[Lerkfish]

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/orego...0303292321.xml

The ad was paid for by Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, a group of 300 Vietnam veterans who served in Swift boats and say Kerry has lied about his war record and disgraced his fellow veterans by publicly opposing the conflict upon his return home. The group said the ad will be aired again, though it has not decided where it will be shown.


French, in an interview Thursday, said Kerry lied about the circumstances that led to one of his Purple Hearts and a Bronze Star. Kerry received a Bronze Star, a Silver Star and three Purple Hearts commanding a Swift boat in Vietnam.


French said he is relying on the accounts of three other veterans who were friends of his at the time. A fourth veteran with whom French was acquainted corroborated their accounts.


"I was not a witness to these events but my friends were," said French, who was awarded two Bronze Stars during the war. "I believe these people. These are people I served with."


One of the men is Larry Thurlow, a leader of the veterans group and one of Kerry's most vocal critics. Thurlow, who served alongside Kerry, has disputed Kerry's claim that the senator's boat was under fire in March 1969 when he pulled Lt. Jim Rassmann out of the water.


But according to Thurlow's military records, obtained this week by The Washington Post, the five-boat flotilla was under enemy fire that day.


French -- relying on friends' accounts -- said Rassmann would have been picked up by another boat if Kerry had not helped. And French said any shots that were fired came from U.S. soldiers providing cover as Rassmann and two others were rescued.


"It's not like he wouldn't have been saved if Kerry had not been there," French said. "I don't believe they were under any fire when that happened. None of the other boats were damaged."

I really love that last comment: "its not like he wouldn't have been saved if Kerry had not been there" But he was, and he did. So he shouldn't get the medal because in an alternate universe if someone else was standing exactly where Kerry was, he would have done the same thing?

amazing pretzel logic...oh , and I love appearing in an ad claiming someone is a liar about events you did not personally witness....so that's hearsay about someone else's hearsay...

this is getting thinner and thinner, folks.

[spacefreak]

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
this is getting thinner and thinner, folks.

What's getting awfully thin is Kerry's inability to address the mountains of charges levied against him in Unfit for Command. All he has to do is authorize a full and complete release of his military record and, if he's being truthful, the entire scandal would disappear overnight.

Instead, Kerry's chooses to silence these vets and have the book banned and removed from bookshelves. Then he whines and cries about this 527s (initial) $100,000 ad buy while conveniently sidestepping the fact that MoveOn.org has spent $62 million in advertising over the last year.

That you think it's getting thin shows that you have no idea what's in the book other than what others have told you. And even with every Democrat and their moms furiously looking inder every rock to try and discredit any SwiftVet, only about .5% of the charges against Kerry have even been substantially addressed.

[Lerkfish]

Originally posted by spacefreak:
What's getting awfully thin is Kerry's inability to address the mountains of charges levied against him in Unfit for Command. {B]All he has to do is authorize a full and complete release of his military record and, if he's being truthful, the entire scandal would disappear overnight. /B]

http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/service.html
http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_...y_records.html

[SimeyTheLimey]

As I posted in the other thread, Kerry has not released his records in their entirety.

Washington Post: Swift Boat Accounts Incomplete and Flawed

Some of the mystery surrounding exactly what happened on the Bay Hap River in March 1969 could be resolved by the full release of all relevant records and personal diaries. Much information is available from the Web sites of the Kerry campaign and Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, and the Navy archives. But both the Kerry and anti-Kerry camps continue to deny or ignore requests for other relevant documents, including Kerry's personal reminiscences (shared only with biographer Brinkley), the boat log of PCF-94 compiled by Medeiros (shared only with Brinkley) and the Chenoweth diary.

Although Kerry campaign officials insist that they have published Kerry's full military records on their Web site (with the exception of medical records shown briefly to reporters earlier this year), they have not permitted independent access to his original Navy records. A Freedom of Information Act request by The Post for Kerry's records produced six pages of information. A spokesman for the Navy Personnel Command, Mike McClellan, said he was not authorized to release the full file, which consists of at least a hundred pages.

But anyway, lerk, how about keeping this to the threads that are open? Hm? That way the discussion can proceed in an orderly fashion so that people don't have to make the same point in multiple threads.

[Logic]

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
As I posted in the other thread, Kerry has not released his records in their entirety.

Has Bush?

[SimeyTheLimey]

Originally posted by Logic:
Has Bush?

Yes, Bush has signed form 180 authorizing the release of all his military records to the press and public. But what has that got to do with the need pointed out by the Post for Kerry to do the same?

