[gumby5647]

Originally posted by nightflame:
<STRONG>Just wondering... What do students do in school that really requires a G4?

</STRONG>

one word: AQUA....

[kennethmac2000]

Originally posted by Paco500:
<STRONG>Has anyone noticed that the font they are using to badge the eMac is not Apple Garramond? Is this the first Mac, or even the first Apple Product since the mid-eighties not to use Apple Garamond for it's badging?

Interesting- Thinking Different.

Paco</STRONG>

Yup, I noticed they weren't using Apple Garamond as well. I'm hoping that's because they intend there to be clear blue water between this thing and their proper computers.

As other people have said, they CANNOT sell this to consumers as it will not only cannibalize iMac sales, it will be Apple caving in to the lowest common denominator, which in the long term will be terrible for the Apple brand.

[zythemac]

Originally posted by Mac The Fork:
<STRONG>I'm wondering about speaker incidents...</STRONG>

I was wondering that too, then found this pic on Apple's site.



[ 04-29-2002: Message edited by: zythemac ]

[Paco500]

nevermind.

[ 04-29-2002: Message edited by: Paco500 ]

[Northform]

I know the machine looks great at $999, but that price is for schools only. The price for students and teachers is $1249 for 700MHz 128 RAM 40GB HD Combo Drive and 56k modem (all include Geforce2mx 32MB).

Update: They do not offer the low end model (CD-ROM) to students/teachers. The midrange is 1199 for schools and 1249 for students.

Is it just me or should they offer this computer including the low-end CD-ROM to the general public. It would have better margins than the iMac (me thinks) since it doesn't use the LCD screen and I prefer the sharpness of the CRT combined with the added resolution/size and better screen updates. iMacs are currently $50 less for students so the eMac would probably be 1299 for the general public (100 off the new iMac w/the same specs).

Note the school low end 999 doesn't have a modem, just ethernet (I don't care since I have a cable modem, but some might).

[thjonas]

Well, if eMac costs 1249$ for students it will probably cost 1299$ to us regular folks. That means Apple is giving schools 300$ discount on emac but only 100$ on the new imac. Does anyone else think this is stupid?

[thjonas]

Originally posted by Northform:
<STRONG>They do not offer the low end model (CD-ROM) to students/teachers. The midrange is 1199 for schools and 1249 for students.</STRONG>

Oh, didn�t notice that. Guess I type too slow too.

[cejones]

so are the speakers on the new eMac "kid-proof" ? Or are they like the one in the Quicksilver towers? Everytime I walk through a CompUSA, I would see tis speaker all crumpled from people pushing in the speaker membrane... I hope the eMac has protected speakers...

[Superchicken]

Looks like it has speaker covers, and apple just took them off for the pictures.

Does anyone else think that apple was just looking at a Panasonic Somba when they came up with this thing?

i dono, I think I'm just gona be mad if they make an eBook.

anyway, I think this is a pretty good idea, and I bet this means they're gona upgrade the iMac to 17inchs pretty soon then. Soon as LCD prices drop. I think it's kinda stupid though, giving the EDU kids a bigger screen than the consumer.. oh WAIT LCD 15inchs and CRT 17Inchs have the same screen size!
hehehe

[kennethmac2000]

Originally posted by cejones:
<STRONG>so are the speakers on the new eMac "kid-proof" ? Or are they like the one in the Quicksilver towers? Everytime I walk through a CompUSA, I would see tis speaker all crumpled from people pushing in the speaker membrane... I hope the eMac has protected speakers...</STRONG>

Fortunately, this machine won't ever be sold in CompUSA, so you won't have to worry about that.

To everyone that wants Apple to sell this machine to the general public, do you not care about what this would do to Apple in the long term? I mean, let's face it, this machine is pretty ugly and, whilst I know it is a necessary evil to maintain market share in the education market at the moment, if Apple starts going down the route of producing commodity PCs that compete head on with the likes of eMachines then it is going to lose a lot of the goodwill associated with the Apple brand and in the very long term could even be forced into a dirty price war which results in the complete abandonment of Mac OS.

If Apple keeps the eMac on the market for the coming academic year, then quietly removes it and goes back to the clean 4x4 matrix, everything will be fine. Dilute the Apple brand by pushing these things through the consumer channel and the long term outlook for Apple is bleak.

[nana2]

Originally posted by kennethmac2000:
<STRONG>

Fortunately, this machine won't ever be sold in CompUSA, so you won't have to worry about that.

