[marden]

It Isn't Separate Little Wars But Many Different Fronts In The SAME War

Some of you seem to think of the war in Afghanistan and the war in Iraq and the war in Israel and the war in Chechnya and the war in the Philippines and the war in India and the war in Indonesia as separate little wars.

There is only one war.

The war to prevent Islamic conquest of the entire world, an inch at a time, a nation at a time, one law at a time.

[Pendergast]

Originally Posted by marden 

It Isn't Separate Little Wars But Many Different Fronts In The SAME War

Some of you seem to think of the war in Afghanistan and the war in Iraq and the war in Israel and the war in Chechnya and the war in the Philippines and the war in India and the war in Indonesia as separate little wars.

There is only one war.

The war to prevent Islamic conquest of the entire world, an inch at a time, a nation at a time, one law at a time.

It certainly is the fairy tale repeated ad nauseam by you, the underground propaganda repeater.

Now that I am at it, how do you explain the affiliation of a certain number of fascist/totalitarian governments with the U.S., the so-called ultimate democracy?

As usual, the friends of yesterday are now the enemy of today.

It was not so long ago that Talibans were "moral equivalent to America's forefathers"...

Azerbaidjan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan are totalitarian governments enjoying the public support of Washington, while entertaining ongoing dictatorships on their constituents.

Khadafi just celebrated 37 years in power, the great majority of those years fomenting acts of terrorism against the West. He just called for the murder of his opponents in his own country to mark his anniversary in power, without any comments from the media (except in Algeria, where reporters lost their jobs for it. But then, he allows all criticisms over Islam, so I guess he is a friend now too...

This hypocrisy works only for the gullible. U.S. foreign policy is synonymous to chaos creation.

[marden]

Originally Posted by Pendergast 

It certainly is the fairy tale repeated ad nauseam by you, the underground propaganda repeater.

Now that I am at it, how do you explain the affiliation of a certain number of fascist/totalitarian governments with the U.S., the so-called ultimate democracy?

As usual, the friends of yesterday are now the enemy of today.

It was not so long ago that Talibans were "moral equivalent to America's forefathers"...

Azerbaidjan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan are totalitarian governments enjoying the public support of Washington, while entertaining ongoing dictatorships on their constituents.

Khadafi just celebrated 37 years in power, the great majority of those years fomenting acts of terrorism against the West. He just called for the murder of his opponents in his own country to mark his anniversary in power, without any comments from the media (except in Algeria, where reporters lost their jobs for it. But then, he allows all criticisms over Islam, so I guess he is a friend now too...

This hypocrisy works only for the gullible. U.S. foreign policy is synonymous to chaos creation.

Your post highlights the advantage/disadvantage of our system over yours.

The USA may make mistakes but corrects them over time.

Islam remains constant over years, decades, centuries.

And notice I refer to the USA versus Islam, not any one country.

That illustrates my point. We aren't fighting many wars but one war with many fronts.

Iraq is but one.

[Pendergast]

Originally Posted by marden 

Your post highlights the advantage/disadvantage of our system over yours.

The USA may make mistakes but corrects them over time.

Islam remains constant over years, decades, centuries.

And notice I refer to the USA versus Islam, not any one country.

That illustrates my point. We aren't fighting many wars but one war with many fronts.

Iraq is but one.

The USA makes mistakes? I think not; unilateral jacksonianism it is. Create havoc and maintain a minimum of disorder favors the sales of weapons abroad, and creates ties that bind economically, benefiting minorities.

You are quite wrong; there is no mistake here that does not represent a profit; the apparent paradoxical foreign policies of the US appears schizophrenic to the outsider (or those with short term memories) but in the end, there is always benefit in cashflow.

The war in Iraq is only one more smokescreen of which the so-called freedom and democracy are only the cheap wrapper.

Islam is far from being that monolith of belief you paint it. But how convenient it gets when it drives an economy is the eluded point, is it not?

But you can keep on oversimplifying.

[marden]

Originally Posted by Pendergast 

The USA makes mistakes? I think not; unilateral jacksonianism it is. Create havoc and maintain a minimum of disorder favors the sales of weapons abroad, and creates ties that bind economically, benefiting minorities.

