[RonnieoftheRose]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3642910.stm

Afghanistan is still an Islamist stronghold and terrorists are pouring into Iraq. There's no end in sight.

If Bush had half a brain the best way to have done to sort out Al-Qaeda would have been to set up a secret unit of highly paid but progressive Muslims who could have infiltrated Al-Qaeda's leadership, assassinated Bin Ladin but make it look like an accident. Those same men could have hijacked the network and dismantled it slowly for different reasons given. It would have cost less than 5% of what the W.O.T. has cost so far. But then many billions would not have been diverted to bank accounts and reconstruction companies. Oh well. Logic and reason doesn't rule. The world is a less stable place for the profit of the few.

[Atomic Rooster]

The business in Afghanistan was never finished before Bush and his crew went off on a fairy tale nation building tangent in Iraq. And some wacky people actually believe he did the right thing and want him re-elected. They can't think for themselves and are sheepzez.

[idjeff]

Originally posted by RonnieoftheRose:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3642910.stm

Afghanistan is still an Islamist stronghold and terrorists are pouring into Iraq. There's no end in sight.

If Bush had half a brain the best way to have done to sort out Al-Qaeda would have been to set up a secret unit of highly paid but progressive Muslims who could have infiltrated Al-Qaeda's leadership, assassinated Bin Ladin but make it look like an accident. Those same men could have hijacked the network and dismantled it slowly for different reasons given. It would have cost less than 5% of what the W.O.T. has cost so far. But then many billions would not have been diverted to bank accounts and reconstruction companies. Oh well. Logic and reason doesn't rule. The world is a less stable place for the profit of the few.

Ok genius...looks like you got it figured out with your whole brain. Have you dropped off your resume' yet?

[chalk_outline]

Originally posted by RonnieoftheRose:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3642910.stm

Afghanistan is still an Islamist stronghold and terrorists are pouring into Iraq. There's no end in sight.

If Bush had half a brain the best way to have done to sort out Al-Qaeda would have been to set up a secret unit of highly paid but progressive Muslims who could have infiltrated Al-Qaeda's leadership, assassinated Bin Ladin but make it look like an accident. Those same men could have hijacked the network and dismantled it slowly for different reasons given. It would have cost less than 5% of what the W.O.T. has cost so far. But then many billions would not have been diverted to bank accounts and reconstruction companies. Oh well. Logic and reason doesn't rule. The world is a less stable place for the profit of the few.

That makes for bad TV. Sensationalism is key and effectiveness is a bonus.. POWER..POWER..POWER..

[phoenixboy70]

NO, nooo, nOOOOOOO!!!!

annihilate , kill, kill, kill!!!

[Zimphire]

Ahahha the fat lady hasn't sang yet. Defeat? LAWWL!

[dcolton]

My God! Liberal America is getting worst than a French man fighting a paperbag....giving up at the first sign of resistance

[RonnieoftheRose]

Originally posted by idjeff:
Ok genius...looks like you got it figured out with your whole brain. Have you dropped off your resume' yet?

I"ve already shaved the world three timesh.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by dcolton:
My God! Liberal America is getting worst than a French man fighting a paperbag....giving up at the first sign of resistance

Not only that, I am sure they bought Baghdad Bob's stories about what was happening in Iraq.

[Beewee]

Originally posted by RonnieoftheRose:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3642910.stm

Afghanistan is still an Islamist stronghold and terrorists are pouring into Iraq. There's no end in sight.

If Bush had half a brain the best way to have done to sort out Al-Qaeda would have been to set up a secret unit of highly paid but progressive Muslims who could have infiltrated Al-Qaeda's leadership, assassinated Bin Ladin but make it look like an accident. Those same men could have hijacked the network and dismantled it slowly for different reasons given. It would have cost less than 5% of what the W.O.T. has cost so far. But then many billions would not have been diverted to bank accounts and reconstruction companies. Oh well. Logic and reason doesn't rule. The world is a less stable place for the profit of the few.

Clear well written argument...shame it was wasted here.
But I 100% agree

Why not do covert stikes, when the enemy is small and concealed the only way to defeat them is to become smaller and more concealed than they are. How many dollars in bombs did they waste trying to find/capture/kill Bin Laden and they still haven't found him.

How much did the missiles cost that we used on Iraq and we ended up finding Sadam in some hole in the ground as opposed a to bunker.
And who is paying (or gonna pay) for all the wonderful weapons the military is so blithely using? You, me, and anyone else that has to pay taxes, go to school, or attend state universities.

