[Zimphire]

This was from another forum I go to. Mostly Democrats in it.
Said poster is a Democrat unhappy with his party's choice of a candidate.

Wow. I didn't think it was possible, but you may actually blow this thing.

A year ago I thought there was NO way the W could be reelected. Swing voters know he sold us a bill of goods in Iraq and dat's dat.

All you (Dems) had to do was nominate a centerist candidate ( a Clinton who could keep a sacred vow, and keep his paws off girls his daughter's age) and you were home free.

But NOOOO you give us a Massachusetts Senator. HEY!! The term Massachusetts Senator is a negative for those of us over here in the middle. But I thought. OK, Bush still can't win. All you have to do is hammer home Iraq. IRAQ IRAQ IRAQ IRAQ!!

But every time I turn on my radio I hear Kerry, or some fellow traveler stumping for Kerry, say the issues in this election are Jobs, Housing, Heathcare.

No no no no. IRAQ IRAQ IRAQ IRAQ!!

Swing voters (the ones you can't win without) do not believe that government is going to (or should) provide, Jobs, Housing, Heathcare. Government is a middle man. All it can do is TAKE Jobs, Housing, Heathcare from the private sector and mark up the price.

(paraphrasing O'Rourke) If you think Jobs, Housing, Heathcare are too expensive now, just wait until they are free.

If you continue to preach to the Bolshevik choir you will lose.

Have a nice day.

And THAT is why Kerry is having problems getting even Democrats to vote for him that aren't "liberal" Democrats.

[Atomic Rooster]

Yeah, I know what you mean. I dunno how many Republicans have expressed they aren't voting for Bush. So many are dissatisfied with his administration.

[CreepingDeth]

Yes, I wish he was…uh…actually a conservative.
That might help.
Sooooo many bogus tax laws and regulations. Please end this, Mr. Bush. You're supposed to be a neo-con!

[placebo1969]

Actually, I thought I heard about a poll that said something to the effect (or is it affect?) that 40% of Democrats are voting for Kerry and 50% against.

With Republicans it's something like 80 for and 10 against.

I'll see if I can find the link. But if that's true, it would seem that Kerry is simply a NotBush vote instead of an actual vote for Kerry.

[thunderous_funker]

"Bolshevik choir"?!?!?!?

Man, public education in this country has really reached an all time low. It continues to amaze me how many people have absolutely no idea what they are talking about.

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
"Bolshevik choir"?!?!?!?

Man, public education in this country has really reached an all time low. It continues to amaze me how many people have absolutely no idea what they are talking about.

Hmmmm…I recall a bolshevik being an early communist party in Russia.
I think his point was that he should stop preaching to the welfare state liberals, like…this place.

[thunderous_funker]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Hmmmm…I recall a bolshevik being an early communist party in Russia.
I think his point was that he should stop preaching to the welfare state liberals, like…this place.

Who exactly are the "welfare state liberals" and what is their platform. Please, do be specific.

[Shaddim]

Originally posted by Atomic Rooster:
Yeah, I know what you mean. I dunno how many Republicans have expressed they aren't voting for Bush. So many are dissatisfied with his administration.

Not enough to vote for Kerry.

Fact is, if the Dems had nominated a centerist candidate, they'd be mopping the floor with Bush. But they didn't, and they won't.

However

Same goes for Bush. If he'd drop Cheney and pickup McCain or Giuliani, he'd destroy Kerry.

As things are, and if Bush doesn't make that change, it'll be a nail-biter all the way up to election day.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by MacNStein:
Not enough to vote for Kerry.

Fact is, if the Dems had nominated a centerist candidate, they'd be mopping the floor with Bush. But they didn't, and they won't.

However

Same goes for Bush. If he'd drop Cheney and pickup McCain or Giuliani, he'd destroy Kerry.

As things are, and if Bush doesn't make that change, it'll be a nail-biter all the way up to election day.

All the more fun for us non US citizens to watch!

Popcorn, soda, comfy chair and the works on nov 2nd.

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
Who exactly are the "welfare state liberals" and what is their platform. Please, do be specific.

Anyone advocating more welfare, medicare, etc.
Social programs, more government control, less economic freeddoms, etc.

[Shaddim]

Originally posted by voodoo:
All the more fun for us non US citizens to watch!

Popcorn, soda, comfy chair and the works on nov 2nd.

I'll be working alll day, shuttling people to the polls. Though, I'll have all the free hot dogs and sodas that I want.

[Shaddim]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Anyone advocating more welfare, medicare, etc.
Social programs, more government control, less economic freeddoms, etc.