You are quite wrong; there is no mistake here that does not represent a profit; the apparent paradoxical foreign policies of the US appears schizophrenic to the outsider (or those with short term memories) but in the end, there is always benefit in cashflow.

The war in Iraq is only one more smokescreen of which the so-called freedom and democracy are only the cheap wrapper.

Islam is far from being that monolith of belief you paint it. But how convenient it gets when it drives an economy is the eluded point, is it not?

But you can keep on oversimplifying.

Ok.

100,000,000+ Islamic extremists around the world are making moves to take over the world and eliminate democracy and many of us refuse to recognize it.

[SpaceMonkey]

That you threw Chechnya in there proves that you have no clue what you're talking about.

At least read Wikipedia or something.

[vmarks]

Hi. The Chechnyan assault on the school in Beslan was terrorism committed by Muslims who were on the phone to Arabic-speaking men during the siege.

Beslan school hostage crisis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

Hi. The Chechnyan assault on the school in Beslan was terrorism committed by Muslims who were on the phone to Arabic-speaking men during the siege.

Beslan school hostage crisis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The motives of one single actor in a war do not necessarily mean that that is what the war is "about."

Wahabbist terrorist also involved themselves in the wars in the aftermath of the break-up of Yugoslavia, but I wouldn't characterize those wars as being "about" an attempt at Islamicist domination. Actually, the Bosnian Muslims got sick of them pretty quickly.

[marden]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey 

The motives of one single actor in a war do not necessarily mean that that is what the war is "about."

Wahabbist terrorist also involved themselves in the wars in the aftermath of the break-up of Yugoslavia, but I wouldn't characterize those wars as being "about" an attempt at Islamicist domination. Actually, the Bosnian Muslims got sick of them pretty quickly.

One war.

Those of us in the “Obsession” premiere audience who watched it were impressed with the editing, continuity and interleaving of archival footage in ‘both black and white and color” as Steve Emerson said in his post viewing remarks and the comments of the talking heads-several of my friends among them. The film dramatically opens up against the stylized format of a world map and begins a globe girdling radical terrorist attacks sequence beginning with a certain Tuesday in New York on 9/11 that I and many others witnessed first hand with the aerial fire bombing destruction of the now mythic twin towers of the World Trade center to Wednesday March 4th, 2004 and the slaughter of the commuters on those trains pouring into Madrid to those London underground and surface bus bombing on a Thursday in July, 7th, 2005 in London and then clips from other atrocities in Europe, Turkey, Beslan in Russia, Africa, Israel, Iraq, Thailand, Indonesia and the Philippines. While jarring these initial film clips effectively teed up what followed next in sequence: the excerpts of sermons by Islamic clerics and commentators in Egypt, Palestine, Lebanon, Iran, Iraq and the UK.

Here's the first few minutes of it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vypKSWHlnKA

Pay particular attention to the 5:00 mark.

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by marden 

One war.



Here's the first few minutes of it.
YouTube - Obsession: Radical Islam's War Against the West

Pay particular attention to the 5:00 mark.

Okay so what's that got to do with the actual motives for the Chechan wars?

You realize that by lumping these bit players into one grand jihad against the West that you're actually empowering them, right?

[marden]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey 

Okay so what's that got to do with the actual motives for the Chechan wars?

You realize that by lumping these bit players into one grand jihad against the West that you're actually empowering them, right?

There are no jihadists here. This is just us USA lovers. We need to recognize the truth.

[analogika]

You forgot to mention the RAF, ETA, and the IRA. Given a little googling and a four-page cut-and-paste orgy, I'm sure you could construe the necessary missing link.

After all: terrorists, right?

[marden]

Originally Posted by analogika 

You forgot to mention the RAF, ETA, and the IRA. Given a little googling and a four-page cut-and-paste orgy, I'm sure you could construe the necessary missing link.

After all: terrorists, right?

I have no other motive than to warn those who have an interest in preserving this country and democracy and Western civilization that there is a concerted danger afoot around the world to that which we hold dear.

The RAF saved Britain in WWII.

The ETA is when someone will arrive at their destination.

An IRA is what you contribute to so that one day when you retire you will be able to afford the regular Apple obligatory upgrades.

