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Big Mac · 06:15 AM

Now that Linksys supports the Mac with its new routers, I have officially ended my boycott of the company's products. For those who haven't heard, check out this page:

http://www.linksys.com/servlet/Satel...=1938527773L02

Cold Warrior · Aug 15, 2008, 06:49 AM

This isn't enough for me to come back to the brand. Cisco took them over, gutted the memory on them, and made some other changes where the routers haven't worked nearly as well as they did pre-Cisco. For example, a BEFSR41 I purchased a couple months ago can't handle more than 100 or so connections (e.g., BitTorrent) before shutting down for several minutes from the strain.

The inclusion of a Mac config tool is nice, but I hope the web interface is still there.

ghporter · Aug 15, 2008, 08:13 AM

Providing their limited, "setup wizard" so-called assistance for Windows certainly wasn't doing anyone much in the way of favors. I've been a Linksys fan for quite a while, and I've always pointed out that their tech support has been uniformly poor; they just didn't go out of their way to provide extra poor support for Mac users. Oh, and their telephone "techs" didn't get enough training to know that anything you could do with a PC you could do with a Mac (usually better) when it comes to networking. That web interface is what makes Linksys routers powerful and popular, and it's why you never needed a "setup assistant" for these products.

However, now that Cisco has removed one of the real technical advantages of their Linksys line, external freakin' antennas, I'm seriously rethinking whether my next router will be a Linksys. I don't need a new one; I only have one computer that runs N, and it's my iMac. But those external antennas make a huge difference in range and throughput when you're dealing with G speeds-with N, they can make the difference between having a connection and not having one. Dumb, Cisco, very dumb.

Wiskedjak · Aug 15, 2008, 08:38 AM

When did Linksys routers not support Macs? I've been connecting my Macs to Linksys routers for 6 years.

moep · Aug 15, 2008, 09:13 AM

I’m extremely happy with my WRT-54GL running the Tomato Firmware but my next router probably won’t be a Linksys unless they allow open source firmware again.

A remake of the WRT-54GL with gigabit and draft n would sell like hot cakes, instead they pump out new consumer routers with tons of silly proprietary features to keep the marketing department happy.

ghporter · Aug 15, 2008, 09:53 AM

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak

When did Linksys routers not support Macs? I've been connecting my Macs to Linksys routers for 6 years.

My point exactly. They've ALWAYS supported network standards, so Macs "just work" with them. You don't get the "hand-holding for the intellectually challenged" stuff they provide for PC users, but nobody really needs that.

mduell · Aug 15, 2008, 01:09 PM

Originally Posted by Big Mac

Now that Linksys supports the Mac with its new routers, I have officially ended my boycott of the company's products.

Linksys has supported Macs at least since 802.11b was released.
A platform-specific configuration tool is a turd, not a feature; although since they still offer a web interface, it's not as bad as Apple's Airport.

Simon · Aug 16, 2008, 07:46 AM

The fact that Apple doesn't offer a web interface to configure AirPorts is a feature in their opinion.

ghporter · Aug 16, 2008, 08:31 AM

Originally Posted by Simon

The fact that Apple doesn't offer a web interface to configure AirPorts is a feature in their opinion.

I realize that. But it doesn't feel like a feature when APU won't always find your base station. That's the thing about a web interface: once you're in, you're in. The AirPort Utility seems to be an obstacle instead of a tool to facilitate managing an AirPort device.

Wiskedjak · Aug 16, 2008, 09:14 AM

Originally Posted by Simon

The fact that Apple doesn't offer a web interface to configure AirPorts is a feature in their opinion.

Ya, Apple totally thinks it's a feature.

Went on a trip a few weeks ago with an Airport Express and my iPod Touch (no laptop). Needed to tweak the AE, but unfortunately Apple doesn't offer an APU for the Touch OS. Had I taken my Linksys travel router instead, I would have had no problems with it's web interface.

I don't even find the APU interface much better than the Linksys interface. A lot more polished, sure, but in terms of actual usability, it sucks about equally ... I've still got to hunt around to find exactly what I'm looking for sometimes.