[dcolton]

Covert operations. Hmmm....I was wondering, how do you know they are NOT moving forward with covert operations? Because you haven't heard about them? It wouldn't be covert then, huh.

Let me give you guys a hint, the people in power...including Bush, are a lot smarter and definately wiser than you!

[Millennium]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Covert operations. Hmmm....I was wondering, how do you know they are NOT moving forward with covert operations? Because you haven't heard about them? It wouldn't be covert then, huh.

Here, you are correct; there probably are covert operations taking place. Why don't we know about them? Because they're covert.

However, I doubt there are actual assassination attempts underway. It would be justice, but the US got into a fair bit of trouble over political assassinations a few decades ago, and ever since we've forbidden our own government from carrying them out. The Bush Administration stands to lose too much if they're caught at that, so I doubt they'd try it.

Great shame, too. Much cleaner way of administering justice, and yet justice is still done.

Let me give you guys a hint, the people in power...including Bush, are a lot smarter and definately wiser than you!

Appeal to authority isn't a valid form of rhetoric.

[dcolton]

Originally posted by Millennium:
Here, you are correct; there probably are covert operations taking place. Why don't we know about them? Because they're covert.

However, I doubt there are actual assassination attempts underway. It would be justice, but the US got into a fair bit of trouble over political assassinations a few decades ago, and ever since we've forbidden our own government from carrying them out. The Bush Administration stands to lose too much if they're caught at that, so I doubt they'd try it.

Great shame, too. Much cleaner way of administering justice, and yet justice is still done.

As for assassination, I know it is illegal, but I thought a special provision was made for Osama. I remember questioning that myself. Nonetheless, Osama isn't a leader of any nation, so do the same rules apply?

[Myrkridia]

Originally posted by dcolton:

Let me give you guys a hint, the people in power...including Bush, are a lot smarter and definately wiser than you!

Top Ten Bush Quotes:


10) "Families is where our nation finds hope, where wings take dream." —LaCrosse, Wis., Oct. 18, 2000

9) "I know how hard it is for you to put food on your family." —Greater Nashua, N.H., Jan. 27, 2000

8) "I promise you I will listen to what has been said here, even though I wasn't here." —Waco, Texas, Aug. 13, 2002

7) "You teach a child to read, and he or her will be able to pass a literacy test.'' —George W. Bush, Townsend, Tenn., Feb. 21, 2001

6) "I know what I believe. I will continue to articulate what I believe and what I believe — I believe what I believe is right." —Rome, July 22, 2001

5) "There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you.

4) "I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully." —Saginaw, Mich., Sept. 29, 2000

3) "They misunderestimated me." —Bentonville, Ark., Nov. 6, 2000

2) "Rarely is the questioned asked: Is our children learning?" —Florence, S.C., Jan. 11, 2000

1) "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." —Washington, D.C., Aug. 5, 2004

Number one is my personal favorite.
Kinda rules out his "intelligence" and "wisdom"

[dcolton]

Originally posted by Myrkridia:
[B]Top Ten Bush Quotes:

[i]
Number one is my personal favorite.
Kinda rules out his "intelligence" and "wisdom"

Anyone who reinvents the idea of covert operations so they can attack Bush cannot claim to be more intelligent or wiser than bush. Anyone who wonders why they haven't heard about COVERT operations cannot criticize Bush in any way, shape, or form.

[Atomic Rooster]

Zimp quote from sig....

"John Kerry, a man who has adopted more positions than Courtney Love."

end quote.

Sounds like Courtney would be fun! You can have tour missionary position.

Speaking of flippity floppity... What is Shrubby's position on the war on terror today since it's constantly changes from can't win, will win...ahhh whatever...

I served my country in the vietnam war ahh ahh ok ahh I was doing something somewhere ahh ahh I think.

Fool me once ahh shame aahh on you aah me ahh fool me again ahh ahh ahh ahh love your ob/gyn ahh ahh ahh feck it pass the crack Courtney!

google flippity floppity shrubbery

[Myrkridia]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Anyone who reinvents the idea of covert operations so they can attack Bush cannot claim to be more intelligent or wiser than bush. Anyone who wonders why they haven't heard about COVERT operations cannot criticize Bush in any way, shape, or form.

I was speaking only on the general intelligence of our president.
But if his ability to carry out "covert" operations is anything like his ability with the
english language, then we're in big trouble.

[RonnieoftheRose]

Originally posted by Myrkridia:
[B]Top Ten Bush Quotes:

[i]
10) "Families is where our nation finds hope, where wings take dream." —LaCrosse, Wis., Oct. 18, 2000

I wonder if George Jr. is responsible for kung fu film subtitles? Check these and come to your own conclusion...

www.flubtitles.com

-Do remember, you disturb me making love, your dick pocket will be barbecued after your death.

-The police suspects that you gamble illegally, assault, cheating, and also stealing old lady's underwear.

-He's death won't cause you any good...And his living won't cause you any bad neither
I must want him die

-He is an avant-garde... ... as of think of soaking busts in vinegar

-Look at his... pair of eyes... They are so sex appealing and they make you naturally convinced

[Beewee]

Originally posted by dcolton:
Covert operations. Hmmm....I was wondering, how do you know they are NOT moving forward with covert operations? Because you haven't heard about them? It wouldn't be covert then, huh.

Let me give you guys a hint, the people in power...including Bush, are a lot smarter and definately wiser than you!

$200 Billion and counting...I'm sure most of that money when to covert attacks.
You don't have to hear about covert attacks (which you won't) all you have to do is follow the money, how much and where is it going.

If you want to believe everything politicians tell you be my guest. I would much rather think for myself. Though judging by most of your posts recently I would say the best thing you can do is start having people think for you, cuz you're not doing so hot on your own.

[angaq0k]

Actually, the War on Terror is a huge success!

General Objective:

Show the World that America is scary

Specific Objectives:

1) go to war with some under equipped tribes in Afghanistan (make some business too)

2) go to war with the under equipped dictatorship of Iraq (make some business too)

3) put the world in a state of shock, awe by bullying them into "Rightness" or alienate them by figure pointing them as enemies if they do not align (and build some credibility for the guys at home)

So far, 1, 2 have been set accomplished. The wars are still raging over seas and business is good (weapons, oil, deployment of bases in more countries, etc.) while 3's results are mitigated. We will have to wait November to really know...

General mission status: 75% accomplishment.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by dcolton:
As for assassination, I know it is illegal, but I thought a special provision was made for Osama.

What is the point of having a law against something if you can just make "special provisions" to ignore it whenever it suits your purpose? Note, there is a vast difference between someone dying in an attempt to capture them and assasinating that person. One completely goes against EVERYTHING the free world stands for and is the sort of thing we criticize dictators and terrorists of doing.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by angaq0k:
Actually, the War on Terror is a huge success!

General Objective:

Show the World that America is scary

Specific Objectives:

1) go to war with some under equipped tribes in Afghanistan (make some business too)

2) go to war with the under equipped dictatorship of Iraq (make some business too)

3) put the world in a state of shock, awe by bullying them into "Rightness" or alienate them by figure pointing them as enemies if they do not align (and build some credibility for the guys at home)

4) Get Bush reelected

[BlackGriffen]

The "no assassination" thing isn't even a law, IIRC. It's an executive order, so Bush can overturn it on, more or less, a whim.

That is, unless executive orders are more than just signed pieces of paper from the President.

There may be issues of international law that I'm not aware of.

BG

[RonnieoftheRose]

The way I described it was pretty moral compared to actual assassinations carried out and, say, the training of armies to help South American dictators come to power. I just felt it was the cheapest and most effective solution to dismantling a terrorist network. Better than bombing villages full of civilians, causing havoc and creating more terrorism. That is REAL assassination if anything - destroying the lives of thousands of innocent people.

[AKcrab]

President Bush has provided written legal authority to the C.I.A. to hunt down and kill the terrorists without seeking further approval each time the agency is about to stage an operation. Some officials said the terrorist list was known as the "high-value target list." A spokesman for the White House declined to discuss the list or issues involving the use of lethal force against terrorists. A spokesman for the C.I.A. also declined to comment on the list.


Despite the authority given to the agency, Mr. Bush has not waived the executive order banning assassinations, officials said. The presidential authority to kill terrorists defines operatives of Al Qaeda as enemy combatants and thus legitimate targets for lethal force.

Link

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by AKcrab:
Link

That's fair. Killing an enemy in battle is fine. It's assasination where the target is likely murdered in cold blood that bothers me. Sure, the person may be unquestionably responsible for the death of thousands, but murdering that person is not what the free world is about.