[dcolton]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,129014,00.html

Just for Logic and LBK.

JERUSALEM_—_A cache of weapons discovered hidden in caves in the West Bank has raised extra alarm bells among Israel's internal intelligence service because the terrorists are Jewish extremists.


The weapons were stolen from the army by members of the same movement that tried to blow up an Arab girls' school in Jerusalem two years ago using a trailer packed with explosives.


Now the head of Israel's_Shin Bet Security Service (search)_is warning the rise of extremism on the far right in Israel could lead to the assassination of Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, to stop his plan to withdraw Jewish settlements from Gaza.


Israel's minister for internal security has issued a warning that Jewish extremists are again planning to attack mosques in the_hopes of_igniting a war and halt any peace process.


Itamar Ben Gvir is one of the leaders of the outlawed_Kach Movement (search)_— followers of the radical Rabbi Meir Kahane. The posters in their office call for expelling the Arabs from Israel. This Jewish group with an office in downtown Jerusalem is listed both in Israel and the_United States_as a terror group.


Kach's "summer camps" for Jewish teenagers teaches them how to attack soldiers, evade army roadblocks, retake their homes if the army tries to evacuate them and survive police interrogations.




"I have no doubt that an Israeli who gives away parts of the land of Israel is a traitor and Ariel Sharon is a traitor," said Itamar Ben Gvir. "If someone is performing acts against the people of Israel — it is OK to kill him."

[voodoo]

Let us not forget that Jewish terrorists murdered Itzhak Rabbin. Insane sociopath Jewish terrorists exist just as much as their counterpart insane sociopath Muslim terrorists.

Edit: remembering Rabbin: http://www.otn.com/netking2/Guestbook/guestbookOld.html

[Taliesin]

Actually the jewish terrorist-groups before 1948 transfered into the governmental armies and spy-agencies after Israel was founded, the israelic army and spy-agencies since then have used terroristic means to make the life for the palestinians as miserable as possible.

These new "outside-of-the-government-jewish-terrorist-groups" have developed the opinion that their government is not terroristic enough against the palestinians! LOL

Taliesin

[voyageur]

dp

[voyageur]

Indeed, and Rabin was a great loss.
I'll recommend it again: if you have any interest in why people kill in the name of religion (any religion!), read Terror in the Name of God by Jessica Stern.

[PacHead]

Talisien and logic are from the same country ?

What the hell is an Israelic ? They both use that same word.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Talisien and logic are from the same country ?

Now back on topic:

Israeli terrorists.

[BlackGriffen]

This is very frustrating. Kill em all (both sides) and let God sort them out sounds so nice and simple....

Perhaps a one state solution would be more simple. Grant all the Palestinians Israeli citizenship, and hold elections.

No, the Irsraeli hardliners would never accept that, because then the Jews would be heavily outnumbered in the government.

Israel is making the two state solution a farce by incrementally carving more and more territory out of the West Bank.

I'm finding unconditional support of Israel to be less and less tenable. Perhaps it's best to impose a deadline. Say, start incrementally cutting off foreign aid to Israel (private interests can still do whatever they can now, of course).

Yeah, right, like that would ever happen.



BlackGriffen

[Dr.HermanG.]

What do you mean incrementally? Just cut them off at the knees and watch how quickly they start behaving.

[Taliesin]

Originally posted by PacHead:
Talisien and logic are from the same country ?

What the hell is an Israelic ? They both use that same word.

No, we aren't from the same country, as far as I know Logic is from Island, I'm not, but I don't want to say from where I am.

I always thought it was like in buddistic or hinduistic or realistic, frenetic, populistic--> israelic, no?

Taliesin

[dcolton]

Now wait a second. Why is terrorism justifiable for the palestinians and not the Israeli's? Couldn't we quickly point to a root cause for Israeli terrorists. Couldn't I just as easily call them freedom fighters with a noble cause?

Couldn't I use the same arguments I have been hearing from logic, lbk, taliesan and crew to justify these horrific people?

