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Ontario Election and Referendum...
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Mac Elite
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Oct 9, 2007, 09:45 PM
 
I predict Liberals win and form majority.

Tory loses his own riding, and then is eventually ousted as leader of the conservative party.

MMP? Not sure yet.. would be a shame if it does not go through, as I think that it is about time that we change things up.... allegedly.
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Oct 10, 2007, 11:38 PM
 
Nice to see Canadians are smart enough to see how badly things are going in the US and make sure we don't mimic the same bad choices here.
     
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Oct 10, 2007, 11:51 PM
 
please stop with your american bashing analogue sprinkles. it's getting old
     
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Oct 11, 2007, 03:03 AM
 
Originally Posted by brassplayersrock² View Post
please stop with your american bashing analogue sprinkles. it's getting old
Are you the boss of me? I'm not going to stop having an opinion because you don't like it.
     
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Oct 11, 2007, 09:55 AM
 
Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
Are you the boss of me?
LOL have not heard that one in a while.


back on topic...

MMP flopped... sucks for the Green Party..
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Oct 11, 2007, 07:35 PM
 
That Dalton could be elected again, after the stunning shambles that was his first term, only serves to emphasize how much Tory shot himself right in the face with that incredibly idiotic "religious school funding" idea.

It also serves to emphasize that, for some strange reason, Toronto simply can't bring itself to vote anything besides left-wing. Slightly strange, if you ask me, considering all the whining and complaining about the Liberal governments that came from there.

greg
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Oct 11, 2007, 08:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by brassplayersrock² View Post
please stop with your american bashing analogue sprinkles. it's getting old
He's just another anti-US bigot, leave him be. Not worth your time.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
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Oct 12, 2007, 12:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton View Post
That Dalton could be elected again, after the stunning shambles that was his first term, only serves to emphasize how much Tory shot himself right in the face with that incredibly idiotic "religious school funding" idea.

It also serves to emphasize that, for some strange reason, Toronto simply can't bring itself to vote anything besides left-wing. Slightly strange, if you ask me, considering all the whining and complaining about the Liberal governments that came from there.

greg
The Ontario Liberal Pty is hardly 'left wing' in any but the most vigorous stretch of imagination. What's more; the most commonly voiced Toronto complaint RE: previous gov'ts regards the ill-effects of downloading via the Harris conservatives. Do-tell: what liberal gov'ts do you consider as maligned by we fine tee-dots? Also, how would you support your view of McGuinty's 1st term as a 'shambles'? Do tell indeed!
     
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Oct 18, 2007, 02:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton View Post
That Dalton could be elected again, after the stunning shambles that was his first term, only serves to emphasize how much Tory shot himself right in the face with that incredibly idiotic "religious school funding" idea.
Exactly right.

I'm also disappointed that MMP didn't get approved. Maybe next time we can avoid trying to add 30 more MPPs?
     
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Oct 18, 2007, 02:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by DBursey View Post
The Ontario Liberal Pty is hardly 'left wing' in any but the most vigorous stretch of imagination. What's more; the most commonly voiced Toronto complaint RE: previous gov'ts regards the ill-effects of downloading via the Harris conservatives. Do-tell: what liberal gov'ts do you consider as maligned by we fine tee-dots? Also, how would you support your view of McGuinty's 1st term as a 'shambles'? Do tell indeed!
Whoops, didn't see this!

My bad on the "governments"; that should've been "government". By that I meant Dalton's regime. A slip of the finger, as it were!

I consider Dalton's first term to be a shambles first and foremost because of his blatant campaign-promise lies which he obviously had no intention of following through on. When he ran on the explicit (and written/signed, natch!) promise not to raise taxes without the consent of the Ontario voters and promptly broke that promise in his first budget. I believe over the 4-year course of his mandate Ontario tax revenue jumped something like 30% – and yet the only concrete promise he could make for the upcoming elections was not to raise taxes further – which was, I think, the only one of the major three not to promise tax decreases.

Where is all this extra revenue going?? As you said, as far as I'm aware services downloaded onto municipalities via Harris don't seem to have been "uploaded back"...which was a screaming point of debate this past summer in Toronto as the city faced enormous deficits. In fact, the end result looks like Toronto voters might get taxed even further – not by the Liberals, but by the municipality because the Liberals won't help with the problem. It seems to me like more and more taxes are being applied, but I can't for the life of me figure out where it's all going.