I know this is politics, but not everything it tit for tat. There is a standalone issue that could be clarified if Kerry were to let the press do its job. Right now the only records available are those provided selectively by Kerry and his paid historian.

But again, I think this should be moved to one of the existing threads. It's redundant here.

[spacefreak]

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/service.html
http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_...y_records.html

I asked for ALL the records, not the select ones that the Kerry camp makes public.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
Yes, Bush has signed form 180 authorizing the release of all his military records to the press and public. But what has that got to do with the need pointed out by the Post for Kerry to do the same?

I know this is politics, but not everything it tit for tat. There is a standalone issue that could be clarified if Kerry were to let the press do its job. Right now the only records available are those provided selectively by Kerry and his paid historian.

But again, I think this should be moved to one of the existing threads. It's redundant here.

So I am sure you have a link to all of Bush's records? Surely.

[Logic]

Originally posted by voodoo:
So I am sure you have a link to all of Bush's records? Surely.

If he got the link to the records that "disappeared" it would be great if he let the Pentagon know as well

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
Yes,

LIES!

[Spliffdaddy]

Sure Kerry lies.

That's why he's in so much crap right now.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by Spliffdaddy:
Sure Kerry lies.

That's why he's in so much crap right now.

All your Presidents lie. I think it's in the job description.

Kerry sucks ass just as much as Bush. In fact, I think Bush is the lesser of two evils.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
Kerry sucks ass just as much as Bush. In fact, I think Bush is the lesser of two evils.

<kicks LBK to KBL>



[edit: now with a WORKING link!]

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by voodoo:
<kicks LBK to KBL>

The Korean Basketball League?

[voodoo]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
The Korean Basketball League?

Hope you like tall koreans.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Hope you like tall koreans.

See if you can get your mittens on an article entitled "The Warlords of America" by John Pilger. He pretty much reinforced the suspicions I had about Kerry already (no rhyme intended). And Pilger is probably the most far left British journalist you can find!

[CreepingDeth]

Hold on. Were we talking about some Kerry thing or Koreans?

So I guess LBK says "I like [Hitler]."

Ya know, since Bush is pure evil and a terrorist and an idiot and a conspirator and also Hitler…don't forget stupid!

[voodoo]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:


See if you can get your mittens on an article entitled "The Warlords of America" by John Pilger. He pretty much reinforced the suspicions I had about Kerry already (no rhyme intended). And Pilger is probably the most far left British journalist you can find!

Warlords of America.. mkay. That book must have some damning information because I don't see for the life of me how Kerry is the lesser of two evils when compared to W.

I know Kerry is a professional politician and I don't harbor any illusions about such people but that aside John Kerry has relied more on his own common sense through his carrier than on advisors. That contrasts with Bush rather heavily and brings a lot more sense of responisibility to the U.S.Arican president. Bush has set up a model where he is just not responisble because he only did what his advisors told him to do! Sorry he has to go.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Hold on. Were we talking about some Kerry thing or Koreans?

So I guess LBK says "I like [Hitler]."

Ya know, since Bush is pure evil and a terrorist and an idiot and a conspirator and also Hitler…don't forget stupid!

Yep I guess she says just that.

Bush isn't evil he's just irresponsible, dumb as bread and has a knack of making the completely wrong decisions. He's also a neocon pawn : p

[CreepingDeth]

WTF is a USArican? IS that some E.U.rotrash "funny acronym"?

Kerry? Common sense? Where has Bush said he isn't responsible for something?
I love it when Europeans act like they're Americans.

Your European socialists are the harbingers of international communism. Also, Bush i hardly a neocon, and his policies are as conservative as Load was heavy metal. at least baby kitten crossed over to the Darkside.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Hold on. Were we talking about some Kerry thing or Koreans?

So I guess LBK says "I like [Hitler]."

Ya know, since Bush is pure evil and a terrorist and an idiot and a conspirator and also Hitler…don't forget stupid!

[voodoo]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
WTF is a USArican? IS that some E.U.rotrash "funny acronym"?

Kerry? Common sense? Where has Bush said he isn't responsible for something?
I love it when Europeans act like they're Americans.

Actually it is spelled U.S.Arican. It is short for United States of American.

It's not degratory in meaning, simply more accurate than the generic 'american'. like the Europeans don't appreciate it when that term is used over only one nation in Europe (like say, when talking about European nation X with European from European country Y it would just be silly and confusing) So it is out of concern to all the nations in the Americas that you are called United States of Americans. U.S.Aricans.



