[Orion27]

This is what the left thinks of democracy. This is European socialism in a nutshell. This is the nihilist artifact. This is not about liberty, personal freedom or personal responsibility. This is totalitarism at its root. This is the European Union? This is about anarchy in the streets. This is the liberal socialist way of doing business.
Socialists Urge End to Riots in France

[osiris]

dude, take a vacation. you need it.

[BRussell]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

Socialists Urge End to Riots in France

The "liberal socialist agenda" is to end riots?

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by BRussell 

The "liberal socialist agenda" is to end riots?

No, it's to make sure "conservative neo nazis" fail at reading comprehension. Duh.

[hyteckit]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

This is what the left thinks of democracy. This is European socialism in a nutshell. This is the nihilist artifact. This is not about liberty, personal freedom or personal responsibility. This is totalitarism at its root. This is the European Union? This is about anarchy in the streets. This is the liberal socialist way of doing business.
Socialists Urge End to Riots in France

So which one is it? "Totalitarism" or "anarchy"? Aren't those on opposite ends of the spectrum?

[Dakarʒ]

Well this is classic.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by Dakarʒ 

Well this is classic.

Agreed.

Classic, bordering on the truly bizarre.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

what the left thinks of democracy [...] is socialism [...] is the nihilist artifact. [...] is totalitarism at its root [...] is about anarchy

Okay, so it is embarrassingly obvious that you have not the single slightest clue what ANY of those terms mean.

That is embarrassing, but it can be cured by a simple dictionary, or - preferably - an encyclopedia.

However, topping it off with an article link where even the title itself ("Socialists Urge End to Riots in France", considerately auto-inserted into your post by the BB software) says the COMPLETE opposite of what you were trying so pathetically to rant about is just, well, ... amazingly disjointed perception.

You don't read well at all, do you?

[Orion27]

Sure, the socialists call for an end to thee riots after predicting violence for weeks if Sarkozy were elected. Cover your ass my friends with all the spin you have.

[goMac]

Harold Crick: Miss Pascal, what you're describing is anarchy. Are you an anarchist?
Ana Pascal: You mean, am I a member of...
Harold Crick: An anarchist group, yes.
Ana Pascal: Anarchists have a group?
Harold Crick: I believe so, sure.
Ana Pascal: They assemble?
Harold Crick: I don't know.
Ana Pascal: Wouldn't that completely defeat the purpose?

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by analogika 

Okay, so it is embarrassingly obvious that you have not the single slightest clue what ANY of those terms mean.

That is embarrassing, but it can be cured by a simple dictionary, or - preferably - an encyclopedia.

However, topping it off with an article link where even the title itself ("Socialists Urge End to Riots in France", considerately auto-inserted into your post by the BB software) says the COMPLETE opposite of what you were trying so pathetically to rant about is just, well, ... amazingly disjointed perception.

You don't read well at all, do you?

So this is a relgious outburst? Rooted in fundamentalist Islam? A leftist political outburst born on the faliure of French socialism? Or simple insurrection, disorder, chaos, mayhem, tumult, turmoil for the fun of it?

[subego]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

This is what the left thinks of democracy. This is European socialism in a nutshell. This is the nihilist artifact. This is not about liberty, personal freedom or personal responsibility. This is totalitarism at its root. This is the European Union? This is about anarchy in the streets. This is the liberal socialist way of doing business.
Socialists Urge End to Riots in France

Do you intend to persuade people with your posts here? I'm genuinely curious.

For instance, I think you have a really good point here, but I don't know how you expect people to get that point the way you expressed it.

Why do you piss on your audience?

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by subego 

Do you intend to persuade people with your posts here? I'm genuinely curious.

For instance, I think you have a really good point here, but I don't know how you expect people to get that point the way you expressed it.

Why do you piss on your audience?

I'm pissing on my audience? Have you read the above posts? Not one acknowledgement there was even an issue, predicted and incited by the left, nor the usual inane explanations to justify it. This is what the left does. Incite and then fall silent, feign innocence and use personal attacks as an diversion.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

This is what the left does. Incite and then fall silent, feign innocence and use personal attacks as an diversion.

Your argument is so absurd, there is no possible dignified response to give to it.

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Your argument is so absurd, there is no possible dignified response to give to it.

