[PacHead]

I think it is outrageous that the palestinians are being allowed to participate in the Olympics. They are not even a country, because of their terrorist ways. Everybody remembers what happened when they last showed up in 1972. Yasser arafat, the Egyptian terrorist should have nothing to do with the Olympics. If they someday get a democratic, peaceful state, then perhaps they should be allowed, but now it is just a joke.

http://www.gravett.org/Israellycool/...es/004568.html

[UNTeMac]

Because....you know....all Palesitians are terrorists. Your narrow-mindedness is disconcerting at times.

[PacHead]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
Because....you know....all Palesitians are terrorists. Your narrow-mindedness is disconcerting at times.

Cite ? I never said they all were. Obviously enough of them are, plus their leaders are (arafat), which has prevented them from obtaining statehood so far. If they'll ever achieve this, remains to be seen.

[UNTeMac]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Cite ? I never said they all were. Obviously enough of them are, plus their leaders are (arafat), which has prevented them from obtaining statehood so far. If they'll ever achieve this, remains to be seen.

There were "enough" Saudis to bring down the WTC. Should we condemn them all and exclude them from world events build around peace?

[PacHead]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
There were "enough" Saudis to bring down the WTC. Should we condemn them all and exclude them from world events build around peace?

Yes, Saudi Arabia is evil. And also, the PLO has already violated the spirit of the Olympics in the worst possible way , which is a world event built around peace, as you say.

[UNTeMac]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Yes, Saudi Arabia is evil. And also, the PLO has already violated the spirit of the Olympics in the worst possible way , which is a world event built around peace, as you say.

"Saudi Arabia is evil." So who's evil? The people? The government? The house pets? The world is not and has never been black and white despite how easy that assumption is. There are always grey areas in every situation. People who make the mistake of just hating Americans because of the actions of a few of us are doing the same thing you're doing to two notably Arab populations.

[PacHead]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
"Saudi Arabia is evil." So who's evil? The people? The government? The house pets? The world is not and has never been black and white despite how easy that assumption is. There are always grey areas in every situation. People who make the mistake of just hating Americans because of the actions of a few of us are doing the same thing you're doing to two notably Arab populations.

A simple answer is that any totalitarian, dictator run country or territory is evil. In war, there is no room for grey or any other shades inbetween.

[UNTeMac]

Originally posted by PacHead:
A simple answer is that any totalitarian, dictator run country or territory is evil. In war, there is no room for grey or any other shades inbetween.

Well, I don't want to pull this topic totally out of whack so I'll just say that even in war, there are grey areas. There are two sides yes, but the nature of those two sides encompasses a whole spectrum of ideas and participation in the conflict. That dictator may be evil yes, but where do the people fall? Just because Bush is a conservative doesn't make me one just because he's a leader of my country.

[itai195]

Originally posted by PacHead:
A simple answer is that any totalitarian, dictator run country or territory is evil. In war, there is no room for grey or any other shades inbetween.

Like Pakistan?

[PacHead]

Originally posted by itai195:
Like Pakistan?

Yes, Pakistan is evil also. I realize that Bush has to be diplomatic and all, since he's the Prez, but I tell it like it its.

[Millennium]

You assume that all Palestinians are terrorists.

If one of the athletes is found to belong to a terrorist organization, then let that athlete be arrested and duly tried. As for the others, as long as they don't cause any trouble, then I see no problem with allowing them in.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
Because....you know....all Palesitians are terrorists. Your narrow-mindedness is disconcerting at times.

Actually 80% of Palestinians either ARE terrorists, or support Terrorists.

Either way, not a good thing.

I guess we should let the 20% that isn't supportive show up.

[PacHead]

Originally posted by Millennium:
You assume that all Palestinians are terrorists.

If one of the athletes is found to belong to a terrorist organization, then let that athlete be arrested and duly tried. As for the others, as long as they don't cause any trouble, then I see no problem with allowing them in.

Well, at least they don't have a snowballs chance in hell of winning at least. It's all political.

If they won, then this lovely national anthem would have to be played.