Here it comes... wait for it... wait for it...

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by MacNStein:
Here it comes... wait for it... wait for it...

For what? I'm gonna be called a [blank]?
What?

[thunderous_funker]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Anyone advocating more welfare, medicare, etc.
Social programs, more government control, less economic freeddoms, etc.

Does Bush expanding Medicare/Medicaid by half a trillion dollars count?

Has government been granted more or less power in the last 4 years?

Its all well and good to have strong opinions on such issues. What I take offense at is the total ignorance the electorate seems to demonstrate on exactly which politicians and parties are actually to blame.

Neither the Democrats nor the GOP is even the slightest bit interested in limiting government. Why would they? They'd be out of a job if they did. Its not a liberal or conservative thing. Its a class thing. Our government is run by elites for the benefit of elites and they will expand government and spend your money in their best interests.

Pay attention to deeds rather than empty ideologies. You might be surprised.

[ringo]

Yep, Kerry wasn't the best choice...but the Dem primaries didn't seem to offer a lot either. Dean got most of the attention early on, but didn't go anywhere. Kerry seemed to win on mediocrity more than anything, now it's going to be tight all the way to the finish because we've got a mediocre challenger and an uninspiring incumbent. Yawn.

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
Does Bush expanding Medicare/Medicaid by half a trillion dollars count?

Has government been granted more or less power in the last 4 years?

Its all well and good to have strong opinions on such issues. What I take offense at is the total ignorance the electorate seems to demonstrate on exactly which politicians and parties are actually to blame.

Neither the Democrats nor the GOP is even the slightest bit interested in limiting government. Why would they? They'd be out of a job if they did. Its not a liberal or conservative thing. Its a class thing. Our government is run by elites for the benefit of elites and they will expand government and spend your money in their best interests.

Pay attention to deeds rather than empty ideologies. You might be surprised.

Yes, I wish he was…uh…actually a conservative.
That might help.
Sooooo many bogus tax laws and regulations. Please end this, Mr. Bush. You're supposed to be a neo-con!

Who said I was all for the President's economic policy? I want the IRS gone damnit, and nobody cares. Sigh.

[Shaddim]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
Does Bush expanding Medicare/Medicaid by half a trillion dollars count?

Has government been granted more or less power in the last 4 years?

Its all well and good to have strong opinions on such issues. What I take offense at is the total ignorance the electorate seems to demonstrate on exactly which politicians and parties are actually to blame.

Neither the Democrats nor the GOP is even the slightest bit interested in limiting government. Why would they? They'd be out of a job if they did. Its not a liberal or conservative thing. Its a class thing. Our government is run by elites for the benefit of elites and they will expand government and spend your money in their best interests.

Pay attention to deeds rather than empty ideologies. You might be surprised.

CreepingDeath, That (the above) is what.

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by MacNStein:
Creepingdeath, That (the above) is what.

I thought you were going to predict something less predictable. And they think he's some right-wing Nazi! This guy is hardly conservative. If Bush is a Nazi, what does that make us?

[el chupacabra]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
Does Bush expanding Medicare/Medicaid by half a trillion dollars count?

Has government been granted more or less power in the last 4 years?

Neither the Democrats nor the GOP is even the slightest bit interested in limiting government. Why would they? They'd be out of a job if they did. Its not a liberal or conservative thing. Its a class thing. Our government is run by elites for the benefit of elites and they will expand government and spend your money in their best interests.

Pay attention to deeds rather than empty ideologies. You might be surprised.

[thunderous_funker]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Who said I was all for the President's economic policy? I want the IRS gone damnit, and nobody cares. Sigh.

I was taking issue with the phrase "welfare state liberals". Its meaningless. Why is it meaningless? Because it doesn't actually describe anything real. Its a strawman. The kind strawman that usually gets created by people who've made a career out of claiming to be victims of a "vast liberal conspiracy" which doesn't actually exist.

Lets stay away from meaningless soundbytes. "welfare state" doesn't actually mean anything. Its just a euphamism to villify something that probably doesn't even exist as policy or party platform.

Same with "Bolshevik choir". It doesn't mean anything. I'm unaware of any plank of Kerry's platform what would appeal to Bolsheviks.

[Shaddim]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
I thought you were going to predict something less predictable. And they think he's some right-wing Nazi! This guy is hardly conservative. If Bush is a Nazi, what does that make us?

I know, it wasn't very prophetic, but it was fun.

What does that make us? The people they fear even more.

