[sanity assassin]

for the dumbest thing said. The little warmonger came out with this beauty 'I think that gay marriage is something that should be between a man and a woman'.

Guess Dubya makes too many now to be counted.



http://www.metafilter.com/mefi/29951

[voodoo]

Actually Donny won the prize for this gem:

"'Reports that say that something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns — the ones we don't know we don't know"

while the

'I think that gay marriage is something that should be between a man and a woman'.

is an Ahnuld quote.

nevertheless.

[sanity assassin]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Actually Donny won the prize for this gem:

"'Reports that say that something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns — the ones we don't know we don't know"

while the

'I think that gay marriage is something that should be between a man and a woman'.

is an Ahnuld quote.

nevertheless.

Aaah, my mistake. At least Conan could fall back onto the excuse that English isn't his first language.
But Rummie... He's another category of human being (can he be called that?)

[Lerkfish]

try this thread
and I think you're attributing a Schwarzenegger quote to Rumsfeld.

[Developer]

I'm not a Rumsfeld fan, but I think this quote makes sense. It's just not news to anybody (Sokrates).

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Developer:
I'm not a Rumsfeld fan, but I think this quote makes sense. It's just not news to anybody (Sokrates).

Makes no sense to me

i.e. if is trying to say that there are things we know and things we don't know --- then why did he say it in that incomprehensible manner?

[Developer]

Originally posted by voodoo:
i.e. if is trying to say that there are things we know and things we don't know --- then why did he say it in that incomprehensible manner?

What is incomprehensible about this? He just makes three categories: the known knowns, the known unknowns, and the unknown unknowns.

Known unknowns are things like "Where is Saddam Hussein? We don't know." Unknown unknowns are things you can't even ask the question, because you don't know that you don't know them.

[davesimondotcom]

Was Howard Dean in contention for his "Confederate Flag Waving" comment?

[Lerkfish]

Originally posted by davesimondotcom:
Was Howard Dean in contention for his "Confederate Flag Waving" comment?

If you go back to the original thread, you'll see that its an award given to highlight the need for public oration that is clear and easy to understand...a worthy goal. I think they just do this list to get press attention to their organization.

as such, Dean's comment some might argue was politically inexpedient, but certainly it was clear and understandable.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Developer:
What is incomprehensible about this? He just makes three categories: the known knowns, the known unknowns, and the unknown unknowns.

Known unknowns are things like "Where is Saddam Hussein? We don't know." Unknown unknowns are things you can't even ask the question, because you don't know that you don't know them.

Cuz there ain't no known unknowns. Only unknowns. A very important part of embracing wisdom is to be AWARE that most things are unknown to you -- that would be his known unknowns I suppose -- but there are NO unknown unknowns. That is like dividing by 0.

[Developer]

Sure there are known unknowns. The whereabouts of Saddam Hussein are known to be not known. That's a known unknown.

The costs of Saddam's secret poodle breed project however is an unknown unknown. Because we didn't know that Saddam had a poodle breed project we couldn't know that we don't know the costs of it.
Of course now that I mentioned the possibility, it became a known unknown.

In other words:

Known known: Question known. Answer known.
Known unknown: Question known. Answer unknown.
Unknown unknown: Question unknown. Answer unknown.

[voodoo]

=> known unknown == unknown unknown

as per your own logic

my point exactly.

[Lerkfish]

I think the point, though, that gets lost in analyzing what Rumsfeld said, is that even if you can puzzle it out once its in writing and have hashed it back and forth for several pages, its not clearly stated and easily understood to the intended audience...which was what the group who gave the award was trying to promote: clear and understandable public speaking.

[SimeyTheLimey]

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
I think the point, though, that gets lost in analyzing what Rumsfeld said, is that even if you can puzzle it out once its in writing and have hashed it back and forth for several pages, its not clearly stated and easily understood to the intended audience...which was what the group who gave the award was trying to promote: clear and understandable public speaking.

My guess is it is probably something he uses to prod his staffers to think outside of the box, rather like that leaked memo. Most of us have a certain number of things that are on our minds at any given moment which we tend to repeat. I remember him making that comment. It was in a press conference. It wasn't some scripted speech, but was off the cuff.

[Developer]

You have no point. All you say is "I don't understand! I don't understand!".
I tried to explain it to you twice, you don't get it, so we should just leave it like that.

[Developer]

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
I think the point, though, that gets lost in analyzing what Rumsfeld said, is that even if you can puzzle it out once its in writing and have hashed it back and forth for several pages, its not clearly stated and easily understood to the intended audience...which was what the group who gave the award was trying to promote: clear and understandable public speaking.

I don't remember the exact context, but I believe he said it to avoid answering a question. Either because he didn't know the answer or because he didn't want to answer the question. So he said something that said nothing (at least with regard to the question) and that baffled the audience long enough to forget the original question and advance to the next. As such it was a rhetorically appropriate answer.
And he even managed - in free speech - to say something that makes sense, even though that was not the main purpose. The award is just pathetic.

[Lerkfish]

yes, I'm not defending the award or their choices. I think the goal of their organization is a good one, but I don't think as highly of their little award schtick. obviously done to get news interest, but I think it backfires against what they are trying to do.

Similar to Blackwell's worst-dressed list. It does a good job in getting attention, but a horrible job at getting the designer recognition for his own work. It in fact leaves one with the unfortunate impression that his own designs are horrible.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Developer:
You have no point. All you say is "I don't understand! I don't understand!".
I tried to explain it to you twice, you don't get it, so we should just leave it like that.

Throwing a tantrum doesn't make you right

[sanity assassin]

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
My guess is it is probably something he uses to prod his staffers to think outside of the box, rather like that leaked memo. Most of us have a certain number of things that are on our minds at any given moment which we tend to repeat. I remember him making that comment. It was in a press conference. It wasn't some scripted speech, but was off the cuff.

If only that were true. Listening to the man giving his briefings, and in general, he doesn't seem terribly coherent, just aggressive, and lacking any tact, or civility, bit like his commander in chief.

[eklipse]

Originally posted by Developer:
I don't remember the exact context, but I believe he said it to avoid answering a question. Either because he didn't know the answer or because he didn't want to answer the question.

.....or maybe because he didn't know that he didn't know the answer or because he knew that he didn't know that he didn't want to answer the question.

[Developer]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Throwing a tantrum doesn't make you right

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Developer:

[lil'babykitten]

So I enter the Politics Lounge for the first time today and see people exchanging pics of hamsters?

What did I miss?!