Jihad wants to bring an end to Democracy and our way of life as we have come to appreciate it.

[christ]

Originally Posted by marden 

I have no other motive than to warn those who have an interest in preserving this country and democracy and Western civilization that there is a concerted danger afoot around the world to that which we hold dear.

The RAF saved Britain in WWII.

The ETA is when someone will arrive at their destination.

An IRA is what you contribute to so that one day when you retire you will be able to afford the regular Apple obligatory upgrades.

Jihad wants to bring an end to Democracy and our way of life as we have come to appreciate it.

Such gifted rhetoric is unanswerable.

[OreoCookie]

Originally Posted by marden 

The RAF saved Britain in WWII.

That one actually made me laugh
(Try to do another search on this acronym … )

[Troll]

Originally Posted by marden 

100,000,000+ Islamic extremists ...

Where the hell did you get that number from?

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by marden 

Jihad wants to bring an end to Democracy and our way of life as we have come to appreciate it.

You are speaking to those in denial about this. Those that just want to blame Bush and the US for these actions.

I HOPE a lefty gets into office this next presidential term. That way the lefties wont have Bush to blame.

Wait, mark that. I think we all know that if America gets attacked during this time, Bush will still be blamed.

I wonder if Carter blamed Bush when the hijackings started....

[Troll]

Any two things appear linked if you step far away enough. From Mars, everything on this planet looks like one thing. I don't think anyone can doubt that you can make us look at these different conflicts that you mention in a way that suggests that they are linked. I mean, at a basic level, they all fit under the moniker of terrorism.

The question really is whether it is helpful to link these things. I think that even you will agree that the problems in Afghanistan and Chechnya (for example) have different roots, that the US and other countries have different plans for the future of these nations (to the extent that Chechnya is a nation) and that different tools need to be applied to deal with each. Dealing with these things efficiently therefore means dealing with them separately. Which raises the question as to why anyone would want to see them as part of a single conflict.

What I see is a right wing that is trying to divert a debate about the logic behind their policies by constantly overstating the threat that terrorism poses and trying to make people scared. And Mojaberdeen apparently considers it his duty on MacNN to be part of that overstatement. It's starting to backfire for a number of reasons not the least being that even if we believe in this massive terrorist threat, it's patent that the invasion of Iraq made the threat worse - i.e. even if we sign up to your fear-mongering, Marden, the logical consequence is not that we would trust Bush to protect us.

[Powerbook]

Originally Posted by marden 

One war.

One war to rule them all. One war to find them...

[Pendergast]

Originally Posted by marden 

Ok.

100,000,000+ Islamic extremists around the world are making moves to take over the world and eliminate democracy and many of us refuse to recognize it.

Oversimplifying, overgeneralising, mischaracterisation, acute paranoia and ongoing disinformation.

You and vmarks make a nice team; both of you bring about the worst argumentations possble and submit yourself to dramatic discredit.

Keep it up; the Republican Party has a job for you in the highest spheres of power!

[Pendergast]

Originally Posted by Kevin 

You are speaking to those in denial about this. Those that just want to blame Bush and the US for these actions.

I HOPE a lefty gets into office this next presidential term. That way the lefties wont have Bush to blame.

Wait, mark that. I think we all know that if America gets attacked during this time, Bush will still be blamed.

I wonder if Carter blamed Bush when the hijackings started....

You are one amazing case: You among many have been rambling about how America is now so much more "secure".

As a matter of fact, the Democrats will NOT do better, because the usual foreign policies of America are party-blind. Only the wrapper will be different.

As for denial Kevin, you are pretty much made of teflon.

[Rumor]

Originally Posted by marden 

An IRA is what you contribute to so that one day when you retire you will be able to afford the regular Apple obligatory upgrades.

That made laugh pretty good.

[marden]

Originally Posted by Rumor 

That made laugh pretty good.

For those who laughed at the punch lines you all should give credit where it's due. Analogika's set ups were indispensable. Without them there was no possible jokes.

Analogika, you're a great great straight man.

To those who think he posted them accidentally, that perception is due to his genius of imagination, conception and execution.

[Volanges]

They're all Muslims -- therefore it must ALL be the same war! Brilliant lack of reasoning there. Either that or blatant racism, I'm not sure.

