[LeeG]

I have noticed a few things:

1) iPod is so successful
2) The prices of the technology have come down so much (initial 5Gb was 399)
3) Every iPod sold is a vote in favor of standardizing AAC, and a potential iTMS customer - thus a possible revenue stream for Apple
4) Every iPod sold is an advertisement for more iPod sales, iTMS sales, and Apple in general.


Is it now time for Apple to give up greed/high profit margins, and use some of that 3.5 billion dollars to further the platform/make new iTMS customers?

How about a 199 5Gb iPod? There are a LOT of potential customers out there who just wouldn't spend 3-5 hundred on a music player, cause they're not THAT into music, and don't have that much music.

A cheaper version would broaden the market, and lure some people to possibly upgrade to the 10 once they started considering their purchase. And make another iTMS customer. And make another iPod peripheral customer.

I don't know the ins and outs of iPod economics, but it seems they might be able to do such a thing - even if the profit margins were low for Apple.

What do you think?

Lee

[Mallrat]

Originally posted by LeeG:
I have noticed a few things:

1) iPod is so successful
2) The prices of the technology have come down so much (initial 5Gb was 399)
3) Every iPod sold is a vote in favor of standardizing AAC, and a potential iTMS customer - thus a possible revenue stream for Apple
4) Every iPod sold is an advertisement for more iPod sales, iTMS sales, and Apple in general.


Is it now time for Apple to give up greed/high profit margins, and use some of that 3.5 billion dollars to further the platform/make new iTMS customers?

How about a 199 5Gb iPod? There are a LOT of potential customers out there who just wouldn't spend 3-5 hundred on a music player, cause they're not THAT into music, and don't have that much music.

A cheaper version would broaden the market, and lure some people to possibly upgrade to the 10 once they started considering their purchase. And make another iTMS customer. And make another iPod peripheral customer.

I don't know the ins and outs of iPod economics, but it seems they might be able to do such a thing - even if the profit margins were low for Apple.

What do you think?

Lee

you are 100 percent right... the major problem with apple has always been higher prices... at least perceived.... the iPod is one of the best apple products of all time... it's amazing...

but yes, a 200, or 150 version would make sense.. make them with colors... maybe make them a different shape... more plastic?

a nice 200, 10GB consumer pod... call it the cPod... for cheap..... that's the perfect way to get consumers to love apple....

of course they sell like hot cakes anyway... but it's the same way I feel about the music industry.... if you don't want people to steal music... don't sue 12 year old girls, have the basic price for a new CD -- 10 bucks, not 18.... I mean virgin sell a CD for 18 bucks, I can find it for 13... sometimes cheaper... they shoudl be 10 bucks and lower and watch people actually buy them.. a buck a song like apple....

[Ken Masters]

It's funny, how when Apple bring something that is state of the arts, and best of its kind, people flock to it like pigeons.

e.g iPod,

but when they release something that they state that something is when its not, it gets rejected.

e.g first gen G4, where the best of its kind of its time. people bought them like drone, but after no one would want to touch them.

I hope apple just brings out good prephs,

best of its kind,

at its time!!!

Would be great if there was best of its kind in the consumer market, but other campanies have already established themself well enough to do that.

"errors"

[jfinete]

Apple can't offer a cheap 5GB iPod because Toshiba doesn't make the 5GB drives any more. It probably costs the same to manufacture a 5GB drive as the 30GB drive.

Other music players are cheaper because they use hard drives that are physically larger and heavier. If Apple used those hard drives, and other cheaper parts, then it wouldn't really be an iPod.

[kennedy]

Originally posted by jfinete:
Apple can't offer a cheap 5GB iPod because Toshiba doesn't make the 5GB drives any more. It probably costs the same to manufacture a 5GB drive as the 30GB drive.

