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You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > Political/War Lounge > Al Gore Part 2: Liar Liar Pants on Fire

Al Gore Part 2: Liar Liar Pants on Fire
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Clinically Insane
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Jan 29, 2012, 11:01 PM
 
Global warming trend ended in 1997, new data shows | Times 247
The supposed "consensus" on man-made global warming is facing an inconvenient challenge after the release of new temperature data showing the planet has not warmed for the past 15 years.

The figures suggest that we could even be heading for a mini ice age to rival the 70-year temperature drop that saw frost fairs held on the Thames in the 17th Century.

Based on readings from more than 30,000 measuring stations, the data was issued last week without fanfare by the Met Office and the University of East Anglia Climatic Research Unit. It confirms that the rising trend in world temperatures ended in 1997.
So what say you now, Liberals, Leftists, Statists, Socialists, Communists, et al? Is this yet another false report by the false prophets of the vast right-wing conspiracy, or could it possibly be that solar activity (you know, that gigantic ball of fire in the sky during the daytime) has a much greater effect on global climate than the greenhouse hypothesis? Is Al Gore going to go down in history as one of the biggest human turds of the latter 20th Century for attempting to frighten the civilized world into eco-terrorist submission and then attempting to profit massively from that deceit?
( Last edited by Big Mac; Jan 29, 2012 at 11:07 PM. )

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
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Jan 29, 2012, 11:04 PM
 
Shit, I wish there was some more Global Warming. But only in winter.

-t
     
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Jan 29, 2012, 11:26 PM
 
What do I say? I say your Daily Fail source is the scourge of the news world.
     
Big Mac  (op)
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Jan 29, 2012, 11:58 PM
 
A likely story. So now who's the denier of science? But thank you for responding to one of the correct labels I assigned you.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 05:28 AM
 
I don't know what it is but something is definitely changing. The weather in the UK has changed a lot since I was a kid. It used to be reasonably dependable but its not any more and this year in particular is weird. I don't think we even had a frost until after christmas.
I hope its not still snowing come April and May. Winter seems to be running very late this year.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 05:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac View Post
So now who's the denier of science?
What science? There's no link to any scientific information.

The Daily Fail makes sh!t up every day. They are literally the worst rag of the English-speaking world. Did you really not know that? Did you not notice that a third of their front page is celebrity gossip, and the other two-thirds is rightwing outrage interspersed with anonymous sex tales, heroic doggie stories, and Europe-bashing?

Give me a credible news source and I will read it and tell you what I think about it.
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 06:19 AM
 
The Daily Mail according to Russell Howard:

"ASBOs, Muslims, speed camera, speed camera, ASBOs, Muslims, speed camera, speed camera"

Mock The Week Newspapers - YouTube
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Clinically Insane
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Jan 30, 2012, 06:59 AM
 
What I hated about the last Al Gore thread is I posted in it once on the first page. Then for years I'd visit, see the green dot, get that brief moment of excitement, only to go "this thread again?"

Oh shi...
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 09:23 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
What I hated about the last Al Gore thread is I posted in it once on the first page. Then for years I'd visit, see the green dot, get that brief moment of excitement, only to go "this thread again?"

Oh shi...

It would be okay with me without the taunting and other emotional stuff in the leading post.

Threads like this are just personal therapy for Big Mac though, from my observations, just an opportunity to use the thread as an escape valve for his rants.
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 11:34 AM
 
I for one feel confident that those who would welcome this article's results have put in as much effort verifying or debunking it's information as another article that would have the opposite conclusion.
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 12:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
I for one feel confident that those who would welcome this article's results have put in as much effort verifying or debunking it's information as another article that would have the opposite conclusion.
Are you challenging us to an article URL copy and paste-off?
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 02:49 PM
 
Which is to say, none at all.
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 04:03 PM
 
Is this the thread where people make wild generalizations about global climate patterns based on relatively minor chunks of data?

"One ticket to Washington, please. I have a date with destiny."
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 04:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey View Post
Is this the thread where people make wild generalizations about global climate patterns based on relatively minor chunks of data?
No, that's the forest fire thread.
     
