[Athens]

Why is it about hard drugs that make them illegal for adults to use. I wanna know why people want it to be illegal and why others think it stupid.

[nbnz]

Have you seen the results of drug use? Not just for the person taking them (for which it's their personal decision), but for the people around them - whether that be their families, or their communities?
Have you seen someone whacked out and kill someone to get money to support their habit?
Or some punk who steals from his (or her) family to support their habit?

The people who think drugs should be legal think that addicts only hurt themselves, which is not the case.

[Athens]

Originally posted by nbnz:
Have you seen the results of drug use? Not just for the person taking them (for which it's their personal decision), but for the people around them - whether that be their families, or their communities?
Have you seen someone whacked out and kill someone to get money to support their habit?
Or some punk who steals from his (or her) family to support their habit?

The people who think drugs should be legal think that addicts only hurt themselves, which is not the case.

The reason people steal money from family or rob other people to support there addiction is because it is illegal. That aside, why are some drugs legal and others illegal. And yes I see what it does to people, every day on my way to work I pass through Vancouvers Skid Row. I have seen more then prob most people here on macnn.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by Athens:
The reason people steal money from family or rob other people to support there addiction is because it is illegal.

Ummm, wrong... people steal because they can't afford the item directly. Being illegal or legal has nothing to do with it. People steal money for watches, rings, iPods, alcohol, food, etc. etc. etc. and none of them are illegal.

Originally posted by Athens:
That aside, why are some drugs legal and others illegal. And yes I see what it does to people, every day on my way to work I pass through Vancouvers Skid Row. I have seen more then prob most people here on macnn.

What drugs are legal? I'll give you tobacco and alcohol... and I would say "because they have historically been legal" but even that's changing to some degree.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by Athens:
Why is it about hard drugs that make them illegal for adults to use. I wanna know why people want it to be illegal and why others think it stupid.

You aren't going to find many adults that think that hard drugs being illegal is stupid.

[Kilbey]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
You aren't going to find many adults that think that hard drugs being illegal is stupid.

I'll agree with that.

The reason I think hard drugs should be illegal is that they destroy lives. Addiction is easy with them. And with some drugs you are addicted with your first use. Some drugs can affect someone years after only taking once.

But people can also have some of the same problems with alcohol. But not to the same dramatic effects. I would support a alcohol licensing system. You get a DUI, you have to wait five years before you can buy alcohol again. Commit a crime or arrested with alcohol in you system, you can't buy alcohol for 5 years. Require driver's licenses with every alcohol purchase.

[zigzag]

The drug laws harm more people than they protect, for the same reasons that prohibition of alcohol did.

Milton Friedman on drug policy:

http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Misc/friedm1.htm

More here:

http://www.druglibrary.org/special/f...n_friedman.htm

[saab95]

Originally posted by Athens:
Why is it about hard drugs that make them illegal for adults to use. I wanna know why people want it to be illegal and why others think it stupid.

It's more like government wants these drugs to be illegal.

Because government thinks that we as individuals lack the fortitude to decide for ourselves whether taking such drugs can be harmful or not, and the government deems these harmful, and thus these drugs are illegal.

If that logic is valid, then it would hold to reason that alcohol and tobacco should be illegal because their ultimate result would be harmful especially when taken in large quantities. Both alcohol and tobacco can be addictive. Just like heroin or cocaine.

So the government feels it is properly taking care of us by protecting us from hard drugs. So it feels it has the right and obligation to try to keep these drugs away from us.

Yet it is the decision of the individual to use such drugs for whatever purpose he deems fit. He can drink and smoke legally but not snort coke or toke grass- even though the effects of those two have been proven to be no more damaging than heavy drinking or heavy smoking.

The government regulating drugs in this manner for these reasons amounts to their infringing upon our individual rights, and therefore, technically these laws are unconstitutional.

I for one do not favor doing drugs for recreation. But the government has no right to regulate these,either.

[Kilbey]

Originally posted by zigzag:
The drug laws harm more people than they protect, for the same reasons that prohibition of alcohol did.

Milton Friedman on drug policy:

http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Misc/friedm1.htm

More here:

http://www.druglibrary.org/special/f...n_friedman.htm

Three are a lot of opinions and not facts in his interviews.

Friedman: Crack would never have existed, in my opinion

Friedman: Well, maybe. Nobody can say with certainty what will happen along those lines.

And the kicker and the a VERY important reason hard drugs should not be legal is stated very well here.

Friedman: Well, maybe. Nobody can say with certainty what will happen along those lines. ... The really main thing that bothers me about the crack is not what you're talking about, it's the crack babies, because that's the real tragedy. They are innocent victims. They didn't choose to be crack babies any more than the people who are born with the fetal alcohol syndrome.

[zigzag]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
Three are a lot of opinions and not facts in his interviews.

You left out the part where he attributes the number of crack babies at least partly to irrational drug policies. He's intellectually honest enough to know that there's no single solution to the problems - like most matters in real adult life, it's a weighing process. Threatening to throw everyone in jail is simplistic and ineffective.

Besides, this is just an interview. His opinions are well-reasoned and are based on facts and experience. Among other things, he's a Nobel Prize-winning economist - he lives for facts. He also lived through Prohibition and its repeal and has seen this happen before. I would suggest reading some of the other links to his writings.

I've known people who have used heroin, cocaine, alcohol, you name it. Some could handle it, others couldn't. A friend of mine has spent his career treating such people. It's easy to express horror at anecdotal evidence of the ill effects of drug and alcohol use, but as we learned from Prohibition, that's not enough to form a rational policy.

We can't predict some things with certainty, but we do know one thing: the current approach isn't working and has a lot of undesirable side effects. We can't predict what will happen with Social Security reform either, but a lot of people seem to think it's worth pursuing.

Another conservative's view:

http://www.druglibrary.org/think/~jnr/nr0296.htm

[roberto blanco]

the reason why certain recreational substances are illegal isn't to protect the citizens from the ill effects of drug abuse, but because it would be insanely hard to patent them.

and of course the second, and probably bigger reason is, - social "control". by the time the industrial revolution started picking up momentum, you needed "productive" citizens to work 9 to 5 and be able to take orders etc. and well. anybody who has smoked-up before knows that you really don't feel like standing in a production line for ten hours assembling twinkies and hoho's, - you'd probably feel more like eating them.

i'm pretty sure that if the cigarette- and the liquor industry weren't such a big lobby, those things would (by now) be pretty much illegal as well.

so back OT, - i believe all substances should be legal AND monitored by the fda. that way, at least you could avoid some very bad "trips" or buying a bag of oregano for $25.

[Face Ache]

Originally posted by Athens:
And yes I see what it does to people, every day on my way to work I pass through Vancouvers Skid Row. I have seen more then prob most people here on macnn.

FROM THE BUS?!

[Athens]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
Three are a lot of opinions and not facts in his interviews.





And the kicker and the a VERY important reason hard drugs should not be legal is stated very well here.

quote:
Friedman: Well, maybe. Nobody can say with certainty what will happen along those lines. ... The really main thing that bothers me about the crack is not what you're talking about, it's the crack babies, because that's the real tragedy. They are innocent victims. They didn't choose to be crack babies any more than the people who are born with the fetal alcohol syndrome.

So you think alcohol should be banned and illegal too?

[Athens]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
You aren't going to find many adults that think that hard drugs being illegal is stupid.

yup your right, to many adults don't have a problem with government telling them what they can and cant do to themselves.

[Athens]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
I'll agree with that.

The reason I think hard drugs should be illegal is that they destroy lives. Addiction is easy with them. And with some drugs you are addicted with your first use. Some drugs can affect someone years after only taking once.

But people can also have some of the same problems with alcohol. But not to the same dramatic effects. I would support a alcohol licensing system. You get a DUI, you have to wait five years before you can buy alcohol again. Commit a crime or arrested with alcohol in you system, you can't buy alcohol for 5 years. Require driver's licenses with every alcohol purchase.

Alcohol distorys lives, gambling can distroy lives. Neither of those are illegal.

[Face Ache]

Originally posted by Athens:
Alcohol distorys lives, gambling can distroy lives. Neither of those are illegal.

But in an ideal world they would be.

Why move in the opposite direction?

[Athens]

Originally posted by roberto blanco:
the reason why certain recreational substances are illegal isn't to protect the citizens from the ill effects of drug abuse, but because it would be insanely hard to patent them.

and of course the second, and probably bigger reason is, - social "control". by the time the industrial revolution started picking up momentum, you needed "productive" citizens to work 9 to 5 and be able to take orders etc. and well. anybody who has smoked-up before knows that you really don't feel like standing in a production line for ten hours assembling twinkies and hoho's, - you'd probably feel more like eating them.

i'm pretty sure that if the cigarette- and the liquor industry weren't such a big lobby, those things would (by now) be pretty much illegal as well.

so back OT, - i believe all substances should be legal AND monitored by the fda. that way, at least you could avoid some very bad "trips" or buying a bag of oregano for $25.