Just curious.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Now wait a second. Why is terrorism justifiable for the palestinians and not the Israeli's? Couldn't we quickly point to a root cause for Israeli terrorists. Couldn't I just as easily call them freedom fighters with a noble cause?

Couldn't I use the same arguments I have been hearing from logic, lbk, taliesan and crew to justify these horrific people?

Just curious.

And why, all of a sudden, do you care about the root cause? You weren't interested in understanding what motivates Palestinian "terrorists" to do what they do.

If you want to argue in favour of Israeli terrorists, go ahead. Do try and convince me that they have a reasonable, comprehensive cause.

And why was this thread "just for...LBK"? Am I supposed to be happy?

[PacHead]

Originally posted by Taliesin:
No, we aren't from the same country, as far as I know Logic is from Island, I'm not, but I don't want to say from where I am.

I always thought it was like in buddistic or hinduistic or realistic, frenetic, populistic--> israelic, no?

Taliesin

You're not the only one in the world who has used that term, but it is certainly in the minority. Not that I really care, but why so ashamed of where you are from ? It's not like you're giving out any personal info or anything. I never give personal info on forums, but to refuse to say which country you're from ? You posting from the ministry of truth in Iran or something ?

[Taliesin]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Now wait a second. Why is terrorism justifiable for the palestinians and not the Israeli's? Couldn't we quickly point to a root cause for Israeli terrorists. Couldn't I just as easily call them freedom fighters with a noble cause?

Couldn't I use the same arguments I have been hearing from logic, lbk, taliesan and crew to justify these horrific people?

Just curious.

Because the palestinians aren't terrorists, even the militants are not terrorists, they are resistance-fighters fighting occupation and oppression by Israel. I can't remember when it was the last time palestinians have conducted massimprisonments of Israelis and tortured them, I also can't remember the last time the palestinians have stolen land and water from the Israelis, and I also can't remember the last time the Israelis had to ask the palestinians for permission to travel from one town/village to the other, or even asked the palestinians for permission to dug a well in Israel or to build a home.

No, my friend the palestinians are certainly not oppressing or occupying the Israelis and they are not terrorising the Israelis.

The israeli (I learn quick, hmm?) army though is terrorising the palestinians for the last fifty years on numerous levels, not just the killing of civilians, which the israeli army is doing five times as often as the palestinian can retaliate for.

The israeli outside-of-government-jewish-terrorist-groups are as unjustified as the inside-the-government-jewish-terrorist-groups, that call themselves Israel's Defense Force, Shin Beth or Mossad.

Taliesin

[voodoo]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Now wait a second. Why is terrorism justifiable for the palestinians and not the Israeli's? Couldn't we quickly point to a root cause for Israeli terrorists. Couldn't I just as easily call them freedom fighters with a noble cause?

Couldn't I use the same arguments I have been hearing from logic, lbk, taliesan and crew to justify these horrific people?

Just curious.

Terrorists wherever they come from or whatever 'cause' they pretend to fight for are all equally bad. You could just as easily label them whatever you like but I stand by my interpretation of their motives and atrocities.

There is a root and cause for everything of course. Both for the palestinian terrorists and the israeli. That root can be dealt with without dealing with the terrorists (who are beyond salvation or hope)

[dcolton]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
And why, all of a sudden, do you care about the root cause? You weren't interested in understanding what motivates Palestinian "terrorists" to do what they do.

I have always been interested, you guys simply refused to answer

If you want to argue in favour of Israeli terrorists, go ahead. Do try and convince me that they have a reasonable, comprehensive cause.

I don't want to argue for any killer jew or killer muslim. I was just pointing out the hypocrisy. I think all of these people are horrific and deserve nothing more than the sweat from my nut sac. But, I am still waiting for you to prove to me that muslim terrorists have a 'reasonable, comprehensive cause'

And why was this thread "just for...LBK"? Am I supposed to be happy?