The rest of your post wans't coherent. At least not to me.

[CreepingDeth]

Accurate term? I've got an accurate term for your continent.
We're Americans, the dudes above us are Canadians, and the people trying to get away from the country below us are Mexicans. Then you've got a lot of small 3rd world countries the rest of the way down.
European is used because you're countries are so small. Europe has a pretty widespread attitude about us, and since it'd not country specific, just call em by their continent (although the divide between Europe and Asia is hardly a divide).

[voodoo]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Accurate term? I've got an accurate term for your continent.
We're Americans, the dudes above us are Canadians, and the people trying to get away from the country below us are Mexicans. Then you've got a lot of small 3rd world countries the rest of the way down.
European is used because you're countries are so small. Europe has a pretty widespread attitude about us, and since it'd not country specific, just call em by their continent (although the divide between Europe and Asia is hardly a divide).

No can do sir. Your 'country' is a federation or a union of independant-ish (anyway) ex-colonies or new states. That conglamorate is called U.S.A. (can't be bothered with the long title) and makes you U.S.Arican if you are from there. north of you is Canada while above you is teh Sky™. Below you is teh Earth™ and south of you is Mexico. Together, sans the sky (not necessary for the definition) these three countries form North America, or the northern plate of the Americas. Any nation from Argentina to Canada is American. Any citizen of a country included in the Americas is American. For instance the Spanish word for U.S.Arican when dirctly translated means Whitey. Oh no that's what the Mexicans call ya (gringo) but the Spanish word translated literally means Unitestatsian. Same in Icelandic, directly translated it means Unitedstatesian. While you call yourself Americans, others don't. I'll change to Unitedstatesian if you think that is better, but from talking to U.S.Aricans they seem pretty ok with that word. U.S.Asians was too confusing with people from Asia although it would have otherwise functioned well enough.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Warlords of America.. mkay. That book must have some damning information because I don't see for the life of me how Kerry is the lesser of two evils when compared to W.

I know Kerry is a professional politician and I don't harbor any illusions about such people but that aside John Kerry has relied more on his own common sense through his carrier than on advisors. That contrasts with Bush rather heavily and brings a lot more sense of responisibility to the U.S.Arican president. Bush has set up a model where he is just not responisble because he only did what his advisors told him to do! Sorry he has to go.

It's not a book, it's a news article.

Don't get me wrong, Bush is a complete ****tard. That will never change. But, I don't see Kerry making any sort of headway on the foreign policy front, which is all I care about when it comes to these elections. To take just two examples, he's already changed his position on the illegal barrier in Israel after previously being against it. Second, he voted for the Iraq war so his opposition to it now seems kinda redundant. Bonus third, look who he's considering to appoint as his National Security Advisor - James Rubin, the chief asshole of assholes.

I'd be concerned about the neo-conservatives going down under with Kerry in office too. At the moment, with the current dolt in office, we can see right through to the origins of 'Bush's' foreign policy.

Sure Kerry would be a lot more proffesional in his job, he might even demonstrate an ability to speak with authority. But I don't trust him.

You should keep in mind that there aren't many American Presidents that I've liked anyway.

[Logic]

Originally posted by voodoo:
....snipped post....

[Logic]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
You should keep in mind that there aren't many American Presidents that I've liked anyway.

Did you mean U.S.Arican Presidents or don't you like Chavez?

[olePigeon]

Originally posted by spacefreak:
<snip>

Blah blah blah. Where was Bush during the Vietnam war? Oh yeah, no one remembers.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by Logic:
Did you mean U.S.Arican Presidents or don't you like Chavez?

I don't know! Voodoo's post gave me a headache!

[Logic]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
I don't know! Voodoo's post gave me a headache!

[voodoo]

Look, U.S. presidents are as trustworthy as they look but Bush has blundered too much. For the interest of U.S.Aricans in general they should ditch him. Not to mention the rest of the world. + it would be so funny to see Blair have to take a 180 deg turn and begin to kiss a third U.S. president's ass.

As for James Rubin. Well seems like a typical NY-er to me.
http://dosfan.lib.uic.edu/ERC/biographies/rubin.html
Not a very scary dude, unless I'm missing something?

some emotional garbage peeking through but pretty coherent and nice considering it was written so soon after 9/11 - although he mentions the 'pre-empetive attack concept

http://www.guardian.co.uk/wtccrash/s...551067,00.html


Here are his views on the political and diplomatic scandal that was the U.S. iraq campaign.

http://www.foreignaffairs.org/200309...-into-war.html

Fankly, a typical Democratic Clintonite foreign advisor.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Look, U.S. presidents are as trustworthy as they look but Bush has blundered too much. For the interest of U.S.Aricans in general they should ditch him. Not to mention the rest of the world. + it would be so funny to see Blair have to take a 180 deg turn and begin to kiss a third U.S. president's ass.

