[moki]

It's been a busy few weeks for the religion of peace... when will the mainstream majority of Muslims cut off the poisoned branch of Islam?

-- School taken by Islamist gunmen, holding 400 women and children hostage, threatening to blow them up: http://abcnews.go.com/wire/World/ap20040901_399.html

-- Suicide bombing by Islamists kills 10 and injuries 50 in Moscow: http://www.indolink.com/displayArtic...d=083104101357

-- Twin bus bombings by Islamists kills 20 Israelis: http://www.sltrib.com/nationworld/ci_2407159

-- 12 Nepalese executed in Iraq by Islamists, without any demands made: http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/23147.html

-- French journalists threatened with death unless the French ban on headscarves is lifted: http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/9538193.htm

-- Islamist blow up two Russian Airliners: http://www.iht.com/articles/536748.html

-- Islamists bomb a teacher convoy in Thailand: http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stori...104300/1/.html

All we need now is another bombing in India/Kashmir to round things out... unbelievable...

[Logic]

You poor poor soul. None of the attacks was done by the great religion of Islam, but by a few poor souls like yours. Next time you decide to start a Bash Islamathon you better make sure you can back it up by quoting the Quran and showing that it was an Islamic thing to do.

[Spliffdaddy]

Originally posted by moki:
It's been a busy few weeks for the religion of peace... when will the mainstream majority of Muslims cut off the poisoned branch of Islam?

-- School taken by Islamist gunmen, holding 400 women and children hostage, threatening to blow them up: http://abcnews.go.com/wire/World/ap20040901_399.html

-- Suicide bombing by Islamists kills 10 and injuries 50 in Moscow: http://www.indolink.com/displayArtic...d=083104101357

-- Twin bus bombings by Islamists kills 20 Israelis: http://www.sltrib.com/nationworld/ci_2407159

-- 12 Nepalese executed in Iraq by Islamists, without any demands made: http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/23147.html

-- French journalists threatened with death unless the French ban on headscarves is lifted: http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/9538193.htm

-- Islamist blow up two Russian Airliners: http://www.iht.com/articles/536748.html

-- Islamists bomb a teacher convoy in Thailand: http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stori...104300/1/.html

All we need now is another bombing in India/Kashmir to round things out... unbelievable...

They seem to forget that they're just people. People that can be removed from this world by other people.

[lil'babykitten]

That War on Terror of yours is really going well.

[Spliffdaddy]

Indeed it is.

Thanks for acknowledging that fact.

I knew you'd come around.

[lil'babykitten]

Yeah, I mean, this thread proves it.

[Spliffdaddy]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
Yeah, I mean, this thread proves it.

Yup. Ain't been any terrorist activity in Dubya's country.

[Lerkfish]

Originally posted by Spliffdaddy:
Yup. Ain't been any terrorist activity in Dubya's country.

no need. Dubya's doing a better job needlessly sending our fighting men and women to their deaths, at a handful a day clip. He's doing the terrorists' job for them.

[ebuddy]

Logic, what did Sharon and Israel do to usher in the most recent attacks last Tuesday? I might remind a few MacNNers that this is the first attack in quite some time. Let me qualify, considering the region of discussion, it's been quite some time. Since March I believe. Since then, Sharon has decided they will withdraw from the Gaza Strip and 4 additional West Bank settlements. Well, on Tuesday the Israeli headlines read "The nightmare is back." I can't decide if this is payment for the removal of those who have dispatched 5 suicide bombings in recent years, the building of the barrier (which ironically is most porous between Beersheba and Hebron, where the bombers came from. Proof to me that the wall is effective and needs to be completed.), or the plans to withdraw.

Who takes credit for the bus bombing? In a letter faxed to the Associated Press, the Islamic Jihad movement said it mounted the attack because of "a series of massacres" of Palestinian people.

It seems several folks are pretty happy about the whole thing actually. Much celebration among Hamas supporters. The widow of Rantisi, Rasha, calling the attack "heroic" and saying her husband's soul is "happy in heaven." Is this a heaven reserved for suicide bombers and those that sponsor it?

