[Veltliner]

I am about to buy an external hard drive (for back-up and additional storage).

Gtech 800 fire wire drives were recommended to me by a repair tech. Price: (250GB for 250$)

My goal is reliability and quality. I do not want to cut corners with an external hard drive.

Do you think gtech is very good?

Do you have any other recommendations?

Thanks.

[mduell]

I don't know if Gtech is any good, but that price is absurd even if they are. You can get 250GB/FW800 for $110 less, or 500GB for the same price using high quality products.

This $64 enclosure from Macally has 2xFW800 (for chaining) and USB2. It also has a lot of positive reviews.

I recommend Seagate drives, since they're the only brand with a 5 year warranty and I've had a great experience with them. 250GB for $75, 320GB for $92, 400GB for $120, 500GB for $180, or 750GB for $350.

Assembly takes about 5 minutes.

[SLiMeX]

I would recommend anything Seagate. Nothing comes close to the warranty.

[Veltliner]

Thanks a lot.

I also thought the price for a gtech high.

I will check out the seagate and the macally drive.

[Veltliner]

I found this user review at newegg.

What do you think of it? This man seems to know his stuff.

If he is right - that would be quite a nightmare.

---BEGIN OF QUOTE

"Do not buy the ST3250 drive
Reviewed By: OutOfLuck on 12/27/2006
Tech Level: high - Ownership: 1 month to 1 year


Pros: Large capacity enables you to store lots of data which will be ruined when the drive fails

Cons: I have been working in the software industry for nearly twenty years. These are the ONLY drives I have had suddenly and irrecoverably fail in that entire time. I bought one in March 2006. In September 2006 it suddenly developed data corruption. FSCK.EXT3 found over 1000 data errors that appeared overnight. I recovered most of my data by DD'ing the partition onto another drive of the same exact model purchased in October 2006. Last Saturday (December 2006), the new drive suddenly, while in use, developed data corruption. This was not a bad write -- the drive was mounted readonly. The data file I pulled up is a readable text format (.DXF CAD file). Characters have random bits flipped throughout the entire file. This happened on a completely different computer, second drive of the same model (manufactured months apart), while the drive was read-only. The data is completely corrupted.

Other Thoughts: The only explanation I can think of is that Seagate's design is bad. The fact that the data was corrupted while the drive was mounted readonly means it cannot have been a glitch in writing. I don't know whether the platter somehow shifted out of alignment or what. That two different drives, installed in two different computers, manufactured months apart, both failed within months of purchase supports the idea that this is not simply a rare bad drive. I strongly recommend against these drives. If you use one, use it only as an archival data server for data which has been fully backed up and which you won't be changing, ever. That way, when the drive barfs, you can reformat it, reload your data, and access it until the next time the drive barfs and you repeat the process."
---END OF QUOTE

I don't want to raise bad vibes. Many people are satisfied with Seagate drives. But as I am to back up photos and video, I'd like to know what is behind this.

[Veltliner]

I actually found out: this seagate drive was an internal drive.

I need an EXTERNAL DRIVE.

[shifuimam]

An external drive is just an internal drive in a case. You can get an "internal drive" and put it in a case, and voila - external hard drive. It saves money over buying the whole package, and you'll learn a little about computer hardware in the process. A $64 FW800 case plus a $75 drive is a hell of a lot cheaper than buying a package for $250. Not only that, but external drives sometimes have different warranties, and it's highly unlikely you'll find a pre-assembled external setup that uses Seagate drives.

I don't believe a word of that guy's review. He either got a lemon or he's using a bunch of jargon to make himself seem super techie and super smart. Anyone that starts their review with something like "I have been working in the software industry for nearly twenty years." generally can be ignored as being stupid and/or arrogant. I have read reviews and customer feedback messages from people who will say things like "I'm a certified Apple tech and I have been working with computers for 30 years", when in reality they were the computer geek at their school in 1987 and they happened to use their neighbor's Commodore64 back in the day. The "I have been working in the software industry" part could very easily mean "I worked for a third-party tech support company that did tier 1 support for Adobe for six months after my girlfriend kicked me out for playing WoW too much". Just take what such people say or write with a grain of salt.