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Jan 30, 2012, 11:31 PM
 
Did I fncking call it or what?

Discover Magazine: While temperatures rise, denialists reach lower

And Met Office calls out Daily Mail on misinformation.

That's right, the very scientific source of Daily Fail's "report" fought back when Daily Fail completely lied about the contents of the Met Office's work.

Mods, this thread should be renamed "Daily Mail: Liar Liar Pants on Fire." Or maybe it should be called "Big Mac will believe almost any lie he reads if a right-winger wrote it."
     
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Jan 31, 2012, 01:41 AM
 
Thread should be renamed to Al Gore Derangement Syndrome

NASA - NASA Finds 2011 Ninth-Warmest Year on Record

Bush Tax Cuts == Job Killer
June 2001: 132,047,000 employed
June 2003: 129,839,000 employed
2.21 million jobs were LOST after 2 years of Bush Tax Cuts.
     
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Jan 31, 2012, 01:50 AM
 
Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey View Post
Is this the thread where people make wild generalizations about global climate patterns based on relatively minor chunks of data?
No, it's where I say the whole subject is worth f*ck-all, and go about doing what I want to do anyway.
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Jan 31, 2012, 02:50 AM
 
Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey View Post
Is this the thread where people make wild generalizations about global climate patterns based on relatively minor chunks of data?
That's pretty much all MMGW threads.
     
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Jan 31, 2012, 07:28 PM
 
So, what now?

Prediction: no opinions have been changed, GW deniers will lay back and wait for the next article providing alleged smoking gun evidence that GW does not exist, GW believers will continue on continuing on?
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 12:49 AM
 
What now? MMGW nutcases continue using just as much energy as everyone else (in algore's case a hell of a lot more) and everyone else continues to do whatever it is they do.

The biggest thing that none of us changed -hypocrites or otherwise- was the earth's temperature.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 01:28 AM
 
It's one thing to say that we can't just change over night because entire industries, jobs, revenue, and services are dependent on the things that cause global warming; but it's something else completely to just shut your eyes and stick your fingers in your ears whenever the data is presented to you.

I don't understand why it's been so politicized. It would make more sense if the parties had different solutions on how to solve the problem rather than arguing about if there's a problem in the first place.

United States is pretty much the last country on Earth that still thinks there's a debate. I find it odd that people are so willfully ignorant.
( Last edited by olePigeon; Feb 1, 2012 at 01:48 PM. Reason: Fixed a sentence.)
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Feb 1, 2012, 01:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post
The biggest thing that none of us changed -hypocrites or otherwise- was the earth's temperature.
The evidence demonstrates otherwise, and 99% of the experts in the field disagree with you. I know, you're the 1%. Maybe you can go occupy something.
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Feb 1, 2012, 01:35 AM
 
So shut off your computer and stop using energy already. You probably upped the earth's temp a fraction of a percent typing that response. Go plant a tree to atone for your sins. It's your religion, not mine. How come most of your MMGW cultists don't actually practice anything you preach?
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 01:36 AM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
I know, you're the 1%. Maybe you can go occupy something.
Political joke FAIL.

-t
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:17 AM
 
Damn. This has been a hot January month.
Bush Tax Cuts == Job Killer
June 2001: 132,047,000 employed
June 2003: 129,839,000 employed
2.21 million jobs were LOST after 2 years of Bush Tax Cuts.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:19 AM
 
Some are so blinded by their hatred of Al Gore, that they'll be against anything Al Gore supports even if there are vast amounts of evidence supporting the evidence of Global Warming.

Al Gore Derangement Syndrome
Bush Tax Cuts == Job Killer
June 2001: 132,047,000 employed
June 2003: 129,839,000 employed
2.21 million jobs were LOST after 2 years of Bush Tax Cuts.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 05:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
I don't understand why it's been so politicized.
Well there is a whole lot of people who are quite happy running around in gas-guzzling V8s that develop less power than a modern hard drive motor and a lot of people making piles of cash that would grow more slowly if they or their customers reduced fossil fuel usage or rallied against the unmitigated exploitation of natural resources and they prefer not to change their lifestyles or decrease their disposable income.