I just hope Apple is preparing itself for the transition! At some point in the not too distant future, building a 5GB iPod using nonvolatile RAM will be well cheaper than using a drive. At that point, Apple better be ready to shift away from disk drives, or the iPod will become a dinosaur only of interest to the music fanatical (those needing 20-100GB of music in their palm).

OTOH, if Apple considers its interface and brand the essential elements of the iPod (not the drive), and they transition to RAM as soon as economically viable, then I can see them remaining the premier music device.

1GB jump drives are already starting to show up at decent prices... it won't be long now... I'd estimate that Apple needs its first RAM-based iPod before we see G5 PowerBooks.

And for the reasons mentioned in the first post in this thread... a 2GB RAM-based iPod might be sensible real soon now.

[Graymalkin]

RAM drives use an ATA interface, the hard drives in the iPod use an ATA interface. There isn't a whole lot the iPod needs software wise to handle a RAM drive instead of a disk drive. If the RAM drive came in the same form factor as the disk drive it wouldn't need much mechanical work done to support the RAM drive either. The iPod is in a good position to be upgraded at some point in the future to RAM drives.

That is assuming RAM drives are ever going to come down in price to levels which compete with disk drives. Toshiba's 1.8 disk drives retail for about $270 for a 5GB drive. A 1GB CF card will cost you about $300 retail. The price of hard disks is always going to drop faster than solid state storage.

[jojobe99]

I think the low end - low price iPod is a good idea, but I wonder if Apple is holding out because they are worried it may eat into the sales of the higher end & higher profit Pods.

[Augie50]

If there's ever a legitimate competitor, i.e. something of similar size, industrial design and interface, I think Apple should at least lower the entire line by $50.

Apple can get away with charging higher margins on many of its computers because they run the Mac OS. However, they lose the OS advantage with the iPod.

[Peter]

$100 1Gb iPod

[Mastrap]

Most of you are completely missing the point of owning an iPod. Everyone I know who does uses it for much, much more than it just being a music player.

I use mine for backup, to carry files around with me and as an address book.

That's where the larger drives come in.

[Truepop]

I think the ipod is great as a firewire drive and is the one reason I bought an ipod over the competition. I use about 4-7 gigs for video edits so I can take them to a friend and fill the rest of the 10gigs up with music.

[sandsl]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Most of you are completely missing the point of owning an iPod.

I understand but there is definately a market for a cheaper iPod. Currently the pricing is too high for general consumers:

The 10gig iPod is �248.99 for Apple Earphones, AC Adapter, FireWire cable and PC FireWire adapter only.

The basic eMac is �649.00 for 800MHz PowerPC G4, 128MB SDRAM, 40GB Ultra ATA drive, CD-ROM drive, ATI Radeon 7500, 32MB DDR video memory and 56K internal modem.

A difference of just �400.01 - one is supposed to be a consumer level device and the other is a computer! Maybe its just me but I think the pricing is too high for the ipod.

[wludavid]

Originally posted by Graymalkin:
That is assuming RAM drives are ever going to come down in price to levels which compete with disk drives. Toshiba's 1.8 disk drives retail for about $270 for a 5GB drive. A 1GB CF card will cost you about $300 retail. The price of hard disks is always going to drop faster than solid state storage.

This is true, but misses the point slightly. The price points for hard disks are determined largely by physical size - Toshiba 1.8" 5 GB costs more than one-eighth an equally-sized 40 GB drive. Most people have far less than 40 GB of music and probably won't have a great use for a portable FW drive. So when 100 GB drive-based iPods are released for $499, but Dell is making an 8 GB RAM "Personal Digital Jukebox" and selling it for $150, Apple is going to lose a lot of business.

[babble]

I've always had my eyes on the iPods since they were intreduced. But, I'm still waiting for an affordable one.

Heck, they're priced from 439$ to 729$Can. I'm never gonna pay more than 150 to 199$Can for an MP3 player (and yes I know it can also be used to tranfer files, etc.). And I'm also waiting for it to be able to record voice (and I'm willing to add another 50$ for this function built in).

