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Brazuca · Oct 30, 2001, 05:05 PM

I just upgraded to Spooky Peek 6 (OOoooooOOOOooo) and I also downloaded Netscape 6.2 for X. I got to say that even though I prefer OW, Netscape's browser does a much better job at scrolling than either OW or IE. This is also one of my biggest complaints about OW. An improvement in this area would do wonders to improve the feel and the perceived speed of the browser.

Sine · Oct 30, 2001, 06:50 PM

SNP 6 seems to be crashing A LOT more than the previous version.

foamy · Oct 30, 2001, 07:23 PM

Tabs kick ass. This is a must...posting from Mozilla for that reason.

Autocomplete is useless. An IE or mozilla would be better. I do the exact thing the poster above mentioned. Making shortcuts is not a solution.

How about making the splash screen so that the Globe (err pumpkin) is transparent and there is no window behind it (or the window is completely transparent)? I think it would look pretty cool to have the Omni globe just floating there during startup.

FWIW

Sine · Oct 30, 2001, 08:39 PM

Originally posted by foamy:
How about making the splash screen so that the Globe (err pumpkin) is transparent and there is no window behind it (or the window is completely transparent)? I think it would look pretty cool to have the Omni globe just floating there during startup.

FWIW

That would make it hard to see the text with dark backgrounds.

gyc · Oct 30, 2001, 09:23 PM

I remember NCSA Mosaic in their version 3.0 betas doing something similar during Halloween.

The Evener · Oct 30, 2001, 09:42 PM

Okay, that's it -- I'm buying a license for OmniWeb.

Yes, I was waiting until 4.1 hit final, but releasing a "spookypeek" with a pumpkin as the icon shows that these folks are definitely having fun, and sharing it with us at the same time.

Only don't expect me to enter the key/pass once I get it for the browser. I have too much fun reading "warning" dialogues entreating users to help build their Ferrari collection. Let's see some new ones, OmniGroup!

[ 10-30-2001: Message edited by: The Evener ]

Sine · Oct 31, 2001, 12:21 AM

Omniweb still freezes on me when I try to copy text, I have to force quit.

Mongrel · Oct 31, 2001, 12:47 AM

OMNI GUY - I have (what I think) is a great idea for browsers that you could be the first to implement, something I certainly could use, as I'm sure any modem user would appreciate:

Let's say you visit the same web sites every day (like any of us here obviously do). Every day you wait for the same page graphics to load, some big, some little, but annoying anyhow. WHAT IF you could bring down a contextual menu over any graphic on the web, and right there with "save to disk" and "open in new window" is some kind of "Remember this image," kind of like a permenant cache, where even when you quit, logoff, shut down, whatever, that image will always pop right up when you visit again.

That'd be GREAT!!! Right?

Also, will there be any way to personalize our browser buttons?

SMacSteve · Oct 31, 2001, 01:12 AM

Ok, so I've downloaded and installed the sp6 and it seems to work fine. I've installed it on both my systems and they work for the most part without a hitch. I haven't had any crashes yet in the whole 10 min. I've used it on the PB. But what seems to be the deal with those who install it and it immediately crashes. Like instantly after launching OW. I saw this happen on a new QS 867 and this was one at Comp USA. So I reinstalled the 4.06 version that it had on it. This was actually sp5 last week. Does any one know what causes this? I installed it the same way I did on my Macs so what could be wrong with the system that this would happen. I'd like to be able to show it off the the ASC at the Comp USA as he's impressed with the OW 4.06. Any ideas?

Sine · Oct 31, 2001, 02:03 AM

SP6 doesn't seem to like CNN.com. Keeps crashing when I am surfing on it.

Gavin · Oct 31, 2001, 06:05 AM

Hi,

I have a couple of notes for Omni.

Number one is a bug. It looks like the cache is not always updated when I reload a page. If I go back a page I get the first version I downloaded of that page not the updated version. This is with 4.1sp5

Second is a gripe. If I click a link or photo and drag it a little then let go it opens that link or photo in the window. There is no way to change your mind after grabbing it by 'putting it back' like you can with a file in the finder. I would like it to only open the link or photo if you drag it to a new window or the location field, the way it works in explorer and other browsers. Omniweb is the odd man out here.
That may sound a bit petty but I design pages and I find it useful to grab an image and try it out somewhere else on the page using the transparent version. That, and a few other things I do, force me to keep hitting the back button in omniweb. It's the only thing I actually find irritating in an otherwise practically perfect piece of software.