Simon · Aug 16, 2008, 09:45 AM

Originally Posted by ghporter

I realize that. But it doesn't feel like a feature when APU won't always find your base station. That's the thing about a web interface: once you're in, you're in. The AirPort Utility seems to be an obstacle instead of a tool to facilitate managing an AirPort device.

Those are two different things. The bug that APU can't find your APBS is indeed a PITA. But it has nothing to do with the choice of interface. Apple could just as well make all their BSs respond to a certain IP or domain name you enter in APU the way other routers do. But obviously that is not the way Apple wants people to have to do things.

What Apple needs to do is sort out the issues with APU not seeing BSs. Why they have let this one go unattended for so long is beyond me.

That said, if you hard reset a BS and connect it through Ethernet APU will always see it. Once it's configured you disconnect it and log in through wifi. That is an ugly workaround but at least it works.

Wiskedjak · Aug 16, 2008, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by Simon

That said, if you hard reset a BS and connect it through Ethernet APU will always see it. Once it's configured you disconnect it and log in through wifi. That is an ugly workaround but at least it works.

An ugly workaround that makes other router interfaces, D-Link included, look amazing by comparison.

Why hasn't Apple fixed this? Because so many Apple customers are willing to put up with ugly workarounds if Apple tells them it's better.

Wiskedjak · Aug 16, 2008, 11:10 AM

Originally Posted by Simon

Those are two different things. The bug that APU can't find your APBS is indeed a PITA. But it has nothing to do with the choice of interface.

True. What's nice about web interfaces is that you don't have to install anything on the computer to work on the router. It just works.

seanc · Aug 16, 2008, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by Simon

That said, if you hard reset a BS and connect it through Ethernet APU will always see it. Once it's configured you disconnect it and log in through wifi. That is an ugly workaround but at least it works.

Sounds no different to the workaround I had to do to get my Netgear router working.

Hook up cable between router and MacBook
Wait for it to get a DHCP address
Get into the web interface
Disable DHCP server
Set LAN IP
Set SSID and password
Plug in and hope it works

Big Mac · Aug 16, 2008, 08:36 PM

My point about Mac support wasn't concerning the fact that they include some Mac wizard now. I boycotted them before because they explicitly said they would provide no technical support for the platform; I refuse to patronize a company that doesn't want my business as a Mac owner.

Anyway, based on the 4 1/2 star Amazon rating I purchased one of the antenna-less consumer looking routers (I think it's the 54-GL2) to replace a d-link that my brother's MBP experiences a lot of dropped connections with. I thought about the lack of an external antenna but everyone said they were happy with the range so I'm willing to try it.

ghporter · Aug 16, 2008, 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by Big Mac

My point about Mac support wasn't concerning the fact that they include some Mac wizard now. I boycotted them before because they explicitly said they would provide no technical support for the platform; I refuse to patronize a company that doesn't want my business as a Mac owner.

I always had the opinion that they figured we didn't NEED technical support...we use Macs, after all...

Seriously, their tech support has always been slipshod anyway, and they had simply built their (dysfunctional) phone dude scripts based on Windows because of the larger market share. Nothing against Macs, just playing the odds.

And I personally think that if you can hook up your Mac, and you can actually read the manual, you should NEVER need tech support for a router.

Big Mac · Aug 17, 2008, 12:23 AM

Yeah, I know what you mean. But I still won't buy a product if a company doesn't list Mac compatibility on its box or explicitly says "no Mac support, you're on your own." There's no reason to reward such a policy if one can help not doing so.

Wiskedjak · Aug 17, 2008, 09:40 AM

Originally Posted by ghporter

And I personally think that if you can hook up your Mac, and you can actually read the manual, you should NEVER need tech support for a router.

At the very least, you shouldn't need OS specific tech support. An IP address is an IP address; as far as a router is concerned, there is no difference between a Mac, Windows or Linux box. The only challenge I could see for tech support is describing to the caller how to find out through the OS what their IP address is.