The fact that the data was corrupted while the drive was mounted readonly means it cannot have been a glitch in writing.

Unless, of course, he stupidly put the drive next to, say, an unshielded speaker or subwoofer, and the magnetic field corrupted a significant portion of the drive. Magnets don't care what permissions you've set on your drive.

You cannot beat the warranty. If that so-called software tech had known that his drive came standard with a five-year warranty, he would have known that with a credit card and a phone, he could call Seagate and almost immediately have them approve an advance RMA and send him a replacement drive.

Corporate server setups almost exclusively use Seagate drives where data security and reliability is crucial to day-to-day operations. They are excellent drives, extremely reliable, and very well-made.

If Seagate knew their drives were crap, why did they add two years to their standard warranties when Western Digital, Hitachi, and Maxtor DROPPED two years from their warranties?

Just my $0.02.

[mduell]

One bad review out of 18 doesn't make for a bad drive. I'd look it up in StorageReview's Drive Reliability Database or just buy a bigger capacity drive.

[SLiMeX]

I have had absolutely no problems with any of my external Seagate drives - currently 2 160GB's and 1 300GB externals. The warranty is the best you'll find on any hard drives out there - a minimum of 5 years I believe? I think they're great.

[Veltliner]

Shifuimam, thanks for that very instructive reply.

Seagate it will be.

There are impostors in any field, and in my fields I react very sharp to them.

Hearing your story, computer impostors seem to be the most reckless liars of all liars.

The magnetic field! Sure, that must be it. The best device in a fool's hand has a quick end.

If I put together an internal drive and a FW 800 box, what specifications do I have to look at that they really fit together?

[shifuimam]

Originally Posted by Veltliner 

Shifuimam, thanks for that very instructive reply.

Seagate it will be.

There are impostors in any field, and in my fields I react very sharp to them.

Hearing your story, computer impostors seem to be the most reckless liars of all liars.

The magnetic field! Sure, that must be it. The best device in a fool's hand has a quick end.

If I put together an internal drive and a FW 800 box, what specifications do I have to look at that they really fit together?

Haha...sorry if I came off a little strong. I just get irritated at people who consider themselves to be "computer experts" and then dispel misleading information or advice to people, either IRL on the internet.

The only things I can think of for compatibility: there are two different kinds of connections for hard drives - Serial ATA (SATA) and IDE. Get SATA. The transfer speeds are faster, and the cables are easier to work with. Additionally, Seagate drives have a slightly higher power usage rating than other drives. I had a Seagate drive in an external box that wasn't pushing enough power, which caused the drive to work intermittently. Just make sure that the power specs on the case and drive match.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by Veltliner 

If I put together an internal drive and a FW 800 box, what specifications do I have to look at that they really fit together?

The bus for the drive (IDE/ATA or SATA) needs to match the internal connector for the enclosure. The enclosure and drives I linked to are all IDE/ATA.

Originally Posted by shifuimam 

The only things I can think of for compatibility: there are two different kinds of connections for hard drives - Serial ATA (SATA) and IDE. Get SATA. The transfer speeds are faster, and the cables are easier to work with.

FW800-SATA enclosures are much more expensive than FW800-IDE, and FW800 is going to be the bottleneck even with an IDE drive. The cabling issue is significant inside a typical computer case, but in an external enclosure the cable is only 1-2" long and is already in the correct orientation.

[Veltliner]

I found this on techguy.org

QUOTE START----

I’d get a USB External Enclosure for about $30 ... Then add a 300GB Seagate.
My last 300gig Seagate cost $89 .. Free shipping.
You can usually get more gig for the buck this way ... and if the enclosure dies ... just get another.
It’s been my experience that the USB external circuitry is more susceptible to failure than the HD

Seagate HDs have a 5 year warranty … they must think they’ll last ... but I’d keep the receipts.
Here’s my favorite USB External Enclosure … http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817123022

---QUOTE FINISH

What do you think of this enclosure. How much work time would it cost me to put that together.

I also heard, that it is rather the enclosure chip set that fails, and not the HD.