What about making them legal as a medicine for addicts and giving it out like a prescription?

[Athens]

Originally posted by Face Ache:
But in an ideal world they would be.

Why move in the opposite direction?

why not remove the criminal element of hard drugs so people can live with out fear of being robbed and stop wasting money on extra policing, extra jail, and insurance and use that money saved to treat addicts and at the same time put dealers out of business. Is that really moving in the opposite direction?

[Athens]

Originally posted by Face Ache:
FROM THE BUS?!

until recently you could see people injecting right on the side walk, and ya from the bus. I've also walked through skid row countless times, specailly when I was working at a skidrow hotel.

[roberto blanco]

Originally posted by Athens:
What about making them legal as a medicine for addicts and giving it out like a prescription?

i don't know about the perscription issue. i think pot, shrooms etc. should just be sold like tea, cigarettes and alcohol. yeah, come to think about it, cocaine, heroin etc. as well...

what's far more important to me, is that whatever substance it is, it is reviewed and heavily scrutinized before it enters the market.

[Athens]

Originally posted by roberto blanco:
i don't know about the perscription issue. i think pot, shrooms etc. should just be sold like tea, cigarettes and alcohol. yeah, come to think about it, cocaine, heroin etc. as well...

what's far more important to me, is that whatever substance it is, it is reviewed and heavily scrutinized before it enters the market.

im not really big on that idea. I just think its a waste of time to lock ppl up for using anything. Makeing cocain snorts that u can buy over at a 711 is just asking for more problems and addiction

[Stradlater]

Originally posted by Face Ache:
But in an ideal world they would be.

Why move in the opposite direction?

No, in an "ideal" world, people wouldn't be stupid enough to abuse substances in a way that endangers themselves and the lives of others.

[roberto blanco]

Originally posted by Athens:
Makeing cocain snorts that u can buy over at a 711 is just asking for more problems and addiction

i really don't think so. i don't know a single person who would want to do coke, but doesn't because its illegal. those who don't like doing drugs don't do them, and those who want to, - find a way to get them.

[barang]

Originally posted by Athens:
yup your right, to many adults don't have a problem with government telling them what they can and cant do to themselves.

It's also illegal to kill yourself.

If I remember right, one of the purposes of government is to restrain people.

[Kilbey]

Originally posted by Athens:
So you think alcohol should be banned and illegal too?

When you try to put things into my posts that aren't there your argument is weakened. Your credibilty is tarnished. I lose any interest in a rational discussion with you.

It's a weak argumentative tactic and makes your side weaker.

[Kilbey]

Originally posted by Athens:
Alcohol distorys lives, gambling can distroy lives. Neither of those are illegal.

Read what I wrote here.

I'll even quote it for you.

Originally posted by Kilbey:
But people can also have some of the same problems with alcohol. But not to the same dramatic effects. I would support a alcohol licensing system. You get a DUI, you have to wait five years before you can buy alcohol again. Commit a crime or arrested with alcohol in you system, you can't buy alcohol for 5 years. Require driver's licenses with every alcohol purchase.

Alcohol is not a "hard drug". It is a mild sedative. It can be taken in moderation. Crack cannot. Cocaine cannot. Herion cannot.

Gambling is not a drug. Sure it destroys lives, and your bringing it up into a discussion about legalizing "hard drugs" makes you look like you're building a strawman.

[Stradlater]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
When you try to put things into my posts that aren't there your argument is weakened. Your credibilty is tarnished. I lose any interest in a rational discussion with you.

It's a weak argumentative tactic and makes your side weaker.

Maybe it was a typo; "s" is right next to "d"

[BoomStick]

I thought canandndina had no impoverished people in it's socialist utopia.

What's the deal?

VANCOUVER, British Columbia (AP) A clinic providing free heroin to addicts is to open later this month in Vancouver. The trial is intended to see if prescribing the drug can help addicts who have failed in other treatment programs.

Similar projects have been scorned in the United States, seen as unethical or dangerous. There have been such studies in the Netherlands, Switzerland, Germany and Spain.

The 12-15 month trial is to determine if prescribed, pharmaceutical-grade heroin — in conjunction with methadone treatment — is more effective than methadone alone in treating certain opiate-addicted people.

"We're trying to figure out whether we can reach out to those people with medically prescribed heroin," said Dr. Martin Schechter, principal investigator for The North American Opiate Medication Initiative.