My country, my country
My country, the land of my grand fathers
My country, my country
My country, my nation, the nation of eternity
With my determination, my fire and the volcano of my revenge
The longing of my blood to my land and home
I have climbed the mountains and fought the wars
I have conquered the impossible, and crossed the frontiers
My country, my country, the nation of eternity
With the resolve of the winds and the fire of the guns
And the determination of my nation in the land of struggle
Palestine is my home, Palestine is my fire, Palestine is my revenge and the land of eternal
My country, my country, the nation of eternity
I swear under the shade of the flag
To my land and nation, and the fire of pain
I will live as a guerrilla, I will go on as guerrilla, I will expire as guerrilla until I will be back
My country, my country, the nation of eternity

[UNTeMac]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Actually 80% of Palestinians either ARE terrorists, or support Terrorists.

Either way, not a good thing.

I guess we should let the 20% that isn't supportive show up.

80%? Sources?

[Spliffdaddy]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
80%? Sources?

see above: national anthem.

[UNTeMac]

Originally posted by Spliffdaddy:
see above: national anthem.

A national anthem is no proof that 80% of palestinians are terrorists. It takes one person to write a song.

EDIT: Here's another translation btw. Anyone who can read Arabic, I'd love to hear your thoughts on it.

http://www.pac-usa.org/anthem.htm

[PacHead]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
A national anthem is no proof that 80% of palestinians are terrorists. It takes one person to write a song.

And it takes a group of people to adopt that song.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
80%? Sources?

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...=1066799672944

Fifty-nine percent of Palestinians believe that Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad should continue their armed struggle against Israel even if Israel leaves all of the West Bank and Gaza, including East Jerusalem, and a Palestinian state is created, a new survey shows.

Similarly, 80 percent of Palestinians say that, under those circumstances, the Palestinians should not give up the "right of return."

he poll of Palestinians, Israeli Jews, and Israeli Arabs was released in Washington on Wednesday by Itamar Marcus, founder of Palestinian Media Watch and written by pollster Frank Luntz. It was conducted by two polling firms, the Public Opinion Research of Israel and The Palestinian Center for Public Opinion.

Nintey-six percent of Israeli Jews say the people who piloted the planes on September 11 were terrorists, while 37 percent of Palestinians share that view.

Slightly more than one in four - 26 percent - of Palestinians believe Israelis planned the 9-11 attacks.

Forty-two percent of Palestinians and 61 percent of Israeli-Arabs stated that they support the people who are attacking Americans in Iraq. Zero percent of Israeli Jews said they did.

Marcus said he believes such opinions are "not coming from a vacuum" and that the survey demonstrates a "connection between Palestinian media and education and Palestinian beliefs and opinions."

During the Iraq war, Palestinian Authority-sponsored television glorified the killing of American soldiers, a theme that has continued until now in various media, Marcus said.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by PacHead:
A simple answer is ...

At some point you will learn that there are no simple answers.

-s*

[UNTeMac]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...=1066799672944

<snip>

While I would say the Jerusalem Post is more than a little biased on the issue, I'll concede your point. I don't believe however that that makes all or even a majority of palestinians evil people. Indoctrinated? Yes. Evil? No.

[itai195]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
80%? Sources?

You might take a look at Taliesin's posts, he makes it pretty clear that he thinks 80% of Palestinians are either terrorists or support them.

[PacHead]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
While I would say the Jerusalem Post is more than a little biased on the issue, I'll concede your point. I don't believe however that that makes all or even a majority of palestinians evil people. Indoctrinated? Yes. Evil? No.

Are the Borg in Star Trek evil ? Indoctrinated perhaps, but not evil. Does it matter though ? If somebody wants to kill me, I could care less if the person is "indoctrinated" or "evil".

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by UNTiMac:
While I would say the Jerusalem Post is more than a little biased on the issue,

Well that was the first Google link. There are other links I could post I guess giving them same info.

I don't believe however that that makes all or even a majority of palestinians evil people. Indoctrinated? Yes. Evil? No.

I agree.

[Millennium]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Well, at least they don't have a snowballs chance in hell of winning at least. It's all political.

If they won, then this lovely national anthem would have to be played.

My country, my country
My country, the land of my grand fathers
My country, my country
My country, my nation, the nation of eternity
With my determination, my fire and the volcano of my revenge
The longing of my blood to my land and home
I have climbed the mountains and fought the wars
I have conquered the impossible, and crossed the frontiers
My country, my country, the nation of eternity
With the resolve of the winds and the fire of the guns
And the determination of my nation in the land of struggle
Palestine is my home, Palestine is my fire, Palestine is my revenge and the land of eternal
My country, my country, the nation of eternity
I swear under the shade of the flag
To my land and nation, and the fire of pain
I will live as a guerrilla, I will go on as guerrilla, I will expire as guerrilla until I will be back
My country, my country, the nation of eternity

You call that a terrorist song? The French national anthem is much worse than that.