As for James Rubin. Well seems like a typical NY-er to me.
http://dosfan.lib.uic.edu/ERC/biographies/rubin.html
Not a very scary dude, unless I'm missing something?

some emotional garbage peeking through but pretty coherent and nice considering it was written so soon after 9/11 - although he mentions the 'pre-empetive attack concept

http://www.guardian.co.uk/wtccrash/s...551067,00.html


Here are his views on the political and diplomatic scandal that was the U.S. iraq campaign.

http://www.foreignaffairs.org/200309...-into-war.html

Fankly, a typical Democratic Clintonite foreign advisor.

Sorry, I've fulfilled my MacNN long post quota for today. I can only provide 2/3 sentence answers for the rest of the day.

(Feeling lazy and frankly, I cannot be assed to type)

[voodoo]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
Sorry, I've fulfilled my MacNN long post quota for today. I can only provide 2/3 sentence answers for the rest of the day.

(Feeling lazy and frankly, I cannot be assed to type)

Yes I just received this photo of you in front of teh computer

[voodoo]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
Sorry, I've fulfilled my MacNN long post quota for today. I can only provide 2/3 sentence answers for the rest of the day.

(Feeling lazy and frankly, I cannot be assed to type)

Would have used this one but there ain't any keyboard

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Yes I just received this photo of you in front of teh computer

Pretty much, cept I'm not a guy...

[SimeyTheLimey]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Accurate term? I've got an accurate term for your continent.
We're Americans, the dudes above us are Canadians, and the people trying to get away from the country below us are Mexicans. Then you've got a lot of small 3rd world countries the rest of the way down.
European is used because you're countries are so small. Europe has a pretty widespread attitude about us, and since it'd not country specific, just call em by their continent (although the divide between Europe and Asia is hardly a divide).

Don't let him goad you. He only uses that made up word to be obnoxious.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
Pretty much, cept I'm not a guy...

YOURNOTAGUY!!!??

Excuse me, I have to go now since my grandmother is on fire.

I thought I was talking to a little baby kitten!

[voodoo]

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
Don't let him goad you. He only uses that made up word to be obnoxious.

That's projecting and you've been reported.

[macvillage.net]

Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
Yes, Bush has signed form 180 authorizing the release of all his military records to the press and public. But what has that got to do with the need pointed out by the Post for Kerry to do the same?

All the important stuff wasn't in those documents. As the media said. Nothing new was learned from them. So they weren't 'all' of his records. The pentagon has an ongoing 'investigation' into the status of his 'missing' records.

They still don't show if he served his time with the national guard. Nor do they account for him helping with a campaign (while somehow managing to serve at the same time).

Nobody ever got answers to if he did serve as required... or if he bailed for a political career. Those records are still missing.

I'd bet if Kerry were in office, he would have released 'all' his records as well (minus what he doesn't want people to see).

Presidents home field advantage.

[Spliffdaddy]

lol.

Why doesn't Kerry release his records *now*?

If it would help his chances of being elected he would have already done just that.

So we can conclude that there is a good reason for Kerry's reluctance to make those records public.

Either he is unable to sign his name on the release form - or he is unwilling to do so.

[macvillage.net]

Originally posted by Spliffdaddy:
lol.

Why doesn't Kerry release his records *now*?

If it would help his chances of being elected he would have already done just that.

So we can conclude that there is a good reason for Kerry's reluctance to make those records public.

Either he is unable to sign his name on the release form - or he is unwilling to do so.

Why doesn't Bush find the rest of his records?

[Spliffdaddy]

Why doesn't Kerry look for 'em?

[Zimphire]

Bush isn't trying to prop up his job description with his record.

[Logic]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Bush isn't trying to prop up his job description with his record.

Of course not. He can't.

[Zimphire]

Either can Kerry without making stuff up.

[Logic]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Either can Kerry without making stuff up.

Your opinion.

[Zimphire]

Then why else would he be making stuff up? To try to prop up his "history"

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Excuse me, I have to go now since my grandmother is on fire.

...et le singe est sur la branche!

[voodoo]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
...et le singe est sur la branche!

You're the president of Burundi?

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by voodoo:
You're the president of Burundi?

Tu es un travesti?