To everyone that wants Apple to sell this machine to the general public, do you not care about what this would do to Apple in the long term? I mean, let's face it, this machine is pretty ugly and, whilst I know it is a necessary evil to maintain market share in the education market at the moment, if Apple starts going down the route of producing commodity PCs that compete head on with the likes of eMachines then it is going to lose a lot of the goodwill associated with the Apple brand and in the very long term could even be forced into a dirty price war which results in the complete abandonment of Mac OS.

If Apple keeps the eMac on the market for the coming academic year, then quietly removes it and goes back to the clean 4x4 matrix, everything will be fine. Dilute the Apple brand by pushing these things through the consumer channel and the long term outlook for Apple is bleak.</STRONG>

Dilute the Apple brand? Look, the most popular computers in terms of numbers sold are the cheap, entry level models. If Apple has a nice entry level machine at a reasonable price, more people will buy an Apple than if they only have an expensive LCD based g4 iMac, or a visually crippling 15" CRT iMac. More people buying Apple = more market share, reduced costs to Apple due to economies of scale in production, more developer support etc. How can you possibly say that incresing market share means a bleak long term outlook. A clean 4*4 matrix? You think the viability of a company is based on the cleanliness of it's matrix on a web page?

[zythemac]

I don't see the eMac as ugly. I won't say it shocked me (in a good way) like the new iMac or the Cube did, but I think it embodies what Apple is all about - simplicity.

[SeSawaya]

I just heard aobut this on National Public radio news. Aobut 5 seconds of air time!

[ajprice]

Looking at the pictures, it does have speaker covers, and the back of it looks similar to the 17" CRT Studio Display (the ADC one with the clear back) but painted white, iBook style. It's much deeper than a Studio Display though, and has the circular vent on the back.

The typeface for 'eMac' on the front looks like Lucida Grande, the OS X system font.

I think it's cool, if i was still in uni, I'd think seriously about getting one over an iMac flattie or a Powermac. And yet another Apple product has chrome badges!

Some grabs from the eMac qtvr movie:

[macthelastredman]

i think the emac is a good machine and will be good for apple. however i dont like the look of the back of the machine and i think the name emac is stupid

[SpeedRacer]

Originally posted by nightflame:
<STRONG>Just wondering... What do students do in school that really requires a G4? Are they teaching them how to use iMovie? Are they intensively using Photoshop?
</STRONG>

Are you kidding me? Try OS X. The g3's dead as a doornail, as will be indicated with the new iBook g4s coming this summer.

Speed

[kennethmac2000]

Originally posted by nana2:
<STRONG>How can you possibly say that incresing market share means a bleak long term outlook. A clean 4*4 matrix? You think the viability of a company is based on the cleanliness of it's matrix on a web page?</STRONG>

If it's market share at the low margin, low value end of the market, then it can mean a bleak longterm outlook. Just look at what's happened to Gateway. Apple should be concentrating on the same markets as Bang & Olufsen, not going for the lowest common denominator approach.

As for Apple's 4x4 product matrix, yes, I think the clarity and simplicity of Apple's offering since the return of Steve Jobs has played a large part in creating the successful Apple we have today. Diluting this product matrix with the Cube never worked and, although I am just about persuaded of the necessity of the eMac in the short term, in the long term the eMac (or similar) is also a no-brainer non-starter.

[waffffffle]

Has anyone seen the software bundle on these things? http://www.apple.com/education/emac/software.html

I think its interesting that they included PCalc.

Actually the new Ti's software bundle is more interesting: PixelNhance. Art Directors Toolkit, Omnigraffle, Omni Outliner, Snaps Pro X, PCalc 2, and FaxSTf. I go post that over there now.

[vvedge]

Remember about a year ago? the iBook release... I was in love... I'm still in love with my iBook...

But now I think I've found the perfect playmate for my koobi (I named my iBook)

My first reaction to the eMac was outright profanity... This thing is so anti-revolutionary... or so I thought..

But look at it!!
17 inch CRT compared to 15 inch CRT of the old iMac
Inexpesnive Combo Drive compared to the LCD imac (check out my thread here)
The first G4 under $1000!!!!

A few minor gripes... mainly appearance, it looks ugly as anything, but I bet I'll fall in love when I see the thing in person. But it would have been much better if this machine was released a year ago (as the evolution of the iMac), even if it were more expensive than it is now.

I was | | close to deciding to take my old Blueberry iMac to college, now I've found a new object of affection.