Logic, I wish you could tell these folks that they are bastardizing your religion. They seem to believe this is a noble behavior in the name of Allah. Among them are the French hostage takers for a "head-scarf" policy in France, Al-Qaeda, Yasser Arafat, and many more who propogate hate no matter what appeasement policy is initiated by the Israeli. Below is, but a taste of the sentiment of those in leadership among the faith of Islam. Keep in mind the below quotes are from a teacher;

On 13 October 2000, the official Palestinian Authority television station broadcast live a Friday sermon in the Zayed bin Sultan Aal Nahyan mosque in Gaza. Below are excerpts from the sermon, as transcribed by the Middle East Media Research Institute. The speaker is Dr. Ahmad Abu Halabiya, Member of the Palestinian Authority-appointed "Fatwa Council" and former acting Rector of the Islamic University in Gaza.

"O brother believers, the criminals, the terrorists - are the Jews, who have butchered our children, orphaned them, widowed our women and desecrated our holy places and sacred sites. They are the terrorists. They are the ones who must be butchered and killed, as Allah the Almighty said: 'Fight them: Allah will torture them at your hands, and will humiliate them and will help you to overcome them, and will relieve the minds of the believers..."

Did Allah not say this? Well, you may want to get a more respectable post among the believers so they can be enlightened.

"Have no mercy on the Jews, no matter where they are, in any country. Fight them, wherever you are. Wherever you meet them, kill them. Wherever you are, kill those Jews and those Americans who are like them - and those who stand by them - they are all in one trench, against the Arabs and the Muslims because they established Israel here, in the beating heart of the Arab world, in Palestine. They created it to be the outpost of their civilization and the vanguard of their army, and to be the sword of the West and the crusaders, hanging over the necks of the monotheists, the Muslims in these lands. They wanted the Jews to be their spearhead..."

And finally just to make sure there is no confusion here;

"Even if an agreement of Gaza is signed - we shall not forget Haifa, and Acre, and the Galilee, and Jaffa, and the Triangle and the Negev, and the rest of our cities and villages. It is only a matter of time. The weak will not remain forever weak, and the strong will not remain forever strong... If we are weak today... and we are not able to regain our rights, then at least we have to pass on the banner - waving high - to our children and grandchildren..."

And the reason for continued struggle? The reason there will NEVER be peace between Israeli's and Palestinians boils down to imperialism;

"...We will not give up a single grain of soil of Palestine, from Haifa, and Jaffa, and Acre, and Mulabbas [Petah Tikva] and Salamah, and Majdal [Ashkelon], and all the land, and Gaza, and the West Bank..."

"...Let us put our trust in Allah, close ranks, and unite our words, and the slogan of us all should be, 'Jihad! Jihad! For the sake of Palestine, and for the sake of Jerusalem and Al-Aqsa!'"

[ebuddy]

Lerk, I'm really glad folks like you weren't involved in the attempt to liberate America during the Revolution.

Let me ask you simply; is there anything worth fighting for?

[BRussell]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
Let me ask you simply; is there anything worth fighting for?

It was definitely worth 1000 American deaths to find all those Iraqi WMDs! The war on Iraq not only wasn't part of the war on terrorism, it set it back.

PS: Nice post above.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
Logic, what did Sharon and Israel do to usher in the most recent attacks last Tuesday?

Logic is real busy so I'll answer.

This so-called five month lull in violence in that region is absolute BS. Israel has continued to carry out it's botched strikes against the Palestinians. Just a few days ago the IOF attempted to kill Palestinian fighters in a car but they missed and wounded a young Palestinian girl instead. It barely made the headlines. Interesting that as soon as the militants strike bike in revenge, it's all over the news.

http://www.albawaba.com/news/index.p...e&dir=news

missile toward a car carrying four Palestinian activists, but missed and hit a nearby home instead. The incident took place in the West Bank city of Jenin. A Palestinian girl was reported wounded. The four were members of Fatah's Al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades.

It's the same old cycle of violence. You just rarely hear about Israel's state-sponsored terrorism.

[BRussell]

Originally posted by Logic:
You poor poor soul. None of the attacks was done by the great religion of Islam, but by a few poor souls like yours. Next time you decide to start a Bash Islamathon you better make sure you can back it up by quoting the Quran and showing that it was an Islamic thing to do.

I probably shouldn't speak for someone else, but I don't think moki is saying that Islam itself is inherently violent. The people determine the religion, because they interpret and apply it. These people are repeatedly interpreting and applying your religion. They have become the face of Islam in the same way that the religious right have become the face of American Christianity.

[dcolton]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
Logic is real busy so I'll answer.

