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IFLY2HIGH · Dec 8, 2004, 07:10 PM

Hi,

I have udated to a new MDD Dual 1.25 mhz system. I say new cause it realy is "out of the box" new. Anyway, I have ported over my old drives from my old QS running OS 10.3.6, all updates to all my software, I have added an Extra 512 megs of ram to make 1 gig of ram in the machine, and yet it still freezes up. I had to restart earlier and I booted right up and not a min later, froze, no reboot screen no mouse movement nothing. I power down and restart and here I am lol... Things I have done so far is to remove all starup applications and see what happens. This same system was in a Dual 1.0 Ghz Quicksilver and I never had any problems at all, I'd hate to go back cause I can see an nice speed boost in things I do on this machine even though it's really not that much faster. The only other thing I can think of is heat, it is inside of a cubby hole in my desk, same place as the QS, but still the internal fans are hardly running fast and I do have fan above pulling fresh air in and hot air out the top. I wouldn't think this machine would put off that much more heat, but yet the fans arn't running fast like it is overheating. Who Knows...

Any Thoughts?

Thanks!!

Footy · Dec 8, 2004, 08:32 PM

Did you put the ram in right away before starting it up? Maybe it's bad RAM. Remove the 512 chip and see what you get. Why not just update the system that came with then move just your files over? Maybe that would have helped.

Probably not over heating but if you have a door on the cabinet incloser I'd pull it off.

IFLY2HIGH · Dec 10, 2004, 12:46 PM

Egad, well after a few days that machine has a bug stuck up it's processor somewhere. It got to the point to where copying files from one folder to another would make it freeze without any programs running. Stripped it back to everything it had, put it's 80 gig drive back in can't even get though an install of OSX without it freezing. Defently hardware related at this point. I'm using it's Graphics card in my QS, dad's using the memory in his MDD and we're all running fine, so those components are fine, gota be a system board or processor, I can't turn up anyting else in that thing.

Anyone got any other idea's to try?

Azzgunther · Dec 10, 2004, 02:43 PM

To test your temperature.

At least you can rule that off. If your computer is running hotter than (in my opinion) 145�F you might be able to attribute your problems to heat.

BrettOZ · Dec 13, 2004, 01:21 AM

Sounds like bad RAM - I have had the same problem with the same Mac model. Make sure you are using 100% compatible RAM.

cal6n · Dec 13, 2004, 10:47 AM

Sounds just like the problem I had with my dual 1.25 MDD from new.

It was throwing up KPs 3-4 times a day. I solved my issues by removing the RAM, spraying the RAM slots with "Servisol Aero Klene 50" (make sure whatever you use is a specialised electronics cleaning solvent, not WD40 or the like, and that the computer is unplugged!)), and then reseating the RAM a few times with some enthusiasm.

Since then, it's been running 24/7, although since its replacement with a G5, it now runs headless over my network. I feel that if there's some tarnish on the contacts then, although the RAM will pass a simple test (such as the POST or AHT), any real work will cause it to fall over and freeze or KP the machine.

Hope this helps.

Calvin

IFLY2HIGH · Dec 15, 2004, 12:07 AM

The ram that is in there now is what was shipped with it. I pulled out the other 512 I just bought but it still does it, even moved the ram to another slot. We put the ram in my dad's MDD and his is running just fine, I even stole it's Display Card and stuffed it in my QS and it's been fine. The only other thing I can think of is pulling the cpu card up and reseating it. The last time I tried to run the machine it wouldn't even go past the apple logo screen upon power up and hung. I've tried different drives even with no effect. I've got a spare 80 gig laying around now after I got my QS back up and running to play with in this MDD. I mean this thing is practally brand spakin new, been sitting in the box collecting dust in a warehouse never opened or unpacked, go figure that one out.

IFLY2HIGH · Dec 15, 2004, 05:44 PM

Well pop that bad boy back up installed my other 80 gig drive. I pulled off the heat sink and jiggled the cpu card around and reinstalled everything. Has the stock 512 ram, stock CD-RW / DVD rom drive, and my old QS graphics card. Was able to install osx with no hitches, all updates, and coping files to it now and so far so good. I will later on this week reinstall the other 512 ram I have, swap over video card, usb card, and then my superdrive and give a whirl with my existing drives and see what happens. Will just do one thing at a time and see if she stays up and running this time.

BrettOZ · Dec 15, 2004, 10:08 PM

Good luck with it all

IFLY2HIGH · Dec 16, 2004, 04:58 PM

AAAAHHH

Well nothing fixed it yet. Just got done with 4 hangs lol. CPU temp is 116f it's out in the open so I don't feel it's heat. The system was running fine until today. Nothing is new in the system. The only thing I can do right now is to swap out the memory with a different stick to see what happens.

The last two crashes had the dimmed restart your system logo, and there was one that just hung with no warnings like it normally dones. I can rule out software as this has done it with any install of osx I have. Any firmware updates this machine may need I don't know about? The other MDD we have runs great lol, but this ne is just a bad apple lol...

Any system logs I can grab to see what might of went on?

Thanks!!

IFLY2HIGH · Dec 16, 2004, 05:16 PM

Swapped out the memory stick, no changes, will still hang out of nowhere...