The project also will be conducted in Toronto and Montreal, but is set to get under way in Vancouver first, following government approval — expected in about two weeks.

More than 4,000 drug addicts live near the clinic in Vancouver's impoverished Downtown Eastside, an area known for its street drug deals.

Schechter said the trial will not attract addicts from other areas because the 157 people selected to take part must have been addicted for at least five years.

Those in the project will go to the clinic three times a day. Nurses will supervise the injections. Seventy people will receive methadone; the rest will get heroin and methadone.

more
http://cbs2.com/health/health_story_040123935.html

[Athens]

Originally posted by roberto blanco:
i really don't think so. i don't know a single person who would want to do coke, but doesn't because its illegal. those who don't like doing drugs don't do them, and those who want to, - find a way to get them.

making it that easy to get will lead to more people being tempted to try it who would never have tried it otherwise. There ar alots of medications that you can only get as a perscription, same should be for the hard drugs.

[Athens]

Originally posted by barang:
It's also illegal to kill yourself.

If I remember right, one of the purposes of government is to restrain people.

Actually I just recently learned here in Canada anyways its legal for you to kill yourself, you just cant assist in some one elses death.

[Athens]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
When you try to put things into my posts that aren't there your argument is weakened. Your credibilty is tarnished. I lose any interest in a rational discussion with you.

It's a weak argumentative tactic and makes your side weaker.

I didn't put anything into your post, you said it all by yourself Lets look it over a little more carefully.

And the kicker and the a VERY important reason hard drugs should not be legal is stated very well here.

quote:
Friedman: Well, maybe. Nobody can say with certainty what will happen along those lines. ... The really main thing that bothers me about the crack is not what you're talking about, it's the crack babies, because that's the real tragedy. They are innocent victims. They didn't choose to be crack babies any more than the people who are born with the fetal alcohol syndrome.

lets look at the first line.

[quote]And the kicker and the a VERY important reason hard drugs should not be legal is stated very well here.
[quote]

Here you are saying that the very important reason why hard drugs should not be legal is stated in a statment belwo from Friedman. Well thats fine lets look at that statement then.

Friedman: Well, maybe. Nobody can say with certainty what will happen along those lines. ... The really main thing that bothers me about the crack is not what you're talking about, it's the crack babies, because that's the real tragedy. They are innocent victims. They didn't choose to be crack babies any more than the people who are born with the fetal alcohol syndrome.

So either you agree that we should have it illegal because it makes crack babies but its ok to have Fetal Alcohol babies, or your saying that we shouldnt have crack or fetal alcohol babies and both should be illegal or you think if we allow fetal alcohol babies we should allow crack babies too. Please clearify your position beause right now you are sounding more like a politition flip flopping back n forth and not being very clear and straight with your feelings and making Bush like statments to counter me. Is your idol Kerry or something.

[Athens]

Originally posted by BoomStick:
I thought canandndina had no impoverished people in it's socialist utopia.

What's the deal?

and your a fine example of a well educated American btw Iraq isnt beside China just incase you are confused where it is.

[Kilbey]

Originally posted by Athens:
I didn't put anything into your post, you said it all by yourself Lets look it over a little more carefully.

lets look at the first line.

So either you agree that we should have it illegal because it makes crack babies but its ok to have Fetal Alcohol babies, or your saying that we shouldnt have crack or fetal alcohol babies and both should be illegal or you think if we allow fetal alcohol babies we should allow crack babies too. Please clearify your position beause right now you are sounding more like a politition flip flopping back n forth and not being very clear and straight with your feelings and making Bush like statments to counter me. Is your idol Kerry or something.

That's why I requoted myself for you. Like I'll do here. That way you can't twist my posts into what you want me to say. Your argument is still weak.

Originally posted by Kilbey:
But people can also have some of the same problems with alcohol. But not to the same dramatic effects. I would support a alcohol licensing system. You get a DUI, you have to wait five years before you can buy alcohol again. Commit a crime or arrested with alcohol in you system, you can't buy alcohol for 5 years. Require driver's licenses with every alcohol purchase.

Creating a child with fetal alcohol syndrome is a crime. It is child abuse. Well, to you it's not. To you it's "IT" abuse. I believe in protecting a child in the womb. You think "ITs" have no rights.

[Kilbey]

Originally posted by Athens:
And yes I see what it does to people, every day on my way to work I pass through Vancouvers Skid Row. I have seen more then prob most people here on macnn.

