[ebuddy]

Not only are the solar panels ghastly expensive, you need to dedicate about 50'X50' of space for the ghastly expensive storage of this energy. At last check those batteries hold charge for less than nine years at which time you must start replacing them at another ghastly expense.

Not yet practical for most.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by peeb 

It needs to be about five times more than that.

Right, and we all need to have two pairs of shoes (max) and we all need to (simultaneously) walk or bike to school.

Welcome to socialist Utopia.

When it gets to "five times more," we'll have people starving in the streets.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by Eug 

and even worse, the colour is this sickly yellow grey when dimmed.

And for those of us with sensitivity to certain wavelength ranges, they cause headaches. Even the expensive, Al Gore-recommended kind.

[subego]

Originally Posted by peeb 

While it's fascinating that you absolutely must dim every bulb you have, but most people don't do that.

That would be me. And while I fully admit that I carry the dimmer situation to the extreme (just ask my SO), it's not like dimmers are uncommon or anything.

[subego]

Originally Posted by peeb 

Why don't car companies make 2 wheel drive versions of SUVs for the 99% of the market whose only off road experience is the supermarket parking lot?

Because car companies tend to be a good 5-10 years behind the curve on this sort of thing.

Likewise, half the country gets snow.

[subego]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

At last check those batteries hold charge for less than nine years at which time you must start replacing them at another ghastly expense.

Not yet practical for most.

I know this has a ring of conspiracy theory to it, but I understand that much better batteries for this purpose exist, but the companies that made them all went out of business for lack of repeat customers.

I read the article in the 90s, and seem to recall the batteries in question were from the 50s or 60s, most of which were still functioning at the time of the article, and were somewhat jealously guarded by those that had them.

[peeb]

Originally Posted by subego 

Because car companies tend to be a good 5-10 years behind the curve on this sort of thing.

That's right - inventing 2 wheel drive is going to be huge.

Originally Posted by subego 

Likewise, half the country gets snow.

Half the country may get SOME snow, but no way do half the population live in areas which get so much snow that solar panels are not useful.

[peeb]

Originally Posted by subego 

That would be me. And while I fully admit that I carry the dimmer situation to the extreme (just ask my SO), it's not like dimmers are uncommon or anything.

Yes, most people have one or two in the house. I have two actually. That represents about 5% of the light bulbs in my house.

[subego]

Originally Posted by peeb 

That's right - inventing 2 wheel drive is going to be huge.

I meant behind the curve in terms of providing what people want/need.

Originally Posted by peeb 

Half the country may get SOME snow, but no way do half the population live in areas which get so much snow that solar panels are not useful.

I was talking about 4-wheel drive.

[peeb]

Originally Posted by finboy 

Right, and we all need to have two pairs of shoes (max) and we all need to (simultaneously) walk or bike to school.
Welcome to socialist Utopia.
When it gets to "five times more," we'll have people starving in the streets.

No, but we will live closer to the place where we work, and bike, car pool or take mass transit. We've built a whole way of life around the economics of living no where near the places you go every day, and relying on cheap energy to move us around. That's going to change - we're going to reorient our cities and work / home locations to reduce travel.

[peeb]

Originally Posted by subego 

I meant behind the curve in terms of providing what people want/need.

Yes, they seem to be.

Originally Posted by subego 

I was talking about 4-wheel drive.

Oh, sorry - I'd still be astonished is half of fwds in the US are used at all in 4wd mode.

[subego]

Originally Posted by peeb 

Yes, most people have one or two in the house. I have two actually. That represents about 5% of the light bulbs in my house.

Something is fishy about your percentage.

If you have one bulb per dimmer, you would need at least 40 bulbs in your house for that percentage.

That means you have some fixtures that use a bunch of tiny bulbs (thus skewing your percentage), or you are using far fewer dimmers than someone in a house of your size would normally use.

[RobOnTheCape]

Doing a Google search of "dimmable fluorescents" brings up quite a few choices. One of the best deals around this town is the local hardware stores sells compact fluorescents for 99 cents each. Way to go Shirleys!

[Uncle Skeleton]

Peeb, where do you live, and how much does it snow there? Just curious

[subego]

Originally Posted by peeb 

Yes, they seem to be.

While I don't think the 2wd SUV is a bad idea, I'm more irritated at the safety regulations that cripple fuel efficient European cars.

I could understand this if motorcycles were illegal, but since a two wheel platform is acceptable, I don't see how a four wheel platform could somehow be less safe, even if it's made out of bamboo and duct tape.

[Wiskedjak]

II used to drive a 4wd. When the roads were icy, I always had it in 4wd for better traction accelerating, but only because in 2wd it was driving off the rear wheels. Later, when I opted for a smaller car (because I wanted to save money, not the environment), I found that front wheel drive was almost as good as 4wd in most cases, and certainly no worse in deceleration. (it's surprising how many people seem think that 4wd = better breaking on ice)

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by subego 

I know this has a ring of conspiracy theory to it, but I understand that much better batteries for this purpose exist, but the companies that made them all went out of business for lack of repeat customers.

I read the article in the 90s, and seem to recall the batteries in question were from the 50s or 60s, most of which were still functioning at the time of the article, and were somewhat jealously guarded by those that had them.

This wouldn't surprise me and granted, the less you use the fewer batteries you'd need anyway.

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

II used to drive a 4wd. When the roads were icy, I always had it in 4wd for better traction accelerating, but only because in 2wd it was driving off the rear wheels. Later, when I opted for a smaller car (because I wanted to save money, not the environment), I found that front wheel drive was almost as good as 4wd in most cases, and certainly no worse in deceleration. (it's surprising how many people seem think that 4wd = better breaking on ice)

Yep. Anyone who gets snow will tell you that a bigass RWD pickup is next to useless in the winter, and just short of useful if you sandbag the hell out of the bed.

People who whine about needing 4wd for the winter just don't know how to drive in winter conditions, plain and simple. Does it make a difference? Sure, a little bit. A tiny bit. It's not the same difference you get on asphalt though, not even close. FWD is absolutely fine if you don't drive like an idiot, and don't let anyone tell you different.

greg

[subego]

Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton 

People who whine about needing 4wd for the winter just don't know how to drive in winter conditions, plain and simple.

Or maybe they just want to get out of their parking spot in the morning.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by peeb 

Well, it is true that for any solution, there are some applications and places where it is not suitable. While it's fascinating that you absolutely must dim every bulb you have, but most people don't do that. Likewise living in Siberia - for most people that isn't an issue.

It's just an illustration that the advice that some give about how to save energy often is just not that useful.

I have halogen pot lights. There are no CFL replacements for it, unless I replace all the light fixtures at huge expense. I have dimmable flood lamps in other spots in the house, and unfortunately dimmable CFLs don't work for those as I already mentioned. I have other lamps which can use CFLs, and guess what? I already use CFLs for most of those.

P.S. For the record, I driven a hybrid since 2001, and invested in wind power in 2005, so I suggest you may want to drop the 'tude a notch or two.

Oh and I thank the Lord/Buddha/Shiva/mom/Tom Cruise that I don't live in Siberia.

Originally Posted by peeb 

Why don't car companies make 2 wheel drive versions of SUVs for the 99% of the market whose only off road experience is the supermarket parking lot?

They do. They've been selling them for years.

Also, most 4-wheel drive vehicles have a 2-wheel drive setting. In fact, I'm always amused around here when SUV drivers end up in the ditch first after a snowfall because they're too dumb to remember to activate their 4-wheel drive option for their heavy, slide-prone vehicle.

Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton