[phillryu]

The question is, do you prefer Aqua modifications or full themes? I think the one debatable issue here is whether SmoothStripes counts as a modification. I'm going to go ahead and count it as a theme, because Max has redone every single element. That is your call. Themes might include releases such as SoftCandy, SimpleX, AluminumAlloy, Rhapsodized, MacOSXP, iStyle, JetBlack, and Milk.

This is purely a curious question.

[cmove]

Full themes

[bluevertical]

full themes. not a big fan of the aqua variants.
peace.
bv.

[phillryu]

I mean, personally, SmoothStripes used to beone of my favorite themes. I find that if I ever switch into it, I tend to stick wtih it for a while. But I'm really fallen in love with full interface changes now, and I am currently happily testing BBX: Mercury, NickelCobalt, and using MaggraX when in the Kill Bill mood. So whatever.

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by bluevertical:
full themes. not a big fan of the aqua variants.
peace.
bv.

What's the point of an Aqua mod? I wouldn't have paid for SS if that's all I used. Sorry Smooth Stripes fans, Aqua mods aren't my thing.

[quandarry]

Originally posted by bluevertical:
full themes. not a big fan of the aqua variants.
peace.
bv.

bluevertical on aquaslate:

cool...

thanks so much... I can't wait to give it a spin!

i really like it. great job...

aloha. it looks awesome!

thanks for the theme! i really appreciate it!

[sanity assassin]

I don't mind really, I've always kind likde the Aqua look, and now with Panther, it's a damn nice GUI. I'm fussy though, and really picky about things in designs, and many themes just don't seem to do it for me. Main thing for me, is how apps will look when a theme is used, many of the dark ones, which I prefer, just play havoc with applications, pity.

At the moment I'm using an Aqua mod, it's basically the default Aqua, with the sunken buttons and so on taken from smoothstripes, works a treat. it's strange though, but on the PC I really have to have it modded, prefer a dark theme, and lots of other little mods done too.

I am getting a litle tired of the glass look though, so I've started making my own lil mini theme, just hte buttons and a few other things will be changed, here's what I'm going to do with the buttons:

[bluevertical]

Originally posted by quandarry:
bluevertical on aquaslate:

cool...

thanks so much... I can't wait to give it a spin!

i really like it. great job...

aloha. it looks awesome!

thanks for the theme! i really appreciate it!

lol! damn, what is this..... is a person not allowed to change his or her mind? geesh.... and yes, that is a nice aqua mod, i just don't find myself using aqua mods on a regular basis. as for bringing up a several months old quote. get over it. i did.

[quandarry]

i'd say a poll like this taken in this forum would be skewed because of the hard core theme users who inhabit this place...

try it in the lounge.

and don't weigh the questions as you've done here.

[u2zoo]

ShapeShifter has a way to go (IMHO) until "full themes" are a reality. The problem isn't ShapeShifter, it is Apple - Mac OS X is designed for Aqua and Aqua-like themes. There seem to me to be lots of bits hardcoded for Aqua-like themes.

Part of the problem is that it is still a pain in the ass to:
1. Find icon sets that completely change the look of Aqua, since a big part of the desktop are icons. Many icon sets only change the home folders.... or at best every icon in Candybar - but that still leaves out all of the application icons. Which are heavily geared towards the Aqua colors and look. The bevel icon site is a good example of one that tries to provide an alternative for every icon out there. You may not like the look, but show me a more complete icon set.

2. CandyBar doesn't change everything. The sit, zip, pdf, etc etc icons. What a chore it is to update all of these.

And as I've stated in other threads... my favorite themes are boxy, pixelized looks... like BeOS or a number of Kali. Schemes for Classic. It just impossible to get this look on OS X.. because it is geared to the bubbly look of Aqua. Virtually all application developers are making things with Aqua in mind, I find a lot of 3rd party apps just look like crap with any non-aqua theme. Apple's Mail.app looks just about god-awful with anything that isn't aqua or a similar light colored theme.

I switch themes a lot, and I've tried them all... I always come back to Max's Aqua Extreme because it is the best one out there for overall continuity. That's a bit ironic given how ****ed up Aqua can be at times, with Apple failing to follow their own gui guidelines.

The only themes I've had any luck with keeping around for a while were Milk, Rhapsodized, and QNX. What's that say? This isn't a blanket statement that all non-aqua themes suck - I'd love to run a non-aqua theme full time... it can just be a very frustrating experience when you are trying to get work done and an app pops up that looks horrible in your favorite theme of the week.

That said I encourage themers to continue to break the mold, make non-aqua inspired themes and push devs to make the theme tools better. That's the only way it'll improve.

[SwarmyCurve]

Full themes.

Most aqua mods feel like they were meant for the 10.0 dinosaur age. They just look gimmicky.

Its time for imagination to shine through with original designs!