BrettOZ · Dec 16, 2004, 07:23 PM

Have you checked the hard drive to make sure there are no problems with it ?

IFLY2HIGH · Dec 16, 2004, 09:53 PM

Yeah I've done the repair permissions and fix/repair from osx cd. I have a good feeling it's not the disk since it doesn't matter what drive's I'm using, tried several setups.

I did however might of found the culpert. I decided just to try and see if this was heat related. With the above applet I can run fine until 116 degrees farenhight. once I get into that range, bam, freeze. I took a small fan I have and opened the door and positioned the fan to where it blew across the mobo and throught the cpu heat sink. It stayed around 96-98 degrees and I tried everything I could to get it to freeze and it never did. I will try this more over the weekend.

On another note, speaking of heat, my dad's MDD Dual 1.25 has a thinner fined heat sink as where mine is thick thined heat sink. I checked with another friend and his is also the really think fined heat sink. I wonder if this could of been a running production change and could be my problem. I'm almost guessing since the machine ran all day in the cool basement, but now that it's in my warm room, and it's warm, something is not doing it's job. All my fans are running, but eventhe cpu fan seems to run slow and I never hear it pick up.

What is the critial tempture of the cpu to consider it to "overheat". I havn't had a chance to install the temp applet onto dad's system yet, and will do that this week since we basicly have the same system. The only difference seems to be is the hewat sinks.

Thought, idea's? Thanks for hangin in there with me....

BrettOZ · Dec 16, 2004, 11:39 PM

Look at the readme document/on-line help that came with that Software - I think it mentions something about the operating ranges for each of the models.

IFLY2HIGH · Dec 17, 2004, 02:15 PM

It's defintly overheating. Looks like some of these models were prone to it from the get go. Most seem to just add some extra case fans here and there. Looks like there is enough room right behind the sink to install a small fan to actually suck air across the are that the cpu's really heat up instead of the one in the bottom of the case that only gets the bottom of the sink.

I did get the CHUD tools and enable NAP mode and low and behold the temp drops like a friggin rock tossed in a river. I may just use that tol for now to keep the temp down.

BrettOZ · Dec 19, 2004, 08:05 PM

Interesting. Oh well at least you solved the problem. What sort of temps are you getting on the CPU reading ?

Kenneth · Dec 19, 2004, 08:23 PM

I have the DP 1.25Ghz (FW800) here, currently the CPU temp is 136.74F. I did add 2x512MB DDR333 from crucial when I bought it. Right now, my Mac drives a PCI TV card, stock ATI Radeon 9000 Pro, 4 hard drives, 2 optical drives, and AirPort Extreme card without any heat problems.

I even swapped the 120mm fan to a lower RPM one.

I did experience KP, but it was long time ago.

IFLY2HIGH · Dec 19, 2004, 11:37 PM

Did the test over on dad's and his temps get right up there with yours. We both have the Firewire 400 models. I can't understand is why we have different heat sinks though, but still havn't gotten any resolution over this problem yet. We've swapped out ram, video cards, even the Cd-Rw/DVD drive and several different hard drives with allthe same results still. Over on the apple fourms they told me to look at my panic logs, and I havn't had the chance yet to get the computer back into a place where I can keep testing it right now, but will do that later this week...

BrettOZ · Dec 20, 2004, 12:09 AM

Originally posted by Kenneth:
I have the DP 1.25Ghz (FW800) here, currently the CPU temp is 136.74F. I did add 2x512MB DDR333 from crucial when I bought it. Right now, my Mac drives a PCI TV card, stock ATI Radeon 9000 Pro, 4 hard drives, 2 optical drives, and AirPort Extreme card without any heat problems.

I even swapped the 120mm fan to a lower RPM one.

I did experience KP, but it was long time ago.

Hey Kenneth

What brand of PCI TV card are you running ?? are you happy with it?

Kenneth · Dec 20, 2004, 07:38 PM

Originally posted by BrettOZ:
Hey Kenneth

What brand of PCI TV card are you running ?? are you happy with it?

I have been using the AlchemyTV(Televio) PCI G4 card since 9/2003, it's not the best but it works for me. The software package improved a lot compared to last year. Over on railheaddesign.com, the webmaster also owns the same card. He compiled a lengthly article of his experience on the TV card. I encourage you to read it if you have time.

Overall speaking, I love the TV card on my G4.

MacGallant · Dec 20, 2004, 11:17 PM

A guy posted about a similar problem like this thread topic in the Apple forums (MDD) a while back.

He bought a refurbished MDD Tower and It always froze after it reached a certain temperature.

It turned out the source of the problem was the absence of thermal heat paste on the cpu module. So the guy applied some thermal heat paste and remounted the heatsink and all was fine and dandy ever since.

IFLY2HIGH · 12:05 PM

Originally posted by MacGallant:
A guy posted about a similar problem like this thread topic in the Apple forums (MDD) a while back.

He bought a refurbished MDD Tower and It always froze after it reached a certain temperature.

It turned out the source of the problem was the absence of thermal heat paste on the cpu module. So the guy applied some thermal heat paste and remounted the heatsink and all was fine and dandy ever since.

Yeah I've already checked for that too, it was there, but I went ahead and cleaned what was there off and applied new stuff and didn't make a difference.