Three is a feature request.
I usually don't have any use for Autocomplete but I started using a web service that makes me log in every time (they don't have persistent session cookies). Their form uses the very original field names of 'name' and 'password'.

Auto complete would be perfect in this case except for the fact that every site in the world uses name, password, address, phone, etc as their field names but I want to enter different data at different sites.

What would make Autocomplete useful to me is if it worked similarly to the way the cookies do, with a way to use different groups of settings for different websites plus a default group. So at my bank Autocomplete enters my home phone number into the 'phone' field, but on another site Autocomplete enters my work phone number into the 'phone' field. etc.

They best way would be if this sort of info could be stored globally with keychain (or something similar) and accessible by any browser (with my permission of course) so if Omni could just buy Apple and take care of this that would be great! ;-)

In other news my overall experience is that 4.1 seems faster and gets much less bogged down when I have tons of windows open.

Thanks and keep up the good work,
Gavin

el_humpo · Oct 31, 2001, 11:54 AM

I just downloaded Netscape 6.2.

Gotta say - the interface is hideous. What's with the mixture of Aqua scroll bars (on drop-down lists for example) and Netscape's own scroll bars?!?

However, it scrolls much faster than OmniWeb 4.1sp6 on my Pismo - I'm hoping OmniGroup will be able to increase the scroll speed by 4.1 final.

Also, it renders Anandtech (www.anandtech.com) properly - the right side table doesn't take most of the page like it does in OW.

Neo.cmg · Oct 31, 2001, 01:10 PM

I tend to think that OW sp6 crashes a bit more often than I have ever experienced with sp builds thus far. I'm on a QS Dual 800 machine. I've also noticed that scrolling has gotten worse also....

Neo.cmg

malvolio · Oct 31, 2001, 02:25 PM

Gavin wrote:
Three is a feature request.
I usually don't have any use for Autocomplete but I started using a web service that makes me log in every time (they don't have persistent session cookies). Their form uses the very original field names of 'name' and 'password'.

Try Mozilla. It has a really neat feature that allows you to store any website username and password, and will store the data in an encrypted file if you tell it to.
At each login page, it asks you if you want to add the name and pw to your stored data. You can enter "Yes," "No," or "Never for this site." Select "Yes" and it asks you for the encryption password (if you have chosen encrypted storage, like I have), and then automatically completes the name & pw fields for you.

Sine · Oct 31, 2001, 02:28 PM

Originally posted by Neo.cmg:
I tend to think that OW sp6 crashes a bit more often than I have ever experienced with sp builds thus far. I'm on a QS Dual 800 machine. I've also noticed that scrolling has gotten worse also....

Neo.cmg

Same here.. it's almost like the crash app is TOO quick to declare a crash.. sometimes I can still be using omni while the thing is going off.

Sine · Oct 31, 2001, 04:03 PM

BTW it seems "cmd-clicking" on a link seems to be the cause of all my crashes in SP5 and 6

The times It crashes.. I am usually doing the cmd-click on a link.

maximawoo · Oct 31, 2001, 04:26 PM

Well, sneakypeek 7 is out. This version crashes a lot less. I do have question regarding downloads. I remember if i downloaded a file, say a .mov, after it downloaded it would automatically launch QT. Now, after I downloaded the file, it pops up the finder where it is located. Is there anyway to change this back? Or is this a security hazard?

Great work OmniGroup.

Mr_Solar_Wind · Oct 31, 2001, 04:27 PM

Seems to crash on me about every other time I launch the application, when it doesn't crash on launch its days are numbered... Never had this problem in sp1-sp5...

After 5 crashes in approximately and hour of use, I hereby declare OmniWeb 4.1sp6 "OmniWeb 4.1 Toonces Edition."

BZ · Oct 31, 2001, 05:16 PM

Is it just me or is downloading the next Sneaky (or spooky) peak from OmniGroup one of the more enjoyable things you can do.

7 is here? Great! Can't wait to get home.

BZ

sandman · Oct 31, 2001, 06:19 PM

I'm using sp7 and the download issue persists. Instead of launching the helper application, such as StuffIt, the file just comes up (for me the download folder opens). This is pretty annoying. Other than that, no crashes thus far, but scrolling is still slow.

