly. This is not what we are looking for. But now you're saying that the iMac was connected? So can either computer connect directly to the modem? If that's the case, then your ISP is not blocking MAC addresses.
Do you have another e'net cable? Try connecting one (or both) of the comps through the AEBS with an e'net cable. You'll have to set your Network pref pane to Built in Ethernet instead of Airport. I'm beginning to think there is something wrong with your AEBS, so this would be a good test.

[finknottle]

The iMac was connected directly to the cable modem this morning (I wanted to make sure the cable modem was actually working!). I am able to swap around macs but as I said I think last night, there is a time lag of minutes to hours before it recognises a different mac. I have found that powering off the cable modem first (pretty much what you suggested last night) does help.
I'm a little bit vague on the second ppart of your message...DO you mean Cable Modem via ethernet to Airport via ethernet to iBook/iMac? Can I do that? I see there is what looks like an ethernet port on the APBS beside where the modem is plugged. I'm sorry for being so clueless.. If thats what you mean, I can borrow a cable right away!

[aaanorton]

Yep. That's exactly what I mean. However, your response gives me pause... Which port do you have the cable modem plugged into? What does the symbol on it look like? What does the other symbol look like? I bet you've got it in the wrong one. That could explain your difficulties.

[finknottle]

I was just thinking that myself last night....I'll check when I get home from work in nine hours, what an idiot I am if that's the problem!

[wild eep]

sorry if someone has mentioned already, did you set the AEBS to broadcast in 802.11b or "both". I beleive the AAU default setting is 802.11g. I think your cards are "airport" (802.11b) not AE. Good luck.

conrad

[finknottle]

I just wanted to let you know that when I came home iChat was open and working on my iMac
Thanks very much for all the advice and patience with this clueless idiot from Ireland! (I did have the cable in the correct port - at least I had done that right
Anyway thanks again - something you said worked!,

P.S. If you're ever in Ireland aaanorton, I owe you a pint!!

[aaanorton]

Excellent. Maybe I'll take you up on that some day.
Cheers.