Disk First Aid was unable to fix the problem (not sure what the problem is) when my iMac crashed . There was a message to backup my data . I rushed out to buy TechTool Pro 2 ( my friends told me to avoid Norton ) i am still unable to rectify the problem . The application hanged when it got to the File Stuctures ( it stopped at this file ISPF.favourites .html) and the Volume Structure needs to be repaired but the repair option or button or whatever is not visible/available . do i rebuild the volume - will that cause my data to be erased or do i go and backup those file to a 250MB zip drive ? my Internet Explorer hangs and i can't seem to use Netsacpe. it's been 2 weeks .

thanks in advance

[gene]

Rush back to the store and buy DiskWarrior from Alsoft. They also sell it on the web as a downloadable file.

[Don Foy]

Gene is right, get DiskWarrior, but don't download it unless you have a way to burn a bootable CD because DW cannot repair the startup drive. If you buy DW on CD, it will be a bootable CD and by following instructions included, you will be able to repair your drive. You can, however, get purchase the CD version from their web site
http://www.Alsoft.com/DiskWarrior/index.html

thanks .

but i read in the reviews section that Disk Warrior isn't that hot but i'll try DW anyway . can anyone tell me whether TechToolPro actually works ? would Disk Warrior be better ?

thank you .

[wlonh]

DiskWarrior IS THE BEST, PERIOD.

RUN, do not walk, to your store and get it.

It is not that DW is better than TT, they do different things, TT does many things and DiskWarrior does ONE thing (ok... it deletes, rebuilds, and optimises the DIRECTORIES in one procedure) but it does it fantastically... go to www.alsoft.com and check it out.

I do not work for Alsoft nor any other developer... it is just one of the best disk repair apps out there. Whoever wrote that it is 'not that hot' is dead wrong. AND, any repair software (except for DiskWarrior, in my wide and varied experience) can be problematic given any number of situations... I have always used Norton Util's and have NEVER come to grief from using it for over six (if I remember correctly) years on many many Macs and many MacOS'es... I have also had TechTool Pro and it is fine too, I do not own TechTool Pro 2 and have heard mixed reviews of it, and you have had a less than fruitful experience with it yourself...

the absolute bottom line in these matters is this: "YOUR mileage may VARY, REGARDLESS of which utilities package you purchase, regardless of your friend who has the very samne Mac and advises you to buy Software X because it works so well on her/his Mac", with the noted exception of DiskWarrior... could be because it uses NO sharedlibs and other adjunctives, it is a very very straightforward app that does what it is advertised to do.

but it seems i might have to wait a little bit longer - as it seems no one in singapore has that product ( not alot of mac users over here ) resellers or suppliers . might have to import it .

once again thank you .

[Misha]

Given the problem you're describing it looks like DiskWarrior might be the tool for you.

Personally, if I had to pick one utility it would be Norton, then DiskWarrior, then TTP. Norton because it is very good at repair disks and is also the best optimizer out there, DiskWarrior because it can fix most of the HD problems (and now too comes with an optimizer, albeit not as good as Norton), and lastly TTP... becaue while it may do a lot of things, it doesn't really do that many useful things... and the drive repair performance isn't great.

Did you start your mac from the Recover CD? It has a copy of Disk First Aid and a mini macos system.
By the way, I don�t agree with Misha regarding Norton. It SUCKS big time. Period! Symantec released a very buggy software that is ultimately unreliable. Also, Symantec is not commited as the makers of TTPro, whom release a very solid update regularly enough.

[wlonh]

I repeat myself when I'm distressed, I repeat myself when I'm distressed, I repeat myself when I'm distressed... (apologies and a nod to King Crimson)

the absolute bottom line in these matters is this: "YOUR mileage may VARY, REGARDLESS of which utilities package you purchase, regardless of your friend who has the very samne Mac and advises you to buy or NOT buy Software X because it works so well/so terribly on her/his Mac"

Norton would also be my first choice if I had to have only one... I am telling you, if you do not use the features of Norton (i.e., do not do a full install of Norton Utils, no FileSaver, etc... consider Norton Utils as being NDD and Speed Disk ONLY) which require background processes the overwhelming majority of Mac users will be perfectly happy and secure with Norton.

I have read all the horror stories about Norton, they get very highly profiled. What does not get such a high profile are the majority of Norton Utils users that are perfectly happy with Norton Utils and have never experienced the slightest bit of trouble with it.

I have also read some very harrowing tales about TTPro2... so what? Lots of Mac users like it, even if it does do many less than useful widgety things, and it does... so what? They like it, it works for them... lovely!