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
I was taking issue with the phrase "welfare state liberals". Its meaningless. Why is it meaningless? Because it doesn't actually describe anything real. Its a strawman. The kind strawman that usually gets created by people who've made a career out of claiming to be victims of a "vast liberal conspiracy" which doesn't actually exist.

Lets stay away from meaningless soundbytes. "welfare state" doesn't actually mean anything. Its just a euphamism to villify something that probably doesn't even exist as policy or party platform.

Same with "Bolshevik choir". It doesn't mean anything. I'm unaware of any plank of Kerry's platform what would appeal to Bolsheviks.

Uhhh…you guys.
Never said anything about a conspiracy.
I'm just saying all you guys wanna do is make the situation worse. We need to cut this bs and get out of the business of relief. Maybe we can get someone with some conservatism next election…wait…Giuliani…dear God…no.

[thunderous_funker]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Uhhh…you guys.
Never said anything about a conspiracy.
I'm just saying all you guys wanna do is make the situation worse. We need to cut this bs and get out of the business of relief. Maybe we can get someone with some conservatism next election…wait…Giuliani…dear God…no.

"you guys" ??
"all you wanna do" ??
"situation" ??
"worse" ??

Talk sense, man. You seem bright enough to get specific. All you're doing is spouting nonsensical catchphrases that don't actually say anything, articulate a position or even identify your audience.

If you want to advocate dismantling Social Security or ending the income tax than do so. Stop mumbling vague nothings about nothing to nobody.



Maybe Ah-nold is your kinda candidate??

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
"you guys" ??
"all you wanna do" ??
"situation" ??
"worse" ??

Talk sense, man. You seem bright enough to get specific. All you're doing is spouting nonsensical catchphrases that don't actually say anything, articulate a position or even identify your audience.

If you want to advocate dismantling Social Security or ending the income tax than do so. Stop mumbling vague nothings about nothing to nobody.



Maybe Ah-nold is your kinda candidate??

Destroy IRS and have a national sales tax. Income tax is unfair to anyone making over $75,000.
Reduce government spending for useless programs and organizations. 70%, maybe.
End welfare. Do your own work.
End affirmative action. It's racism and insults the working capacity of any minority.
End minimum wage laws. No point and increases unemployment.
No more Davis-Bacon act. Let non-union workers get government contracts.
End protectionist policies—except in sutff vital to nat'l defense—and corporate taxes. Self-explanatory.

That's all for economics right now. If only Bush would do some of this stuff…

Out for now. Gotta do some writing. Hey look! I have all ones. Can I stop my posts at 1337?

[Admiral Ozzel's Hat]

Originally posted by ringo:
Yep, Kerry wasn't the best choice...but the Dem primaries didn't seem to offer a lot either. Dean got most of the attention early on, but didn't go anywhere. Kerry seemed to win on mediocrity more than anything, now it's going to be tight all the way to the finish because we've got a mediocre challenger and an uninspiring incumbent. Yawn.

Its a skull and bones thing, that is why Kerry was picked.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Admiral Ozzel's Hat:
Its a skull and bones thing, that is why Kerry was picked.

Wow that is your first post in 2 years!! /off-topic

[Admiral Ozzel's Hat]

Originally posted by voodoo:
Wow that is your first post in 2 years!! /off-topic

I have been lurking... resurrection

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by Admiral Ozzel's Hat:
Its a skull and bones thing, that is why Kerry was picked.

[Admiral Ozzel's Hat]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
snip

my hat looks like this

[Gee-Man]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
Destroy IRS and have a national sales tax. Income tax is unfair to anyone making over $75,000.
Reduce government spending for useless programs and organizations. 70%, maybe.
End welfare. Do your own work.
End affirmative action. It's racism and insults the working capacity of any minority.
End minimum wage laws. No point and increases unemployment.
No more Davis-Bacon act. Let non-union workers get government contracts.
End protectionist policies—except in sutff vital to nat'l defense—and corporate taxes. Self-explanatory.

That's all for economics right now. If only Bush would do some of this stuff…

Wow. I didn't know we had economic practitioners from the Gilded Age on MacNN. Maybe after Bush does all that, we can party like it's 1899?

[aberdeenwriter]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:

Great lookin cat!

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
Neither the Democrats nor the GOP is even the slightest bit interested in limiting government. Why would they? They'd be out of a job if they did. Its not a liberal or conservative thing. Its a class thing. Our government is run by elites for the benefit of elites and they will expand government and spend your money in their best interests.

Sad, but oh so true.

