[moki]

I saw this whole fiasco on TV. More than anything, I was amazed at the rudeness of the fans in the stadium. They booed the judges into submission, making them change the scores for Nemov. Fine.

But then with Hamm waiting to start the next event, they continued booing, hissing, whistling... and even after Nemov got up and motioned for them to stop, they didn't.

Finally, Hamm did is routine despite the puerile derision from the mob of multinational cretins. There is clearly an anti-American undertone here -- witness Khorkina's statements that she lost because she's Russian, not American. Witness the lack of respect for Hamm having to endure boos, whistles, and jeering for several minutes before and during his performance.

Hamm didn't do anything wrong; the judges are the ones who screwed up on the difficulty of the Korean's routine, yet he is booed. Apparently, the judges also incorrectly deducted from the Korean's routine, so even if it was initially scored out of a 10.0 difficulty level, the Korean would have lost.

The whole scene was very tawdry and unseemly. I'm positive that people will be spouting conspiracy theories about Americans unfairly winning, bribing judges, etc. Khorkina has already started that discussion in public.

So get ready for the din of rude, disrespectful, paranoid voices to start screaming about America's wins. It started in the stadium, it'll continue.

from: http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stori...102811/1/.html

.....

Olympics: Gymnastics takes a tumble - Hamm and egg on judges' faces

ATHENS : If they gave out medals for unhappiness and misery, Olympic gymnastics would provide a podium sweep.

It seems everyone involved is peeved at someone, feeling slighted or robbed, and not even gold medallists are above being caught in the fray of a sport where judging woes abound and even loyal ticketbuyers have lost their patience.

Competition came to a merciful end here Monday after spectators booed so loudly and so long that they halted the concluding horizontal bar event for almost 10 minutes, upset at low scores for 2000 Olympic winner Alexei Nemov.

Taking control of a sport that had lost control of itself through judging miscues, fans served notice they will no longer tolerate scores that do not reflect the reality of their own less-expert eyes.

"I would like to thank all these people for what they did," said Nemov, who won six medals at both the Atlanta and Sydney Olympics. "Everyone should have understood by now that you cannot fool the fans.

"Generally I respect judges and I only try to do my job well. I am very happy that I am leaving Athens with dignity and with the love of all these people who were here."

A sport steeped in beauty and grace trotted out it's ugly side for all to see and some disputes are still to be settled.

Paul Hamm became the first American to win the Olympic men's all-around title, falling from first to 12th with a stumble in the vault, then rallying to win with top marks on parallel bars and horizontal bar.

But Hamm, try as he might and for all his work, will never be able to convince some people that he deserves the only gold medal he won because of a scoring snafu by judges that robbed South Korean Yang Tae Young of the crown.

Judges gave Yang's high bar routine a 9.9 start value rather than a full 10. Had he been correctly valued, Yang had marks good enough to beat Hamm for gold rather than settle for bronze.

The International Gymnastics Federation, abbreviated FIG as in 'We couldn't give a flying fig', ruled the judges were in error and suspended them. But officials also said scores were not protestable, so Hamm's victory would stand.

Unhappy South Korean officials, feeling an injustice, were in talks with FIG before trying to take their case to the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS).

"I do understand and feel the disappointment that Yang Tae Young has been subjected to and I hope he understands what I have been through as well," Hamm said.

"I don't feel I have to give back my medal. If FIG will decide that I have to give it back, I'll do it."

Hamm was also center stage for the high bar boo-fest from frustrated fans at a set of judges who were called in after the Hamm-Yang judging suspensions.

Hamm was up after Nemov and waited through the boos, a stunning vocal demand for fairness by an outraged public unlike anything gymnastics veterans had ever seen before.

Judges wound up submitting a revised score for Nemov that still kept him third, failing to appease the angry crowd while tearing another huge chunk of credibility out of a sport that had so little to begin with.

"It's not very good," said Hamm's coach, Miles Avery.

After agonizing minutes, Hamm walked up and began his routine. The crowd din faded to a murmur but boos returned when scores were announced for runner-up Hamm and Italian winner Igor Cassina and again as gymnasts walked off.

"It's not easy to perform under these conditions," Cassina said.

Russian diva Svetlana Khorkina made her farewell to gymnastics a flop, dropping from the uneven bars as she sought her third consecutive Olympic gold medal in the event. She stormed off before her last rival performed.

Three-time world champion Khorkina took second in the women's all-around behind 16-year-old American Carly Patterson, then took jabs at the judges.

"I knew well in advance, even before I stepped on the stage for my first event, that I was going to lose," Khorkina told the Russian newspaper Izvestia. "I practically did everything right, still they just set me up and fleeced me. ... I think it's because I'm from Russia, not from America."

Asked about Patterson, Khorkina told the paper: "I've seen a much tougher opposition than her. Let's see how long she can remain on top. Can she keep going and compete in two more Olympics like myself?"

Patterson's reply: "She's probably just a sore loser. I don't really care what she says. I won."

Romania's women and Japan's men outdueled US rivals for team gold, the Japanese reclaiming the crown for the first time since 1976.

China was a disappointment, losing team crowns and seeing favorites struggle simply to win medals. Coaches made bold predictions for changes and success at the 2008 Beijing Games, but their results showed that much work is needed.

[Millennium]

I severely doubt there is any pro-American or anti-American bias in the judging, given that errors have been made both for and against Americans. More likely, the gymnastics judges this year are simply incompetent.

[dcolton]

Blame it on the Canadians!

At any rate, does it really matter? It's gymnastics afterall. An exhibition that doesn't quaify as a sport because it requires judging that is based on reputation. We are better off just eliminating such events. The judges changed their scores after the fact for Christ sake! How horrific is that.

[Mastrap]

Christ Moki, what sad, sad world do you live in? Do you spend all your days looking for an anti American (Olympics) or anti Semitic (Tour de France) bias so you can get all upset?

FWIW, several athletes have complained that the US is getting an easy ride. The truth? It's a human competition, judged by other humans. To expect 100% accuracy is impossible. Get over it already.

How on earth do you run your company if you take everything so damn personal?

[moki]

Originally posted by Millennium:
I severely doubt there is any pro-American or anti-American bias in the judging, given that errors have been made both for and against Americans. More likely, the gymnastics judges this year are simply incompetent.

I agree, the judges suck -- but the lack of respect paid to Hamm was even worse. Ditto the comments from the Russian bitch.

[Logic]

Originally posted by moki:
I agree, the judges suck -- but the lack of respect paid to Hamm was even worse. Ditto the comments from the Russian bitch.

Thanks for showing how much better you are yourself....

[moki]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Christ Moki, what sad, sad world do you live in? Do you spend all your days looking for an anti American (Olympics) or anti Semitic (Tour de France) bias so you can get all upset?

That's Tour de Lance. I don't recall posting anything about the Tour de France, but anyway...

No, I do not spend all of my time looking for said stories; but when I find them, I post them here, because it's amusing to watch the America-haters get their panties in a bunch and try to explain away comments like "I practically did everything right, still they just set me up and fleeced me. ... I think it's because I'm from Russia, not from America."

[moki]

Originally posted by Logic:
Thanks for showing how much better you are yourself....

After a comment like that, and her other sulking, posturing, etc. that she displayed at the Olympics, I think the term is fitting, no?

There is also simply no excuse to continue booing, jeering, and whistling when another competitor is waiting to do his routine. None.

[Logic]

Originally posted by moki:
After a comment like that, and her other sulking, posturing, etc. that she displayed at the Olympics, I think the term is fitting, no?

Calling a woman a bitch is never a fitting term, no.

[moki]

Originally posted by Logic:
Calling a woman a bitch is never a fitting term, no.

Well, we disagree then -- I think when the shoe fits, you wear it.

While I'm at it, I'd like to offer props to her compatriot, Nemov -- he was EXTREMELY classy about the whole thing. Kudos to him for showing good sportsmanship. Rotten tomatoes for Khorkina and for the crowd.

[Logic]

Originally posted by moki:
Well, we disagree then -- I think when the shoe fits, you wear it.

So you won't complain the next time I call you or someone on this board something that I see fit? Good to know.

[Spheric Harlot]

Moki:

I wish you would just accept that we all hate Americans with a passion.

Every European, in his heart, hates America, Americans, American values, and American food.

Yes, we hate them so much that we have poisoned the entire international community (and we didn't even have to bomb, kill, and maim innocents for - imagine that!) to the point where Olympic judges will mess up a KOREAN'S score *just* to witness the gratifying event of an American being booed out by a "mob of multinational cretins".

You are certainly one of the most stupid people I have yet encountered, and I don't care if you cut down trees with your teeth.

-spheric* (m.c.)

[Turias]

"I knew well in advance, even before I stepped on the stage for my first event, that I was going to lose," Khorkina told the Russian newspaper Izvestia. "I practically did everything right, still they just set me up and fleeced me. ... I think it's because I'm from Russia, not from America."

Whether or not she is a bitch is not for me to judge. But still, I saw all of those performances, and she definitely made a number of big mistakes. No way did she deserve to win. She's just a sore loser, like the American man who lost the shot put competition because he stepped out of bounds on his final shot. He screamed at the judges, insisting that he did not go out of bounds. He did.

[yakkiebah]

Originally posted by moki:
That's Tour de Lance. I don't recall posting anything about the Tour de France, but anyway...

dementia

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by moki:
I saw this whole fiasco on TV. More than anything, I was amazed at the rudeness of the fans in the stadium. They booed the judges into submission, making them change the scores for Nemov. Fine. ......WAAH WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH......