[bwilson]

I have to say I think the eMac looks to be a wonderful machine and I can't wait to get one. I purchased a PowerBook G4 and I really like it. But I don't use it much for portability, pretty much as just a desktop replacement. I got the PowerBook instead of the iMac because I wanted a Mac with a G4 but I didn't like the 15" screen in the iMac. Shortly after I got my PowerBook the new iMacs came out. What I've wanted all along was a classic iMac style with a 17" screen.

I think the new eMacs are totally awesome. Great specs and I think it's a sharp looking machine. G4 700MHz, 40GB hard drive, combo drives, and at almost half the cost I paid for my 550MHz PowerBook G4.

I can't get one until July because of the educational purchase rules from Apple but I have a friend that wants to buy my PowerBook so I can't wait.

Can't wait till they're available and to hear what people think of them.

Brett

[Macintosh]

The eMac will fail.

[OzTiBook]

Originally posted by maffioso:
<STRONG>...I am now looking very hard at getting a 15" Apple LCD to compliment the new PB I will purchase in the next few weeks... </STRONG>

I don't really see why you would want Apple's 15" LCD to use with a PoweBook - it is smaller and has a lower resoultion than the TiBooks built-in display.

The 17" studio display would be a good buy, but there are ofcourse cheaper non-Apple LCDs out there.

[qaramel2001]

posted by The Ginger Rat

It is possible that Apple will release the system to consumers later, but I am not sure about this. Maybe a buddy still in school or a prof will be your agent.

posted by Superchic[k]en

Buddy, don't you know at least one university student?

Problem: here in Spain (where I live) Apple doesn't have the same educational division/ policies as in the States - I have just been told by Apple that they do not plan to bring the machine here at least until Dec02 - Great!!

posted by surfacto

Geez man, you flame a company just for releasing a new product that you like too much?

I've got an old G3 iMac as well, and am wishing I had this thing instead, but that's not Apple's fault.

If they did release it to the general public the price would be much higher. And the thing is pretty ugly, no way it would compete with the iMac at the same price.

I see your point, but note that my flaming is due to that company releasing a new product that I like too much... and they have placed out of my reach apparently just because I'm a little older than I should!

and, just a thought: how am I supposed to believe that I could go by with a g3 when they are puting g4s at schools!!!???

edit: another thought: how much higher the price? US$ 200? still cheaper than the new LCD iMacs...

[ 04-30-2002: Message edited by: qaramel2001 ]

[nana2]

Originally posted by kennethmac2000:
<STRONG>
As for Apple's 4x4 product matrix, yes, I think the clarity and simplicity of Apple's offering since the return of Steve Jobs has played a large part in creating the successful Apple we have today. Diluting this product matrix with the Cube never worked and, although I am just about persuaded of the necessity of the eMac in the short term, in the long term the eMac (or similar) is also a no-brainer non-starter.</STRONG>

The cube failed because it was massively over priced.

[mrchin]

Originally posted by kjb:
<STRONG>I just have to say, this new eMac is the ultimate Gateway/Dell killer. Just imagine takin' grandma to the apple store and showing her a kick a$$ Mac w/ all of the iApps for a grand and then go look at what you get for a $1000 from gateway or dell with that software. I know Gateway is selling a 1.6 P4 w/ 15" lcd for $1000, but to me, this is by far the superior low-end consumer machine.

Kevin</STRONG>

I hope grandma's enrolled in the local County College so she can pick one up. Unless you can pretend to buy it for your kid or nephew, whatever, then just give it to her.

So does having a student qualify buying one at edu pricing or is it only for the institutions and college students?

[mitchell_pgh]

Education-wise, this thing looks PERFECT... considering the past...

[Oneota]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
<STRONG>Education-wise, this thing looks PERFECT... considering the past...

</STRONG>

Hey, now! I LOVED the G3 AIO. I had one for myself my senior year of H.S. Darn-near perfect machine, IMO. Nearly broke my heart to sell it, but I really wanted a laptop for college.

[The Ginger Rat]

Originally posted by qaramel2001:
<STRONG>

I see your point, but note that my flaming is due to that company releasing a new product that I like too much... and they have placed out of my reach apparently just because I'm a little older than I should!

and, just a thought: how am I supposed to believe that I could go by with a g3 when they are puting g4s at schools!!!???

edit: another thought: how much higher the price? US$ 200? still cheaper than the new LCD iMacs...

[ 04-30-2002: Message edited by: qaramel2001 ]</STRONG>

Ah, me understand now (didn't know where you were from). Yeah, the downside of the globality of the Web is seeing all the cool stuff you can't get right away.