When you then have a party willing to tell them that this behaviour is fine and they can carry on as they please without having to spend any time, effort or money changing themselves or their habits, you are on to a vote winner. Its laziness and selfishness on the part of the voters and amoral power grabbing on the part of the politicians, none of which should surprise you at all.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post
So shut off your computer and stop using energy already.
Maybe you missed the part where I said:

Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
It's one thing to say that we can't just change over night because entire industries, jobs, revenue, and services are dependent on the things that cause global warming; but it's something else completely to just shut your eyes and stick your fingers in your ears whenever the data is presented to you.
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post
You probably upped the earth's temp a fraction of a percent typing that response. Go plant a tree to atone for your sins. It's your religion, not mine. How come most of your MMGW cultists don't actually practice anything you preach?
It's not a religion. It's not even an opinion. It's science. If you had bothered to read what I had posted instead of spewing partisan bullsh*t, you'd realize I'm not advocating having everyone change over night. I'm more practical than that. I think making small goals as a nation is a step in the right direction. Investing in hydrogen and encouraging innovation. These are things that can drive our country to be more prosperous and help deal with the problems we've created.

But we can't even do that. For whatever reason, we have an entire political party trying to convince people of something contrary to all the evidence. It's mind boggling.

What I don't understand is why this is a partisan issue. There's money to be made and jobs to be created by solving these issues, so where's the problem? There's a way to do this without disrupting everyone's lives or hurting business owners and shareholders. We just need a little cooperation.

Humans are pretty darn innovative. I think we can make important changes without making any sacrifices.
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
It's science
It's inconvenient.

Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
What I don't understand is why this is a partisan issue.
It represents more regulation and a decrease in profits for certain industries. That's all it'll take.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
What I don't understand is why this is a partisan issue. There's money to be made and jobs to be created by solving these issues, so where's the problem? There's a way to do this without disrupting everyone's lives or hurting business owners and shareholders. We just need a little cooperation.

My theory as to why it is a partisan issue...

It seems that what is in dispute is whether GW is being contributed to by man. With some people there is literally nothing that can be said that would change their mind either way, they are committed to their beliefs.

However, these beliefs are so fervent that they can't even mentally get to the practical side of non fossil fuel-based energy that has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not man is contributing to GW, because whenever any topic comes up that triggers some relation to this issue they have an emotional response they cannot get past. How many emotional responses have we seen in the history of MacNN similar to Crash's? Literally dozens, if not hundreds.

I kind of share your confusion though, probably because I'm pretty good at keeping my emotions under control with debating most subject matter, including this. Sometimes I'm unemotional to a fault though, so I'm not trying to claim that I'm awesome or anything. I am awesome, but not for this reason.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
I kind of share your confusion though, probably because I'm pretty good at keeping my emotions under control with debating most subject matter, including this. Sometimes I'm unemotional to a fault though, so I'm not trying to claim that I'm awesome or anything.
All thread participants have now been assigned shovels to allow safe passage from this thread.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:43 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
All thread participants have now been assigned shovels to allow safe passage from this thread.
Well, I might convey emotion, but I'm not really stewing about stuff I come across on the internet. If I did I wouldn't be so quick to start a new thread given how many have gone not so well...
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Well, I might convey emotion, but I'm not really stewing about stuff I come across on the internet. If I did I wouldn't be so quick to start a new thread given how many have gone not so well...
You know, curiosity, confusion, and astonishment are all emotions. And your lack of shame, embarrassment, or ability to learn don't necessarily denote a lack of emotion.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
You know, curiosity, confusion, and astonishment are all emotions. And your lack of shame, embarrassment, or ability to learn don't necessarily denote a lack of emotion.

Ahh, I see your point. I meant the sort of emotions that affect debate tone and behavior.