Diff'rent strokes for diff'rent folks and no two Macs/Mac users are the same, my friend.

[disectamac]

bamabhaj,
you know what I do when I run into a scary error message or frequent inexplicable hangs & crashes? I run every piece of freeware, shareware, and fullware utility I can get my hands on in the shortest possible time and in no particular order. One of em's bound to fix it, but if they don't? what I would do is chuck Internet explorer(if thats the problem child) and re install explorer.
I don't know if you can access www.download.com from over there
but they have the stuff.

I'm sorry if I sound steriotypical, you probably get this asked a million times but, isn't illegal to chew bubble gum in Singapore?
I have to hear it from someone who lives there to believe it.


ps, make sure your updated with the latest version of MS explorer and other Apple updates such as Open Transport. you never know.

[This message has been edited by disectamac (edited 01-25-2000).]

[gene]

You can still download DiskWarrior from Alsoft and place it on another removable media like a Zip drive or an external USB drive. Just make sure that you boot off some kind of CD.

thank you all for info . you do get fined for bringing in chewing gum , just like you can't bring in Cuban cigars into the US of A . i've had friends who go over to Malaysia ( during the weekend ) and smuggled in the mentioned contraband . everyone chews gum in broad daylight , no problem .

to: macen

i did use the CD and it did hang . maybe it's the browser ( came with the free surfing deal ) - it's version 4.5 , that's kinda recent .

[This message has been edited by bamadhaj (edited 01-25-2000).]

I think Disectamac is on the right track, since you can't get DiskWarrior quickly. You can download MS IE from Microsoft and reinstall. It should also be on your Apple system or software discs (which you can start from).
As a last resort you could do a clean install and find all the bits removed in a file on HD and find your settings there. Favorites.html is a file containing Favorites in Explorer. You can copy that to your Zip and trash it and see if that clears things up. I don't know what the ISPF part of the file name you use relates to: possibly to your utility program?
I use Norton and I would expect it to tell me which file is the problem; I would give that file the copy to zip and trash treatment. I've been adventuresome in my short Mac life and have had to reinstall, etc., a number of times: a learning experience.

[wlonh]

Al, no reinstalling of anything is going to help this matter unless you consider reinitialising and reinstalling MacOS...

there is some damage here that has NOT been fixed and installing anything on top of such a problem would doubtless incur more trouble.

read again:

"Disk First Aid was unable to fix the problem (not sure what the problem is) when my iMac crashed... I rushed out to buy TechTool Pro 2... i am still unable to rectify the problem... the Volume Structure (alarms go off here- Moderator) needs to be repaired but the repair option or button or whatever is not visible/available. do i rebuild the volume... ?"

in short: yes, rebuild the volume with DiskWarrior, or clobber it with Norton DiskDoctor.

Well, gee, Wlonh, it worked when Norton said it couldn't fix Sherlock--but what about the clean install suggested as a last resort. The guy said he couldn't get DiskWarrior in Singapore. He maybe wants to fix it now. He could back up his setting on his Zip or find them in the Saved folder after the clean install. Wouldn't that work, and even if he's unable to work out the settings, that's a local problem he should be able to get help with from his ISP. It's not like not being able to get DiskWarrior for some days. So?

but TechTool did have a rebuild volume option . do i try that in the meantime ?

(funnily though TechTool ver 1.1.9 passed my system . no erors whatsoever. )

so where is everyone from ? UK or US ?

[wlonh]

yes do the rebuild option in TechToolPro

and yes Al,if you were to do a clean install, that might help... but if there's a problem with the disk wrapper or something like that, i would certainly feel more secure by reintialising and reinstalling MacOS and not doing a clean install... that is IF i had no utility that could/would fix this volume error.

And Al, whaddaya talkin' "Sherlock" here? where did that come from? when did he get into the subject at hand? that's a curveball... from left field.


bamadhaj, i am a citizen of the USA and i am proud to say that i live in NYC, where all peoples of the world live in a relatively harmonious fashion... yeah sure it is a big noisy city, but it works. Gotham.

[This message has been edited by wlonh (edited 01-25-2000).]

[disectamac]

Hi, I'm from Providence RI and I was shoveling snow all day!!

ok , let's try that "rebuild" option . My other half suggested that I called the reseller to service my iMac . somehow i didn't like the idea . maybe because I'm using a Mac , y'know . it's like mac users can figure out things and maybe a D.I.Y kinda feeling /attitude .

no snow here unless it's the end of the world . been raining though and strong winds too .

danke .

tried the rebuild option .

came out with a message - " created a check volume in memory and has mounted onto your desktop " . the message also asked to check between my current driectory and the check volume directory as to whether it is accurate ( it looks accurate - icons and stuff) but looking at the " Technical Comparison " reveal some unsual changes ( figures in red ) , so i'm now wondering whether i should proceed - my fear is that those figures in red could mean that my system will not fucntion normally after the final rebuild .

