[Big Mac]

BHO began his campaign last year defining the Middle Class (who he has tried his best to convince) as those making incomes of over $1,000,000 (unless I'm mistaken). Subsequently, he cut that figure in half to $500,000. This year he cut it in half again to $250,000, which he stuck with throughout the rest of his campaign until very recently. In his infomercial this week he said that the bar is now set at under $200,000 for a joint filing (therefore probably $150,000 for singles) - violating his repeated, pointed claims that the bar was going to be at $250,000. And not long after that aired, Biden changed the figure again, calling the Middle Class those who make under $150,000 a year. Finally, not to be outdone, Obama supporter Bill Richardson lowered the bar one more time to under $120,000. Now going from $1,000,000 to under $120,000 is a HUGE spread, by any standard whatsoever. According to my count, the BHO campaign has changed its mind at least six times now during this campaign cycle. If he becomes our President and Honorable Dictator, how many more times will the Middle Class be redefined downward?

[The Crook]

Yeah, pretty much no idea what you're referring to here.

Don't you think links would helpful?

[hyteckit]

Middle class are those making $60k/yr.

[Shaddim]

"Middle class" varies according to geography. $60k is a joke in most major cities, you'll be lucky if you can buy a box to live in for that kind of money.

[The Godfather]

Originally Posted by Shaddim 

"Middle class" varies according to geography. $60k is a joke in most major cities, you'll be lucky if you can buy a box to live in for that kind of money.

Also depends on upward mobility, equity, transformable assets, etc.

[Mrjinglesusa]

Originally Posted by Big Mac 

If he becomes our President and Honorable Dictator, how many more times will the Middle Class be redefined downward?

Wow. So now he's going to be a dictator too?

Let's see what we have so far:

Socialist, Terrorist, Muslim, Communist, Marxist, and Dictator



You guys are REALLY afraid of this guy aren't you?

[ort888]

Well, his number has a long way to go down to hit my income. I have a hard time feeling bad for someone making 200k a year having to pay a little more in taxes. And let's be realistic here, it's not like they are suddenly going to be in the poorhouse. Their taxes are going to go up a little bit. Not enough to effect their quality of life in any noticeable way.

[vmarks]

So, what you're really saying is that people earning more money than you are too successful, and it's only fair that you get their money?

I mean, if it's 200k, why not 150k? If it's 150k, why not 120k?
or 90k? or 70k? or 40k?

Once we decide that you have the power to say who makes too much money, where does it end?

Why do you have that authority?

[Doofy]

Let's cut to the chase here...

"Middle class" = anyone not likely to be voting for Barry.

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

So, what you're really saying is that people earning more money than you are too successful, and it's only fair that you get their money?

I mean, if it's 200k, why not 150k? If it's 150k, why not 120k?
or 90k? or 70k? or 40k?

Once we decide that you have the power to say who makes too much money, where does it end?

Why do you have that authority?

"the power to tax involves the power to destroy"
McCulloch v. Maryland 1819

[0157988944]

What the hell are we talking about here? Why would anyone define the middle class as upwards of $1,000,000 per year? That is high-UPPER-class.

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Let's cut to the chase here...

"Middle class" = anyone not likely to be voting for Barry.

middle class=anyone earning a paycheck.

[besson3c]

http://www.barackobama.com/taxes/

[ort888]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

So, what you're really saying is that people earning more money than you are too successful, and it's only fair that you get their money?

I mean, if it's 200k, why not 150k? If it's 150k, why not 120k?
or 90k? or 70k? or 40k?

Once we decide that you have the power to say who makes too much money, where does it end?

Why do you have that authority?

It already happens. I pay more taxes then people making less money then me. It's the way it's worked in this country for 100 years.

I'm not in the lowest tax bracket. Not by a good margin. I'm paying plenty more then plenty of people.

People are acting like Obama's tax plan is some sort of brand new thing. It's the exact same thing we've had for 100 years, with slightly different math applied. BFD.

Would I like to pay less? Sure. Who wouldn't. But I also like having things like cops. Roads. Schools and an army to pretect me.

People are getting all bent out of shape like Obama is suddenly going to put anyone making over 200k in the poorhouse. It's not even close. Maybe those poor poor people making over 200k will have to buy a BMW instead of a Masarati. Boo hoo. It's not like we're talking about any sort of lifestyle changing numbers here.

