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Dino-Rider · Aug 23, 2006, 11:23 AM

http://youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU

Heh. Truth hurts.

Kevin · Aug 23, 2006, 11:27 AM

For one, Atheists and Agnostics aren't the same (They counted them as such however)

And that video is about as "truthful" as a Michael Moore film

This thread is labeled "Flame Bait"

And is in the wrong part of the forum to boot.

demograph68 · Aug 23, 2006, 11:38 AM

Atheism eh? Just show them... THE BANANA!

turtle777 · Aug 23, 2006, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by Dino-Rider

Truth hurts.

No, your flame bait attempt does.

-t

sek929 · Aug 23, 2006, 11:44 AM

I don't get it.

Atheists hate when Christians push their beliefs on people, yet are known for doing the same...more frequently even.

wallinbl · Aug 23, 2006, 12:01 PM

What truth is it that is hurting? I'm not sure what the point of the clip was. Yes, there have been intelligent and accomplished people that were atheists. Big whoop. The fact that a Bible verse refers to atheists as fools is unrelated to their intelligence or accomplishments. The Bible verse is calling them fools because, from the point of view of the Bible, they are failing to choose eternal life over death.

Eug Wanker · Aug 23, 2006, 12:07 PM

turtle777 · Aug 23, 2006, 12:08 PM

^^^ Motion seconded.

-t

moodymonster · Aug 23, 2006, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by demograph68

Atheism eh? Just show them... THE BANANA!

yes, the banana... those guys in that video really didn't do their research did they.

Dino-Rider · Aug 23, 2006, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by wallinbl

What truth is it that is hurting? I'm not sure what the point of the clip was. Yes, there have been intelligent and accomplished people that were atheists. Big whoop. The fact that a Bible verse refers to atheists as fools is unrelated to their intelligence or accomplishments. The Bible verse is calling them fools because, from the point of view of the Bible, they are failing to choose eternal life over death.

I think the part about the divorce rates, and the inmates in prison were the real telling things. The whole point of the video was that holding a spiritual gun to your head to 'force' you to be a good person ends up not working... in fact, it seems to do the opposite.

awcopus · Aug 23, 2006, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by sek929

I don't get it.

Atheists hate when Christians push their beliefs on people, yet are known for doing the same...more frequently even.

Is it possible for the government simultaneously to protect each person's right to determine his or her belief system while enforcing laws that favor one set of religious theories? Historically and logically, the answer is no.

Only a government that is nontheistic makes it possible to live in a society that allows peaceful religious diversity. Once government chooses sides in religion, you get exactly the conditions that prompted people to come to America in the first place: religious persecution by the state, violent yet legal intolerance of differences of opinion.

Religious and nonreligious people should debate one another vigorously, set forth their perspectives and arguments using cultural and economic outlets. And the government should enforce individuals' rights to enter and to exit these debates in peace. Can't we all agree on that much?

Troll · Aug 23, 2006, 12:57 PM

What's an athiest?

hyteckit · Aug 23, 2006, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by Troll

What's an athiest?

athi-est: Having the most authority.

Landos Mustache · Aug 23, 2006, 01:52 PM

Well they did get the part about Bill Gates being a "fool" right.

At any rate the statistics on inmates and divorce rates is hilarious. Good thing they didn't even tough teen pregnancy.

forkies · Aug 23, 2006, 02:23 PM

why is jack nicholson's crotch highlighted in the video?

Landos Mustache · Aug 23, 2006, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by forkies

why is jack nicholson's crotch highlighted in the video?

Lens flare from his Academy award which he keeps in his pants.

Well that or someone just polished his knob.

hyteckit · Aug 23, 2006, 03:24 PM

Christopher Reeves an atheist? No way.

Landos Mustache · Aug 23, 2006, 03:48 PM

Originally Posted by hyteckit

Christopher Reeves an atheist? No way.

He became one after God made him fall on his head.

Troll · Aug 23, 2006, 05:17 PM

OMG, that was the funniest thing I've read all day, Landos!

voodoo · Aug 23, 2006, 05:34 PM

rule 8 violat.... whatever

V

wallinbl · Aug 23, 2006, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by Dino-Rider

I think the part about the divorce rates, and the inmates in prison were the real telling things. The whole point of the video was that holding a spiritual gun to your head to 'force' you to be a good person ends up not working... in fact, it seems to do the opposite.

I think that's a useless statistic. Many Christians know very little about the religion. People that actually go so far as to say they are Atheist (rather than just saying "I dunno" or "I believe in something, but I'm not really a Christian) are more likely to be somewhat intelligent and reasonable. My point is that Atheists are going to represent a narrower range of the spectrum.

wallinbl · Aug 23, 2006, 05:54 PM

One more comment - saying you're a Christian doesn't mean much. Christianity is more than simply saying "I believe", which is about how involved most Christians I know are. Saying you're a Christian doesn't make you a follower of Christ, and saying it doesn't make you a better person.

voodoo · Aug 23, 2006, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by wallinbl

One more comment - saying you're a Christian doesn't mean much. Christianity is more than simply saying "I believe", which is about how involved most Christians I know are. Saying you're a Christian doesn't make you a follower of Christ, and saying it doesn't make you a better person.