[dcmacdaddy]

Why don't we do to the Muslims what they plan to do to us? We should invade and forcibly convert (to Christianity) every majority-Muslim country. Those that refuse to convert should be killed.

That would settle the question of religious superiority once and for all. It would be a grand mal battle of religions. Each side tries to convert as many of the other side as possible--The Jews don't count; Everone knows both Christians and Muslims want them all dead--and whichever side is left with the most adherents wins the battle.

Sounds like a good plan to me. I am going to give myself a this time.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by Pendergast 

It certainly is the fairy tale repeated ad nauseam by you, the underground propaganda repeater.

And repeated by me, and most intelligent folks I associate with. As being obvious for many years now. Since 1979 at least, but really since about '73 or so. Most of us who were around back then saw it coming.

Denial only works for so long, you know.

It's not about racism, or genocide, unless you want to include the elimination of Israel and death to non-believers.

[marden]

Originally Posted by Volanges 

They're all Muslims -- therefore it must ALL be the same war! Brilliant lack of reasoning there. Either that or blatant racism, I'm not sure.

Excuse me but this is not the feigned outrage thread. Everyone knows that the proof is there. It takes no reasoning and it isn't racism. (Besides, Islam is not a race.)

We all know you are wearing a toupee. Don't bother denying it.

[marden]

Originally Posted by dcmacdaddy 

Why don't we do to the Muslims what they plan to do to us? We should invade and forcibly convert (to Christianity) every majority-Muslim country. Those that refuse to convert should be killed.

That would settle the question of religious superiority once and for all. It would be a grand mal battle of religions. Each side tries to convert as many of the other side as possible--The Jews don't count; Everone knows both Christians and Muslims want them all dead--and whichever side is left with the most adherents wins the battle.

Sounds like a good plan to me. I am going to give myself a this time.

Yours is EXACTLY their plan.

First, kill all the Jews. (dc-anti-semite-daddy?)

Then, a war to end all wars.

This is one reason why George W. Bush has been such a great President. He prevented this from happening long enough for the American people to recognize the truth and he has kept America so safe that many of us think there is no threat to us.

And the innocent Muslims have been protected from wide scale attacks.

[invisibleX]

Originally Posted by marden 

It Isn't Separate Little Wars But Many Different Fronts In The SAME War

Some of you seem to think of the war in Afghanistan and the war in Iraq and the war in Israel and the war in Chechnya and the war in the Philippines and the war in India and the war in Indonesia as separate little wars.

There is only one war.

The war to prevent Islamic conquest of the entire world, an inch at a time, a nation at a time, one law at a time.

So to prevent Islamic conquest we're conquering the world one bite at a time. How noble of us.

Isn't that the great thing about terrorists though? They have very little physical impact but a huge psychological one. A tiny group of people blowing up a couple buildings becomes something so much more. I don't mean to belittle the loss of life but if we're talking an actual war the psychological impact was dwarfed real damage

Marden, I don't know what you think we're fighting or why but multiple fronts a single war does not make. Why you ask? Because the enemy is not united in their goals. Unless you are talking about it conquering the world as a religion, in which case we have no business preventing that.

Its easy to find people supporting a religious leader and lord knows there are enough extremists out there but we're the ones who painted a target on our asses and decided to play war in their back yard. Now those are the kind of actions that will motivate the average joe. If we are in fact interested in democratizing the ME than we better start winning the hearts and minds of those muslims.

So here we have it: a small group of radicals set in motion a reaction that in turn creates more hostility towards the US. Fear is an effective weapon to force your enemy to play to your tune, and isn't that what terrorism is doing a fantastic job of doing? It is almost poetic in its simplicity and genius. You will point at enemies on every front except the one that gets hit the hardest.

PS: If its not written in your own hand, I don't want to read it. I can use Google too, thanks.

[marden]

Originally Posted by finboy 

And repeated by me, and most intelligent folks I associate with. As being obvious for many years now. Since 1979 at least, but really since about '73 or so. Most of us who were around back then saw it coming.

Denial only works for so long, you know.

It's not about racism, or genocide, unless you want to include the elimination of Israel and death to non-believers.