This so-called five month lull in violence in that region is absolute BS. Israel has continued to carry out it's botched strikes against the Palestinians. Just a few days ago the IOF attempted to kill Palestinian fighters in a car but they missed and wounded a young Palestinian girl instead. It barely made the headlines. Interesting that as soon as the militants strike bike in revenge, it's all over the news.

http://www.albawaba.com/news/index.p...e&dir=news


It's the same old cycle of violence. You just rarely hear about Israel's state-sponsored terrorism.

So the Israeli's miss a car full of terrorists and unintentionally injure a little girl. Is this justification for the latest round of terrorist attacks?

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by dcolton:
So the Israeli's miss a car full of terrorists and unintentionally injure a little girl. Is this justification for the latest round of terrorist attacks?

The Israelis struck with the intention to murder - regardless of who they were aiming for, it doesn't make their murder attempts any more justifiable. They were attempting to kill Palestinians and that's all that matters to the militants. It's their justification for the bus bombings.

From my point of view, the actions of both sides are equally deplorable.

[ebuddy]

It's the same old cycle of violence. You just rarely hear about Israel's state-sponsored terrorism.

I'm sorry to hear that Israeli's attacks continue with haphazard disregard for "surgical" application. Yes, you are correct. The cycle continues. Israel attempts to hunt down Islamic Jihadists to secure continued peace in their region and Islamic Jihadists continue to deliberately target innocent civilians in an attempt to take all of Israel's land and her Jewish people off the map. 1 for 14 is fair to be sure. Are they not able to look beyond yesterday? Can they not understand that peace is being attempted and policy is shifting in favor of the PA? No. They continue to foil the efforts of leaders interested in peace by continued attacks on innocent civilians. Palestinians don't want the barrier? It's oppressive to them? Well, they certainly helped solidify the Israeli need for it by exploiting one of the few open points it has left. Thankfully, this has not hindered Sharon from continuing on with plans of withdrawal. Can the Palestinian forget yesterday in the hope of a better tomorrow? Only if they are content to allow the Jew to exist. If they won't be satisfied until the last Jew is slaughtered, there will never be peace.

Look, Lil' babykitten-with all due respect for your values and beliefs (as I am repeatedly held accountable for those that have historically propogated violence in my God's name, a history for which I am often ashamed); you can tell me whatever you want regarding the peaceful nature of Islam; those that spearhead the Islamic Jihadist movement, Arafat, the PA, Islam clergy, leadership, spokesmen, Dr.'s, Professors, are all saying the same things in the name of Allah. "Exterminate the Jew." They've made the point time and again and always tie it in with their obligation to Islam. Every single time. I've not seen one attack initiated that was not conducted in the interest of Allah or similar extremist religious sentiment. Don't believe me? I've got so many Arafat quotes, PA quotes, and other numerous and miscellaneous Islamic clerical quotes on the matter it'd make your head spin away from Mecca.

Meanwhile, Arafat urges; "no...really, stop."

Those Israeli tanks don't have pictures of Yeshua plastered on them nor are any statements made propogating Crucade, yet continue to seek peace through the removal of those that do. The Israeli helicopters don't fly overhead while cleric's statements; "The God of the Torah is comin' for you!" can be heard wafting throughout the headlines. Islamic Jihadists (according to you) are bastardizing an otherwise peaceful religion. You should unite in the removal of them as they only serve to hinder peace.

[ebuddy]

They have become the face of Islam in a much more violent way than the religious right while becoming the face of American Christianity.

fixed.

[ebuddy]

BRussell quote; The war on Iraq not only wasn't part of the war on terrorism, it set it back.

While I understand your statement, we will probably remain in disagreement regarding Iraq's sponsorship of terrorism. Remember, the WMD's are weapons Saddam himself admitted having and threatened using. This, in accordance with intelligence from just about every "historically" credible souce having confirmed it, we did and are doing what we have to do. 12 years, 14 resolutions, continued threats and oppression. Enough was enough. We cannot disseminate education under a dictatorial regime. Now that the dictator is eliminated, they can fight on their own for peace and freedom. I hope they enhance the movement soon.

[phoenixboy70]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
Now that the dictator is eliminated, they can fight on their own for peace and freedom. I hope they enhance the movement soon.

fat chance. the only way they are ever going to reach any kind of stability is by breaking up that damn country.

the extreemly evil dictator saddam was, his style of "leadership" was the only thing that kept iraq from being what it is essentially now, - a complete and total fiasko.