Very good point. Saying one is a Christian means little. One has to walk the path as well. Actions speak louder than words.

V

Kevin · Aug 23, 2006, 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by Dino-Rider

I think the part about the divorce rates, and the inmates in prison were the real telling things. The whole point of the video was that holding a spiritual gun to your head to 'force' you to be a good person ends up not working... in fact, it seems to do the opposite.

Wow no one is holding a spiritual gun to my head.

You simply don't understand Christians or Christianity. It's not like that at all.

Krusty · Aug 24, 2006, 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by Kevin

Wow no one is holding a spiritual gun to my head.

You simply don't understand Christians or Christianity. It's not like that at all.

I agree. I grew up Southern Baptist (agnostic now) and I don't really think that the church is holding a gun to anybody's head to go. However, my (purely anecdotal) experience was that the majority of people who showed up at church were doing so for social/parental/traditional/guilt reasons and dropped any semblance of piety or spirituality as soon as they walked out the door.

With a few notable exceptions (people that I truly admire to this day), most church goers I've known through my nearly 2 decades of attending church were complete hypocrites. Some of the most vile, racist, cheats-on-their-wives, drunkard, "old boys" I've met in secular life I have wound up finding out they are deacons or elders in their local churches. As I became more self aware around 16, 17, 18 years of age I began to realize that I WAS one of those hypocrites and that I either needed to start following biblical teachings earnestly or quit the charade of calling myself a Christian.

What surprises me to this day is all the people I meet who continue this charade for their entire lives, seemingly without any self-conciousness about the fact that what they actually do in life isn't bearing much of a resemblance to what they are nodding their heads to on Sunday morning.

Meh.

Landos Mustache · Aug 24, 2006, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by Krusty

I agree. I grew up Southern Baptist (agnostic now) and I don't really think that the church is holding a gun to anybody's head to go. However, my (purely anecdotal) experience was that the majority of people who showed up at church were doing so for social/parental/traditional/guilt reasons and dropped any semblance of piety or spirituality as soon as they walked out the door.

Fine but I don' think anyone cares about that. If you want to go to church and be a liar, cheat, wear bunny ears whatever that is your choice.

The problem starts when these people walk out of Church and apply their beliefs to others and force the government to follow their views.

Krusty · Aug 24, 2006, 02:19 PM

Originally Posted by Landos Mustache

The problem starts when these people walk out of Church and apply their beliefs to others and force the government to follow their views.

True enough ... but I was trying to stay mildly on topic with the content of the video in the OP which wasn't really commenting on the infusion of religion in to politics. More about the conflict between teachings of the bible and the characteristics of those who do (or do not) choose to practice christianity ("Hey, look at all the cool, smart people who are atheists and how rarely they wind up divorced or in jail")

olePigeon · Aug 24, 2006, 02:46 PM

Originally Posted by Kevin

Wow no one is holding a spiritual gun to my head.

Christianity has laws you have to follow, otherwise you go to Hell. Sure, Hell isn't exactly a gun, but I'd imagine it's a might worse.

Shaddim · Aug 24, 2006, 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by olePigeon

Christianity has laws you have to follow, otherwise you go to Hell. Sure, Hell isn't exactly a gun, but I'd imagine it's a might worse.

You do realize that not all Christian churches believe in a literal, eternal Hell? Right?

The concept (a place of eternal punishment) is actually quite new in relation to the nearly 2K years that Christianity has existed.

Dino-Rider · Aug 24, 2006, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by Landos Mustache

He became one after God made him fall on his head.

Dino-Rider · Aug 24, 2006, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by Kevin

Wow no one is holding a spiritual gun to my head.

You simply don't understand Christians or Christianity. It's not like that at all.

Actually there is one. According to your OWN BELIEFS, if you are a bad person, if you don't accept Christ as your savior, etc, you are going to hell. For all eternity. That's a pretty big threat, if you believe in that bullshit.

Dino-Rider · Aug 24, 2006, 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by MacNStein

You do realize that not all Christian churches believe in a literal, eternal Hell? Right?

The concept (a place of eternal punishment) is actually quite new in relation to the nearly 2K years that Christianity has existed.

Uh, no it wasn't. Zoroaster invented it, before Christianity even existed. Christianity basically borrowed ideas from all the other religions of the time (since it's totally man-made), and the concept of heaven/hell for good/bad people was lifted straight of of Zorastrian beliefs.

Kevin · Aug 24, 2006, 08:53 PM

Originally Posted by Landos Mustache

Fine but I don' think anyone cares about that. If you want to go to church and be a liar, cheat, wear bunny ears whatever that is your choice.