Francisco Pires · Oct 31, 2001, 06:25 PM

Is there no support to Java? I�m looking for a browser that access Internet Banking... I tested IE 5.2, Opera, NS6.2, etc, but they don�t work ok with java I.B.

If OW 4.1 work it would be great feature.

PS: I�m testing SP7, but it does not work with JAVA yet...

Guy Incognito · Oct 31, 2001, 07:34 PM

Originally posted by sandman:
I'm using sp7 and the download issue persists. Instead of launching the helper application, such as StuffIt, the file just comes up (for me the download folder opens). This is pretty annoying. Other than that, no crashes thus far, but scrolling is still slow.

I think it's a security measure...how would you like it if Virus.app launched itself onto your computer after download (ok, so apps don't launch automatically but you get the point.)

Also, I found the scrolling to be actually much faster in sp7 than any previous versions.

Pages render quickly...and I haven't had a crash yet so far either.

Neo.cmg · Oct 31, 2001, 08:42 PM

Originally posted by sandman:
I'm using sp7 and the download issue persists. Instead of launching the helper application, such as StuffIt, the file just comes up (for me the download folder opens). This is pretty annoying. Other than that, no crashes thus far, but scrolling is still slow.

Yeah, I noticed this too. It may be a security measure, but I think I would rather be able to at least turn it off. I find it annoying that the desktop finder window pops up anyways. There is no reason for this whatsoever. I can see things on the desktop, and I don't need to be shown this in my file hierarchy finder window. I'm downloading sp7 now. I hope omnigroup puts this back the way it was....

Neo.cmg

SMacSteve · Oct 31, 2001, 10:01 PM

So when is the eta on the 4.1 final release?

jog · Oct 31, 2001, 10:50 PM

OmniWeb. this is so great. thanks guys.

X Cal · Oct 31, 2001, 11:24 PM

Well it looks like I've got another thing to download when I get home in an hour. Its great fun watching the progression of OmniWeb through the sneaky/spookypeaks. Only thing is i want to keep that AWESOME pumpkin icon. I better save it before its lost forever

Callum

Sine · Nov 1, 2001, 12:21 AM

Yeah I save the Spooky Peek too

SP7 seems fast and solid so far.

rw · Nov 1, 2001, 01:21 AM

Originally posted by Gavin:

Second is a gripe. If I click a link or photo and drag it a little then let go it opens that link or photo in the window. There is no way to change your mind after grabbing it by 'putting it back' like you can with a file in the finder. I would like it to only open the link or photo if you drag it to a new window or the location field, the way it works in explorer and other browsers. Omniweb is the odd man out here.

For the record, Gavin's "gripe" is one of my favorite features. Oh, well ... I guess you can't please everybody

Gavin · Nov 1, 2001, 02:45 AM

I'm a control freak!

Sharky K. · Nov 1, 2001, 02:46 AM

SP7 renders menu's at www.tweakers.net now but when I go to a link on this page and go back sometimes the rendering is messed up. When (doesn't want to work sometimes) I want to reload it renders almost as good as in IE/Mozilla.

Less crashes with SP7
btw, whith an OmniWeb "crash" I just hide the "bom" and I could continue my browsing

el_humpo · Nov 1, 2001, 03:53 AM

Just installed sneaky peek 7. I'm having a lot of fun keeping up with the development of OW - sneaky peeks are great!

One question tho; when will we get back Verdana? According to the release notes on OmniGroup's web site, Verdana was removed in version 4.0.1:

Temporarily disabled the Verdana font (substituting Arial instead), since the metrics reported by the text system make line heights much taller than they are on other systems, breaking pages which are sensitive to precise text layout (like www.msnbc.com).

Verdana works fine in IE and Netscape for OS X. A few of my own sites have used it, and I'd like to see OW support it again.

Keep up the good work!

Zadian · Nov 1, 2001, 06:44 AM

Originally posted by Gavin:
I'm a control freak!

Move the icon or link to the Menubar and let it there go. This way the icon or link will return to its place without doing anything (like in the finder).

Sharky K. · Nov 1, 2001, 09:00 AM

one word:
"iframe"

Still no iframe support!!!

(iframe is not "internet" frame but internal (i thought) frame)

[ 11-01-2001: Message edited by: Sharky K. ]

BZ · Nov 1, 2001, 09:02 AM

Sneaky Peek 7 is very nice.