Because I thought you would appreciate an article exposing Jewish terrorists since so many threads are about muslim terrorists. Sheesh, I guess I was wrong

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by dcolton:
I have always been interested, you guys simply refused to answer

50% of my post count probably comes from responding to threads about the Palestinian issue. So, maybe you missed all that?

Originally posted by dcolton:
But, I am still waiting for you to prove to me that muslim terrorists have a 'reasonable, comprehensive cause'

Well, that's an inaccurate remark. I'm strictly talking about the Palestinian issue here. Not Muslim terrorists in general. And I have said, countless times, that I believe the Palestinian fighters have a reasonable cause but I don't agree with them attacking civilian targets.
I don't have to convince you of anything.

Originally posted by dcolton:
Because I thought you would appreciate an article exposing Jewish terrorists since so many threads are about muslim terrorists. Sheesh, I guess I was wrong

Ah. Well, it does make a change.

[MacNStein]

Originally posted by Taliesin:
Because the palestinians aren't terrorists, even the militants are not terrorists, they are resistance-fighters fighting occupation and oppression by Israel.

Fine, they need a bullet in their heads the same as any others of their type (including Jewish terrorists). I'd be more than happy to oblige them.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Taliesin:
Because the palestinians aren't terrorists, even the militants are not terrorists, they are resistance-fighters fighting occupation and oppression by Israel.

the Palestinian terrorists are most certainly terrorists. Placing bombs in public places to incite fear and hopelessness or to exact revenge are textbook examples of terrorism. There are also Israeli terrorists yes.

[Logic]

So when will their houses be demolished, their offices be targeted by gunships, their families rounded up and shipped to prison and their only chance of income be destroyed?

Just wondering because I'm sure Israel treats all terrorists alike................

[MacNStein]

Originally posted by Logic:
So when will their houses be demolished, their offices be targeted by gunships, their families rounded up and shipped to prison and their only chance of income be destroyed?

Just wondering because I'm sure Israel treats all terrorists alike................

Well, that's basically the law. If they don't, I'll be quite disappointed.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by MacNStein:
Well, that's basically the law. If they don't, I'll be quite disappointed.

Well I think you had better sit down then son ...

[MacNStein]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Well I think you had better sit down then son ...

I don't agree with Meir Kahane, and find his tactics replulsive, and do believe that he and his ilk will get what's coming to them. However, I don't believe that his agenda is predominant in Israel.

[Logic]

Originally posted by MacNStein:
I don't agree with Meir Kahane, and find his tactics replulsive, and do believe that he and his ilk will get what's coming to them. However, I don't believe that his agenda is predominant in Israel.

Well if you look at the other thread about the willingness of the Israeli people to install apartheid you'll see that he probably has more support than one would expect from a "civilised" nation.

[ThinkInsane]

Originally posted by Taliesin:
Because the palestinians aren't terrorists, even the militants are not terrorists, they are resistance-fighters fighting occupation and oppression by Israel.
Taliesin

Wrong answer, they certainly are terrorists. Not all Palestinians, but the ones that walk into a crowded cafe and detonate a bomb sure as hell are. Anyone that spills the blood of innocent people to push a political agenda is a terrorist, no ifs ands or buts about it. I grew up being told that the IRA were 'freedom fighters', real hero’s fighting the good fight against oppression and spent a good many years believing that. Then I grew up. You know what I think the IRA is now (most of my fathers side of the family)? Murdering ****ing terrorists and thugs. That's it, nothing else.

When I was a child, I saw my father gunned down. I miss my dad more than anything, but you reap what you sow.

[Dr.HermanG.]

Originally posted by Logic:
Well if you look at the other thread about the willingness of the Israeli people to install apartheid you'll see that he probably has more support than one would expect from a "civilised" nation.

That is what happens when a state becomes too intertwined with a single religion and whose sole existence comes from some fantasies written in a book.

[voyageur]

Originally posted by ThinkInsane:
When I was a child, I saw my father gunned down. I miss my dad more than anything, but you reap what you sow.