Here's part of the root of the problems with most of your posts. You define life by your experiences and assume no one has as much knowledge as you. You're young. You're arrogant.

I live near Flint, MI. 12 miles away. I worked in the city and drove through downtown everyday for over 9 years. Google Flint, MI crime. It's certainly no utopia. But I bet it sucks worse than Vancouver crime rates. I don't define everyone else's life by my experiences in Flint though. I don't assume everyone has it nicer or worse off. I've lived in the country (extremely rural) to inner city. I currently live in a tiny town in a semi-rural area. I have experiences with crime filled areas and I currently live in an area where people leave their keys in their SUVs at night so they won't lose them. The world is filled with all kinds of people.

You assume too much kid. Open your ears and listen a bit more.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
Read what I wrote here.

I'll even quote it for you.



Alcohol is not a "hard drug". It is a mild sedative. It can be taken in moderation. Crack cannot. Cocaine cannot. Herion cannot.

Gambling is not a drug. Sure it destroys lives, and your bringing it up into a discussion about legalizing "hard drugs" makes you look like you're building a strawman.

Couldn't agree more. Gambling is more in line with shopping additions. You can be addicted to anything, fishing, cars, etc. etc. and they all destroy a family. A major difference is that you generally don't destroy your health like hard drugs.

I feel hard drug laws do keep then out of the hands of people that want to make something of their lives.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by Athens:
and your a fine example of a well educated American btw Iraq isnt beside China just incase you are confused where it is.

I find it interesting that you are so self conscious about Canada. I think most americans poke fun at Canada in the same way they may poke fun because in general the countries are very similar (I'm sure you would completely disagree, but there is religious freedom and basically people can do what they please within reason).

With reference to global influence, Canada is more on par with Italy as compared to the United States, Japan, Germany, Britain, France and China...

[Athens]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
That's why I requoted myself for you. Like I'll do here. That way you can't twist my posts into what you want me to say. Your argument is still weak.



Creating a child with fetal alcohol syndrome is a crime. It is child abuse. Well, to you it's not. To you it's "IT" abuse. I believe in protecting a child in the womb. You think "ITs" have no rights.

Thats incorrect, I said IT shouuld be defined in the law to end the endless arguments about rights. AS you should have read I said I dont believe in abortion except for very very early stages. Me personally I wouldn't ever want a girl friend or wife to abort my child at all.

[Athens]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
Here's part of the root of the problems with most of your posts. You define life by your experiences and assume no one has as much knowledge as you. You're young. You're arrogant.

I live near Flint, MI. 12 miles away. I worked in the city and drove through downtown everyday for over 9 years. Google Flint, MI crime. It's certainly no utopia. But I bet it sucks worse than Vancouver crime rates. I don't define everyone else's life by my experiences in Flint though. I don't assume everyone has it nicer or worse off. I've lived in the country (extremely rural) to inner city. I currently live in a tiny town in a semi-rural area. I have experiences with crime filled areas and I currently live in an area where people leave their keys in their SUVs at night so they won't lose them. The world is filled with all kinds of people.

You assume too much kid. Open your ears and listen a bit more.

LOL if im a kid then you are really old. And no im not arrogant, I dont define life based on my experiences, I based most of my opinions on what I read, research and hear from others along with my own experiences. I was asked a question if saw the effects of drug use, I answered that question.

[Athens]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I find it interesting that you are so self conscious about Canada. I think most americans poke fun at Canada in the same way they may poke fun because in general the countries are very similar (I'm sure you would completely disagree, but there is religious freedom and basically people can do what they please within reason).

With reference to global influence, Canada is more on par with Italy as compared to the United States, Japan, Germany, Britain, France and China...

Im not self conscious about Canada, im just sick of things being turned into Canada / USA and USA / Canada bashing. We are very similar and we are also very different. In the end we all have the same problems the same issues, the real differences is the attitude on how to deal with them and the approches taking.

I feel Canadians are the best of Americans and Europeans. Our economey, general style of living, out cities and freedoms are more American, but when it comes to war, capital punishment, crime. drugs, sex we are more like Europeans.