So, building your own external hard drive would give you more control over your data, as you just exchange the casing.

What do you think of that?

[Veltliner]

I also read that there are IEE 1394 firewire drives, and USB 2.0 drives.

I guess, for an iMac g5 2.1 ghz IEE1394 firewire would be better, would it?

[mduell]

Originally Posted by Veltliner 

I found this on techguy.org

QUOTE START----

I’d get a USB External Enclosure for about $30 ... Then add a 300GB Seagate.
My last 300gig Seagate cost $89 .. Free shipping.
You can usually get more gig for the buck this way ... and if the enclosure dies ... just get another.
It’s been my experience that the USB external circuitry is more susceptible to failure than the HD

Seagate HDs have a 5 year warranty … they must think they’ll last ... but I’d keep the receipts.
Here’s my favorite USB External Enclosure … Newegg.com - Once You Know, You Newegg

---QUOTE FINISH

What do you think of this enclosure. How much work time would it cost me to put that together.

I also heard, that it is rather the enclosure chip set that fails, and not the HD.

So, building your own external hard drive would give you more control over your data, as you just exchange the casing.

What do you think of that?

Your link is no good, so I can't comment on the enclosure.

Enclosures are unlikely to fail unless you do something strange like plug them in wrong.

I think it's a great idea to buy separate enclosures and drives. It takes about 5 minutes to put them together.

Originally Posted by Veltliner 

I also read that there are IEE 1394 firewire drives, and USB 2.0 drives.

I guess, for an iMac g5 2.1 ghz IEE1394 firewire would be better, would it?

Many enclosures support both Firewire and USB2. I'd buy one with both.

If you have an iMac, why did you start the thread talking about Firewire 800, a port you don't even have?

I'd recommend any of the 5/5 rated enclosures on this page: Newegg.com - Once You Know, You Newegg
All of them have FW400 (or 800) and USB2; prices range from $25 to $65.

[Veltliner]

Thanks.

Does it actually matter if you unplug an external hard drive from a eyesight iMac (PPC) and then plug it into an intel iMac? I am thinking about upgrading when OS 10.5 and the iMac with the new chip comes out.

[Veltliner]

Most drives come OEM.

What cables do you actually have to buy to install them into the enclosing?

And what screws?

Thanks.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by Veltliner 

Thanks.

Does it actually matter if you unplug an external hard drive from a eyesight iMac (PPC) and then plug it into an intel iMac? I am thinking about upgrading when OS 10.5 and the iMac with the new chip comes out.

No.

Originally Posted by Veltliner 

Most drives come OEM.

What cables do you actually have to buy to install them into the enclosing?

And what screws?

Thanks.

The enclosure includes all the cables and screws.

[SLiMeX]

Mduell, you cease to impress me with your knowledge every time you post!

[mduell]

Originally Posted by SLiMeX 

Mduell, you cease to impress me with your knowledge every time you post!

I hope you meant to add a "never" in there.

[deeper]

That's pretty funny. Seriously though mduell, you do offer very helpful information. Thank you!

[Veltliner]

Originally Posted by mduell 

No.



The enclosure includes all the cables and screws.

Thanks.

This is really great. Now I'm getting a Seagate quality drive with a good aluminum enclosure at the price of some low-quality your-hair-will-stand-on-end drive.

[art_director]

As noted the GTech drives are expensive but they're worth every penny, IMHO. My three GTech drives work perfectly and consistently. They transfer data fast and they don't have the obnoxious lag time of some of the competitive options.

I've gone the budget drive route and it wasn't worth the hassle, not to mention the drives I bought went bad and much data was lost.

As a rule: you get what you pay for.

As another rule: it's not 'if' a drive will go bad, it's 'when' a drive will go bad.

As another rule: make multiple copies of your data.

[art_director]

Also, if you're a professional user, you might want to consider looking at a hardware RAID solution. The Wiebe Tech RT5 is a nifty but spendy option that I can vouch for.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by art_director 

As noted the GTech drives are expensive but they're worth every penny, IMHO. My three GTech drives work perfectly and consistently. They transfer data fast and they don't have the obnoxious lag time of some of the competitive options.