TECHNICAL COMPARISON
Current directory check directory
volume information
total files : 9645 total files : 9638(in red)
total items :11273 total items : 11266(in red)

Catalog B tree
leaf records : 22552 leaf records : 22092

[wlonh]

it is as i have suggested, this HD has some major damage (not physical damage, at least i think not) and i am just so very certain it requires DiskWarrior to fix and i am sorry if i sound like a broken record...

you MIGHT get away with doing a 'clean' install, this procedure does not require reinitialisation of the HD, it installs a NEW System Folder and renames the old System Folder to 'Previous System Folder'...

HOWEVER, if you can't get Norton Disk Doctor to fix this volume issue and you can not get DiskWarrior anytime soon, i STRONGLY suggest that you backup all your sensitive and important personal data IMMEDIATELY and reinitialise your HD and do a full install of MacOS... that will surely fix things.

oh yes, something that fell through the cracks of my mind: TechTool 1.1.9's so-called "System" check is a check of the System suitcase, it is NOT a check of the System Folder or anything like that... the nomenclature is somewhat deceiving here. its big brother, TechToolPro2, is a repair/diagnostic/widget software that does many many things the freeware version does not, have you looked into that? could be available where you live... get it on a CD if possible, of course...


[This message has been edited by wlonh (edited 01-26-2000).]

thanks .

[This message has been edited by bamadhaj (edited 01-26-2000).]

ok , i hear you and you don't sound like a broken record . Yes , this HD has some problems but just one last thing , do i continue with the rebuild option or not ?

(my data has been stored elsewhere and I'm waiting for that shipment of Disk Warrior to arrive and wondering whether i should use the hacked/pirated copy of Norton Utilities )

[wlonh]

well, if you have a hacked copy (i will not go into ethics here) of Norton, I'd not use it... I question its integrity...

as for continuing the rebuild, is this a desktop rebuild, done by TechTool 1.1.9?

if so, proceed, it will likely not help much but it should not hurt.

[wlonh]

NOTE to THOSE reading this thread... READ THE WHOLE THREAD CAREFULLY!!!!

this is NOT a simple case of a file being at fault, this person has had a crash of the sort that not only ganked the file, this crash did some really serious damage to the MDB, etc!!!!!

Please, do NOT consider this problem to be only of a "bad file" nature, IT IS NOT.

I have reread, Wlonh, carefully. I have been looking to see where he can download a trial version of Norton, but I could find only stuff for Windows as trail or shareware on their site. I've seen it on CDs that come with Mac books and mags...

You've waited two weeks with this problem? You're having help from the other half? For immediate results the Wlonh's post 710 is the obvious choice. You have a 250MB Zip. Backup like crazy, reinitialize and start over. Or bite the bullet and take it back to the store and let them do it. Or try the clean install, less drastic but evidently not all that certain here. (It does save the old files, though.) Or order DiskWarrior by the most expedient means and wait a little longer: it appears that your description make the moderators feel this is right up this utilities alley. Best of luck. I'm US, Tucson in Arizona, adventursome (with my iMac) as I said: meaning I get myself into fixes it takes time and effort to straighten out.

to wlonh :

what does wlonh mean ? and rebuild option is the rebuild volume option under the expert interface in TechTool Pro 2.5.3 and not ver . 1.1.9 and as far i can understand ( i couldn't find enough documentation in the booklet provided - maybe i should document my experience to them ) the programme has created a new directory from the current (old) directory . that couldn't be the desktop .

besides the system or me for that matter cannot find the IE 4.5 internet preferences file /folder/control panel - is this Y2K ?!!!!

[wlonh]

i meant that i THOUGHT you had TT 1.1.9 (freeware) because you had not been specific as to which version you had early on in this thread and i wnated to be clear that TT freeware does certain things and TTPro does other, that is all... you have done correctly with your version of TT (Pro) and IF you feel that you HD has regained its integrity (scan it with NDD and TTPro again), then rip out all of the IE stuff you can find and start over, or trust the MS IE self-repair routine and just rip out all the IE-associated files in your System Folder and in your Preferences folder and launch IE, it will regenerate the files you trashed...
and you cab download a trial version of NDD and Speed Disk here: http://www.symantec.com/nu/nu_mac/
see the links on right hand side they are labeled "Go!"