[Holigen]

Although I like both, full themes are pretty snazzy if they fit in right with icons and the other elements that cant be changed. When I first started themeing, I was a huge fan of SmoothStripes. It was really nice. I gradually moved on to Pearl and other themes of that time. Right now, I have TiSkin applied (I know Ive said I dont like it in the past, but its actually a pretty nice theme). Before TiSkin, I used a modded version of Milk as my main theme. I had it on for a few months. Oh and in response to this:

Originally posted by a zoo:
The bevel icon site is a good example of one that tries to provide an alternative for every icon out there. You may not like the look, but show me a more complete icon set.

Smoothicons 5
Smoothicons 6
Smoothicons 7
Smoothicons 8
Smoothicons 9

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by u2zoo:
ShapeShifter has a way to go (IMHO) until "full themes" are a reality. The problem isn't ShapeShifter, it is Apple - Mac OS X is designed for Aqua and Aqua-like themes. There seem to me to be lots of bits hardcoded for Aqua-like themes.

I disagree. I'm using BBX M right now, it looks nothing like Aqua and fits quite nice in the Aqua footprint. It has already been proven many times that "full themes" are very posable with SS the way it is. True you can't make borders and extra crap, but I don't really care, your "full themes" are very posable the way things are now.

1. Icons are a minor problem.

2. live with it or hack the app's resorces

3. Most 3rd party apps that look like crap tend to look like crap even in Aqua... It's a minor problem that can be lived with. The only App that doesn't look nice with themes that I use is MS word with all it's 10.1 hard coded Aqua graphics. And there's always the exclude list if worse comes to worse, and I have yet to do that with any apps I use.

[u2zoo]

Smoothicons are geared towards an Aqua-like theme IMHO. Now the Clipper System icons are rather complete. Come to think of it I wish there was a theme designed around those!

> 2. live with it or hack the app's resorces

I have and do but I doesn't mean I can't bitch. :-D It makes switching to a "full theme" a real pain in the ass. It should be easier.

> 3. Most 3rd party apps that look like crap tend to look like crap even in Aqua...

I strongly disagree with this... Unison is a very usable news reader but it doesn't work as well w/ a theme like MakkiX. (which is one of my favorite themes). Many of the non-apple menu extras aren't theme friendly, but I don't think they are poorly designed. The Office and Adobe apps of course don't work in non-aqua themes due to their reliance on custom widgets.

Now a 3rd party that does play nice with most themes is DragThing, kudos to James for his work there. I think you seel 3rd party developers short by suggesting that many are poorly designed... you really have to go out of your way in interface builder to make a crappy Apple app in my mind.

The app which really tends to screw with most themes is Mail.app in my mind - an Apple app.

Max's Alluminum Alloy is a great example of a full theme that just about works all over, but in my mind it is essentially playing in the same sandbox as Aqua. I'd be curious to try BBX M when Max's update released for ShapeShifter. That was another theme I used for some time.

Look I am not slamming the "original" themes... I love them, I just think the 1.5 ShapeShifter update will be a blessing to these themes... and improved CandyBar which could perhaps do some ShapeShifter like memory-switching of common icons like .sit. (i have no idea if that's possible ... and I don't need some smack down explanation of why it won't work...)

[Holigen]

I have always loved BBX Mercury. Its probably my favorite theme...

Ive just gone back to using LaunchBar (was using QS for a while there) and it works really well with themes. It adopts their background color which is nice with a dark theme. As for the Mail issues, Im not sure exactly what the problem is with Mail that youre referring to. Is it the toobar buttons or the huge contrast between a dark theme and the white of the white sidebar and viewing space?

[u2zoo]

Yeah, it is a combination of toolbar buttons and the background of the drawer and viewer panes. It is not a show-stopper to some folks, but for me it slows me down.. I am focusing on the theme and not how the contents of the app.

[mac15]

Full themes are pretty much what I used but smoothstripes and aqua extreme are still damn Cool. BBXM is awesome for panther Phill... how do I know this?

[BrianC]

There are full themes out there that are done well and look amazing but I only end up using them for maybe a few hours before it's back to Aqua. For whatever reason Aqua is perfect for my tastes.

I use Max's Aqua Extreme only because Apple's widgets look like crap compared to his.

[natey]

Originally posted by BrianC:
There are full themes out there that are done well and look amazing but I only end up using them for maybe a few hours before it's back to Aqua. For whatever reason Aqua is perfect for my tastes.

I use Max's Aqua Extreme only because Apple's widgets look like crap compared to his.

Amen! Same here. Aqua Extreme and SmoothStripes fan.

The other thing that's bugging me right now is the inconsistency. I can't stand it. Most theme lack app skins, besides, SS can't skin iTunes/Quicktime yet...

[Holigen]

Originally posted by Brian:
I use Max's Aqua Extreme only because Apple's widgets look like crap compared to his.