Let's go children of the fatherland,
The day of glory has arrived!
Against us tyranny's
Bloody flag is raised! (repeat)
In the countryside, do you hear
The roaring of these fierce soldiers?
They come right to our arms
To slit the throats of our sons, our friends!

Grab your weapons, citizens!
Train your batallions!
Let us march! Let us march!
May impure blood
Water our fields!

...and that's just the first verse.

[macvillage.net]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Cite ? I never said they all were. Obviously enough of them are, plus their leaders are (arafat), which has prevented them from obtaining statehood so far. If they'll ever achieve this, remains to be seen.

So are many israeli's, including the leadership.

Lets kick them out too.

Why discriminate based on religion?

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by macvillage.net:
So are many israeli's, including the leadership.

Yeah, you'll go far with that.

[PacHead]

Originally posted by macvillage.net:
So are many israeli's, including the leadership.

Lets kick them out too.

Why discriminate based on religion?

Well, my statement was fact, yours is bogus and untrue.

[PacHead]

Originally posted by Millennium:
You call that a terrorist song? The French national anthem is much worse than that.

...and that's just the first verse.

Yes, I have to admit I had never seen the text for the French one before. Yep, It's pretty horrible.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Well, my statement was fact, yours is bogus and untrue.

You probably don't even realize your silliness, but still:

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:


You probably don't even realize your silliness, but still:

Nothing silly about his statement.

[macvillage.net]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Well, my statement was fact, yours is bogus and untrue.

Ok, so lets analyze this.

We can't make generalizations about Israel, because it's a Jewish state

But we can condemn the entire muslim faith because of the actions of a few (considering how many millions there are, it literally is a decimal of a percentage).


Here we have the root of the problem. Your a perfect example of what breeds terrorism. You are the root of the worlds problems right now.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by macvillage.net:
Ok, so lets analyze this.

We can't make generalizations about Israel, because it's a Jewish state

No, you can generalize it all you want. It has nothing to do with it being a Jewish state. You just made that part up.

But we can condemn the entire muslim faith because of the actions of a few (considering how many millions there are, it literally is a decimal of a percentage).

Who condemned the ENTIRE muslim faith JUST because of the actions of few?

Here we have the root of the problem. Your a perfect example of what breeds terrorism. You are the root of the worlds problems right now.

Yeah sure bub. You'll go far with that.

[PacHead]

Originally posted by macvillage.net:
Here we have the root of the problem. Your a perfect example of what breeds terrorism. You are the root of the worlds problems right now.

Yes, your analysis is spot on.

In my sparetime, I am an evil imam who runs a congretation where I hold weekly hate speeches, telling my followers to kill all infidels.

I also run a muslim charity which funnels money out of the country to Hamas.

I am also an active sponsorer of several maddrass schools in Pakistan, where students learn violent Jihad.

And to top it all off, I am an expert chemist, and I make suicide belts in my basement.

Yes, I, me personally, I am the root of the worlds problems right now. I breed terrorism.

Can't you ask Bush to start a war against PacHeads ? He seems to be way off the mark with his current policies.

[Spheric Harlot]

You seem to think that's funny.

He wasn't kidding, and he was right.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Yes, your analysis is spot on.

In my sparetime, I am an evil imam who runs a congretation where I hold weekly hate speeches, telling my followers to kill all infidels.

I also run a muslim charity which funnels money out of the country to Hamas.

I am also an active sponsorer of several maddrass schools in Pakistan, where students learn violent Jihad.

And to top it all off, I am an expert chemist, and I make suicide belts in my basement.

Yes, I, me personally, I am the root of the worlds problems right now. I breed terrorism.

Can't you ask Bush to start a war against PacHeads ? He seems to be way off the mark with his current policies.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
You seem to think that's funny.

He wasn't kidding, and he was right.

It's attitudes like that, that keeps terrorism going.

[eklipse]

Originally posted by itai195:
You might take a look at Taliesin's posts, he makes it pretty clear that he thinks 80% of Palestinians are either terrorists or support them.

I don't think Taliesin ever said the Palestinians were terrorists or supported terrorism - he sees it as legitimate resistance and support of said resistance.