Improved:
- Scrolling speed (better)
- Stability
- Download launching
- OmniWeb CPU resources (seems to take up less when idle and none when just open)
- Now works with Bank of America online banking (YEAH!)

Suggestions:
- Make download launching an option
- Build in separators in bookmarks
- Make dock icon book marks an option (I have hundreds of bookmarks and it just takes over my screen)

Bugs:
- Still has problems rendering large long simple pages (try a big Analog report for an example)
- Some javascript issues (try http://www.salomonsmithbarney.com no left nav?)
- Refresh problem. In the Zope management interface when you delete something from a folder it does not reload the folder after the delete. You have to do a manual "reload frame".

(this post was sent to [email protected])

The good news is I have not opened up IE in like a week.

BZ

NosniboR80 · Nov 1, 2001, 10:25 AM

Ok, i've found one thing that OWsp7 can do that IE can't. I was unable to unsubscribe from fink-users-digest under IE. Decryption error! OW handled it no problem. Probably something wrong with my computer or the site rather than IE. But who knows, maybe Fink just hates M$!

GRAFF · Nov 1, 2001, 10:28 AM

Originally posted by BZ:
Sneaky Peek 7 is very nice.

- Now works with Bank of America online banking (YEAH!)

BZ

Unfortunately, I still can't log on to my Cr�dit Lyonnais account (which I can do on IE and Netscape 6.2 for 10.1)

https://interactif.creditlyonnais.fr/

BZ · Nov 1, 2001, 10:37 AM

Originally posted by GRAFF:


Unfortunately, I still can't log on to my Cr�dit Lyonnais account (which I can do on IE and Netscape 6.2 for 10.1)

https://interactif.creditlyonnais.fr/

It is possible that they are blocking anything BUT IE and Netscape.

BZ

Guy Incognito · Nov 1, 2001, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by Sharky K.:
one word:
"iframe"

Still no iframe support!!!

(iframe is not "internet" frame but internal (i thought) frame)

[ 11-01-2001: Message edited by: Sharky K. ]

Ummm...it does support iframes...I post on ArsTechnica forums using OW and they have iframes to show the thread you're replying in.

Membranophonist · Nov 1, 2001, 04:08 PM

Does anyone know what all speech commands are available with 4.1sp7? I'm rather pleased to see that Omni has incorporated Speech control into the app, but the documentation is not yet available.

Obviously not a pressing issue, but hey!

Good job, Omni Group!

Brazuca · Nov 1, 2001, 04:25 PM

Originally posted by GRAFF:


Unfortunately, I still can't log on to my Cr�dit Lyonnais account (which I can do on IE and Netscape 6.2 for 10.1)

https://interactif.creditlyonnais.fr/

Really? Why don't you let me try? ;p

GRAFF · Nov 1, 2001, 05:36 PM

Originally posted by BZ:


It is possible that they are blocking anything BUT IE and Netscape.

BZ

Good point. I'll write to their tech support and find out

Sharky K. · Nov 1, 2001, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by Guy Incognito:


Ummm...it does support iframes...I post on ArsTechnica forums using OW and they have iframes to show the thread you're replying in.

try this:
<BLOCKQUOTE>code:<HR><pre>
<html> <head> <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1"> <title>iframe</title> </head> <body bgcolor="#ffffff"> <iframe src="http://www.apple.com/" scrolling="yes" marginwidth=0 marginheight=0 frameborder=0 vspace=0 hspace=0 width=100 height=100></iframe> </body> </html>
[/code]

btw an other thing. When I click on a link OmniWeb still loads the website with the link but I want to the next page.

[ 11-01-2001: Message edited by: Sharky K. ]

Rickster · Nov 1, 2001, 06:55 PM

Hmm... betcha we'll hit seven pages soon.

Also, will there be any way to personalize our browser buttons? - Well, you're welcome to open up the app package and replace TIFF files.

If I click a link or photo and drag it - I'd like to do what IE and Netscape have done on the Mac, where the window is only a drag target for drags initiated within it if you drag the link outside and back in, but I'm not sure that's possible in Cocoa. On the other hand, some people like it this way. Anyway -- Mac drag-and-drop UI has always allowed dragging to the menu bar as a means of canceling a drag.

secure storage for passwords in web-based forms - something we've already been researching for 5.0.

sometimes you can still use OmniWeb after it crashes - This sometimes happens when a background thread crashes. You can't keep using if forever, though... sooner or later it'll need to use that crashed background thread again, and it'll barf.