[Chris_G]

The other option would be to buy a refurbished second generation iPod from Apple (go to their store and check out their special deals)... currently they have 20GB for $269... from time to time they've had 10GB iPods for $169... I know its not what you guys are talking about but when someone gives you lemons you make lemonade.

Cheers!
Chris

[videian28]

they are going to have to do this now that dell has their own fake ipod out

[gadster]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Most of you are completely missing the point of owning an iPod. Everyone I know who does uses it for much, much more than it just being a music player.

I use mine for backup, to carry files around with me and as an address book.

That's where the larger drives come in.

I have always wondered about the choice of name for this device - (iPod). A pod is like something that comes off a mother-ship. It doesn't sound like the name of a music player. And it's not a frivolous thing, branding a completely new line of hardware. I doubt they would've have thought that name up over lunch.

I am suspecting Apple have bigger plans for it than just a jukebox, IMHO, in the longer term. We will see , I guess.

[Rain]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Most of you are completely missing the point of owning an iPod. Everyone I know who does uses it for much, much more than it just being a music player.

I use mine for backup, to carry files around with me and as an address book.

That's where the larger drives come in.

Yep. I got mine yesterday and I'm planning on using it to store a lot, and I mean, A LOT of text files of my notes for school so that I can study any where and any time without having to whip out my binders or index cards.

As for the "consumer" priced iPod, I'll totally support it because there is no way my family will ever pay $500 CAD (10G) for it. It was sheer luck that Apple was offering the edu. bundle deal when I needed a new notebook Had it not been for the rebate, I would have went and bought a PDA instead because the one I was looking at (Palm Zire 71) is about the same price and I can do even more with it (listening to mp3s included). I would have never bought the iPod at its regular retail price.

[LeeG]

I also have to disagree that 'most' people are using it as anything more than an MP3 player. Maybe the computer savvy folks are, but everyone I know that has recently bought, or has asked me about buying them didn't even know it could be used for storage - they wanted a kick-ass mp3 player.

If Apple makes the wintel mistake of increasing the size continually, and misses the boat of technology becoming CHEAPER with revisions, they are stuck.

2Gb usb ram drives are out, it wont be long before 5Gb and greater arrive. Combine that with the iPod's easy OS and a form factor of HALF the size - that would be a worthy upgrade. Then it would just be battery that was determining size.

Dell will undercut Apple for sure - and consumers see price. And they think - well I have a dell computer, a dell music player would probably work better with it than an Apple iPod-

Just playing devil's adv. - this is how people think, unfortunately...

Lee

[slider]

Apple greedy? Yes, Apple has higher priced machines than other PC companies, yet few spend large amonts of money on R&D and prefer to Copy instead of develop. Also Apple's cost are simple higher spending, they sell few computers than Dell, for instants so overall cost will be higher. Yes, Apple does charge a premiem, but to say they are greedy is just not thought out.

As far as Apple going to ram type players, as soon as it is viable Apple will. They came out with the iPod, concept and design were not seperate, but a union. Apple will continue to improve the iPod, and others will continue to copy and steal the idea's Apple has developed.

As for as Apple Drones are concerned. Yes, there are some people that buy Apple products b/c they are mistified by Apple computer as a whole, but these people are minority, but Mac users have made a choice to go against the grain, so say, "I have had enough of the Wintel machine and choose an alternative". The "Apple is only still around because Apple buyers are drones", mentality is just as stupid as people who buy everything Apple puts an apple logo on.

Sorry for the rant, but I just keep seeing this same thing over an over again, ridiculous comments simply b/c some people disagree with another persons comments when defending Apple.

I'm done.

[Uday's Carcass]

I'm sure Apple did the pricing research and analysis on the iPod's price point. It probably decided that it could make more money at current pricing. Basic stuff, really.

And it's making loads of money. Good for the stock (which is good for me).

Make excellent products and gobs of money, Apple, and you'll keep my happy.