Great post! Thanks, finboy!

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by marden 

And notice I refer to the USA versus Islam, not any one country.

I thought it was terrorism, not Islam? I wouldn't expect you to make any distinction, though.

How's the sand?

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by dcmacdaddy 

Why don't we do to the Muslims what they plan to do to us? We should invade and forcibly convert (to Christianity) every majority-Muslim country. Those that refuse to convert should be killed.

You tried that once. It was called The Crusades.

[invisibleX]

Originally Posted by Kevin 

You are speaking to those in denial about this. Those that just want to blame Bush and the US for these actions.

I HOPE a lefty gets into office this next presidential term. That way the lefties wont have Bush to blame.

Wait, mark that. I think we all know that if America gets attacked during this time, Bush will still be blamed.

I wonder if Carter blamed Bush when the hijackings started....

Tell me, do you vomit a little in your mouth when you agree with marden? Because I notice you don't actually say you agree with what he says but that you disagree with other people's political view-points.

Arguing politics is fine and dandy but marden's theories are a tad... insane, don't you think?

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by Kevin 

You are speaking to those in denial about this. Those that just want to blame Bush and the US for these actions.

I HOPE a lefty gets into office this next presidential term. That way the lefties wont have Bush to blame.

Wait, mark that. I think we all know that if America gets attacked during this time, Bush will still be blamed.

I wonder if Carter blamed Bush when the hijackings started....

Do you believe that "100,000,000+ Islamic extremists around the world are making moves to take over the world and eliminate democracy"?

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by marden 

Ok.

100,000,000+ Islamic extremists around the world are making moves to take over the world and eliminate democracy and many of us refuse to recognize it.

Is anyone who chooses to follow Islam the enemy?

[marden]

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

So to prevent Islamic conquest we're conquering the world one bite at a time. How noble of us.

You consume too much propaganda. We are opposing radical Islamic aggression. You seem to be apologizing for it.

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

Isn't that the great thing about terrorists though? They have very little physical impact but a huge psychological one. A tiny group of people blowing up a couple buildings becomes something so much more. I don't mean to belittle the loss of life but if we're talking an actual war the psychological impact was dwarfed real damage

Marden, I don't know what you think we're fighting or why...

And people say I should stop saying the same things because they think everyone already knows the truth. Here's proof that's not the case.

We are fighting to prevent the free world and the rest of the earth from being conquered & dominated by Islamic radicals, according to the instructions in the Islamic Holy Texts.

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

but multiple fronts a single war does not make. Why you ask? Because the enemy is not united in their goals. Unless you are talking about it conquering the world as a religion, in which case we have no business preventing that.

See what I mean, dear readers? InvisibleX thinks we have no business preventing radical Islam taking over the Earth.

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

Its easy to find people supporting a religious leader and lord knows there are enough extremists out there but we're the ones who painted a target on our asses and decided to play war in their back yard.

I'll spare us all the list of unprovoked attacks on America and American interests even while Clinton was following your advice. So, that puts an end to that line of thought.

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

Now those are the kind of actions that will motivate the average joe. If we are in fact interested in democratizing the ME than we better start winning the hearts and minds of those muslims.

That's one way.

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

So here we have it: a small group of radicals set in motion a reaction that in turn creates more hostility towards the US. Fear is an effective weapon to force your enemy to play to your tune, and isn't that what terrorism is doing a fantastic job of doing? It is almost poetic in its simplicity and genius. You will point at enemies on every front except the one that gets hit the hardest.

PS: If its not written in your own hand, I don't want to read it. I can use Google too, thanks.

There are countless examples of radical Islamic violence around the world that have nothing to do with America or Iraq but everything to do with a concerted campaign to conquer the world for Allah and using any and every way or means possible to do so.

In fact, I suspect you are practicing a form of jihad right now.

[marden]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

Is anyone who chooses to follow Islam the enemy?

Nope. If they choose to act on the instruction to conquer the world and kill the unbelievers for Allah, then they are the enemy.

Remember, OBL declared war on America in 1998 and he said he was following the wishes of the Prophet and/or Allah.

[marden]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

Do you believe that "100,000,000+ Islamic extremists around the world are making moves to take over the world and eliminate democracy"?

Many of them are merely shouting, "death to America" after Friday prayers in thousands of places around the world. So, on a practical basis they aren't making moves but they would if it were easier or there was more impetus.

[marden]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

I thought it was terrorism, not Islam? I wouldn't expect you to make any distinction, though.

How's the sand?

There's Islam and it's texts say what they say.

Then there are the followers of Islam or believers who are called Muslims or Islamic.

Then, as far as this little situation is concerned, there are those believers who take the whole writings in those texts as their personal instructions to conquer, kill and dominate (using terrorism or other means of jihad), and there are those who don't.

It's simple, really.

[Troll]

Originally Posted by marden 

Many of them are merely shouting, "death to America" after Friday prayers in thousands of places around the world. So, on a practical basis they aren't making moves but they would if it were easier or there was more impetus.

So you admit that you pulled your 100,000,000 figure out of your anus then. Great, let's move on. Let's assume you are right that Islamic fundamentalism is a major threat and that there is a concerted effort by groups as diverse as Chechens and Thais to take over the world. To sane people this is quite a stretch, but for the sake of argument and humouring you, we'll assume it.

You still have to persuade us that George Bush and his neocon-dominated Republican party knows how to deal with that threat. Iraq has gone from a secular state to an Islamic state. If you don't believe me, read their Constitution. It has gone from a country controlled by a secular dictator to one ruled by religious leaders. It has become a training ground for terrorists which it never was before (the best you can say is that previously in Kurdish/American controlled territory there was some terrorist training going on), it has become a place where Americans are killed in greater numbers than anywhere else in the world. It has gone from being Iran's greatest enemy to being a sphere of Iranian influence. The Administration has turned 180 degrees on almost every plan that was hatched for Iraq. So, even if everyone had your cooked view of the way the world works, there is absolutely no rational reason to believe that George Bush and his cronies have any idea how to sort the problem out.

As for your "dear readers" comment, do you now admit that you're the same person that posted under the Aberdeenwriter login?

[analogika]

He *CAN'T* be.

He'd be a liar if he were!

[christ]

Originally Posted by marden 

...This is one reason why George W. Bush has been such a great President. He prevented this from happening long enough for the American people to recognize the truth and he has kept America so safe that many of us think there is no threat to us.

And the innocent Muslims have been protected from wide scale attacks.

I lolled.

[Taliesin]

Palestine/Israel, Chechnya/Russia, Pakistan/India...

are all different conflicts with different roots, history and solutions. They are legitimate conflicts, that have developed in the process of crumbling empires, ie. the ottoman empire, the british empire and the Soviet-empire.

Islamistic terrorists and guerillia-fighters feel magically attracted to such genuine conflicts, where one party of the conflict are muslims, they travel there, offer their assistance, their ideology and their support... and therefore intensify the conflicts.

That's why people like marden think they are one big war.

Taliesin

[Troll]

Originally Posted by analogika 

He *CAN'T* be.

He'd be a liar if he were!

You stole my thunder!

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by Kevin 

I HOPE a lefty gets into office this next presidential term. That way the lefties wont have Bush to blame.

Not necessarily. Clinton has been out of office for over 6 years, and the "righties" are still able to blame him him for everything without any difficulty. I doubt the "lefties" with a "lefty" president will have any trouble blaming Bush.

[invisibleX]

You consume too much propaganda. We are opposing radical Islamic aggression. You seem to be apologizing for it.

I was simply commenting on your statement. That is what we're doing right? We attacked those countries to root out the terrorists, no? We're planting new governments, right? This is what we call conquering.

And people say I should stop saying the same things because they think everyone already knows the truth. Here's proof that's not the case.

You believe your own words. How cute.

We are fighting to prevent the free world and the rest of the earth from being conquered & dominated by Islamic radicals, according to the instructions in the Islamic Holy Texts.

See here is where I take issue. They haven't actually DONE what we're preventing them from doing. They haven't even tried. Furthermore radicals will NEVER conquer anything unless they hold popular opinion, something we are so kindly providing them. Did Osama try to conquer us? Was hussein planning massive world domination? I have no doubt there are extremists who would like to take back whats theirs and Israel is the prime example. Until you can quote the Quran saying this and correctly interpret it, I'm not buying it. Misinterpretations do not count.