Now, after I downloaded the file, it pops up the finder where it is located. - This is a partially implemented security feature -- it'll be fleshed out before we ship 4.1 final. We realized that our existing system (in which clicking on a link would download and then open the file) would be bad for certain file types: for example, in 10.1, downloading a Java JAR file would cause it to be run automatically. So we're working on finding a way to make sure that clicking a link doesn't cause code to be executed on your machine without you expecting it, but other files will automatically download and open just as they did before.

I find it annoying that the desktop finder window pops up anyways. - I looked into this earlier, and it looks like it's a problem with -[NSWorkspace selectFile:inFileViewerRootedAtPath:] (a method in the Cocoa frameworks). Maybe we should workaround this by just not selecting the file if it's on the desktop. Or maybe we can use AppleScript as a kludgy workaround.

Make download launching an option - Done. Our UI paradigm is that, if you single-(left-)click on a link, you want to see the file that link points to. So, if it's a file OmniWeb can display, it'll take you there in the browser window. If it's not, it'll download the file and open it as if double-clicked in the Finder. If you want to save a file to disk without opening it, do the same as if you wanted to do that to an HTML file: control-/right-click on the link and choose Save. We don't think we should have different UI for links to file we can display than for links to files we can't, especially since you could have a plugin that allows us to natively display more data types.

Build in separators in bookmarks - Done. Bookmarks that have no label, URL, or children appear with no icon, so you can use them as separators. And there's a shortcut to creating one in the Bookmarks > Edit Bookmarks menu.

Make dock icon book marks an option - Done. See Bookmark Preferences. That's three for three!

It is possible that they are blocking anything BUT IE and Netscape. ... in which case you can use Compatibility Preferences to fool them.

Does anyone know what all speech commands are available with 4.1sp7? - See the Error Log window for now; in the final version we'll be using the Speech Commands window.

iamnotmad · Nov 2, 2001, 01:34 AM

Originally posted by The Evener:
Okay, that's it -- I'm buying a license for OmniWeb.

Yes, I was waiting until 4.1 hit final, but releasing a "spookypeek" with a pumpkin as the icon shows that these folks are definitely having fun, and sharing it with us at the same time.

Only don't expect me to enter the key/pass once I get it for the browser. I have too much fun reading "warning" dialogues entreating users to help build their Ferrari collection. Let's see some new ones, OmniGroup!

[ 10-30-2001: Message edited by: The Evener ]

Wherer can I get this icon? sounds neat, and sp6 has been replaced with 7.

AirSluf · 02:07 AM

Sharky K. · Nov 2, 2001, 03:24 AM

- pop menu's in prefs have blue border
- same as radio buttons in prefs

I now see the "privacy" feature :-) didn't know before. great.
- It would be great if you could make rules like in Mail with privacy.

If this URL http://www.apple.com/quicktime/ads/
Then load all images

If this URL http://gathering.tweakers.net/
Then Load all images that are not from server
Then do not load ad's

for example.

- Can't add bookmarks to an empty bookmark folder in the bookmark drawer

- When I get info from a bookmark I can't change it

[ 11-02-2001: Message edited by: Sharky K. ]

BZ · Nov 2, 2001, 12:34 PM

Rick... you (and OmniGroup) rock so hard it hurts.

OmniWeb is growing up nicely. 4.1 SP 7 is dream. I can't imagine what 5.0 will do.

Keep up the great work.

BZ

Ron Goodman · Nov 2, 2001, 12:44 PM

sp7 is nice, and more stable. The NYTimes web page is still missing a lot of it's content in the lower half of the page though.

rsh · Nov 2, 2001, 01:58 PM

Originally posted by Rickster:
Hmm... betcha we'll hit seven pages soon.

Well.. here's my contribution to the seven pages mark. javascript: x()

Like others, I had been waiting for the official 4.1 to buy a license. After downloading Sneaky Peek 7 I took the plunge today.. hell with it. The Omni folks have been exemplary developers within the Mac community and deserve the support in my view, even if I am never able to play my beloved Yahoo Literati in OmniWeb.

A question: I can't figure out how the Google shortcut is supposed to work. I know that there must be some arcane bit of magic that lets me lookup a term as part of the shortcut, but darned it I can figure out what it is. Can someone help?

LordJavac · Nov 2, 2001, 04:07 PM

Never mind.

[ 11-02-2001: Message edited by: LordJavac ]