Wooah where did that come from? I read his post and he mentioned non of these.

The problem starts when these people walk out of Church and apply their beliefs to others

Like you do in here all the time? Is it ok for you to but not Christians? Practice what you preach.

and force the government to follow their views.

Simply does not happen. If your rant was just, you'd not have to revert to dishonesty.

Originally Posted by olePigeon

Christianity has laws you have to follow, otherwise you go to Hell. Sure, Hell isn't exactly a gun, but I'd imagine it's a might worse.

My point is, I don't know any Christians that follow those laws because they are afraid of going to hell.

Fear has nothing to do with it.

Originally Posted by Dino-Rider

Actually there is one. According to your OWN BELIEFS, if you are a bad person, if you don't accept Christ as your savior, etc, you are going to hell. For all eternity. That's a pretty big threat, if you believe in that bullshit.

Read above.

Kevin · Aug 24, 2006, 08:56 PM

Originally Posted by Dino-Rider

Uh, no it wasn't. Zoroaster invented it, before Christianity even existed. Christianity basically borrowed ideas from all the other religions of the time (since it's totally man-made), and the concept of heaven/hell for good/bad people was lifted straight of of Zorastrian beliefs.

The Zoroaster silliness has been debunked long ago. You were involved in the thread. Stop acting like you don't know better.

Dino-Rider · Aug 24, 2006, 09:34 PM

It wasn't debunked at all. It says that Zoroaster had the ideas long before Christianity did in my freaking history textbooks. It also says that Christianity adopted these ideas along with ideas from other religions. But hey, I can see why you wouldn't want to believe it. Science, evidence, and history are the sworn enemies of the ignorance the church provides.

Kevin · Aug 24, 2006, 10:00 PM

Originally Posted by Dino-Rider

It wasn't debunked at all. It says that Zoroaster had the ideas long before Christianity did in my freaking history textbooks. It also says that Christianity adopted these ideas along with ideas from other religions. But hey, I can see why you wouldn't want to believe it. Science, evidence, and history are the sworn enemies of the ignorance the church provides.

No it was. It said Zeroaster had ideas SIMILAR to that of Christians. Christianity is based on a belief that can't be dated. So to say Zeroaster's belief came before this is dishonest.

Remember? We went over this.

For some reason I knew I would have to go over it again. Probably wont be the last time either.

BTW Rob, you are still banned.

Dino-Rider · Aug 24, 2006, 10:16 PM

Originally Posted by Kevin

No it was. It said Zeroaster had ideas SIMILAR to that of Christians. Christianity is based on a belief that can't be dated. So to say Zeroaster's belief came before this is dishonest.

Remember? We went over this.

For some reason I knew I would have to go over it again. Probably wont be the last time either.

BTW Rob, you are still banned.

Um, no, you're wrong. Sorry Kevin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroaster

Zoroaster predated Christainity by an extremely long time. To fathom that whoever the people who 'invented' Christainity came up with identical ideas is just silly.

Kevin · Aug 24, 2006, 10:26 PM

Originally Posted by Dino-Rider

Um, no, you're wrong. Sorry Kevin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroaster

Zoroaster predated Christainity by an extremely long time. To fathom that whoever the people who 'invented' Christainity came up with identical ideas is just silly.

You aren't listening to me Rob.

I never said Zoro didn't predate Christianity. I said Christian's beliefs, it's religion is based on something that hasn't ever been dated. And probably never will.

In other words, Christianity is new, But it's base faith is not. There was believers of the God of Abraham waaaaaay before Christ entered the picture. Before Abraham himself even.

Do you understand what I am saying?

No wonder you didn't think your Zoro rant didn't get debunked. You simply didn't understand the debunker.

smacintush · Aug 25, 2006, 07:38 AM

Originally Posted by Kevin

No wonder you didn't think your Zoro rant didn't get debunked. You simply didn't understand the debunker.

You should know better, everything he reads and posts is filtered through his huge-mongous ego.

Dino-Rider · Aug 25, 2006, 07:53 AM

Dude... google "christianity age". Tell me your results. >rolls eyes<

Kevin · Aug 25, 2006, 06:14 PM

Originally Posted by Dino-Rider

Dude... google "christianity age". Tell me your results. >rolls eyes<

Did you not read ANYTHING I said?

In this matter Christianity's age is irrelevant. Why?

Because the belief of said God can not be dated.

Understand?

We don't know when said belief was started to make a measurement as to who was first.

You for some reason keep avoiding this simple fact.

Why you want to self-delude Rob is beyond me. It doesn't sound like you are wanting the TRUTH. You just want something that supports your narrow version of the "facts" regardless of the truth.

That isn't very honest. And it's just lying to yourself.

And jeesh, 164 posts before anyone could get around to banning him?