BRussell is spot-on with his comment. "we" just created a mess, killing thousands of innocents and soldiers...while accomplishing next to nothing.

oh, and as far as the wmds are concerned, - they didn't find any. why? - because there weren't any to be found. period.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
I'm sorry to hear that Israeli's attacks continue with haphazard disregard for "surgical" application. Yes, you are correct. The cycle continues. Israel attempts to hunt down Islamic Jihadists to secure continued peace in their region and Islamic Jihadists continue to deliberately target innocent civilians in an attempt to take all of Israel's land and her Jewish people off the map. 1 for 14 is fair to be sure. Are they not able to look beyond yesterday? Can they not understand that peace is being attempted and policy is shifting in favor of the PA? No. They continue to foil the efforts of leaders interested in peace by continued attacks on innocent civilians. Palestinians don't want the barrier? It's oppressive to them? Well, they certainly helped solidify the Israeli need for it by exploiting one of the few open points it has left. Thankfully, this has not hindered Sharon from continuing on with plans of withdrawal. Can the Palestinian forget yesterday in the hope of a better tomorrow? Only if they are content to allow the Jew to exist. If they won't be satisfied until the last Jew is slaughtered, there will never be peace.

You obviously believe that Sharon and his government are continually striving for a peaceful resolution to the conflict. I don't. And their actions have given me no reason to believe otherwise. They are just as stuck in their extreme Zionist ideology as the Palestinian militants are in their distorted interpretations of the Qu'ran. Sharon speaks of withdrawals from certain occupied areas while he approves plans for the building of new settlements in others. He claims that he is building a protective barrier to prevent militants from entering Israel yet this barrier has in many areas overlapped on to Palestinian territory. A blatant land grab. Additionally, whenever there is a short break in the cycle of violence, Israel decides to suddenly attack the Palestinian areas, serving only to incite retaliation once more.

Originally posted by ebuddy:
Look, Lil' babykitten-with all due respect for your values and beliefs (as I am repeatedly held accountable for those that have historically propogated violence in my God's name, a history for which I am often ashamed); you can tell me whatever you want regarding the peaceful nature of Islam; those that spearhead the Islamic Jihadist movement, Arafat, the PA, Islam clergy, leadership, spokesmen, Dr.'s, Professors, are all saying the same things in the name of Allah. "Exterminate the Jew." They've made the point time and again and always tie it in with their obligation to Islam. Every single time. I've not seen one attack initiated that was not conducted in the interest of Allah or similar extremist religious sentiment. Don't believe me? I've got so many Arafat quotes, PA quotes, and other numerous and miscellaneous Islamic clerical quotes on the matter it'd make your head spin away from Mecca.

Don't be fooled in to thinking that the extremist viewpoints are limited to the Palestinian militants, because they aren't. There are plenty of Jewish extremists working in that region with a view to rid Israel of every Palestinian. And again, only in a rare documentary (if that) do you see any analysis of these elements, which certainly exist in Israel. The extremists on both sides tend to make this a religious conflict and until those elements are removed and replaced with moderates, we won't see any sort of peaceful resolution.

Originally posted by ebuddy:
Those Israeli tanks don't have pictures of Yeshua plastered on them nor are any statements made propogating Crucade, yet continue to seek peace through the removal of those that do. The Israeli helicopters don't fly overhead while cleric's statements; "The God of the Torah is comin' for you!" can be heard wafting throughout the headlines. Islamic Jihadists (according to you) are bastardizing an otherwise peaceful religion. You should unite in the removal of them as they only serve to hinder peace.

I know what you're saying and I do my part. But I don't have any kind of worldwide influence! (yet ) It's not so straight forward. Muslims all over the world are being oppressed, their families destroyed, their lives destroyed. It shouldn't be at all surprising to see them distort the religion to somehow comfort them and legitimise their actions in their own minds. I realise that there are also plenty of "muslims" who deliberately distort Islamic teachings to further their own political agenda. It's nothing new either. The state of affairs between the Middle Eastern and Western parts of the world right now is pretty messed up, hence the rise and rise of Islamic extremism. It's not a problem that will be resolved by bombing and trying to kill as many of them as possible either. That sort of mindless 'problem-solving' only serves to give rise to more and more extremists.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Logic:
You poor poor soul. None of the attacks was done by the great religion of Islam, but by a few poor souls like yours. Next time you decide to start a Bash Islamathon you better make sure you can back it up by quoting the Quran and showing that it was an Islamic thing to do.

Whaa? You didn't read his post. But knee-jerked instead.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Lerkfish:
no need. Dubya's doing a better job needlessly sending our fighting men and women to their deaths, at a handful a day clip. He's doing the terrorists' job for them.

And so are you by posting such drivel.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
Lerk, I'm really glad folks like you weren't involved in the attempt to liberate America during the Revolution.

Me too.

Let me ask you simply; is there anything worth fighting for?

Not when there is a Republican in the office!

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by lil'babykitten:
The Israelis struck with the intention to murder - regardless of who they were aiming for, it doesn't make their murder attempts any more justifiable. They were attempting to kill Palestinians and that's all that matters to the militants. It's their justification for the bus bombings.

Yes, they are simple minded. I agree.

From my point of view, the actions of both sides are equally deplorable.

Hardly equal.

[dcolton]

Originally posted by Logic:
You poor poor soul. None of the attacks was done by the great religion of Islam, but by a few poor souls like yours. Next time you decide to start a Bash Islamathon you better make sure you can back it up by quoting the Quran and showing that it was an Islamic thing to do.

When you get a chance, please explain to me why someone has to quote the Quran when discussing the undeniable actions of muslim terrorists.

[Logic]

Originally posted by dcolton:
When you get a chance, please explain to me why someone has to quote the Quran when discussing the undeniable actions of muslim terrorists.

Reading comprehension:

1. Done by a person who claims to be a Muslim.

2. Done by Islam.

What's the difference between the two.




Oh, and keep it up lbk. I'm still busy

[Zimphire]

Logic you were the one that knee-jerked here.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Logic you were the one that knee-jerked here.

Uh no. It was the usual inflammatory, ignorant BS we've come to expect from moki. The title of this thread is bigoted let alone the first post.

[lil'babykitten]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Yes, they are simple minded. I agree.

Well you're agreeing with yourself because I didn't say that.

[Zimphire]

Another knee-jerk.

When he said

"when will the mainstream majority of Muslims cut off the poisoned branch of Islam? "

He was talking about those not really following along with Islamic law. That alone in PERSPECTIVE with what he also said made it not what you knee-jerkers claimed.

And it's a GOOD question.

The answer is probably fear. They FEAR what would happen if they tried.

[dcmacdaddy]

Originally posted by BRussell:
I probably shouldn't speak for someone else, but I don't think moki is saying that Islam itself is inherently violent. The people determine the religion, because they interpret and apply it. These people are repeatedly interpreting and applying your religion. They have become the face of Islam in the same way that the religious right have become the face of American Christianity.

Exactly.

In terms of stridency of beliefs the religious right in American is
not much different from Islamic fundamentalists around the world.
In terms of violent actions, yes there is a difference. But give the
Christian Right time, I'm sure we will be seeing public stonings any day now.

[dcolton]

Originally posted by dcmacdaddy:
But give the
Christian Right time, I'm sure we will be seeing public stonings any day now.

Sure.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
While I understand your statement, we will probably remain in disagreement regarding Iraq's sponsorship of terrorism.

The terrorism that Iraq sponsored was not a threat to the US.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Wiskedjak:
The terrorism that Iraq sponsored was not a threat to the US.

Wis Iraq was involved with terrorists groups that were a threat to the US. Sorry. Spin that somewhere else.

[dcolton]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Wis Iraq was involved with terrorists groups that were a threat to the US. Sorry. Spin that somewhere else.

Psst. DOn't try to make any sense of it...he is canadian.

[itai195]

Do you consider Taliesin a Muslim? He believes that suicide bombings are justified.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Wis Iraq was involved with terrorists groups that were a threat to the US. Sorry. Spin that somewhere else.

Which terrorist groups supported by the Iraqi government were a threat to the US?

[christ]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Another knee-jerk.

When he said

"when will the mainstream majority of Muslims cut off the poisoned branch of Islam? "

He was talking about those not really following along with Islamic law. That alone in PERSPECTIVE with what he also said made it not what you knee-jerkers claimed.

And it's a GOOD question.

The answer is probably fear. They FEAR what would happen if they tried.

All this may be true, but he also entitled the thread "busy few weeks for the religion of peace", not "busy few weeks for the poisoned branch of the religion of peace". This therefore implies that he was tarring Islam with the brush. This could have been avoided with a less emotive title, but less emotive titles don't fit in with moki's bomb and run modus operandi.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Wiskedjak:
Which terrorist groups supported by the Iraqi government were a threat to the US?