'wlonh' is a comglomeration of my name/initials... not too creative huh?

just asking - what is the retail price for Disk Warrior ? I was told that to import it over - it would cost me $799 . HORRIFIC!

besides the guy told me that Code Warrior is the app for the job - isn't that a programmer's kinda thing .

[wlonh]

lord!! 799??? US dollars???

DiskWarrior by Alsoft and Code Warrior are two COMPLETELY (!!!!) different things and yes CW is for developers, whoever told you that CW is what you need has a screw loose.

come on man, go to alsoft.com and see for yourself the price... jeez.

[This message has been edited by wlonh (edited 01-27-2000).]

[TheJoshu]

DiskWarrior should cost you about $70.00 US

TechTool pro has a very funny way of solving my problem - they have 3 interface level { simple/standard/expert} . I get stuck at simple and standard . then when i think that the problem is rectified in expert ( rebuild the volume 3 times in expert ) and on a whim i decide to test again in the standard , the problem is still there and so i'm going back and forth repairing between the standard and expert levels and each time the problem is repaired or the disk is optimized , TechTool Pro will find/flag the same problem and rectify the same problem all over again .

well when i start my imac up ... applescript is not installed , i cannot open jpeg or giff files/pictures that i downloaded from the net or anything QuickTime - some component must be missing ( error -3000) , IE 4.5 hangs or stalls seconds after it is launched but i can open my applications (appleworks , illustrator , etc .) and i can view them and print them out . audio is out - the control panels is out under the monitors and sound .

what's funny or creepy about all this is when i go on the net ( using iCAB - it's faster) and i go to check into hotmail - IT LAUNCHES IE 4.5 ! Bill Gates is far more dangerous than we credit him for .

better go for that Disk Warrior .

[wlonh]

did you get my email, bamadhaj?

wlonh : i didn't get a chance to view - i am using iCAB but when i go to hotmail , it launches IE 4.5 ( i have no idea what triggers the application ) immediately .

anyway , the shop which i got TechTool Pro from , will get for me ( in 1 week 3 days time ) Disk Warrior and it costs SGD$ 280 . and i thought it was $799 . i'm not going to recommend this store to others , staff are most likely windows users or something - not very knowledgeable .

[Nilram]

I hope I'm not beating a dead horse here, but I will give my comments. I am a tech support agent for apple, and deal mostly with iMacs not that all macs are not the same with regards to hard drive errors. What I really want to stress, and what appears to already have happened is the user has backed up their data. THAT IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING. Whenever disk first aid says the problem can not be repaired BACKUP. I to would cast my vote for Diskwarrior (I've seen it do some cool stuff) but backup is far more important that what utility you use to try to repair the problem. if worse comes to worse, backup, initialize and reinstall.

Marlin

------------------
If you would like to contact me, please use my icq number. 8273989

bamadhaj:
While it is true the Norton can do weird things to your computer especially Speed Disk..if you have severe problems that Disk First Aid can't repair then Norton is your best bet. I have been in many of these circumstances with iMac's and it fixed the problems. Give it a go..just open Norton Disk Doctor and run the check on your computer...it can't hurt!

i did try using Norton but it wanted to initialize my disk ???!!!
so i figured i'd better try something else . anyways Disk Warrior is coming in a weeks time . i guess you can't have too many tools if you're a mac user ... in Singapore .

I recommend to use Norton Utilities 4.0 or 5.0. I have OS 8.5.1 and had recently one serious crash, could even start the thing. I used Norton 4.0 CD successively 3 to 4 times until the disk was perfectly fixed. I only had to delete one preference file afterwards.

regards [email protected]

Originally posted by bamadhaj:
Disk First Aid was unable to fix the problem (not sure what the problem is) when my iMac crashed . There was a message to backup my data . I rushed out to buy TechTool Pro 2 ( my friends told me to avoid Norton ) i am still unable to rectify the problem . The application hanged when it got to the File Stuctures ( it stopped at this file ISPF.favourites .html) and the Volume Structure needs to be repaired but the repair option or button or whatever is not visible/available . do i rebuild the volume - will that cause my data to be erased or do i go and backup those file to a 250MB zip drive ? my Internet Explorer hangs and i can't seem to use Netsacpe. it's been 2 weeks .

thanks in advance

finally i have a cure for my iMac - DISK WARRIOR . didn't try Norton anyways . got the disk today and ran the application and everthing is back like normal . applescipt , quicktime , audio - EVERYTHING ! thank god !

thank you to everyone . yeah , i'm back !!!