[CreepingDeth]

Originally posted by Gee-Man:
Wow. I didn't know we had economic practitioners from the Gilded Age on MacNN. Maybe after Bush does all that, we can party like it's 1899?

I didn't know we had economic practitioners from Soviet Russia on MacNN. Maybe after Kerry does all that, we can party like it's 1945.

I see you're in favor of government control like crazy. Good for you.

[Spoogepieces]

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
Our government is run by elites for the benefit of elites and they will expand government and spend your money in their best interests.

How exactly do foodstamps, Medicare, Social Security, welfare, or the other 50% of the budget that is mandatory spending help the elites?

[LoganCharles]

Kerry will lose because nobody likes him.


Man it's so simple.

[Zimphire]

Southern Democrats don't like them Yankee dems. It's as simple as that.

They are two different animals.

It's also the reason Kerry is trying to come off somewhere in the center.

No one is buying it though.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
We need to cut this bs and get out of the business of relief.

You mean like nation building and liberation? (LIBERAtion ... almost sounds like LIBERAL)

[Zimphire]

Yeah the compassion has seeped out of the liberals and jumped into Bush it seems in some cases.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Yeah the compassion has seeped out of the liberals and jumped into Bush it seems in some cases.

Get the "welfare state" "compassionate conservatives" out of government! I mean, not only are they a welfare government, but they're not even spending the billions on Americans!!!

[ringo]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Southern Democrats don't like them Yankee dems. It's as simple as that.

They are two different animals.

That's why Edwards is on the ticket, but Edwards might not be enough of a force to counter a Dem from Mass for the southern vote. The south has been moving right anyway now that the racists are starting the get over the whole "Party of Lincoln" image and the evangelicals and baptists are really getting behind the Reps in an organized way.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Wiskedjak:
Get the "welfare state" "compassionate conservatives" out of government! I mean, not only are they a welfare government, but they're not even spending the billions on Americans!!!

Hey, I am more in the middle when it comes to helping people out. There are a lot of extreme right views I don't side with.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by ringo:
That's why Edwards is on the ticket, but Edwards might not be enough of a force to counter a Dem from Mass for the southern vote. The south has been moving right anyway now that the racists are starting the get over the whole "Party of Lincoln" image and the evangelicals and baptists are really getting behind the Reps in an organized way.

Edwards is an ambulance chaser. People know that.

Having said that, I think a Edwards/Kerry ticket would have probably gave the Democrats an edge over Bush.

[olePigeon]

General Clark was always my favorite.

[ringo]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Edwards is an ambulance chaser. People know that.

Having said that, I think a Edwards/Kerry ticket would have probably gave the Democrats an edge over Bush.

Bush would have gone after Edwards on experience and wiped the floor with him. This isn't a good political climate for someone with such a small amount of time in public office to run for president.

[Zimphire]

Doesn't matter. Edwards has the look, can be charismatic. And is from the south.

[LoganCharles]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Doesn't matter. Edwards has the look, can be charismatic. And is from the south.

Eh? Edwards won't even be able to win S. Carolina for Kerry.

Edwards has got to be a let down for the Kerry camp. I think they were banking hard on him to bring in the 'likability' vote. You know the soccer moms and metrosexuals. He hasn't come through. He more or less is a puppet, a spokesperson for Kerry to rattle off controversial 'jabs' at the Bush camp.

[Gee-Man]

Originally posted by CreepingDeath:
I didn't know we had economic practitioners from Soviet Russia on MacNN. Maybe after Kerry does all that, we can party like it's 1945.

I see you're in favor of government control like crazy. Good for you.

No, I'm in favor of our current economic system that has worked extremely well for the past 60 years, right here in the USA. Although it's kind of interesting that you can't debate without resorting to the tired old "communist" accusation. Do you even know what the Gilded Age was? And what does Kerry have to do with anything I said?

My point is, these "new" economic ideas you so desperately want Bush to implement are almost as old and throughly discredited as communism is. Most people realized that almost a century ago. Reading your post, I realized that your original plea isn't that Bush should be a Barry Goldwater-style conservative, it's that he's not enough of a robber baron-style conservative, hence the snarky comment.

[aberdeenwriter]

Originally posted by LoganCharles:
Kerry will lose because nobody likes him.


Man it's so simple.

NOBODY is a strong word there, Pilgrim! Sounds like you are "whistling past the cemetary!"

[Zimphire]

Yeah using extreme words like "Nobody" and "Everybody" is a bit lame.

I've told people a million times to stop exaggerating.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
I've told people a million times to stop exaggerating.

Thanks for the laugh. Sometimes you are so funny unintentionally!