Just like someon living below the poverty line can look at what I make in taxes and say I have to get an iMac instead of a Mac Pro. Boo hoo. Either way, we'll al be fine.

[Shaddim]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

middle class=anyone earning a paycheck.

This is the correct answer.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by ort888 

Just like someon living below the poverty line can look at what I make in taxes and say I have to get an iMac instead of a Mac Pro. Boo hoo.

And does that dude on the poverty line know whether you need four internal drives or not?

[The Crook]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

So, what you're really saying is that people earning more money than you are too successful, and it's only fair that you get their money?

I mean, if it's 200k, why not 150k? If it's 150k, why not 120k?
or 90k? or 70k? or 40k?

Once we decide that you have the power to say who makes too much money, where does it end?

Why do you have that authority?

The why is twofold:

First, he has the ability to do so legally:

(1) There's no constitutional prohibition on it. (Or there's not a majority on the Court who thinks there is. Your dissenting opinion on these things holds no legal weight, obviously.)
(2) He's a voter.
(3) It's really that simple.

Second, there are a myriad of justifications for the progressive income tax. I'm sure you've run across a few of them. This just isn't something we can all agree about.

[vmarks]

His vote does not grant him the authority to steal from the rest of us. It really is that simple.

Constitutionally, the government has the power to collect monies from income. It lacks the power to spend on whatever it pleases.

My opinion matters because I regard the Constitution as the highest law in the land, where Mr. Obama and his supporters who fervently want federal government paid for healthcare and other illegal programs are willing to toss it aside whenever it seems inconvenient.

[kobi]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

My opinion matters because I regard the Constitution as the highest law in the land, where Mr. Obama and his supporters who fervently want federal government paid for healthcare and other illegal programs are willing to toss it aside whenever it seems inconvenient.

So do you believe that the Constitution lays out the laws of the land?

Or do you believe that the Constitution tells the citizen what the Government cannot do to us/for us?

Sorry to break it to you, but Bush and Co. threw out the Constitution years ago.

[The Crook]

Originally Posted by vmarks 

Constitutionally, the government has the power to collect monies from income. It lacks the power to spend on whatever it pleases.

My opinion matters because I regard the Constitution as the highest law in the land, where Mr. Obama and his supporters who fervently want federal government paid for healthcare and other illegal programs are willing to toss it aside whenever it seems inconvenient.

Please, vmarks.

Let's not just blame Democrats. Your opinion here is to the right of even Republicans. Not even Republicans in Congress-- not even the Republican "Scalito"-Roberts- Thomas foursome on the Supreme Court read the Constitution as narrowly as you do. So at least let's have a bit of recognition that your opinion here a dissenting view from basically everyone in government.

Maybe Ron Paul backs you up. R[evol]ution!

[Chuckit]

"He did it first" doesn't even work in preschool, kobi.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Let's cut to the chase here...

"Middle class" = anyone not likely to be voting for Barry.

I know you like your catchphrases, but you might want to at least tailor them to something that least sound like they could make sense.

Given that YoMama states that under his plan, "Middle class families will see their taxes cut", one might guess his definition of "Middle class" will likely include an awful lot of people that will vote for him.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by ort888 

Just like someon living below the poverty line can look at what I make in taxes and say I have to get an iMac instead of a Mac Pro. Boo hoo. Either way, we'll al be fine.

iMac? Are you kidding me. He says you get a used eMachine with a modem.

[PER3]

Good lord! This is supposed to be a site populated by more-or-less educated people.

What has been done to those with right-wing views that has turned them into rabid, irrational, harpies?

Surely one can oppose and do so logically and reasonably?

Is it their schooling, or the media?

In any case, it's very sad.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by PER3 

Good lord! This is supposed to be a site populated by more-or-less educated people.

What has been done to those with right-wing views that has turned them into rabid, irrational, harpies?

They've been around the block a few thousand times.

Now, as a lib you might have a memory the length of a goldfish's and thus every argument is new, fresh and exciting to you, but trust me on this, most of the right-wingers on here would have been through the same old argument many, many times. So explaining everything again is much like a constant "" feeling.

There's nothing irrational going on at all. You only think there is because you have a lib mind and can't comprehend that anything not conforming to your narrow worldview is at all rational.

[hyteckit]

Middle Class

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/22600.html

Median income: $48,201

[Eug]

So far: Exit polling from voters making over $100000: