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azukizero · Feb 10, 2004, 12:59 PM

I'm in the process of making the switch to Mac (eagerly), but in reflecting back on why I haven't made the switch before, I can think only of gaming reasons. Sorry if I'm asking redundant questions but I'm curious how many of you game on your Macs or if you have a PC dedicated to gaming.

The numbers of games available on PC versus on Mac are ridiculous. Is this simply because of the smaller audience that Mac users represent or are games harder to program for Mac?

thanks

Turias · Feb 10, 2004, 01:08 PM

I'm an avid gamer, and my Mac has served me quite well. To me, it seems as though most of the good games that come from popular companies are released for both systems. It's much better now, than it was a few years ago.

You need to look at the games that interest you now and see if they have also been released for the Macintosh. If so, then you don't need to worry. On the other hand, if you are really serious about games and if there are a bunch of recent games that you really love and that haven't been released on the Mac, then it might be a good idea to build a gaming pc to have in addition to your Mac.

bpd115 · Feb 10, 2004, 01:09 PM

Smaller market. Games are expensive to make and you can't recoupe the costs let alone make a profit on 5 percent of the market.

This is why most games are ports from PC (less developmental costs). However, on a positive note, most of your BIG PC games (UT 2003/4, Tony Hawk, Quake, MOH, C&C, etc.) are available for the Mac.

-Q- · Feb 10, 2004, 01:10 PM

Most of the popular games made for the PC make their way to the Mac (I say most because Half-Life was a notorious exception to that rule) so I don't feel I've been left out of the gaming scene too much. The biggest problem I've had is paying US$50 for a game recently released for the mac that's been available for the pc for 6 months to a year. So the delay in release cycles can be frustrating but overall it's not a bad thing I think.

fizzlemynizzle · Feb 10, 2004, 02:55 PM

I think you're kidding yourselves about "most" of the big releases making it to the Mac. None of the EA Sports games are ported, except for last year's version of Tiger Woods golf. Those are the top selling franchises in the world: Madden 200x, NHL 200x, etc.

Half Life and Counter Strike: negative. Deus Ex 1 and 2: Negative. Homeworld 1 and 2: Negative. Call of Duty: Negative. Final Fantasy XI: Negative. Doom 3: Unconfirmed, probably negative. Half Life 2: Negative. Grand Theft Auto: Negative. Age of Empires/Mythology: Negative. Mechwarrior/commander: Negative. Max Payne 2: Negative.

Not trying to be a downer, but let's be realistic. If you want a gaming system then you don't want a Mac. If you want a productivity and creativity system you want a Mac.

And there's a bright side: the PC gaming market is rapidly becoming stale. The number of innovative/interesting games being released on consoles (either consoles first and then later ported to PC or console exclusives) is outpacing PCs by quite a margin. Get a Gamecube, Xbox and a Mac and have the best of all worlds.

Turias · Feb 10, 2004, 03:23 PM

Originally posted by fizzlemynizzle:
Half Life and Counter Strike: negative. Deus Ex 1 and 2: Negative. Homeworld 1 and 2: Negative. Call of Duty: Negative. Final Fantasy XI: Negative. Doom 3: Unconfirmed, probably negative. Half Life 2: Negative. Grand Theft Auto: Negative. Age of Empires/Mythology: Negative. Mechwarrior/commander: Negative. Max Payne 2: Negative.

Deus Ex 1 is out for Mac.

Also, I was under the impression that Deus Ex 2, Call of Duty, and Max Payne 2 are being worked on while Doom 3 and HL2 are possibly coming. I could be wrong, though.

Arkham_c · Feb 10, 2004, 03:25 PM

Originally posted by fizzlemynizzle:
Half Life and Counter Strike: negative. Deus Ex 1 and 2: Negative. Homeworld 1 and 2: Negative. Call of Duty: Negative. Final Fantasy XI: Negative. Doom 3: Unconfirmed, probably negative. Half Life 2: Negative. Grand Theft Auto: Negative. Age of Empires/Mythology: Negative. Mechwarrior/commander: Negative. Max Payne 2: Negative.

Actually, Dues Ex, Age of Empires, Age Of Empires 2, and Age of Mythology are all available on the Mac. Counter Strike is being ported. Doom 3 will be on the Mac when it comes out (every ID game has been released on the Mac, from Wolfenstein 3D all the way up to Quake 3 Team Arena). Max Payne 2 will likely be ported to the Mac as well, since the original Max Payne was.

The Mac doesn't have ALL the PC games, but it has enough to keep any gamer busy and happy.

Busemann · Feb 10, 2004, 03:28 PM

Its probably economic reasons why most companies don't port to the Mac, especially now that the PC games industry is in pretty rough times already.

btw. Doom 3 was first demonstrated on a Mac and should definitely come to the platform since its based on OpenGL. Half-Life 2 is a lot more uncertain, but I cant see why a porting company wont pick it up since it will be a big $$$-maker (like Deus Ex which did very well for the Mac)

But if PC gaming is what you live for, a Mac isnt a smart move. Or you can dust off that console..

-Q- · 05:13 PM

Originally posted by fizzlemynizzle:
I think you're kidding yourselves about "most" of the big releases making it to the Mac. None of the EA Sports games are ported, except for last year's version of Tiger Woods golf. Those are the top selling franchises in the world: Madden 200x, NHL 200x, etc.

None of the sports games are ported. They tried Madden a few years ago and it bombed. But I also wonder how well Madden sells on the PC platform? Cuz I'm betting it sells best on the XBox, GC, and Playstation.

Half Life and Counter Strike: negative. Deus Ex 1 and 2: Negative. Homeworld 1 and 2: Negative. Call of Duty: Negative. Final Fantasy XI: Negative. Doom 3: Unconfirmed, probably negative. Half Life 2: Negative. Grand Theft Auto: Negative. Age of Empires/Mythology: Negative. Mechwarrior/commander: Negative. Max Payne 2: Negative.[/B]

Other than Call of Duty I think everyone adequetely corrected your mistakes.

Not trying to be a downer, but let's be realistic. If you want a gaming system then you don't want a Mac. If you want a productivity and creativity system you want a Mac. [/B]

With your point below, I'd argue that you'd want a console.

And there's a bright side: the PC gaming market is rapidly becoming stale. The number of innovative/interesting games being released on consoles (either consoles first and then later ported to PC or console exclusives) is outpacing PCs by quite a margin. Get a Gamecube, Xbox and a Mac and have the best of all worlds. [/B]

One of the biggest positives about Mac gaming: we don't get stuck with the shite (Daikatana anyone?). Only the good stuff makes it to our platform.

But the Mac gaming market isn't nearly the isle of desolation you make it out to be.

Eug · Feb 10, 2004, 04:54 PM

If you need or want a Mac for everyday stuff and work, and do some gaming on the side, a Mac would be fine.

If you want a cutting edge gaming machine, then you'll need to get a Windows PC. Besides the reduced number of games on the Mac side, performance suffers because most seem to be optimized first for the PC platform. Also, many Mac games aren't so well dual optimized, despite the fact that Apple's Power Mac mainstay design is dual processor.

P.S. There is also a gaming forum at MacNN. There are probably some more intense Mac gamers there than here.

Luca Rescigno · Feb 10, 2004, 06:51 PM

I'd have to go with Eug on this one. Although a good portion of the very popular games get ported to Mac, they usually perform so poorly that you wonder if it's really worth buying them. If you compared a 1.6 GHz G5 with a 1.6 GHz Pentium/AMD machine, with the same graphics cards, the x86 machine would do much better in nearly every game you can get. The only exception might be Unreal Tournament 2003, which has been patched nicely and now runs very quickly even on somewhat old Macs (it's even playable on my old dual 450/Radeon).

-Q- · Feb 10, 2004, 07:04 PM

Originally posted by Luca Rescigno:
I'd have to go with Eug on this one. Although a good portion of the very popular games get ported to Mac, they usually perform so poorly that you wonder if it's really worth buying them.

I don't know that I agree with that. Neverwinter Nights runs very well on both my G5 and my PowerBook 867. Unreal screams on the G5 and does surprisingly well on the PB. I do think there are some bad ports out there (*cough* HALO *cough* - damn shame too) but there are some game companies that really truly try. I think you have to judge the games individually and can't lump all mac games into a 'all ports are bad' pile.

fizzlemynizzle · Feb 10, 2004, 07:26 PM

Don't worry about the Mac port of Halo having been bad, considering the PC port was bad, too. The Xbox version is the best, despite no multiplayer and the lowest resolution.

Lateralus · Feb 10, 2004, 07:43 PM

Luca makes a partial point in that games don't run as well as they would on a similarly equipped PC. But I think he goes a bit overboard in saying that games run as badly as he says they do. Mac gaming is not that bad, and the level of performance in games between PCs and Macs is evening out. The only downside to Mac gaming is the selection of titles. But performance wise, any high end G4 or any G5 will be more than fine.