Indubitably

[Holigen]

Originally posted by n8d4gr8:
The other thing that's bugging me right now is the inconsistency. I can't stand it. Most theme lack app skins, besides, SS can't skin iTunes/Quicktime yet...

Au contraire nate. SS can skin those apps as far as is allowable in the resource file. As for the background (which I believe you are referring to) it isnt skinnable much anyways. However, I have heard that Jason may be able to fix this. Just look at what he did with Panther's Finder.

[deej5871]

I would compare Aqua Mods to training wheels. You should use them first then you can go to the next level.

[bOOzo]

I'd say that the best reason to use Aqua mods is consistency, although that is sort of ruined by the contrat between Metal and Aqua apps, unless the mod fixes that of course.

I always used to go back to SmoothStripes, but now I return to AA Volcanic instead. And with all the appskins I made, I feel that it's consistent enough.

[Caesar2099]

Originally posted by bOOzo:
I always used to go back to SmoothStripes, but now I return to AA Volcanic instead. And with all the appskins I made, I feel that it's consistent enough.

I always used to return to Smooth Stripes too, but these days I usually return to good 'ol ProPlastic. I like ProPlastic mainly because Apple seems to be adding more and more plastic elements, so a complete plastic-makeover is inevitable.

Oh and a little off topic but I hadn't realized themers used their own themes. In retrospect I think I was being a little naive, but I had assumed themers used Aqua. I just couldn't imagine Max using Aluminum Alloy, it's like an architect living in a building they designed.

[brutal]

Originally posted by deej5871:
I would compare Aqua Mods to training wheels. You should use them first then you can go to the next level.

that's easily the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

[deej5871]

Originally posted by brutal:
that's easily the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

Why? It's what I did. One of my longest running themes was SmoothStripes..then I moved on to the more modded Aluminum Alloy (this was all before ShapeShifter BTW) and then I finally started using more complete theme (not that SmoothStripes isn't complete, but you know what I mean). I just think a first time theme-user might be more interested in consistency than major modification, like I was; then again that's just my opinion.

[rhythmicmoose]

Originally posted by deej5871:
Why? It's what I did. One of my longest running themes was SmoothStripes..then I moved on to the more modded Aluminum Alloy (this was all before ShapeShifter BTW) and then I finally started using more complete theme (not that SmoothStripes isn't complete, but you know what I mean). I just think a first time theme-user might be more interested in consistency than major modification, like I was; then again that's just my opinion.

Funny, I didn't really think of this, but I did pretty much the same thing (although I started a bit earlier than you I think, but my first themes were more Aqua-ish).

But I think he meant from a developing sense, as an intro to ThemePark.

I don't quite get that comment, since it makes perfect sense to me...

[wibs]

Originally posted by Caesar2099:
Oh and a little off topic but I hadn't realized themers used their own themes. In retrospect I think I was being a little naive, but I had assumed themers used Aqua. I just couldn't imagine Max using Aluminum Alloy, it's like an architect living in a building they designed.

I don't really use my themes so much as run them as I work on them. Since I've had something in the works constantly since starting theming, I've pretty much only looked at incomplete themes since I started making them. Every once in a while I load NEOS, but that's about it. Nothing is as good a motivator as trying to use my incomplete work .

As for architects living in their buildings, that's not uncommon at all, or at least wasn't. It depends on the architect of course, and what kind of buildings they tend to design, but the majority of the good ones a few decades ago either lived in their own buildings or the buildings their friends had designed for them (friends also in the architect business, of course).

[Holigen]

I had the same experience as the guy who talking about the training wheels did. I used SS for a really long time before moving onto things like Pearl. Just a bit of info...

[JoE950]

smooth stripes always suited my eMac very well. glossy. yeah!

[jokell82]

Considering I've had nothing but problems with SS, I'm gonna have to say neither.

Some of the current things are making me want to try out SS again, though. Last time I tried I needed an OS reinstall, so I hope it goes a little better this time.

[brutal]

Originally posted by deej5871:
Why? It's what I did. One of my longest running themes was SmoothStripes..then I moved on to the more modded Aluminum Alloy (this was all before ShapeShifter BTW) and then I finally started using more complete theme (not that SmoothStripes isn't complete, but you know what I mean). I just think a first time theme-user might be more interested in consistency than major modification, like I was; then again that's just my opinion.

Well, I started off using Cappuccino two weeks after getting my Mac, and it stuck with me for a long time. later I started using AlumiteX and then went over to Shinobi and NEOS. But now I'm back on Aqua Extreme Graphite, which I'll problably stick with for the rest of my life.

How does that fit into your profile?