Not an argument, just an observation. The truth is there for all to see. You saw it in LA on May 1st as well.

[subego]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

I'm pissing on my audience? Have you read the above posts?

All of them, yours too.

Your opening gambit was to call European Socialism a nihilist artifact. That's just going to tick people off.

Do you think European Socialists see themselves as nihilists?

Make your point without the editorial, let the socialists decide for themselves.

If you don't think this is possible for them to do that, you state your opinion of your audience in no uncertain terms: you lack respect for them.

If that's how you feel, fine. But it is the height of hypocrisy lack respect for your audience and then bitch about how they don't respect you.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

Not an argument, just an observation. The truth is there for all to see. You saw it in LA on May 1st as well.

I don't recall violence when Bush got elected, either time.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

Sure, the socialists call for an end to thee riots after predicting violence for weeks if Sarkozy were elected. Cover your ass my friends with all the spin you have.

There is quite a fundamental difference between *predicting* violence and *calling for* violence, n'est pas?

There were severe riots last year. Sarkozy poured oil onto the fire with his comments. It did not take any brains whatsoever to figure that there would be violence if he got elected.

In fact, I'm pretty certain that Sarkozy himself would have predicted violence in the event of his election, had anybody bothered to ask him. I don't think he's on record as having said so, because nobody bothered asking such a no-brainer.

I'd expect the rioters to have voted for Royal, for sure, but that doesn't really have much to do with her representing their views...

[analogika]

Originally Posted by subego 

All of them, yours too.

Your opening gambit was to call European Socialism a nihilist artifact. That's just going to tick people off.

Actually, he called European Socialism an anarchic, totalitarian nihilist artifact.

That's just...it's not even funny. Just embarrassing.

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by analogika 

There is quite a fundamental difference between *predicting* violence and *calling for* violence, n'est pas?

There were severe riots last year. Sarkozy poured oil onto the fire with his comments. It did not take any brains whatsoever to figure that there would be violence if he got elected.

In fact, I'm pretty certain that Sarkozy himself would have predicted violence in the event of his election, had anybody bothered to ask him. I don't think he's on record as having said so, because nobody bothered asking such a no-brainer.

I'd expect the rioters to have voted for Royal, for sure, but that doesn't really have much to do with her representing their views...

Maybe you could help educate me as to why predictable violence was a no brainer.

[Helmling]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

I'm pissing on my audience? Have you read the above posts? Not one acknowledgement there was even an issue, predicted and incited by the left, nor the usual inane explanations to justify it. This is what the left does. Incite and then fall silent, feign innocence and use personal attacks as an diversion.

Fall silent? The article was all about leftists speaking out and calling for an end to violence...are you actually mental?

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by Helmling 

Fall silent? The article was all about leftists speaking out and calling for an end to violence...are you actually mental?

Their speaking out now is a tad disengenuos.

[Atomic Rooster]

France has a history of making their feelings known to the government. The reason Paris has those beautiful wide boulevards Is because Napoleon III figured they would be hard for the citizens to block and make it easier for his troops to pass and bash rioters. True fact.

And remember "The Terror"? Haven't you taken any history courses?

Jeezuz, they're on their fifth republic.

Oh, and by the way seek help for all that pent up anger. Sounds like you may have gotten a thrashing by a commie socialist leftist pig in the school yard and now you have issues.

Keep your head. [?] hint [/?]

[besson3c]

Orion: I want to know who you think are Liberal Socialists? Why do you fling this word around in such a hap-hazard way? Have you actually thought about its meaning, or is it just a nice feeling knee-jerky phrase?

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

This is the liberal socialist agenda for France: [Totalitarian] Anarchy

Fixed

[besson3c]

I think that Orion just so badly wants to come up with a negative generalization of the Left that will stick and be agreed upon.

Unfortunately, people are too complicated to generalize in such a simplistic way, Orion.

[analogika]

I think he liked the term "nihilist" when he saw Big Lebowski, and decided since they were German, it's gotta be appropriate to all Europeans who...erm...who...don't vote right-wing.

Or something.

[villalobos]

The irony in all that being that were Orion to call a French socialist a 'liberal', he would get kicked in the you-know-what for insult.

[Helmling]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

Their speaking out now is a tad disengenuos.

A tad disingenuous?

Pot and the f'in kettle...

