[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye_a

And "Take it like a man" ? goMac dosent seem to have an issue with lack of HD support as do most people. maybe you should take it "like a man" ?

Because he is 19, has no HD TV and took a year to save for a DS. You really think he represents serious gamers?

[MinM]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet

...serious gamers...

Oxymoron alert!

Games are supposed to be fun, not serious.

[ort888]

Just for sh*ts and giggles, I just set my 360 to 480p and flipped the switch on the cord from HD to standard. Holy crap, there is a world of difference. Not a tiny difference, a huge difference.

All of the games looked absolutely terrible in comparison. Like night and day. I was actually shocked. I really didn't think it would be THAT noticeable.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by ort888

Just for sh*ts and giggles, I just set my 360 to 480p and flipped the switch on the cord from HD to standard. Holy crap, there is a world of difference. Not a tiny difference, a huge difference.

All of the games looked absolutely terrible in comparison. Like night and day. I was actually shocked. I really didn't think it would be THAT noticeable.

I did the same thing by accident and thought my TV was broken. Seriously.

[Hawkeye_a]

Originally Posted by ort888

The thing about HD support is this. To a lot of people, it doesn't matter... but to people with an HDTV, it matters a lot.

So while adding HD support hurts no one, removing it turns off a lot of HDTV owners.

How much more can it possibly cost? I mean, the Xbox and PS2 both have HD support, so what's the big deal? I think it might have to do with compatibility with the magic wand technology. Maybe it is tough to program it to work with different pixel counts and screen sizes.

At any rate, I'm cautiously optimistic about the Revolution. If it turns out cool, and is relatively cheap, I'll probably get one. But if it doesn't support HD, then that will be a huge turnoff to me.

I'm not even going to bother trying to speculate about it though, since it's silly to do right now... seeing as how little we actually know about it. I also thought the DS was retarded at first, but It's really grown on me.

I agree with you on the HD. excluding it caould harm it, but including it wont have any negative reprocussions, except a negligable difference in price.

But like you i am casually optomistic. this is Nintendo after all, with a record of under-hyping and over delivering everytime in every aspect of video games. i'd say being an anti-Nintendo idiot is not justified. especially given the f*ckups of Microsoft and Sony in they gaming hardware which lags behind in innovation and quality.

[Hawkeye_a]

"the 3D controller that Nintendo is onto is a very good idea. If you look at today’s controller with triangles, Xs, squares and circles, it’s scary. It’s like a keyboard. People are interface phobic." - Atari Founder Nolan Bushnell

http://www.revolutionreport.com/inde...de=read&id=208

Hmmm...obviously he hasnt a clue about the video game industry or video games in general. oh wait...hes the founder of Atari. funny he dosent mention poygons, mhzs and gigaflops, cause as we all know thats what makes great games these days. some people

[starman]

Screenshot of River Raid on the Revolution:

[goMac]

Originally Posted by starman

Screenshot of River Raid on the Revolution:

Oh no! Those graphics look awful!

Oh wait. They really don't. In fact they look pretty awesome for a scroller.

It's no Unreal 2007, but if Atari can throw together an engine and make it look like that, the Revolution must have some power behind it.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet

Because he is 19, has no HD TV and took a year to save for a DS. You really think he represents serious gamers?

Huh? In that time-frame I "saved" I bought myself a 3.8 ghz P4 and went to WWDC. No I didn't "save". I didn't "buy". I waited until there was a game I wanted to buy. In fact, this month I'm buying my girlfriend a DS, a month after I got mine.

[ort888]

Nintendo has during recent months remained publicly quiet on its next-generation console, codenamed Revolution, but even so the company has taken behind-the-scenes steps to prepare development studios for the platform. We spoke with multiple software houses either creating software for or experimenting with the machine in its still incomplete stage and have been able to compile some new technical details.

Readers are advised to make two notes before continuing with this article. The first is that developers are still working with incomplete Revolution hardware. Most studios are, in fact, developing on "GameCube-based kits," according to major software houses we spoke to, which have asked to remain anonymous. The second is that developers are still without final specifications for Revolution's ATI-developed graphics chip, codenamed Hollywood.

That stated, many third parties have been partially briefed by Nintendo representatives about the Revolution hardware, its overall horsepower, and the Big N's plan for the console. Based on the information studios have relayed to us, Revolution is truly poised to cater to an altogether different game market than either Microsoft or Sony with their Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 consoles respectively. Nintendo's machine will simply not deliver the same graphic horsepower as its competitors. Revolution is all about the controller and what it can do for gameplay experiences.

When Revolution was initially unveiled, a Nintendo executive said it would be "two-to-three times more powerful than GameCube." The company never commented on Revolution's horsepower again and we were later told that the initial statement was incorrect. However, according to development houses, that description accurately sums up Revolution's power.

"To be honest, it's not much more powerful than an Xbox. It's like a souped up Xbox," a major third party source revealed to us. "But it's the controller that makes the difference and the controller is really nice."

Nintendo has said all along that sheer horsepower has not been a priority with Revolution. Rather, the company hopes to make the console small, quiet and affordable. It is very likely for this reason that the Big N chose not to make Revolution compatible with the emerging 720p, 1080i and 1080p high-definition video resolutions, which are focuses for competing consoles.

Gamers holding out for Nintendo to reverse its stance on the HD front may be in for a disappointment. Revolution will not have the RAM capacity to store and display an abundant source of high-definition textures. Third parties have revealed to us that the console will top out with 128MBs of RAM, and possibly even less. One studio would not give us an exact figure, but did say, "The same as GameCube plus an extra 64MB of main RAM." That number is by comparison nearly triple the amount of memory in GameCube. However, it is a far cry from the 512MBs present in Xbox 360.

One studio we spoke to hinted at the possibility of accessing further Revolution RAM, but its comments were cryptic. "There is more RAM that you can use, but Nintendo is using that for general memory, like game saves and all sorts of other things. You could use it, but you can't rely on it." This comment seems to suggest that developers might be able to tap into Revolution's 512MBs of on-board Flash memory, but to our knowledge such a solution would be too slow to utilize in games.

Still, the studios we spoke with are still very intrigued by Revolution and are not ruling out the possibility of additional graphic horsepower. No developer that chatted with us had, or was willing to share, details on the console's GPU, Hollywood. One studio said: "As soon as we find out what it can do then we'll know if Revolution will just be like an Xbox or something a little more."

Asked if it was developing for Revolution, one major third party source said that it was well past the experimental stage and was evaluating what types of games might work on the platform. "We are looking at it quite differently. It's like another current generation platform for us. But it's such a nice controller that it opens up a lot of possibilities. It's very different and it's very precise."

Finally, quizzed about publishers' internal reaction to the device, a source responded: "People are interested, but they're still taking it all in at the moment. I'm sure [Nintendo is] going to get a fair amount of support. Probably a lot of people will initially look at existing franchises and whether or not they can kind of do customized versions for Revolution using most of the assets they've got. But whether they'll say, "Okay, let's do something completely original for it," that's the other question because it could be quite expensive to do that. Not as expensive as doing a PS3 or Xbox 360 game. But if you're a third party and you want to do cross platform, if you're doing a game on 360 you can do it on PS3 or PC using the same assets and that does make it a bit easier."

Nintendo has consistently downplayed the role of horsepower with Revolution, often saying that graphics have reached a "saturation point" in today's games. Nintendo bigwig Shigeru Miyamoto has suggested that players might not be able to tell the difference between the new Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess and some high-definition games.

The Big N will reveal much more about Revolution beginning early next year, according to company executives, and will show first games at the Electronics Entertainment Expo 2006 next May in Los Angeles. Stay tuned for more.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by ort888

Most studios are, in fact, developing on "GameCube-based kits," according to major software houses we spoke to

Paging SWG.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by starman

Screenshot of River Raid on the Revolution:

"Before anyone gets all giddy, it should be known that the developer (NIBRI) of these screens has no official Revolution development kit or publisher ready to distribute the game. That said, the above image comes from the game entitled Raid of the River. Actual screens were developed on a PC and in a recent interview with Revolution Report, the developer said: ”[NIBRI] would like to do this game directly for Revolution and DS. Only Nintendo platforms [will] get this game.”
If the company is truly wishing to get on board with a Revolution publisher, best of luck to them. More developers is only a good thing. But given the lack of Revolution knowledge, tech specs, and mostly the controller, it’s tough to tell what the company could do with this one. Take this with the largest dose of salt Joystiq has ever prescribed and comment if you got ‘em.'


http://www.joystiq.com/entry/1234000263070998/

[meelk]

I remember when Nintendo downplayed the power of the gamecube, and it turned out fine. This has been Nintendo's party line for awhile now, get used to it folks. I am admittedly one of those people who enjoys Nintendo product more than anything else tho. It really bothered me to have to sell my gamecube with a slew of games to pay for school books at one time.
Its easy to see the Rev will not be as powerful as the other systems but in the long run I dont know how much it matters. It will have a price tag of HALF of what they have as well. People seem to be skipping that very important point in their overzealous arguments about system "power".
If I cant play Mario, F-Zero, Zelda on it, I dont really want it. If those games dont appeal to you, fine and dandy move along, but dont bother argueing with me or anyone else who likes Nintendo, as you wont change our minds.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by meelk

I remember when Nintendo downplayed the power of the gamecube, and it turned out fine.

Actually they bragged that it is better than the PS2.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

Actually they bragged that it is better than the PS2.

And it was...

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by goMac

And it was...

In SOME ways yes. I have always agreed with that.

In many other ways NO. Like developer support, HD support, storage, "image" and audio quality.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Holy CRAP the Rev is a YEAR away. That's more trouble:

http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/revolut...-06-141165.php

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

In SOME ways yes. I have always agreed with that.

In many other ways NO. Like developer support, HD support, storage, "image" and audio quality.

Playstation 2 might have been more powerful but it was horribly crippled by the lack of RAM.

The person next door to me has programmed for the Playstation 2. He will gladly tell you exactly that (he still prefers the Playstation despite the graphical limits for the limit).

Gamecubes generous RAM for the time allowed for bigger levels, easier development, better graphics and better audio (Playstation sometimes tried to cheat around this by using CD-Audio).

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by goMac

Playstation 2 might have been more powerful but it was horribly crippled by the lack of RAM.

True, but it didn't show and developers later on learned how to properly use the CPU so it didn't matter. Read up about it before you reply and make yourself look silly.

Give me the BEST looking GameCube game (say RE4) and put it against PS2's GT4 in 1080i will beat the crap out of it in visuals and sound.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

Give me the BEST looking GameCube game (say RE4) and put it against PS2's GT4 in 1080i will beat the crap out of it in visuals and sound.

Hmmm... Give me a game that for PS2 that looks better than Twilight Princess. We know what that looks like. We even have gameplay movies.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by goMac

Hmmm... Give me a game that for PS2 that looks better than Twilight Princess. We know what that looks like. We even have gameplay movies.

GT4 and Twilight hasn't shipped. Not to mention it should look better considering it is coming out over a year and a half after GT4!

[meelk]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

Actually they bragged that it is better than the PS2.

I remember no such thing. (and it is anyway, so point?)

[Hawkeye_a]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

Holy CRAP the Rev is a YEAR away. That's more trouble:

http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/revolut...-06-141165.php

Nintendo has announced that ? Even IF that were true, i wouldnt be too worried. Nintendo = videogames. people will buy the revolution, either if its released tomorrow or 10 years from now. If i were you id be more concerned about Sony having no online strategy at all, or getting that XBox360 of your back from repairs. lol.

Seeing as how, its the technophiles the PS3 and XB brand caters too, id wager that those problems would be alienating their niche audience with little to no appeal to anyone else. bad business, bad technology, bad quality, high prices, fewer games, more expensive games, no online multiplayer. Oh, but everything(if anything) with be in dual HD !!! ohhhhhhhh...ahhhhhhh lol. Oh hows that pathetic disc capasity on the XB360 treating ya ? lol...seeing as how thats what you keep whining about the cube, i wonder why you dont seem to have much of an issue with the XB360. ...fanboy to the max. and surprisingly clueless about quality videogames as well.

Oh, dont mean to rain on your parade, but a game in HD does not make it the greatest videogame ever. get used to it.

[Hawkeye_a]

Originally Posted by meelk

I remember no such thing. (and it is anyway, so point?)

I agree. if anything i remember them downplaying graphics, which is night n day better than the PS2(which btw, cannot produce "toy story-like graphics" lol). The controller was better and there were far more AAA games and revolutionary games on the Cube than on the PS2. but thats just bragging now .... how many games from the PS1 do you remember ? Now mention the N64 and you'll hear a load of them....the same seems to be happening with the PS2 vs GCN. but hey....some(like SWB) prioritize quantity, others(such as myself) prefer quality.

[starman]

how many games from the PS1 do you remember?

Off the top of my head:

Final Fantasy VII-IX
Crash Bandicoot 1 & 2
Silent Hill
Tekken 1-3
Tomb Raider
Dark Forces
Episode 1 Racer
Dino Crisis
DDR
Atari Archives
Best of Activision
Metal Gear Solid
Tony Hawk
Spyro
Driver
Madden
Resident Evil
Chrono Trigger
Crazy Taxi
Soul Reaver
Spider-Man
Syphon Filter
Parappa the Rapper

As for "more AAA games", you're full of sh*t. The PS2 has had substantially more AAA games than the GC could ever dream of.

Go to ign.com and do a search on reviews and click on "9" (neither platform has a game with a rating of "10"). You'll see THREE TIMES as many PS2 games with a rating of 9 or above than the GC.

As for the N64, there are very few games I remember for it:

Zelda (OoT and MM)
Turok 2
Shadows of the Empire
Rogue Squadron
Mario 64
Superman (wasn't that the worst game ever made?)
Starfox 64

[realmeatychunks]

Originally Posted by starman

As for the N64, there are very few games I remember for it:

Zelda (OoT and MM)
Turok 2
Shadows of the Empire
Rogue Squadron
Mario 64
Superman (wasn't that the worst game ever made?)
Starfox 64

My only problem with this is that you somehow don't remember Golden Eye, Perfect Dark, and Super Smash Brothers!

[starman]

Originally Posted by realmeatychunks

My only problem with this is that you somehow don't remember Golden Eye, Perfect Dark, and Super Smash Brothers!

That's because I had to run to a meeting. I have PD on cart still. Smash Brothers I never got, and Goldeneye I just hated.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by meelk

I remember no such thing. (and it is anyway, so point?)

The point is he said they downplayed the GameCube specs also and it turned out alight.

Wrong. they bragged about them and the end result always looked better on an Xbox.

Find me one game for both or all three systems where the cube looked better.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

"“To be honest, it’s not much more powerful than an Xbox. It’s like a souped up Xbox.” Having 128MB of RAM will do that to you. “But it’s the controller that makes the difference and the controller is really nice.”

Not only that, “third parties have been partially briefed by Nintendo representatives about the Revolution hardware, its overall horsepower, and the Big N’s plan for the console,” and some have confirmed an earlier (mis)statement that the Revolution will only be “two-to-three times more powerful than GameCube”—without counting the Hollywood graphics chip, of course. IGN’s other big caveat: these devs are still working with “GameCube-based kits,” revealing that nothing’s set in silicon quite yet."

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

"“To be honest, it’s not much more powerful than an Xbox. It’s like a souped up Xbox.” Having 128MB of RAM will do that to you. “But it’s the controller that makes the difference and the controller is really nice.”

Not only that, “third parties have been partially briefed by Nintendo representatives about the Revolution hardware, its overall horsepower, and the Big N’s plan for the console,” and some have confirmed an earlier (mis)statement that the Revolution will only be “two-to-three times more powerful than GameCube”—without counting the Hollywood graphics chip, of course. IGN’s other big caveat: these devs are still working with “GameCube-based kits,” revealing that nothing’s set in silicon quite yet."

Wasn't I the one who told you it sounded like they were using GameCube based dev kits because the GPU probably hadn't shipped yet?

[meelk]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

The point is he said they downplayed the GameCube specs also and it turned out alight.

Wrong. they bragged about them and the end result always looked better on an Xbox.

Find me one game for both or all three systems where the cube looked better.

find me a statement where nintendo *ever* bragged about their graphical capabilities. you seem to be the ONLY person in this thread who remembers this version of history.
FYI: sure the xbox was prettier, but it also cost $100 more at retail, and MS did nothing but LOSE money on it. Nintendo did not.

[meelk]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

The point is he said they downplayed the GameCube specs also and it turned out alight.

Wrong. they bragged about them and the end result always looked better on an Xbox.

Find me one game for both or all three systems where the cube looked better.

actually IGN had a large article where they gave the nod to Prince of persia on the cube over both the other versions. Please dont try to defend the PS2 as some graphical powerhouse. Its simply not the case. Sony has what, ONE game running at 1080i and you latch on to that like its gods gift to the world. Ive seen it, its pretty damn ugly. 99.9999% of everything else on the system wont even run in 480p, when a substantial number of cube games will.
You reek of fanboy.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by meelk

find me a statement where nintendo *ever* bragged about their graphical capabilities. you seem to be the ONLY person in this thread who remembers this version of history.

From the Press releases from Nintendo:

"Designed to optimize the gameplay experience, the system features the best technology in each field including the main memory and embedded memory, both with very low latency enabled by 1T-SRAM technology, a proprietary optical disc and a wireless Wavebird controller."

BEST TECHNOLOGY IN EACH FIELD?!!! They also seem rather keen on mentioning technobabble.