I've gone the budget drive route and it wasn't worth the hassle, not to mention the drives I bought went bad and much data was lost.

As a rule: you get what you pay for.

As another rule: it's not 'if' a drive will go bad, it's 'when' a drive will go bad.

As another rule: make multiple copies of your data.

Another rule: Lots of companies are out there trying to rip you off.

Gtech only offers a 2 year warranty. That's not terribly confidence inspiring when the industry norm is 3 years for hard drives and Seagate offers 5 years on every drive.

I'll second the recommendation for the Wiebetech RT5 for external hardware RAID.

[art_director]

Originally Posted by mduell 

Another rule: Lots of companies are out there trying to rip you off.

Gtech only offers a 2 year warranty. That's not terribly confidence inspiring when the industry norm is 3 years for hard drives and Seagate offers 5 years on every drive.

I'll second the recommendation for the Wiebetech RT5 for external hardware RAID.

LaCie = 2-year warranty

Maxtor (now owned by Seagate) = 1-year warranty

Seagate = 1-year warranty


Who still has a 3 / 5-year warranty?

[phillymjs]

I'm late to the party, but let me weigh in here. Instead of buying a boxed drive, pick up an empty enclosure and put the drive of your choice into it.

For the enclosure, I'm a fan of these: OWC Mercury Elite Pro FW800/400 + USB 2.0/1.1... (MEFW800) at OWC
Triple interface, good quality-- I've own a couple of these and have never had a problem.

To fill it, go to NewEgg.com. Buy an OEM drive to get the most bang for your buck (since you just get the drive and no fancy packaging or documentation.

If you do decide to go with a retail external, avoid LaCie. I have had no end of problems with LaCie drives and will never buy one or recommend another one to a client. In lieu of LaCie we have switched to Fantom Drives: Welcome to Fantom Drives - Your Data Storage SuperSource

[mduell]

Originally Posted by art_director 

LaCie = 2-year warranty

Maxtor (now owned by Seagate) = 1-year warranty

Seagate = 1-year warranty

Who still has a 3 / 5-year warranty?

Seagate Technology - Barracuda Hard Drive Family

Key Features and Benefits
* Capacities from 40 GB to 750 GB
* Perpendicular recording technology (7200.10 only)
* ATA or Serial ATA interfaces
* Fast performance and superb reliability
* 5-year warranty

I'm advocating putting an internal drive in an enclosure, not buying a preassembled external drive.

[art_director]

Originally Posted by mduell 

Seagate Technology - Barracuda Hard Drive Family

Key Features and Benefits
* Capacities from 40 GB to 750 GB
* Perpendicular recording technology (7200.10 only)
* ATA or Serial ATA interfaces
* Fast performance and superb reliability
* 5-year warranty

I'm advocating putting an internal drive in an enclosure, not buying a preassembled external drive.

Gottcha. No doubt their internal drives are top-notch.

BTW, those 10K Baracudas SCREAM. Have one in my G5 tower. Only bummer is you need to get a SATA card w an internal port to make it work -- they don't play nice with the stock board.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by art_director 

BTW, those 10K Baracudas SCREAM. Have one in my G5 tower. Only bummer is you need to get a SATA card w an internal port to make it work -- they don't play nice with the stock board.

O.o
Do you mean Raptor? Or are you using SAS drives?

[art_director]

Originally Posted by mduell 

O.o
Do you mean Raptor? Or are you using SAS drives?

My bad...the Raptor.

[bbales]

I just pickup up a 500 GB external Seagate (it was only $179, and that included the shipping). I could not find on the web site anything about the warranty, but have now discovered it's only 1 year. So -- now I'm leery. I have a couple seagates; have had no problem with them (knock on wood). THis was a good price, but I'd seen that guy's rant on "never buy a Seagate," and am concerned.

Any thoughts? (I have other issues on whether I should divide the drive in half, but I'll figure that out on my own.)
Thanks.

[art_director]

Originally Posted by bbales 

I just pickup up a 500 GB external Seagate (it was only $179, and that included the shipping). I could not find on the web site anything about the warranty, but have now discovered it's only 1 year. So -- now I'm leery. I have a couple seagates; have had no problem with them (knock on wood). THis was a good price, but I'd seen that guy's rant on "never buy a Seagate," and am concerned.