Luca Rescigno · Feb 10, 2004, 07:47 PM

I was thinking of Jedi Knight II, which was sometimes nice and fast even at very high detail settings, and other times was under one frame per second even at the minimum detail settings. Most games I've played aren't that bad - often they are quite playable at low detail settings with average hardware, and often fairly good if you have a nice, fast machine and use medium settings. Don't count on being able to use a resolution past 800x600 on many Mac games, although that will of course depend on the game and the hardware. Some run fine even at 1280x1024, and others are slow at 640x480. It's just more of a mixed bag than games on the PC side.

Also, my view might be skewed because I've never gamed on a really fast Mac. Best I did was an 867 MHz Quicksilver with a Radeon 9000.

Beewee · Feb 10, 2004, 09:20 PM

I have had no problems with finding games for my mac. I got max payne, halo, WCIII, SC, and I have thought about buying EQ. Plus Urban Terror, I love that mod.

Eug Wanker · Feb 10, 2004, 09:35 PM

I don't have a Power Mac, but I'm thinking I wouldn't be completely happy with almost any dual G4 Power Mac or iMac for 1st person shooters. I'd be happy with a dual G5 though.

elvis2000 · Feb 11, 2004, 01:26 PM

Originally posted by fizzlemynizzle:
And there's a bright side: the PC gaming market is rapidly becoming stale. The number of innovative/interesting games being released on consoles (either consoles first and then later ported to PC or console exclusives) is outpacing PCs by quite a margin. Get a Gamecube, Xbox and a Mac and have the best of all worlds.

I find being a Mac user / Xbox owner to be more satisfying than PC-Only. My former P4 2.8c based machine with Radeon 9700 Pro was a bulky piece of turd that required quite a bit of tweaking, dicking around with, just to keep games running smoothly. Now I have an easy to use OS that my wife can figure out, as well as a simple and satisfying gaming experience on the XBox. However, if I were big on first-person shooters I'd be SOOL, but I passed that phase back around Quake I.

Elvis

fizzlemynizzle · Feb 11, 2004, 01:56 PM

Rainbow Six 3 is one of the best FPS out there and its arguably best incarnation is on the Xbox. Using comm through the headset and hearing responses through the headset from team members (in single player mode no less) is awesome.

solitere · Feb 11, 2004, 02:10 PM

Originally posted by fizzlemynizzle:
I think you're kidding yourselves about "most" of the big releases making it to the Mac. None of the EA Sports games are ported, except for last year's version of Tiger Woods golf. Those are the top selling franchises in the world: Madden 200x, NHL 200x, etc.

Age of Empires/Mythology: Are available for OS X

solitere · Feb 11, 2004, 02:10 PM

Age of Empires/Mythology are available for the Mac!

ryju · Feb 11, 2004, 03:13 PM

Originally posted by Arkham_c:
Counter Strike is being ported.

Could you possibly post a link as to where it says this? I find it a little hard to believe is all.

starman · Feb 11, 2004, 03:51 PM

No "avid gamer" uses a Mac.

Mac + games = laugh out loud until your sides burst.

Excuse me while I play games on my PC.

Age of Empires/Mythology are available for the Mac!

Wow! Welcome to 1998.

Don't worry about the Mac port of Halo having been bad, considering the PC port was bad, too. The Xbox version is the best, despite no multiplayer and the lowest resolution.

Very wrong. The update fixed a lot of problems.

Mike

SouthPaW1227 · Feb 11, 2004, 04:09 PM

I'm a hardcore gamer, and I own a Dual 1.25Ghz G4 PowerMac w/ 2GB RAM and a GeForce 4 Ti 128MB...it does great w/ Quake III, Halo, RtCW, Soldier of Fortune, and MoHAA, but if you want true gaming horsepower & the ability to get ALL the games, you gotta have a PC. I have a PC gaming rig that I use for Max Payne 2, Half Life, HL2 (when it ever ships), Call of Duty, BF1942, etc...there's just no comparison really, the PC has raw graphics horsepower.

3.1416 · Feb 11, 2004, 08:55 PM

Originally posted by Eug Wanker:
I'm thinking I wouldn't be completely happy with almost any dual G4 Power Mac or iMac for 1st person shooters.

Jedi Knight II runs well on my Sawtooth with a Radeon 8500 and 1.2GHz upgrade at 1600x1200. Although tonight I'll see how UT2004 does; I suspect it will only increase my impatience for a G5 tower revision.