Speaking of lack of ability to learn, I hope that someday you learn that these sorts of cheap shots are unnecessary, generally speaking. I learn from my involvement and from what is said all the time. You're right that I lack shame and embarrassment though
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 02:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Ahh, I see your point. I meant the sort of emotions that affect debate tone and behavior.

Speaking of lack of ability to learn, I hope that someday you learn that these sorts of cheap shots are unnecessary, generally speaking. I learn from my involvement and from what is said all the time. You're right that I lack shame and embarrassment though
Define: cheap shot.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 03:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
Define: cheap shot.
Provoking/picking a random fight with somebody over an issue of no real importance.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 03:20 PM
 
Its not even about genuine belief, its about what people want to believe. The oil barons want to keep making cash hand over fist so they speak, do, bribe lobby and vote accordingly. Others will buy into it because they want to continue driving their 8-litre pickups without feeling bad about it or being charged extra, others again will buy it simply because it has become a partisan issue and thats the party line now.

The reasons why people jump on this bandwagon are not hard to understand, its the laziness, selfishness and ignorance that is.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 03:27 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Provoking/picking a random fight with somebody over an issue of no real importance.
I'm not looking for a fight, I'm calling it as I see it. I'd say your inability to learn is of some importance, given the amount of people who get frustrated at the conversational circles they end up running with you. With some of the questions you ask, many times I feel like a good portion of the forum, if not just myself, can't tell if you're playing dumb or actually dumb. It seems once a month I respond to a post of yours aimed at the conservative side of the forum because the question is so basic, anyone who follows politics with any consistency should know.

If it makes me a bad guy to feel free to air my opinion, so be it. I appreciate the effort to keep the political lounge, well, alive, but your reflection on what I would see as a side of the political spectrum we share some views on completely guts me and leaves me embarrassed to read many of your posts. I believe this forum needs more honesty in all forms, including the type of political in-fighting that conservatives deem off-limits because of their more strict "us vs. them" mentality.
So I'm being honest.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 03:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
I'm not looking for a fight, I'm calling it as I see it. I'd say your inability to learn is of some importance, given the amount of people who get frustrated at the conversational circles they end up running with you. With some of the questions you ask, many times I feel like a good portion of the forum, if not just myself, can't tell if you're playing dumb or actually dumb. It seems once a month I respond to a post of yours aimed at the conservative side of the forum because the question is so basic, anyone who follows politics with any consistency should know.

If it makes me a bad guy to feel free to air my opinion, so be it. I appreciate the effort to keep the political lounge, well, alive, but your reflection on what I would see as a side of the political spectrum we share some views on completely guts me and leaves me embarrassed to read many of your posts. I believe this forum needs more honesty in all forms, including the type of political in-fighting that conservatives deem off-limits because of their more strict "us vs. them" mentality.
So I'm being honest.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 03:44 PM
 
I'm... not sure quite how to take that.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 04:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE View Post
So shut off your computer and stop using energy already.
More conservative black and white thinking. All or nothing.

There's never a middle ground.
Bush Tax Cuts == Job Killer
June 2001: 132,047,000 employed
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2.21 million jobs were LOST after 2 years of Bush Tax Cuts.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 04:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post

The reasons why people jump on this bandwagon are not hard to understand, its the laziness, selfishness and ignorance that is.
You forgot politics. That's why Al Gore's name is in the thread title.
Bush Tax Cuts == Job Killer
June 2001: 132,047,000 employed
June 2003: 129,839,000 employed
2.21 million jobs were LOST after 2 years of Bush Tax Cuts.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 05:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by hyteckit View Post
You forgot politics. That's why Al Gore's name is in the thread title.
I mentioned the politics, I just don't think the politics are so hard to understand.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 08:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
The evidence demonstrates otherwise, and 99% of the experts in the field disagree with you. I know, you're the 1%. Maybe you can go occupy something.
99% of the experts "in the field" say absolutely nothing of the sort. You've got a circle-jerk of pals who review one another's work before handing it off to a panel of government officials and authors who haven't a clue of what they're writing.