Go read the 9/11 commissions findings Wisk. Even they said there was NO DOUBT that Iraq had TERRORIST connections. Yes, even the big bad Al-qaeda_is mentioned.

They however said that they found no connections of Saddam having anything to do with 9/11.

This wasn't a war on the people that did 9/11.

This was a war on terrorism, and those who supported terrorists. Iraq indeed falls under that category.

Admit it or not, like it or not.

[BRussell]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Wis Iraq was involved with terrorists groups that were a threat to the US. Sorry. Spin that somewhere else.

I'm reluctant to turn this into YAIWT (yet another Iraq war thread), but the 9/11 commission report was pretty clear in indicating that, of all the countries in the region, Iraq was probably the country least involved with al Qaeda. Maybe Jordan was even less involved. But Syria, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, and some of the other smaller countries were probably much more involved. If anything, Iraq stood out because of its non-involvement with al Qaeda.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by christ:
All this may be true, but he also entitled the thread "busy few weeks for the religion of peace", not "busy few weeks for the poisoned branch of the religion of peace". This therefore implies that he was tarring Islam with the brush. This could have been avoided with a less emotive title, but less emotive titles don't fit in with moki's bomb and run modus operandi.

And when he added the "when will the mainstream majority of Muslims cut off the poisoned branch of Islam? " It separated that.

Reading the title, and then reacting is indeed knee-jerking.

[christ]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
And when he added the "when will the mainstream majority of Muslims cut off the poisoned branch of Islam? " It separated that.

Reading the title, and then reacting is indeed knee-jerking.

Reading the first post, when coloured by the title, is analysis, not knee-jerk.

A thread entitled 'Bloggs is a Republican' (when it is widely known that Bloggs is no such thing) with a first thread that said 'well, he isn't really' is still inflammatory and unnecessary, and responding to it to say so would not be a knee-jerk. Neither is it in this case.

[Zimphire]

Again, the content inside explains the topic. If you read the topic, and then responded it is indeed a knee-jerk.

No, if ands or buts about it.

[christ]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Again, the content inside explains the topic. If you read the topic, and then responded it is indeed a knee-jerk.

No, if ands or buts about it.

So it is your contention that inflammatory titles can never be challenged? (Without such a challenge being written off as 'knee-jerk')

It seems more likely that anything that you disagree with is 'knee-jerk', and anything with which you agree is 'considered commentary'.

[PacHead]

It has been a busy few weeks indeed, for jihadists all around the globe practically .

This is the very reason we're fighting the war on terror, inorder to eliminate this sick ideologi and the morons who follow this death cult.

It's also pretty pathetic to read all of the silly excuses, justifications, and other crap brought forth by certain people here.

Wake up. Either you are with the terrorists or you are not. If you are with them, then all bets are off, and these people will get what's coming to them eventually.

[ebuddy]

Saying; "Jews are bad too" isn't enough I'm afraid LBK. "Jews" and Jewish leadership aren't the ones continuously propogating violence in the name of the God of the Torah. On the other hand from Arafat on down the line-they have all made this and continue to make this a Holy War. It may or may not surprise you that there is a vast number of seculars fighting for Israel as well. They are not fighting in the name of any God, but the Peace and Freedom of their small and waning region. The leadership in Israel is not turning this into a holy war. One more thing that should be noted here, Israel has extreme military might compared to the Palestinian. If Israel was hell-bent on eliminating the Palestinian, it would've been done years ago, swiftly, and quite completely. This does not help any of the points made that suggest Sharon is hell-bent on eliminating the Palestinian. He's shown incredible restraint.

Again, I reiterate because I think it got lost in the shuffle a smidgen;
You can tell me whatever you want regarding the peaceful nature of Islam; those that spearhead the Islamic Jihadist movement (note; not a Muslim generalization, but quite clearly ISLAMIC. Don't blame me, blame them and unite in their removal) Arafat, the PA, Islam clergy, various leadership, spokesmen, Dr.'s, Professors, are all saying the same things in the name of Allah not only in the Middle East, but here in the US. "Exterminate the Jew." They've made the point time and again and always tie it in with their obligation to Islam. It should also be noted that those in Russia are feeling it now. Those in France are feeling it now and now Americans have been lumped in with the Jews just to ensure Jihad doesn't stop in Israel. It's all being tied back in with Islam. Every single time. I've not seen one attack initiated that was not conducted in the interest of Allah or similar extremist religious sentiment. Don't believe me? I've got so many Arafat quotes, PA quotes, and other numerous and miscellaneous Islamic clerical leadership quotes on the matter it'd make your head spin.

