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-   -   Strangely dead 9500 (http://forums.macnn.com/64/classic-macs-and-mac-os/63787/strangely-dead-9500-a/)

 
archinla Jul 17, 2000 07:33 PM
Strangely dead 9500
I have a 9500 upgraded just 2 weeks ago with a PowerLogix G3 ZIF 300MHz. (Highly recommended - easily 3X as fast as the 132MHz before) The machine froze on me, then would not boot up. Not even a startup chime! Screens black, a little initial disk activity heard, fan still going, but nobody's home.
My immediate theory is that it's the clock battery, but I tried another 3.6V Lithium in it to no avail. This other battery was similar, but not exactly the same as the 9500's - which must have been its original. Am I right in thinking it has to be the EXACT same model number battery? Even Radio Shack don't stock this one - LS 14250 3.6volts.
Other than this it's something serious. (Removed my 9500's HD - it works fine in an old 8500, so no damage done there.)
Many thanks, these forums are great.
Martin Archer,
4.33 PM
Monday, July 17, 2000
mart@dazeofourlives.com http://www.dazeofourlives.com
 
wlonh Jul 17, 2000 09:05 PM
try reinstalling the upgrade card and hit the CUDA button again
 
Herr Newton Jul 17, 2000 10:54 PM
Try taking the processor card out and reseating it, making sure to press the CUDA button before closing the case and starting her up.

I've seen similar symptoms on an LC5400 in a high school. Someone hadn't properly closed the back door which keeps the motherboard (whole motherboard slides out on these style machines) in place. Over time, the board had shimmied out of place thanks to vibration. Symptoms? No chime, fans going, hard drives chatter a bit.
 
archinla Jul 18, 2000 02:57 PM
I tried reinstalling the upgrade card - to no effect.
I did put the upgrade card in an 8500 - essentially a smaller 9500 - which has the same daughter card slot. It booted, but did behave squirrelly, even after a couple of restarts, so I removed it as I had to get back to a stable system to do a little work. I put the 8500's 132 MHz card back in.

The ATI Rage 128 card from the 9500 works in the 8500; the RAM from either is interchangeable without any problems; the only other PCI cards used in either machine were USB hubs and an old Radius 4MB video card (the original from the 9500.)

Swapping PCI cards from one of the Macs to the other is horrible work. I did, indeed find that I hadn't slotted the 8500 motherboard all the way back in one time I was swapping stuff over, and it makes inserting the PCI cards impossible. So I've learnt that lesson and eliminated that from the possibilities.

The exact battery is proving almost impossible to find, but I'd like to eliminate this as a suspect. Is it really so important that it's exactly the same one? Comparing the 9500 battery to the 8500, the 9500's + (positive charge) end - the nodule - is about 3mm long whereas the 8500's is only 1mm. I just can't imagine why such a small thing would make such a difference. But there again, a few years ago, when a clock battery in an old 68040 Mac I had ran down the machine gave me the chimes of death.

Thanks,
Martin Archer,
11.56 AM
Tuesday, July 18, 2000
mart@dazeofourlives.com http://www.dazeofourlives.com
 
dobru Jul 18, 2000 03:05 PM
Did you talk to the Powerlogix people?
You may need to try another card.
 
reader50 Jul 18, 2000 04:44 PM
Concerning the battery: Apple has a TIL article on batteries.

The tip length is not important, just the total length including tip. I changed an LCIII battery, and the Radio Shack lithium replacement had a short tip with longer body. Total length was the same, voltage was the same (3.6), width was the same. The battery worked fine, and I figure less tip & more battery got me an extra few months before the next battery is needed.

It looks like the battery would also fit in my G4, whose battery is a dead ringer for the Radio Shack battery. I would just get the RS battery if the total length/body width are the same as your original. RS catalog #23-026, $9.99 US.

Concerning the upgrade problems, no advice. I have no experience with upgrade boards. Perhaps a fresh battery will fix, or the CUDA switch after a fresh battery is installed.
 
archinla Jul 18, 2000 04:51 PM
I definitely have to try the battery. I put the old 132 MHz back in the 9500 and it is still dead, suggesting that the upgrade card is NOT to blame.
Incidentally - how are you supposed to press the CUDA button with the PowerPC daughtercard back in there? It's almost obscured by the card. I pressed the button before putting the card back in.
Thanks for all the advice,
Martin Archer,
1.50 PM
Tuesday, July 18, 2000
mart@dazeofourlives.com http://www.dazeofourlives.com
 
reader50 Jul 18, 2000 05:55 PM
I would be inclined to press the CUDA button with the daughtercard in place, so the entire system gets the reset. Try a plastic knife, fine dowel rod, plastic straw, anything long and thin that doesn't conduct electricity.

And get that battery. Some Mac models are known to "boot" to a black screen and nothing else if the battery is dead. Don't know if that applies to the 9500.
 
archinla Jul 19, 2000 01:53 PM
It was the battery!!
I took everyone's advice and tried reseating the cards, pressing the CUDA switch, etc. etc. but it was a $16 battery that brought a Xthousand dollar system down and wasted 3 days work.

You can imagine how relieved I am, but also how annoyed that such a puny thing can cripple a big system like this. Why isn't there a way to alert the user to this? Seems to me we're talking elementary electrics and junior school programming to avoid the gigantic waste of time.

Now I'm thinking I have to run 2 machines and keep the second one fairly concurrent with the main one in order to avoid situations like this. Easy to realise that in hindsight, but it does seem that one computer just isn't good enough when you have a steady stream of work to do.
Check my site out to realise how important this is to me.

Anyhow, thanks again.
Martin Archer,
10.50 AM
Wednesday, July 19, 2000
mart@dazeofourlives.com http://www.dazeofourlives.com
 
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