Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

GeneA · May 22, 2001, 01:14 PM

Educate me about the value of ordering the iBook with the DVD. I definitely do *need* a CD-RW, for extended time on the road. But is it really worth it to half its 'burning' time to get a DVD-ROM??? Does the DVD serve any other purpose other than watching a movie? Can it be hooked to a TV and act as DVD player (or is that hard on it--like using a camcorder to watch a movie)? Can it read the disk from inside my DVD-RAMs--if it could do that, then I 'd be ecstatic but I have my doubts....

MaxMac · May 22, 2001, 01:23 PM

You can watch it on the TV via the AV cable (about $19 extra). It is processor intensive, but people do it all the time with dvd drives in their computers. I am not sure if you can read the DVD-RAM from your... I assume G4 Tower. I ordered the combo, because if I am burning on the fly, as storage, 4x should be adequate, and the DVD is purely for enjoyment. Having both together make it easier to pack the bag.

------------------
I love deadlines. They make a whooshing sound as they pass by.

jtc · May 22, 2001, 01:28 PM

Can it read the disk from inside my DVD-RAMs--if it could do that, then I 'd be ecstatic but I have my doubts...

Some DVD-RAM discs can be removed from the cartridge and read on any DVD drive (I can't remember if it's type I or type II).

It is processor intensive, but people do it all the time with dvd drives in their computers

It's only processor intensive if your video card doesn't do hardware decoding (which ATI 128 and newer cards do).

GeneA · May 22, 2001, 01:32 PM

Yes, my DVD-RAM is the one in the G4 tower (I'd sure love it if there is someone who knows for sure about this). You seem to be saying that the 'burning' speed difference between 4x and 8x isn't all that significant. If that's the case, then maybe the combo is the 'best of all worlds'!?

[This message has been edited by GeneA (edited 05-22-2001).]

graffix · May 22, 2001, 01:46 PM

The difference between 4x and 8x is about 7-10 minutes (depending on whether or not you're burning a 650MB or 800MB CD)...
Figure that 1x is ~150k/sec, so 4x burns at 600k/sec, and 8x burns at 1.2M/sec.
Personally, I bought Toast Titanium to go along with my combo-drive, so I can just burn in the background and really not even notice the burn times...
Also, the CD-RW only writes at 4x anyway (which is the part I plan on using mostly) so I don't think I'll miss the extra 4x speed that the combo-drive was originally rated for writing CD-R's...
The combo-drive is a good value if you want an 'all-around' optical drive... it'll read just about everything.
I've also gotten a couple of home DVD's lately that have special disks that you can read in your computer, but haven't been able to try them since I haven't had a DVD drive up until this point... that's another bonus of having DVD-Rom.
cheers.
g.

------------------
First there was man,
then there was
Macintosh

GeneA · May 22, 2001, 02:04 PM

Explain this Toast Titanium to me. Do you mean that by using a 3rd party 'burning' software, you can do something that the built-in Apple software won't let you do--i.e. 'burn' in the backgound? How much does it cost?

MaxMac · May 22, 2001, 02:05 PM

4x and 8x (as well as all other > x speeds) have noticeable differences, when burning large (long) files. Yes, if you are burning 650-800mb the time difference is very noticeable. However if you are backing up files (in leu of a floppy) on a CDRW, and the files are a few mb at a time, no big deal. If I am going to burn a full CD then I'll do it at home on my tower while I surf or watch a DVD on my iBook. But I will have the option, and that's what I'm paying for.

videoalex · May 22, 2001, 02:27 PM

Originally posted by GeneA:
Explain this Toast Titanium to me. Do you mean that by using a 3rd party 'burning' software, you can do something that the built-in Apple software won't let you do--i.e. 'burn' in the backgound? How much does it cost?

Yest, Toast Titanium (made by a company called "roxio") will allow you to do much much more with your CD burner. it will allow you to burn in the background, it will let you burn windows compatible CDs, it will even let you make videoCDs from iMovie, if that's your thing. It's mature, solid, Mac software that's been around since CD-R was thought up. All this at the rock bottom price of about $100. load it on your G4 and see all the doors it opens to you.

Oh, and if you buy now, I've confirmed from roxio support, when mac OS X compatibilty is finished, you will be able to upgrade for free.

---Alex

GeneA · May 22, 2001, 02:59 PM

"...load it on your G4 and see all the doors it opens to you."

Just to be sure--you can also load it on the G3 iBook???

RodriCO2000 · May 22, 2001, 03:27 PM

Actually the Mac OS DOES NOT use the Rage 128 DVD hardware deciding ability... It can do it but the Mac OS does not use it.... Its all Processor intensive.....

------------------
Be happy

Be Cool

Be Different, but be yourself...

GeneA · May 22, 2001, 03:51 PM

quotes:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
It is processor intensive, but people do it all the time with dvd drives in their computers
------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's only processor intensive if your video card doesn't do hardware decoding (which ATI 128 and newer cards do).
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Actually the Mac OS DOES NOT use the Rage 128 DVD hardware deciding ability... It can do it but the Mac OS does not use it.... Its all Processor intensive.....
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Can one of you explain this and its significance to me as a user of an iBook. How would it affect me?

G4Man · May 22, 2001, 04:35 PM

I just ordered a dvd model. I didn't go with the cdrw or combo, because you can save more money by buying and external firewire cdrw. I'm getting one on eBay for $250. Yamaha 16x10x40. That would rock with my ibook. And I've downloaded Toast Titanium from a server, and burning in the background works beautifully, haven't had any problems yet with my G4 and teac 8x cdr. Just my 2�
www.amaesing.net

RodriCO2000 · May 22, 2001, 05:12 PM

All this means is that when you watch a DVD it will use your full Processor power, you cannot do anything else at all besides wtahc the DVD as far as perfomance wise its pretty much the same as hardware decoding.... all this means i sthat The DVD player will use 100% CPU time while watching a DVD...

------------------
Be happy

Be Cool

Be Different, but be yourself...

GeneA · May 22, 2001, 05:20 PM

Great explanations and useful info -- now I just have to decide! You've encouraged me to lean to the combo instead of just the CD-RW I was originally thinking. And then, if I want to 'burn' in the background, buy Toast Titanium. The external CD-RW would be fine for my desktop G4, but for my on-the-go laptop, I want everything in one neat package.

MaxMac · May 22, 2001, 05:26 PM

My thoughts exactly GeneA.

------------------
I love deadlines. They make a whooshing sound as they pass by.

BobVB · May 22, 2001, 06:01 PM

GeneA said:
--------------
Actually the Mac OS DOES NOT use the Rage 128 DVD hardware deciding ability... It can do it but the Mac OS does not use it.... Its all Processor intensive.....
--------------

Not exactly true. In one of the forums (MacFixit? XLR*?) the Voodoo and ATI people got in a bit of heated 'discussion' about the technologies involved. Although the Mac DVD Player does not use the hardware MPEG decoding abilities of the ATI chip it does use a number of other hardware routines of the ATI chipset to display the picture with the lowest CPU usage.

In fact, that's my personal theory why its taking so long to get new OS X compatible DVD player software for the Mac: the NVidia cards don't have the routines that were used before and Apple is either having to totally rewrite the code to take advantage of what codes are there, or redo what used to be done in hardware with new software code (and the corresponding CPU hit that will cause)