See what I mean, dear readers? InvisibleX thinks we have no business preventing radical Islam taking over the Earth.

How exactly do you prevent someone from doing something they aren't doing? Do not presume to tell me what I think.

I'll spare us all the list of unprovoked attacks on America and American interests even while Clinton was following your advice. So, that puts an end to that line of thought.

Terrorist attacks. Can you even comprehend what this means?

There are countless examples of radical Islamic violence around the world that have nothing to do with America or Iraq but everything to do with a concerted campaign to conquer the world for Allah and using any and every way or means possible to do so.

In fact, I suspect you are practicing a form of jihad right now.

Really? Thats incredible. Step 1: Misinterpret Quran. Step 2: Assume everyone else is following your interpretation. Step 3: Realize that by your own admission, America is screwed. My proof? I don't really need any. Terrorism by definition is about as effective a method of conquest as writing a really nasty letter. It does however create fear. Good thing they were so kind as to reveal their plans though.

And you are performing a form of ignorance.

I'm going to do something very kind because I, unlike yourself, am willing to listen to another's ideas. How exactly is this conquest happening? How can a handful of radicals do.. anything? I don't want to hear political bullshit, I want the facts. How does blowing yourself up further these goals? How can this coalition of radicals conquer anything when they've failed to do anything meaningful to Israel, which is without doubt what they want the most?

Here is the bottom line: If there is actually a threat you will be able to present these things:
1) Proof of coordination between different extremist groups. Not agreement or association, clear cut coordination.
2) A rough method by which it could take place. Don't need specifics (for all those MacNN terrist lurkers) but we do need a viable strategy since its rather far fetched to begin with.
3) Proof that the enemy has the capability. I could say I'm going to conquer Japan but it doesn't mean I can. What radicals would need is support of their general populace AND support here at home. Again, I don't want more bullshit, I want hard evidence that muslims support the leaders of this conquest.
4) Direct quotes from a holy text that support the views of these leaders. Not third party, not commented, not poorly translated or interpreted. Actual quotes.

Look at it this way: I'm giving you a fair shot at convincing me and anyone else here with half a brain of your view. Being condescending, insulting, and generally a dick hasn't won you too many supporters, give my way a shot.

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by marden 

There's Islam and it's texts say what they say.

Then there are the followers of Islam or believers who are called Muslims or Islamic.

Then, as far as this little situation is concerned, there are those believers who take the whole writings in those texts as their personal instructions to conquer, kill and dominate (using terrorism or other means of jihad), and there are those who don't.

It's simple, really.

The Bible has equally stupid rules regarding killing people and spreading Christianity.

We had Presidents who supported (and some who seem to still support) Manifest Destiny.

That sand must taste great becuase you keep sticking your head in it.

[ink]

Originally Posted by marden 

Neo-Conservatives prey on the unfounded and largely imaginary fear that 100,000,000+ Islamic extremists are making moves to take over the world and eliminate democracy. Many of us see through their political tactics.

Fixed.

Just because Osama Bin Laden says something, doesn't make it true.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey 

You realize that by lumping these bit players into one grand jihad against the West that you're actually empowering them, right?

I suspect he's counting on it. By empowering them he empowers those who claim to oppose them. It's a tried-and-true political strategy: convince people that a threat exists where none does, and convince those people that you (or those you support) are their only salvation from that threat.

Win-win; you get sign-off to do almost whatever you please, and you don't have to worry about any real threats (other than your people realizing they've been duped)

[ink]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

I suspect he's counting on it. By empowering them he empowers those who claim to oppose them. It's a tried-and-true political strategy: convince people that a threat exists where none does, and convince those people that you (or those you support) are their only salvation from that threat.

Win-win; you get sign-off to do almost whatever you please, and you don't have to worry about any real threats (other than your people realizing they've been duped)

And, to wit, it's the same tactic Ahmadinejad and his ilk use on their population: "The evil West.. it's soo scary! They'll legalize divorce! People will download porn! Women will walk around outside of our control! People will have RIGHTS, can you belive it?!?!?"

Which leads to a bunch of irony wrt The Patriot Act and the Military Rights act...