[itai195]

Originally posted by eklipse:
I don't think Taliesin ever said the Palestinians were terrorists or supported terrorism - he sees it as legitimate resistance and support of said resistance.

He's said as much several times, I remember it pretty well. It's not that I agree with him, I definitely do not, it's that it shocked me. Seeing it as legitimate resistance or not is a matter of interpretation, the fact is he said they support the very organizations some of us consider terrorist organizations.

[Zimphire]

Taliesin is a terrorist sympathizer. It didn't surprise me any.

[Millennium]

Originally posted by macvillage.net:
Here we have the root of the problem. Your a perfect example of what breeds terrorism. You are the root of the worlds problems right now.

The root of the problem is no one but the terrorists themselves. They are the ones who choose to kill, and no one else.

Nevertheless, what PacHead is demonstrating here is another kind of problem. However, neither is this the root of anything, because it's a trivial thing to brush these loonies off as such. The time when people held any significant power -with the one major exception of Israel- is over. No one needs to take them seriously anymore, and no one should.

[Taliesin]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Taliesin is a terrorist sympathizer. It didn't surprise me any.

But it surprised me, I swear to God that I'm not sympathising with the US-army nor the US-CIA, nor the US-paramilitary-troops, nor Israel's army, nor Israel's Mossad nor Israel's Shin Beth and also not with Israel's settlers!

Please believe me.

Taliesin

[Taliesin]

Originally posted by Millennium:
The root of the problem is no one but the terrorists themselves. They are the ones who choose to kill, and no one else.

I agree completely, ah that stubborn israelic army and those stubborn settlers that terrorise the palestinians.

Taliesin

[Millennium]

Originally posted by Taliesin:
I agree completely, ah that stubborn israelic army and those stubborn settlers that terrorise the palestinians.

Indeed, if they deliberately organize to target noncombatants then they are terrorists.

Show me the orders to kill noncombatants, and I will call them terrorists. Until then, in the interest of presumption of innocence, I cannot do so.

[dcolton]

Originally posted by Taliesin:
I agree completely, ah that stubborn israelic army and those stubborn settlers that terrorise the palestinians.

Taliesin

Where did you say you were from taliesin?

[dcolton]

BOT:

I actually think it is a good thing for Palestinians to participates in the olympics. It might prevent other terrorists from attacking. If I were an athlete or even a spectator, I would stay as close as possiblt to the Palestinian athletes.

But seriously, I thnk this could be good. It could be a chance to see the Palestinians in a different light.

[Taliesin]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Where did you say you were from taliesin?

Sorry, but I don't want to answer that without a lawyer by my side. But I'm a muslim, that should suffice for being guilty.

Taliesin

[dcolton]

Originally posted by Taliesin:
Sorry, but I don't want to answer that without a lawyer by my side. But I'm a muslim, that should suffice for being guilty.

Taliesin

Guilty of what? I just want to know where you are from.

Answer me this...does your attitude reflect that of those in your area.

[Taliesin]

Originally posted by Millennium:
Indeed, if they deliberately organize to target noncombatants then they are terrorists.

Show me the orders to kill noncombatants, and I will call them terrorists. Until then, in the interest of presumption of innocence, I cannot do so.

Oh, well, history is full of that. There is that nice little story happening in Lebanon a few decades ago, where the PLO had its headquarters for a while. In a cease-fire-agreement between Israel, Lebanon and Syria negotiated with the help of the US, the PLO agreed to withdraw its militants from Lebanon to Syria.

Little time after the PLO-militants withdrew from Lebanon to Syria, Israel broke that cease-fire and bombarded two refuggee-camps, where the families of the PLO-militants stayed back, their wifes, children and elderly. They bombarded the two refuggee-camps for two days, and then sent in christian militias, that were financed and equipped by Israel to form a counterweight to the islamic militias and powers in Lebanon, to kill those that survived the bombardments.

Two days these christian militias slaughtered women, children and elderly under the eyes and with the permission of the israelic army who manned military-posts surrounding these refuggee-camps. Everyone who wanted to escape those refuggee-camps was sent back and was not allowed to exit.

Taliesin

[dcolton]

..

[Taliesin]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Guilty of what? I just want to know where you are from.

Answer me this...does your attitude reflect that of those in your area.

Ok, you have talked me over, I will answer your question, your last one first:

No, my attitude does not reflect that of my area, because I'm located right in your brain: I'm your bad conscience.

Seriously, I can't answer you, sorry.

Taliesin