So yeah, I dunno. I only live in Toronto for a few months a year, and I'm not a poli sci person or anything so I really just have a casual view of the whole situation; you're welcome to clear up any misconceptions I have if I've went wrong!

As for my comments about liberal Toronto, I think they are probably fairly correct, no? It's generally a "red city" so to speak, for whatever reason.

greg
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Oct 22, 2007, 12:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by shabbasuraj View Post
I predict Liberals win and form majority.

Tory loses his own riding, and then is eventually ousted as leader of the conservative party.

MMP? Not sure yet.. would be a shame if it does not go through, as I think that it is about time that we change things up.... allegedly.

Since you started this thread; what is the referendum about? If the elections are about the performance of the government, it cannot be a referendum.
     
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Oct 22, 2007, 01:33 PM
 
Originally Posted by Monique View Post
Since you started this thread; what is the referendum about? If the elections are about the performance of the government, it cannot be a referendum.
That's why the referendum was not an election.

P.S. Google is your friend.


Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton View Post
That Dalton could be elected again, after the stunning shambles that was his first term, only serves to emphasize how much Tory shot himself right in the face with that incredibly idiotic "religious school funding" idea.

It also serves to emphasize that, for some strange reason, Toronto simply can't bring itself to vote anything besides left-wing. Slightly strange, if you ask me, considering all the whining and complaining about the Liberal governments that came from there.
The Liberals are traditionally considered centrist in Canadian politics. But yeah, I think the Tories might have done a bit better, if John Tory hadn't been such an idiot with that religious school funding idea. Even most of the religious groups thought it was stupid.
     
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Oct 22, 2007, 02:27 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
The Liberals are traditionally considered centrist in Canadian politics. But yeah, I think the Tories might have done a bit better, if John Tory hadn't been such an idiot with that religious school funding idea. Even most of the religious groups thought it was stupid.
Tory was just really ill-advised on so many fronts. I saw him on breakfast TV, in an apron, cooking some pasta dish. Obviously designed to portray him as a down home family guy. Nothing wrong with that, only when asked by the reporter he admitted that he rarely ever cooks at home. I mean, wtf? It just made him look insincere.

Toronto is a liberal city mainly because the Conservatives have traditionally an incredibly hard time to get their message across to immigrant communities. And with 50% of Torontonians being borne outside Canada this is set to continue for the time being IMO.
     
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Oct 22, 2007, 02:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
He's just another anti-US bigot, leave him be. Not worth your time.

He seems reasonably well informed and makes reasonable conclusions to me, although he often doesn't engage people in debate (which is almost always a futile exercise anyway).

Instead of just blowing him off, why not actually take the time to learn about his point of view and why he might feel the way he does? Why not learn a little bit about Canada so that you have a frame of reference?
     
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Oct 22, 2007, 03:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
He seems reasonably well informed and makes reasonable conclusions to me, although he often doesn't engage people in debate (which is almost always a futile exercise anyway).

Instead of just blowing him off, why not actually take the time to learn about his point of view and why he might feel the way he does? Why not learn a little bit about Canada so that you have a frame of reference?
In the short time I've been here, all I've seen him post is anti-US vitriol. If that's incorrect, then I must have just caught him during a bad month.
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Oct 22, 2007, 03:10 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
In the short time I've been here, all I've seen him post is anti-US vitriol. If that's incorrect, then I must have just caught him during a bad month.
anti-US vitriol would be generic insults about America such as "Americans are fat/lazy/wasteful/stupid", etc. Instead, his viewpoints are usually connected to a particular political or social issue.

Examining other perceptions than are different from yours will sharpen your arguments and your own viewpoints.
     
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Oct 22, 2007, 03:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
anti-US vitriol would be generic insults about America such as "Americans are fat/lazy/wasteful/stupid", etc. Instead, his viewpoints are usually connected to a particular political or social issue.

Examining other perceptions than are different from yours will sharpen your arguments and your own viewpoints.
I tried that, but after reading his posts several times all I could determine is that he's another US hating, Canadian, gay guy with a massive chip on his shoulder. Maybe he just needs more fibre?

Edit: In fact, after using the search function, I found that a large % of the topics he starts are bashing the US in some way. Oh well, at least it seems that he's found a hobby. I suppose that's a plus.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
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Oct 22, 2007, 03:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by Mastrap View Post
Tory was just really ill-advised on so many fronts.
Actually, the opposite is true. He refused to listen to his advisors on this issue. They told him this would hurt them electorally, but he ignored them.
     
   
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