[Helmling]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I think that Orion just so badly wants to come up with a negative generalization of the Left that will stick and be agreed upon.

Unfortunately, people are too complicated to generalize in such a simplistic way, Orion.

Amen, brother.

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by Helmling 

Amen, brother.

I find it interesting that not one reply here has offered an explanation to the riots. Just personal attacks on me. It appears I've made my point.

[osiris]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

I find it interesting that not one reply here has offered an explanation to the riots. Just personal attacks on me. It appears I've made my point.

Perhaps because those who can explain the rioting are too busy rioting.

Oh, and you never seem to make a point.

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by osiris 

Perhaps because those who can explain the rioting are too busy rioting.

Oh, and you never seem to make a point.

I was told in a post here that the violence following the election of Sarkozy was a no brainer. I asked for an explanation and there was none nor was that statement challenged by others. I accused the left of inciting the riots and that wasn't challenged either. I was offered the explanation that the violence was totally consistant with French history.
I also made the parrallel with the left inspired protests in Los Angeles, which in the end turned violent. That was not challenged either. My observation was it appears violence and character assasination is the coda of leftiist thought. The personal attacks on me here is indicative of the leftist slant in in this forum. Just an observation.

[osiris]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

I was told in a post here that the violence following the election of Sarkozy was a no brainer. I asked for an explanation and there was none nor was that statement challenged by others. I accused the left of inciting the riots and that wasn't challenged either. I was offered the explanation that the violence was totally consistant with French history.
I also made the parrallel with the left inspired protests in Los Angeles, which in the end turned violent. That was not challenged either. My observation was it appears violence and character assasination is the coda of leftiist thought. The personal attacks on me here is indicative of the leftist slant in in this forum. Just an observation.

I'll leave you with a great quote for your digestion:

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, make violent revolution inevitable."

America's Revolutionary War - I'm sure there was an English counterpart who spoke very much like yourself when faced with a similar question regarding those violent filthy smelly Neanderthal colonists.

An lastly: America would be NOTHING without violence. *Nothing*

[OldManMac]

Jesus was a liberal.

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by osiris 

I'll leave you with a great quote for your digestion:

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, make violent revolution inevitable."

America's Revolutionary War - I'm sure there was an English counterpart who spoke very much like yourself when faced with a similar question regarding those violent filthy smelly Neanderthal colonists.

An lastly: America would be NOTHING without violence. *Nothing*

Peaceful revolutions are had at the ballot box in democracies. So your point being France has a disenfranchised minority? Is is because the French make assimilation so difficult? Or is it more likely the failure of French liberalism has made assimilation impossible? In addition are you arguing the the French are at the beginning of another revolution? Are they about to throw off the shackles of 27yrs of failed socialist policy to make room for the disenfranchised minority? What I always find interesting is promises of the left never seem to materialize even after decades in power. But the minority, which they claim to represent, always seem bent on violence to pursue the same failed policy and promises.

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by osiris 

I'll leave you with a great quote for your digestion:

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, make violent revolution inevitable."

America's Revolutionary War - I'm sure there was an English counterpart who spoke very much like yourself when faced with a similar question regarding those violent filthy smelly Neanderthal colonists.

An lastly: America would be NOTHING without violence. *Nothing*

And the left continues in the same vein, the same scenario in Germany:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070509/...ermany_raids_3
There appears to be a pattern here.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

Maybe you could help educate me as to why predictable violence was a no brainer.

You really don't read too well, do you?

Originally Posted by analogika

There were severe riots last year. Sarkozy poured oil onto the fire with his comments. It did not take any brains whatsoever to figure that there would be violence if he got elected.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

And the left continues in the same vein, the same scenario in Germany:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070509/...ermany_raids_3
There appears to be a pattern here.

Care to explain your point? Pretty please?

Police raids against forty places suspected of planning violent protests and possibly borderline domestic "terrorism".

Is this good in your opinion? Why?

Or bad? Why?

Or is this police action indicative of how the German government supports left-wing violence - the same way the French socialist party calling for an end to violence is somehow indicative of their totalitarian AND anarchic approval of nihilistic violence in whatever brown stain passes for your brain?

