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muddywaters2 Dec 16, 2001 05:38 AM
When Do You Think OS 9 Will Be Dead?
I'm trying to figure out when Steve doesn't permit OS 9 to run by itself on the new computers.

Sure, some say OS 9 apps. can run in classic; but nobody say all do, nor anyone has said it runs fast.

Any quesses when that Big Day arrives in which OS Xxx will be the true default system?

(What will happen to those who've invested thousands in older apps? Will they shell out or ugh, switch to those machines that lack design?


mw2 :)
waffffffle Dec 16, 2001 06:38 AM
No way. I see OS 9 shipping on all Macs for at least another year after March (when we all expect to see OS X as the default.) There are just too many apps that will not be out for a while. Plus, classic must still be there, so I'm thinking that classic support will be uncluded with OS X for at least 2 years from that point. Hopefully by that time Apple will be able to scale classic down into a smaller virtual machine-like application, instead of needing to boot the entire OS.
Cipher13 Dec 16, 2001 06:45 AM
If a sane man ran Apple, I'd agree.

Steve Jobs, based upon his actions since he was the CEO of Apple, is not. He is short sighted, and takes many idiotic risks.

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if the G5 can't run OS9 - not at all. It just makes sense too, given that it's a new architecture.

If that is the case, I'll be using my G4 for a long time, and then... who knows?

I won't switch to OSX until they make it what I want it to be.
And there are a lot of people like me out there.
seanyepez Dec 16, 2001 06:46 AM
Thank me for pointing your local Mac genius, Cipher, to this thread. I gave him the link on AIM.

Oh, and...

Praise Allah! :p
Stan Jobson Dec 16, 2001 08:43 AM
I believe 0S 9 will be around for a while...I know Steve wants everybody to use OS X, but OS X isn't complete yet. It still has work to do and I believe it won't be complete until...Honestly, MWSF 2003. 10.2 will be a good update, but it won't be finished. Steve can't kill 9 off any time many apps and still so many users. If he does the whole G5 ordeal...So many people will be upset...We don't want to be forced into using things...It will not be a wise CEO decision to force everybody to use OS X instead of 0S 9, because the G5 won't support 0S 9...that would be a foolish move...and Yes,l he has taken many risks.
scaught Dec 16, 2001 09:39 AM
i wont switch to osx until they pry my OS9 using mouse from my cold dead hands.
Jerommeke Dec 16, 2001 11:57 AM
when cipher is using os x fulltime


oh that's gonna be a hard one

let's say:
- when apple has figured out how to upgrade firmware in os x
- when there are really NEW things is os x which aren't in os 9. and then i don't mean a dock or what, but a support for a new functionality, ya know what i mean?
- when all significant software has been ported
- when all the < 500 mhz mac's are about dying (well.. most of them)
sodamnregistered Dec 16, 2001 01:57 PM

I spend days at a time in OSX, but still revert to OS9 for serious $$$ work.

It is still rough in comparison to OS9 in a lot of ways. I see the spinning CD too much still, and the flow of running all over the place madly clicking on stuff just is not there yet, for me anyhow. I hate that I can't usually right-click on something and send it to the trash, stuff like that, and nixing spring loaded folders is a first class omission error on Apple's part.

At first I found the look of OSX distracting, but it did grow on me. I think it looks nice now. The dock is pretty cool. I will use OSX one day exclusively.

As a gfx artist, I understand the power of refinement. We can help by making sure Apple understands what we want. Let's not let up the heat by telling them what works and what doesn't. The devil is in the details. The core seems solid.

I'm guessing about one more year and OSX.5 or something. The length of this transition is longer than I'd like.

For the long haul, OSX is the right thing. For now, Apple is in a mess. I feel sorry for new users. Veterans can deal, newbies are probably wondering what is what far too much- learning 2 OSs at the same time.

If the iMac goes flat screen and the res stays at 1024x768 then that is a mistake. You need screen for this OS and a 17" crt iMac with 1280 resolution would have been preferable to a flat screen with less res.

sek929 Dec 16, 2001 03:29 PM
I'm with scaught and Ciph on this one. Until my G4 is so slow and outdated I can't use it 9 will be my default OS thank-you-very-much. After that maybe XP will be good and PC hardware will be as cheap as always.

Why am I griping so much? Maybe because simply moving my mouse over the dock uses over 80% of my 733 G4 processor. Does anyone else realize how absurd that is?
fisherKing Dec 16, 2001 05:41 PM
i'll move to X when quark is ported over to it...
or until the sun burns out, whichever comes first. ;)
MikeM32 Dec 16, 2001 05:52 PM
Why am I griping so much? Maybe because simply moving my mouse over the dock uses over 80% of my 733 G4 processor. Does anyone else realize how absurd that is?
That's one thing that'll keep people using OS 9 for quite a while. I used to think that OSX just performed crappy on my system because it's an older machine (G3/266 Platinum Desktop) And I've seen "slight" improvement on slightly faster systems. What I keep hearing time and time again is how poorly OSX runs on systems that are practically brand new (like sek929 mentioned about his G4/733).

Now that really says something to me. I'm considering upgrading to a new system soon, but I don't think I'll be diving into OSX. Just from reading several posts about Graphics App's (my bread and butter) that have been carbonized I'm getting the impression that they (quite frankly) suck on OSX.

As much as I'll try to stick to using the Mac I also won't dismiss going to a Windows system unless Apple can really shape-up thier future OS. I've had OSX v 10.0.4 installed for quite a while here and I can't recall the last time I booted into OSX. I don't find the OS itself difficult in terms of use, but the hardware compatability just isn't there. That's why I haven't orderred the v10.1 update yet either.

I'll be on OS 9.x for a while.

sek929 Dec 16, 2001 06:23 PM
I agree about the hardware situation as well Mike. My scanner won't work yet, my printer is flakey at best and my M$ scroll mouse is sub-par. Plus most of the graphics apps I use are no real improvement in X over the 9 versions or are betas or are not even ported at all yet.

In fact there is only one reason that I would ever switch to X and that is the whole never crashing thing....but then again 9.2 hasn't crashed on me in a good solid couple of weeks. And that is with no restarts and heavy use. Plus in X apps can crash just as easily, just this time it won't bring the whole OS down.......thats not very compelling either.

Screw OSX for now, I have work to do.....
muddywaters2 Dec 16, 2001 06:56 PM
Thanks for the help. Of course, nobody knows.

And Steve, our AlphaMale Dad, has made rash decisions. But by dissing OS 9 users by not having "Classic" work smoothly on OS Xx, or by not having OS X move as smoothly as say, OS 9.1, he could hurt The Corporation. It would be a big mistake to turn out yet another Beta for it seems fine-tuning a relatively new OS takes a lot of time, as did the previous OS's (ie., 1-9, whatever).

I hope Steve is well-medicated and will not make any sudden moves that could subvert the Mac market and his esteemed standing.

I am baffled why WIntel machines are so ugly. Even Dvorak, I think a perennial Mac-hater, chided the PC community for puttin out b..-ugly machines; that aesthetics do matter b/c people feel intimate w/a system they use day by day and looking at an ugly machine is a psychic turn-off. What's wrong with these people. Are good designers so difficult to obtain or is the Engineering mentality King at the Other Side and the aesthetes are frightened rabbits.

Blah blah


mw2 ;)
The Ancient One Dec 18, 2001 01:40 PM
I just hope OS 9 stays around until I can get AbiWord and GNUmeric running under OS X because I sure ain't gonna pay Micro$oft's upgrade price for Office. Fortunately, Classic works just fine with Office 98.
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