[bOOzo]

Originally posted by Caesar2099:
[snip]
Oh and a little off topic but I hadn't realized themers used their own themes. In retrospect I think I was being a little naive, but I had assumed themers used Aqua. I just couldn't imagine Max using Aluminum Alloy, it's like an architect living in a building they designed.

For me it's natural to use my own themes, otherwise I wouldn't have made them. I have a hard time using other peoples theme because I'm really picky about quality.. I usually just test out new themes and then return to my own.

I don't really use my themes so much as run them as I work on them. Since I've had something in the works constantly since starting theming, I've pretty much only looked at incomplete themes since I started making them. Every once in a while I load NEOS, but that's about it. Nothing is as good a motivator as trying to use my incomplete work .

As for architects living in their buildings, that's not uncommon at all, or at least wasn't. It depends on the architect of course, and what kind of buildings they tend to design, but the majority of the good ones a few decades ago either lived in their own buildings or the buildings their friends had designed for them (friends also in the architect business, of course).

I do the same thing, using incomplete themes is a great motivator like you said.

[deej5871]

Originally posted by brutal:
How does that fit into your profile?

I don't exactly understand that question.. The only profile I can think of is forum profile.. Or am I over-thinking this? Please, elaborate.

[Link]

Nope, not anymore. Shapeshifter took my desire of using themes away.

Why? Before it's existence there were a plethora of DLTA style themes, which there were almost a half dozen apps you could use, many nearly suggesting you buy them.

Now there's one, and well.. that's how I feel. I'm thinking about making some really good themes and distributing them in dlta but we'll see

[sanity assassin]

I'd love to use SS, or some other APE's, but I can't because APE majorly screws up OSXVNC server, the devoloper says it's a known issue that APE will make osxvnc unuseable, and that the issue lies with Unsanity.

oh well.

[servo]

Originally posted by sanity assassin:
I'd love to use SS, or some other APE's, but I can't because APE majorly screws up OSXVNC server, the devoloper says it's a known issue that APE will make osxvnc unuseable, and that the issue lies with Unsanity.

oh well.

That's odd, OSXVNC Server works just fine with Shapeshifter for me. What is the problem exactly?

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by Link:
Nope, not anymore. Shapeshifter took my desire of using themes away.

Why? Before it's existence there were a plethora of DLTA style themes, which there were almost a half dozen apps you could use, many nearly suggesting you buy them.

Now there's one, and well.. that's how I feel. I'm thinking about making some really good themes and distributing them in dlta but we'll see

I think writing SS off like that is closed minded, everyone else is using SS with great themes. I don't see how or why anyone would want to stay with .dlta themes, now with app skins, text color amd metal windows are no longer a problem, in addition to the safe theme changing that SS allows. Jason is also a great developer.

[jokell82]

Originally posted by NetworkShadow:
I think writing SS off like that is closed minded, everyone else is using SS with great themes. I don't see how or why anyone would want to stay with .dlta themes, now with app skins, text color amd metal windows are no longer a problem, in addition to the safe theme changing that SS allows. Jason is also a great developer.

Just gotta say that I've never had SS been safe on my machine. As I said, last time I decided to "try it out" I had to reinstall my whole system.

I'd love for there to be another option out there. A single closed-source solution will keep me away from themes.

[jagededge]

Currently, an Aqua Mod.

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by jokell82:
Just gotta say that I've never had SS been safe on my machine. As I said, last time I decided to "try it out" I had to reinstall my whole system.

I'd love for there to be another option out there. A single closed-source solution will keep me away from themes.

Shift at log-in disables APE. It should never have messed with your system to the point of re-installin, also when was the last time you tried SS?

[jokell82]

Originally posted by NetworkShadow:
Shift at log-in disables APE. It should never have messed with your system to the point of re-installin, also when was the last time you tried SS?

About a month ago maybe? I posted a thread here about the bug. I'm fed up with it, as the last three times I've tried to install SS it has happened.

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by jokell82:
About a month ago maybe? I posted a thread here about the bug. I'm fed up with it, as the last three times I've tried to install SS it has happened.

Have you tried uninstalling APE to start with? If you install SS again without APE installed, the SS installer will reinstall APE. Try a permissions fix too.

[jokell82]

Uh, a reformat with a new system didn't fix it... I doubt it had anything to do with permissions...

[Altix]

Originally posted by servo:
That's odd, OSXVNC Server works just fine with Shapeshifter for me. What is the problem exactly?

I've just installed APE, and getting this problem too, hope there's a fix soon cause I quite like what APE can do.

Here's what the developers of OSXVNC say:

'Q: The OSXvnc application launches fine the first time but after that it just bounces in the Dock and never launches?

A: This is most likely because you are running APE from unsanity.org. Whatever APE does corrupts the OSXvnc bundle to the point where it can no longer function. Please remove APE from your system and send email to unsanity.org about this problem.'

[Altix]

Fixed it, just don't load the App itself, but let the server load as a background process.