It became politicized once it made its way into the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change commissioned as a governing body to assess the scientific, technical, and socio-economic information related to the risk of human-induced climate change and draft legislation to address the foregone conclusion.

Hide the decline!
ebuddy
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 09:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by ebuddy View Post
99% of the experts "in the field" say absolutely nothing of the sort. You've got a circle-jerk of pals who review one another's work before handing it off to a panel of government officials and authors who haven't a clue of what they're writing.

It became politicized once it made its way into the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change commissioned as a governing body to assess the scientific, technical, and socio-economic information related to the risk of human-induced climate change and draft legislation to address the foregone conclusion.

Hide the decline!

What would it take for you to believe that man is contributing to GW? Just wondering...
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 09:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
What would it take for you to believe that man is contributing to GW? Just wondering...
Something tells me this is like asking a religious person what it would take to stop them believing in god.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 11:04 PM
 
IPCC? How about NASA? How about NOAA?

NASA: Global warming caused mostly by humans

Bush Tax Cuts == Job Killer
June 2001: 132,047,000 employed
June 2003: 129,839,000 employed
2.21 million jobs were LOST after 2 years of Bush Tax Cuts.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 11:18 PM
 
Interesting reactions. I didn't mean to spark a Dakar-besson political battle. Never saw that one coming actually.

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Feb 1, 2012, 11:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
I don't know what it is but something is definitely changing. The weather in the UK has changed a lot since I was a kid. It used to be reasonably dependable but its not any more and this year in particular is weird. I don't think we even had a frost until after christmas.
I hope its not still snowing come April and May. Winter seems to be running very late this year.
I was just talking about that with my dad. When I was growing up in Seattle, we'd rarely get snow at all. We'd be lucky to get an inch on one day a year. Now, the last four or five winters have had major snow events with nearly a foot (sometimes more) of snow. My dad grew up in Colorado Springs where he would routinely wake up to multiple FEET of snow. The most snow I've seen in Colorado Springs, where I spend most of the winter since 2005, has been 18 inches. Something has definitely shifted. However, I'm not prepared to believe that this isn't a natural part of the earth. As a historian, there have definitely been weather trends within written history that have had a major effected on civilization. For example, Europe experienced extremely cold and long winters during the 14th century that resulted in malnutrition for the growing population. We know these trends exist. I don't think it's as serious though as Al Gore and Co say. I'm not sure that human pollution really contributes a lot to this, though I also don't think we should be okay with factories and oil refineries spewing crap into the atmosphere 24/7.
     
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Feb 1, 2012, 11:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
I'm not looking for a fight, I'm calling it as I see it. I'd say your inability to learn is of some importance, given the amount of people who get frustrated at the conversational circles they end up running with you. With some of the questions you ask, many times I feel like a good portion of the forum, if not just myself, can't tell if you're playing dumb or actually dumb. It seems once a month I respond to a post of yours aimed at the conservative side of the forum because the question is so basic, anyone who follows politics with any consistency should know.

If it makes me a bad guy to feel free to air my opinion, so be it. I appreciate the effort to keep the political lounge, well, alive, but your reflection on what I would see as a side of the political spectrum we share some views on completely guts me and leaves me embarrassed to read many of your posts. I believe this forum needs more honesty in all forms, including the type of political in-fighting that conservatives deem off-limits because of their more strict "us vs. them" mentality.
So I'm being honest.
My tactics here over the years I would have thought would be pretty transparent by now. I'm here to have fun. Sometimes this means thoughtful research, sometimes I'm lazy, sometimes I'm right, sometimes I'm not. I don't really care if I embarrass myself because I don't take this place all that seriously. Given that so few threads pan out into productive conversation, is this not a rational way of going about things?

If you are so bothered by embarrassing questions and stuff, why do you never take a more active stance in calling out ridiculous tactics and rhetoric and stuff that prevents even getting into the subject matter (e.g. emotional rant threads/posts, leading questions, phantom enemies, the MacNN filtration process, etc.)? With so much of this, it would seem that what you are describing would be the least of anybody's worries?
     
 
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