Don't go G3 unless you absolutely cannot wait and cannot afford available G4s. IMHO the G3 simply cannot keep up with OS X for much longer (if it can now) so it would be a very short term solution that will be expensive in the long run.

[tinrib]

I don't see why it has a 40GB hard drive. Surely in a school situation where the computers will ideally be booted centrally from g4s running OSX server & netInfo it would be much better to store everything else, applications and user folders, on the server. I think they would be better off selling a cheaper model with a much smaller hard drive. Really the only reason you need a hard drive is for VM, and for a lot of purchasers the HD will be redundant. And why do students need to watch DVD movies? What would have been better is the option of a good rewritable storage solution, such as zip or DVD RAM or somethere in between. CD-R(W) is not enough, although I suppose there is a good point that *everyone* has a CD-ROM drive with their computer (doesn't seem long ago it was a luxury).

As for the weight, I think it's heavy weight could be a bonus. Less likely to be knocked off a table. This machine is designed to be knocked about - it's got to survive in a school.

I'm pretty impressed by the machine, and if my school had bought these, I would be spoilt When I was at school we had a room full of poxy 386s, BBC Micro Model Bs (remember elite? :cool , 1 mac classic and 1 even cooler Archimedes. A room full of eMacs would've been great!

[edgarbarefoot]

I work for a large university in the southwest. WE have all kinds of macs deployed around the school. The eMac is the perfect box to upgrade to. A G4 tower with flat panel will cost over $2000.00. The thing will go to staff, and faculty as well as student computer labs. At ~$1500.00, saved desk space, fast processor, burner, etc make it perfect for the universuty setting. The big sell is the added screen realestate and small form factor compared to a tower at a reasonable cost. The flat panel iMac will not take the abuse a lab environment generates. To fragile. We have 2 here. I have one at home. They're great. But in other forums here you see the problems that would be a total pain in the *ss to deal with. Failed drives, screen problems, etc. It didn't stop me from buying one, but it doesn't make sense to put them in a lab. for faculty/staff maybe. I'm glad this product is available to us. It fills a BIG gap.

[Commodus]

I suspect that the reason they have a Combo drive in the eMac is not because they necessarily need to watch DVD movies, but for the sake of future-proofing. Remember, schools often tend to keep computers for much longer than the average home user does. Eventually software will start to be released exclusively on DVD, and you don't want to find out that your school has 50 computers that can't run a new program simply because they don't have the right optical drive.

You could say that it's the difference between a basic pocket knife and a Swiss Army knife. The pocket knife (the CD-ROM model) is best-suited to people who only need a tool for one purpose; in this case, something that runs a straightforward program. The Swiss Army knife (the Combo model) is for people who can't predict, or just know, that they'll need more than one function.

As a student (like me) or faculty member, more often than not you'll know that you want more than just the ability to read CDs. Unless you really think you can use a USB floppy or Zip drive, you'll probably want to write CDs. The DVD functionality at least gives you a cheaper alternative to buying a TV and DVD player alongside your computer, and also helps justify the higher price that you would be paying anyways.

[Rumor Addict]

For those of you that are wondering about how ram is installed, here it is from the developers notes:

RAM Expansion Slots

The eMac has two RAM expansion slots. The slots accept standard PC-100 or PC-133, 168-pin DIMMs (dual inline memory modules) that use SDRAM devices. A DIMM for a eMac can contain either 64, 128, 256, or 512 MB of memory.

A door on the bottom of the computer provides access to the RAM expansion slots. Before opening the bottom door, the user should place the computer face down on a soft cloth.

When the door is open, the portion of the main logic board that contains the two RAM expansion slots is visible. The top slot is normally occupied by the factory-installed RAM DIMM. Either RAM expansion slot can accept a user-installed DIMM.

Important

The user should be reminded to observe the usual precautions to avoid damage to the electronic components due to static electricity.

Note: The eMac does not use memory interleaving, so installing two DIMMs of the same size does not result in any performance gain.

[scopegate]

Originally posted by Paco500:
<STRONG>�or even the first Apple Product since the mid-eighties not to use Apple Garamond for it's badging?</STRONG>

nope.

[clebin]

Is white a good colour for schools?

I mean, I remember all those dirty yellowing BBC Micros and 8086s that had sat in the classroom for yonks. I can't help thinking that the eMac is going to look really grotty really quickly - like a white sofa.

Black would be a better colour, if Apple had the guts!

Chris