Any thoughts? (I have other issues on whether I should divide the drive in half, but I'll figure that out on my own.)
Thanks.

Again, it's not a question of whether a drive will fail but more a matter of when it will fail. With a Seagate drive you're buying some time and peace of mind. They make some of the best drives on the market. I only buy Seagate and Western Digital. I've never had a problem with either.

[art_director]

Be sure to have multiple copies of your important files. Best case scenario is to get a hardware RAID solution if it's work-related or info you can't afford to lose.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by bbales 

I just pickup up a 500 GB external Seagate (it was only $179, and that included the shipping). I could not find on the web site anything about the warranty, but have now discovered it's only 1 year. So -- now I'm leery. I have a couple seagates; have had no problem with them (knock on wood). THis was a good price, but I'd seen that guy's rant on "never buy a Seagate," and am concerned.

Any thoughts? (I have other issues on whether I should divide the drive in half, but I'll figure that out on my own.)
Thanks.

For reasons I don't totally understand, Seagate only offers a 5 year warranty on every internal drive, but only a 1 year warranty on their external drives. Seems odd, since I'd bet their externals are all using their own internal drives.
Some reasons I can think of: an external drive has more points of failure (enclosure/chipset), gets abused more (dropped and connector damage from lots of disconnections), and the competition isn't offering much better (most are 1, some are 2).

[kamina]

I would imagine it's the abuse. I've found in alot of places estimates that knocks are the biggest cause of premature failure in drives. Nothing extensive though...

I just got a Western Digital My Book Pro 500GB drive. The price dropped about 30% within the last 2 weeks, their pricing is currently really good. It has fw400 & fw800, and is pretty silent. Only one drive inside though.

[EvilDonut0]

Will these two work together?

Newegg.com - macally PHR-100AC External Enclosure - Retail
Newegg.com - Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 500GB 3.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

[art_director]

Originally Posted by EvilDonut0 

Will these two work together?

Newegg.com - macally PHR-100AC External Enclosure - Retail
Newegg.com - Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 500GB 3.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

No, they won't. The enclosure takes ATA ( IDE ) drives and that one is SATA.

[mduell]

I linked to the 500GB drive you need in my first reply in this thread.

[EvilDonut0]

So what kind of argument would you give me as to not buying say, a 500GB MyBook Essentials? You can get them for 150 bucks with free shipping.

I would need these 3 items to work on my notebook, which total out to 170?
Newegg.com - Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 400GB 3.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
Newegg.com - macally PHR-100AC External Enclosure - Retail
Newegg.com - VIGOR FWA-AC-01 Firewire Adapter 6-Pin Female to 4-Pin Male - OEM

Is it REALLY worth 20 extra bucks? I can spend the extra 20 if it really is though.

[EvilDonut0]

or i could just use USB and take of the adapter, but its only a few bucks. Also, is there an advantage to SATA over ATA? Seems to me the SATA drives are more bang for your buck in some cases. Why is this?

[mduell]

If you're comfortable with the shorter warranty, go for it.

SATA is the new popular standard while ATA is the older technology. The performance is about the same, but SATA is what is being produced in volume now.

[indigoimac]

Originally Posted by phillymjs 

I'm late to the party, but let me weigh in here. Instead of buying a boxed drive, pick up an empty enclosure and put the drive of your choice into it.

For the enclosure, I'm a fan of these: OWC Mercury Elite Pro FW800/400 + USB 2.0/1.1... (MEFW800) at OWC
Triple interface, good quality-- I've own a couple of these and have never had a problem.

To fill it, go to NewEgg.com. Buy an OEM drive to get the most bang for your buck (since you just get the drive and no fancy packaging or documentation.

If you do decide to go with a retail external, avoid LaCie. I have had no end of problems with LaCie drives and will never buy one or recommend another one to a client. In lieu of LaCie we have switched to Fantom Drives: Welcome to Fantom Drives - Your Data Storage SuperSource

Bingo, OWC's enclosures are top-notch, I have a dual hd enclosure from them that I filled w/ the two SATA drives out of my PC(1 Hitachi, 1 Seagate) I highly recommend either of those brands, they are all I use, and I have yet to have one fail me.