Puh-leeze. Gimme a break. Do you realise what a tough role it is to be a judge of such a high profile event? Sure there's been some controversy, there always is. I think the judges, for the most part, do a damn good job. They even react to the crowd and re-examine the scores.

Trust you to think up something about anti-american conspiracy theories. It's the bloody Olympics! Give it a rest.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by yakkiebah:
dementia

Ah, yes - moki at his best.

Any other person would have posted this thread in the regular Lounge, but when moki gets ahold of something like this, of course it's "political".

I stand by my first comment in that thread.

[Millennium]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
Puh-leeze. Gimme a break. Do you realise what a tough role it is to be a judge of such a high profile event? Sure there's been some controversy, there always is. I think the judges, for the most part, do a damn good job. They even react to the crowd and re-examine the scores.

They can't even get such standardized things as starting values right, and that's before any actual judging -the high-pressure stuff- takes place. They've already screwed up significantly more times than any past judging team, by enough of a margin than can be attributed to simple human mistakes.

The fact is, they're incompetent and need to be removed. It's too late to do anything about the errors already committed, but finding a set of judges who can actually do the job right shouldn't be that difficult.

[macvillage.net]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Christ Moki, what sad, sad world do you live in? Do you spend all your days looking for an anti American (Olympics) or anti Semitic (Tour de France) bias so you can get all upset?

FWIW, several athletes have complained that the US is getting an easy ride. The truth? It's a human competition, judged by other humans. To expect 100% accuracy is impossible. Get over it already.

How on earth do you run your company if you take everything so damn personal?

It's like masturbation. You keep doing it harder and harder, and it feels better and better.

Even US athletes in recent olympic games have said they (and the rest of the western world) feel it seems to get it easier than some other countries when it's arbitrary (judges used rather than a stopwatch).

These sports can't be tied to numbers. It's arbitrary.

My favorite color may not be your favorite color. But is mine not really my favorite? Is mine worth less? Or just a different opinion?

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by Millennium:
They can't even get such standardized things as starting values right, and that's before any actual judging -the high-pressure stuff- takes place. They've already screwed up significantly more times than any past judging team, by enough of a margin than can be attributed to simple human mistakes.

The fact is, they're incompetent and need to be removed. It's too late to do anything about the errors already committed, but finding a set of judges who can actually do the job right shouldn't be that difficult.

How many times has the error been made in the starting values? Once, if I recall correctly. Not a big deal. Sh1t happens.

[tie]

Originally posted by moki:
So get ready for the din of rude, disrespectful, paranoid voices to start screaming about America's wins. It started in the stadium, it'll continue.

I'm ready for the din of paranoid right-wingers to start screaming about how everyone -- Europeans, lefties, freed Iraqis -- hates America. Give it a break, it's just gymnastics.

[Secret__Police]

This is the last straw Bush needs to add Greece to the list of terror states

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Secret__Police:
This is the last straw Bush needs to add Greece to the list of terror states

Subliminable.

[deedar]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
Moki:

I wish you would just accept that we all hate Americans with a passion.

Every European, in his heart, hates America, Americans, American values, and American food.

Yes, we hate them so much that we have poisoned the entire international community (and we didn't even have to bomb, kill, and maim innocents for - imagine that!) to the point where Olympic judges will mess up a KOREAN'S score *just* to witness the gratifying event of an American being booed out by a "mob of multinational cretins".

-spheric* (m.c.)

Bastards. I knew it!!!

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Blame it on the Canadians!

Actually, Canada has been burned in Gymnastics as well. Looks like there's an anti-Canadian conspiracy as well!
http://www.cbc.ca/story/olympics/nat...ers040824.html

[Millennium]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
How many times has the error been made in the starting values? Once, if I recall correctly. Not a big deal. Sh1t happens.

Twice at least thus far, and possibly more than that. And this is in the part of the judging that you could practically train pigeons to do; this isn't even in the meatier aspects of judging which take actual skill.

There is no excuse for there to be more than one error, because the first should have set everyone on guard to be particularly careful about checking their results. That has evidently not happened. You can't just keep giving infinite second-chances.

[Monique]

They were not booing Hamm they were booing the judges and I love the fact they had to change the score. The Russian did a great job and he should have had the gold. Anyway, I am glad that Hamm will keep his gold for the all around and the judges in this case will not be pressured to give it to the South Korean. The Russian guy had a lot of class and I am sure he loved the fact that the crowd was on his side after so many years being the least favorite in competitions.

[tie]

The fans acted similarly badly at the men's 200 m finals. Apparently they were upset that the Greek star had failed a drug test and dropped out (after a "motorcycle accident"). Even if their tickets were expensive, and they were disappointed in their star, it's no excuse. The crowds aren't making a good impression on TV at least.