I can't imagine...how horrible. And quite admirable you were able to break the cycle.

[itai195]

Originally posted by Dr.HermanG.:
That is what happens when a state becomes too intertwined with a single religion and whose sole existence comes from some fantasies written in a book.

Thanks for the pseudo-history lesson.

As far as the actual topic of this thread -- I certainly hope that if these groups start behaving violently, the Israeli government will take measures to stop them. I'm not sure what more to say about the topic than that. Does the existence of these people actually come as a surprise to anyone? The difference compared to the Palestinians is that these groups, though an obstacle to peace, don't represent a predominant segment of public opinion, whereas our own Taliesin has often reminded us that Palestinian terror groups represent upwards of 80% of Palestinian public opinion.

[version]

Originally posted by ThinkInsane:
Wrong answer, they certainly are terrorists. Not all Palestinians, but the ones that walk into a crowded cafe and detonate a bomb sure as hell are. Anyone that spills the blood of innocent people to push a political agenda is a terrorist, no ifs ands or buts about it. I grew up being told that the IRA were 'freedom fighters', real hero’s fighting the good fight against oppression and spent a good many years believing that. Then I grew up. You know what I think the IRA is now (most of my fathers side of the family)? Murdering ****ing terrorists and thugs. That's it, nothing else.

When I was a child, I saw my father gunned down. I miss my dad more than anything, but you reap what you sow.

There's a problem with the dilution of what is a terrorist today in Israel/Palestine. I've seen too many caes of stone-throwing Palestinians being classed as terrorists, and as such, treated in the same way as those who strap bombs to themelves and walk into a crowd of civilians.

It's the same with gun-wielding Palestinians who fire in Israeli troops in the Occupied Tertitories.

[macvillage.net]

Originally posted by MacNStein:
I don't agree with Meir Kahane, and find his tactics replulsive, and do believe that he and his ilk will get what's coming to them. However, I don't believe that his agenda is predominant in Israel.

They have no issue getting funding.

And Israel isn't exactly cracking down. (nor is the US who also lists them as a terrorist organization).

[Taliesin]

Originally posted by itai195:
The difference compared to the Palestinians is that these groups, though an obstacle to peace, don't represent a predominant segment of public opinion, whereas our own Taliesin has often reminded us that Palestinian terror groups represent upwards of 80% of Palestinian public opinion.

Well, here you are comparing apples (no pun intended) to oranges, you are comparing the resistance-groups like Hamas and PLO to these new jewish terrorgroups, and then look at how many percent of the people support them. But you really should compare the support for the palestinian resistance groups with the support of the Israelis for their official governmental armies and secret agencies.

In the future palestinian state, should it ever become reality, these resistance groups you and others so blindly call terrorist-groups will transfer to the governmental armies and secret agencies.

Retaliation is not terrorism, as long as the israeli side is killing five times as many civilians.

One could really look at it from a pacifistic side and condemn the palestinian retaliation and even stop it, but that's contraporductive as exactly that palestinian retaliation is offering the balance to the israelic violence to restrain the israelic armies. See, without the palestinian retaliation through suicide-bombings, which is by the way a relative new form of resistance, the death-toll of the palestinians would be much higher, like in former times, before the direct retaliation was introduced, in which the israeli armies didn't feel the need to restrain itself.

Taliesin

[version]

Originally posted by macvillage.net:
They have no issue getting funding.

And Israel isn't exactly cracking down. (nor is the US who also lists them as a terrorist organization).

It's the same with the IRA in the States. Under Clinon we saw some movement to curb the massive funding they wee getting from the States, and despite some rhetoric on this matter to stop such things, it still continues.

[macvillage.net]

Originally posted by version:
It's the same with the IRA in the States. Under Clinon we saw some movement to curb the massive funding they wee getting from the States, and despite some rhetoric on this matter to stop such things, it still continues.

Very true.

But America 'will not stand for terrorism'... unless we fund it.