[EvilDonut0]

Originally Posted by indigoimac 

Bingo, OWC's enclosures are top-notch, I have a dual hd enclosure from them that I filled w/ the two SATA drives out of my PC(1 Hitachi, 1 Seagate) I highly recommend either of those brands, they are all I use, and I have yet to have one fail me.

That OWC enclosure is slightly pricy for me. If i am looking for something a little cheaper, say, under $50, what would you reccomend? Valentines Day wiped me out hehe.
What i'm really looking for is a SATA drive enclosure. What u recommend for that?

[MacNslash]

I'm new to posting up but not new to the forums here and I can't begin to thank everyone enough for all the info plopped down in this thread. I was a little leery at building my own external hard drive but now the idea seems pretty fun and it's less expensive. I'm leaning towards the 500gig variety myself.

Thanks again

[Veltliner]

Originally Posted by art_director 

As noted the GTech drives are expensive but they're worth every penny, IMHO. My three GTech drives work perfectly and consistently. They transfer data fast and they don't have the obnoxious lag time of some of the competitive options.

I've gone the budget drive route and it wasn't worth the hassle, not to mention the drives I bought went bad and much data was lost.

As a rule: you get what you pay for.

As another rule: it's not 'if' a drive will go bad, it's 'when' a drive will go bad.

As another rule: make multiple copies of your data.

I haven't bought any drive yet (work, work, work...), and I will consider this.

The same day I decided to buy seagate, a friend called, cooking with anger, as another seagate drive expired.

I do not know if there are cheap and good seagates. I had a barracuda 250 gb in mind.

[Veltliner]

Originally Posted by art_director 

Gottcha. No doubt their internal drives are top-notch.

BTW, those 10K Baracudas SCREAM. Have one in my G5 tower. Only bummer is you need to get a SATA card w an internal port to make it work -- they don't play nice with the stock board.

So, for an iMacg5 2.1 gig I have to buy an ultra ATA- ide drive. That's the one mduell recommended in his first reply here.

Which computer can use a SATA drive? The new Core Duo iMacs or MacPros?

And: is it better to connect such a self-made external via firewire or usb? (if firewire, I need to buy an adapter?)

[Veltliner]

What about this drive?

Newegg.com - Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 320GB 3.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

Compatiblity problems?

And this enclosure?

Newegg.com - Mapower KC31C1 External Enclosure - Retail

Does it have to say SATA for the enclosure as well to be able to hold a SATA drive?

Is there any software to load onto the hard drive after installation into the external enclosure?

[Veltliner]

This G-tech only costs 20$ more complete than a self-built seatgate with external enclosure.

Does it have the downside, that, in case of failure (I have heard the enclosures fail more often than the hard drives) it is harder to repair? Or is it just a slower drive for more money?

[mduell]

Originally Posted by Veltliner 

So, for an iMacg5 2.1 gig I have to buy an ultra ATA- ide drive. That's the one mduell recommended in his first reply here.

Which computer can use a SATA drive? The new Core Duo iMacs or MacPros?

And: is it better to connect such a self-made external via firewire or usb? (if firewire, I need to buy an adapter?)

If you want to replace the internal drive in an 2.1Ghz iMac, buy a SATA drive. All of the Intel Macs also use SATA drives internally.

For a PowerPC Mac, Firewire is faster and USB is cheaper; the choice is yours. Your computer already has both ports so you don't need to buy adapters.

Originally Posted by Veltliner 

What about this drive?

Newegg.com - Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 320GB 3.5" SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

Compatiblity problems?

And this enclosure?

Newegg.com - Mapower KC31C1 External Enclosure - Retail

Does it have to say SATA for the enclosure as well to be able to hold a SATA drive?

Is there any software to load onto the hard drive after installation into the external enclosure?

No, that will not work. The drive is SATA and the enclosure is IDE.

No, you don't need to load any software onto the drive. Just open up Disk Utility and format it.