[Logic]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
Saying; "Jews are bad too" isn't enough I'm afraid LBK. "Jews" and Jewish leadership aren't the ones continuously propogating violence in the name of the God of the Torah.

I read the rest but it wasn't worth commenting on. I'll just ask you one question about the above.

On what basis was Israel founded and what religion/race does Israel treat best?

Saying that they aren't doing this in the name of God is nothing but a desperate attempt of distorting the truth.....

[ebuddy]

To BRussell and whomever else is drawing comparisons between the "extremist Christian right" in America and the Extremist Islam Jihadist;

There is no longer a comparsion. Christianity saw it's way through the bastardization of Christian doctrine for use on alleged witches, numerous and various crucades, persecution, and execution. We are now beyond that period. Christians I know, and yes even the staunch ones, are not about violence. If you take a war to them, in many cases they are heavily armed and will defend their country and family 'til death fearlessly-this is not necessary because of the blessings endowed our free country. A country in which freedom of religion and the open practice of it are embraced. They are not out bombing in mass, killing innocent to influence government policy, holding hostages in the name of Yeshua and/or Jesus. We have continuously invited God out of our country since it's inception and we are growing near a time when perhaps secular persecution will be taken to the Christian in the name of eliminating cults, but not today. Until then, we vote with the sword of ink.

[Spliffdaddy]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
Saying; "Jews are bad too" isn't enough I'm afraid LBK. "Jews" and Jewish leadership aren't the ones continuously propogating violence in the name of the God of the Torah. On the other hand from Arafat on down the line-they have all made this and continue to make this a Holy War. It may or may not surprise you that there is a vast number of seculars fighting for Israel as well. They are not fighting in the name of any God, but the Peace and Freedom of their small and waning region. The leadership in Israel is not turning this into a holy war. One more thing that should be noted here, Israel has extreme military might compared to the Palestinian. If Israel was hell-bent on eliminating the Palestinian, it would've been done years ago, swiftly, and quite completely. This does not help any of the points made that suggest Sharon is hell-bent on eliminating the Palestinian. He's shown incredible restraint.

Again, I reiterate because I think it got lost in the shuffle a smidgen;
You can tell me whatever you want regarding the peaceful nature of Islam; those that spearhead the Islamic Jihadist movement (note; not a Muslim generalization, but quite clearly ISLAMIC. Don't blame me, blame them and unite in their removal) Arafat, the PA, Islam clergy, various leadership, spokesmen, Dr.'s, Professors, are all saying the same things in the name of Allah not only in the Middle East, but here in the US. "Exterminate the Jew." They've made the point time and again and always tie it in with their obligation to Islam. It should also be noted that those in Russia are feeling it now. Those in France are feeling it now and now Americans have been lumped in with the Jews just to ensure Jihad doesn't stop in Israel. It's all being tied back in with Islam. Every single time. I've not seen one attack initiated that was not conducted in the interest of Allah or similar extremist religious sentiment. Don't believe me? I've got so many Arafat quotes, PA quotes, and other numerous and miscellaneous Islamic clerical leadership quotes on the matter it'd make your head spin.

word up.

I think the Islamic fundamentalists have lost any chance of being taken seriously - now or in the future.

It's to the point where the word 'Islam' has a violent, barbaric, and cult-like stigma attached to it.

Christians and Jews can continue to share the 'hypocrite' stigma - while Islam roars past them on the chariot of death and killing.

[Logic]

Originally posted by ebuddy:
They are not out bombing in mass, killing innocent to influence government policy, holding hostages in the name of Yeshua and/or Jesus.

So bombings of abortion clinics is just a myth? Bush never referred to the WoT as a crusade?

And before you start spinning:
crusade

\Cru*sade"\ (kr?-s?d"), n. [F. croisade, fr. Pr. crozada, or Sp cruzada, or It. crociata, from a verb signifying to take the cross, mark one's self with a cross, fr. L. crux cross; or possibly taken into English directly fr. Pr. Cf. Croisade, Crosado, and see Cross.] 1. Any one of the military expeditions undertaken by Christian powers, in the 11th, 12th, and 13th centuries, for the recovery of the Holy Land from the Mohammedans.