[roberto blanco]

Originally posted by Kilbey:
...Crack cannot. Cocaine cannot. Herion cannot.

yes, it can, yes it can and yes it can. otoh, i've known more people that have had their lives seriously ****ed up by alcohol, than by any other substance.

quite a few people i know have been smoking pot almost every day for the last 20 years or so, and hold down (good)jobs, are in relationships etc.

others have been doing blow, or even smack for a short while and are probably in better physical shape than you are.

substances are just that, and just about anything can be overdone and/or addictive (nicotine most likely being the worst of them all), and if cocaine was legal and monitored, you'd probably not even have a drug like "crack" on the market (and maybe even speed (which imho is the poor man's coke))

[roberto blanco]

dbl. post

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by Athens:
I feel Canadians are the best of Americans and Europeans.

A good opinion, but many Americans and Europeans would disagree.

Originally posted by Athens:
Our economey, general style of living, out cities and freedoms are more American, but when it comes to war, capital punishment, crime. drugs, sex we are more like Europeans.

I think Canada unfortunately MUST be more "European" when it comes to war... as Canada has about as much global influence as a small european country.

You only seem to see one side of the issue, your side. Some people talk about "freedom" as though it's a liberal monopoly. Making hard drugs legal would trample on my freedoms IMHO. I would be forced to live in a country that not only condones, but profits off of hard drug use. What about MY freedoms?

You can scream "but what about tobacco and alchohol" all you want. The fact is, I'm comfortable (as are many Americans) with the current laws... but even they are changing (lowering of blood alchohol content for DUI, no smoking in public buildings, etc. etc.) to protect the non-drinking [with reference to driving] and non-smoking [2nd hand smoke] population.

[saab95]

Originally posted by Face Ache:
But in an ideal world they would be.

Why move in the opposite direction?

Baloney about your ideal world.

In an ideal world there is freedom of choice.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by roberto blanco:
quite a few people i know have been smoking pot almost every day for the last 20 years or so, and hold down (good)jobs, are in relationships etc.

others have been doing blow, or even smack for a short while and are probably in better physical shape than you are.

I would be more then happy to show you plenty of people that smoke pot or blow every day that don't hold down good jobs and whose bodies are falling apart. Pot/Blow = Good Job + Fit Body is the exception, not the rule. Can some people do it, sure... just like some people can get completely drunk and still work just fine the next day.

[roberto blanco]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I would be more then happy to show you plenty of people that smoke pot or blow every day that don't hold down good jobs and whose bodies are falling apart.

so could i, but that's beside the point. i was responding to that specific post, and it said that (my quote)"one could do alcohol recreationally", but not coke, herion etc.

that is simply not true.

like i said, i haven't known anybody who wasn't able to get their hands on drugs if they really wanted to.

[Stradlater]

Originally posted by saab95:
Baloney about your ideal world.

In an ideal world there is freedom of choice.

o brave new world...

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by roberto blanco:
like i said, i haven't known anybody who wasn't able to get their hands on drugs if they really wanted to.

I bet I could get my hands on an endangered species so I could hang it on my wall... if I really wanted to.

[it still doesn't address the underlying issue]

[roberto blanco]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
[it still doesn't address the underlying issue]

which is...?

the issue is whether societies are better or worse of regulating/criminalizing certain substances.

i would say worse off, since all it does is create an entire criminal subculture, which in-turn has to be combated with the averge joe's tax dollars. AND BEYOND THAT it really doesn't stop anybody from doing drugs who is dead set on doing so.

and no, people wouldn't just be walking through the local wallgreens going "hmmmm...i really don't feel like aspirin anymore, - i think i'll try some crack instead".

that was my point.

[Athens]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
A good opinion, but many Americans and Europeans would disagree.



I think Canada unfortunately MUST be more "European" when it comes to war... as Canada has about as much global influence as a small european country.

You only seem to see one side of the issue, your side. Some people talk about "freedom" as though it's a liberal monopoly. Making hard drugs legal would trample on my freedoms IMHO. I would be forced to live in a country that not only condones, but profits off of hard drug use. What about MY freedoms?

You can scream "but what about tobacco and alchohol" all you want. The fact is, I'm comfortable (as are many Americans) with the current laws... but even they are changing (lowering of blood alchohol content for DUI, no smoking in public buildings, etc. etc.) to protect the non-drinking [with reference to driving] and non-smoking [2nd hand smoke] population.

I dont hard drugs legal for purchase, what im talking about is providing it free to addicts as medicine. Thats not profiting off of it. And the part about freedoms, its not trampling on your freedoms unless you are forced to USE drugs.

[Athens]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I bet I could get my hands on an endangered species so I could hang it on my wall... if I really wanted to.

[it still doesn't address the underlying issue]

which is as long as drugs remain illegal they create a underground criminal enviroment which costs society more and causes more innocent victoms.