[osiris]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

Peaceful revolutions are had at the ballot box in democracies. So your point being France has a disenfranchised minority? Is is because the French make assimilation so difficult? Or is it more likely the failure of French liberalism has made assimilation impossible? In addition are you arguing the the French are at the beginning of another revolution? Are they about to throw off the shackles of 27yrs of failed socialist policy to make room for the disenfranchised minority? What I always find interesting is promises of the left never seem to materialize even after decades in power. But the minority, which they claim to represent, always seem bent on violence to pursue the same failed policy and promises.

I think you just hate the French.

[villalobos]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

I find it interesting that not one reply here has offered an explanation to the riots. Just personal attacks on me. It appears I've made my point.

ACtually you answered the question yourself. The riots were mostly due to kids who just wanted to burn cars and pillage stores, just for fun.

[HackManDan]

As for LA, the POLICE incited the violence by attacking PEACEFUL demonstrators, as well as reporters who were covering the event.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by villalobos 

ACtually you answered the question yourself. The riots were mostly due to kids who just wanted to burn cars and pillage stores, just for fun.

This was exactly what happened in the Seattle WTO riots. The protesters were actually peaceful, but anarchists came in and started destroying things, using the protesters as a cover.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

Or simple insurrection, disorder, chaos, mayhem, tumult, turmoil for the fun of it?

That one.

The last couple of election cycles in France were dominated by the fear of this kind of stuff, and according to some friends of mine (who predicted this outcome) people have gotten tired of appeasing the Left/Socialists within the country. Last year's riots really didn't help the cause. The feeling among many ordinary people, evidently, is that they should just go ahead and confront the anarchist/socialist elements and get it over with, politically-speaking.

It's a typical modus operandi for the Left everywhere, though: if you can't get ahead in the discourse of ideas, grab the torches and pitchforks and intimidate the middle 80%. Say it's "for the children" or "the common man" while maintaining class distinctions. Sometimes it works.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by HackManDan 

As for LA, the POLICE incited the violence by attacking PEACEFUL demonstrators, as well as reporters who were covering the event.

You mean all those PEACEFUL demonstrators that injured the police and refused to disperse. Refusing to leave an area once lawfully told to do so is not by definition "PEACEFUL."

[Dakarʒ]

It's called civil disobedience.

[Helmling]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

I find it interesting that not one reply here has offered an explanation to the riots. Just personal attacks on me. It appears I've made my point.

We're not making personal attacks. We're pointing out you didn't have a point.

You posted some article about riots and tried--rather hamfistedly--to use it to condemn an ideology you seem unable to even define, much less really understand.

You've made your self a joke.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by finboy 

It's a typical modus operandi for the Left everywhere, though: if you can't get ahead in the discourse of ideas, grab the torches and pitchforks and intimidate the middle 80%. Say it's "for the children" or "the common man" while maintaining class distinctions. Sometimes it works.

That's a pretty ****ing broad brush you got there, finboy.

I take it you'd likewise claim that it's typical M.O. for the Right everywhere to plant burning crosses in people's gardens if they can't get ahead in the discourse of ideas?

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by analogika 

Care to explain your point? Pretty please?

Police raids against forty places suspected of planning violent protests and possibly borderline domestic "terrorism".

Is this good in your opinion? Why?

Or bad? Why?

Or is this police action indicative of how the German government supports left-wing violence - the same way the French socialist party calling for an end to violence is somehow indicative of their totalitarian AND anarchic approval of nihilistic violence in whatever brown stain passes for your brain?

People have posted violence was expected, predicted and a no brainer. All I have asked is why? Can you explain it? No one else has attempted. I have also pointed out the failure of the left in France ( an ideology ) and I'm accused of hating the French. I point out a pattern of violence on the left and you insult me. All I'm doing is making and observation and all I get back are personal insults. This is what the left does. So can you get around personally insulting me and answer my simple questions?

[osiris]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

People have posted violence was expected, predicted and a no brainer. All I have asked is why? Can you explain it? No one else has attempted. I have also pointed out the failure of the left in France ( an ideology ) and I'm accused of hating the French. I point out a pattern of violence on the left and you insult me. All I'm doing is making and observation and all I get back are personal insults. This is what the left does. So can you get around personally insulting me and answer my simple questions?

You point out the failures of France. Wonderful.
Then you include sweet zingers like "this is what the left does" and expect an intelligent discussion.