""In just the past few years, the graphic improvement in video games has been stunning. S3 will be a major force in accelerating the performance we'll achieve on Dolphin," explained Howard Lincoln, Chairman, Nintendo of America Inc. "With their unique graphics compression technology, developers will be able to provide players with more complex and colorful graphics. Coupled with our previously announced strategic agreements with companies like IBM, Matsushita, ArtX and MoSys, incorporation of S3 technology will make Dolphin a console without equal."

WOW NO EQUAL EH.

This is the best one:

"Nintendo is also working with Matsushita to create an online gaming network that aims to make the competition shudder. Information about the network, code named N1E2x8T, has been leaking out during the past few weeks.

Shigeru Mayamoto, a Nintendo design team member, said: "I'm very interested in online gaming, and I fully understand why people are so enthusiastic. But if it ever came to the stage where we were talking about online gaming, it would be because we had a new way to approach the idea. It wouldn't just be because everyone else is doing it."

If rumours are to be believed, the network will allow for 32 players to play against another 32 opponents - another first. Although the network is still in development, it is hoped to have it finished within six months of the Dolphin's launch."

YA IT REALLY MADE XBOX's SHUTTER

"Nintendo has already said that the WORST games (graphics-wise) for Dolphin will have graphics similar to the movie Toy Story."

"Nintendo has already stated that not only will the Dolphin be regarded as a technological marvel the day it is released, but four years later it still will be considered greatness."

Tons more but I can't be bothered.

[goMac]

Remember when the Dolphin was announced the XBox wasn't. Nintendo was only comparing the Playstation, and they were right on the mark. Also S3 graphics was dropped in favor of ATI, most likely improving the graphics more.

Nintendo never said they were working on an online gaming network. A rumor said that. I thought Nintendo made it quite clear it was only under consideration.

[meelk]

and this is differerent from Sony saying the PS2 would do everything except give you oral sex, along with their pre-rendered presentations of things like ridge racer that never actually showed up? please, dont play this like Nintendo is the only company tht ever issues a press release, at least they dont go overboard.
btw: nintendos network is free for any nintendo 1st party game. Microsofts isnt
nintendo is getting there.

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

From the Press releases from Nintendo:

"Designed to optimize the gameplay experience, the system features the best technology in each field including the main memory and embedded memory, both with very low latency enabled by 1T-SRAM technology, a proprietary optical disc and a wireless Wavebird controller."

BEST TECHNOLOGY IN EACH FIELD?!!! They also seem rather keen on mentioning technobabble.

""In just the past few years, the graphic improvement in video games has been stunning. S3 will be a major force in accelerating the performance we'll achieve on Dolphin," explained Howard Lincoln, Chairman, Nintendo of America Inc. "With their unique graphics compression technology, developers will be able to provide players with more complex and colorful graphics. Coupled with our previously announced strategic agreements with companies like IBM, Matsushita, ArtX and MoSys, incorporation of S3 technology will make Dolphin a console without equal."

WOW NO EQUAL EH.

This is the best one:

"Nintendo is also working with Matsushita to create an online gaming network that aims to make the competition shudder. Information about the network, code named N1E2x8T, has been leaking out during the past few weeks.

Shigeru Mayamoto, a Nintendo design team member, said: "I'm very interested in online gaming, and I fully understand why people are so enthusiastic. But if it ever came to the stage where we were talking about online gaming, it would be because we had a new way to approach the idea. It wouldn't just be because everyone else is doing it."

If rumours are to be believed, the network will allow for 32 players to play against another 32 opponents - another first. Although the network is still in development, it is hoped to have it finished within six months of the Dolphin's launch."

YA IT REALLY MADE XBOX's SHUTTER

"Nintendo has already said that the WORST games (graphics-wise) for Dolphin will have graphics similar to the movie Toy Story."

"Nintendo has already stated that not only will the Dolphin be regarded as a technological marvel the day it is released, but four years later it still will be considered greatness."

Tons more but I can't be bothered.

[meelk]

Originally Posted by goMac

Remember when the Dolphin was announced the XBox wasn't. Nintendo was only comparing the Playstation, and they were right on the mark. Also S3 graphics was dropped in favor of ATI, most likely improving the graphics more.

Nintendo never said they were working on an online gaming network. A rumor said that. I thought Nintendo made it quite clear it was only under consideration.

nintendo never said anything solid until the network was within months of launch essentially. there were a bunch of rumors, but they didnt come from behind nintendo's iron curtain.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by meelk

and this is differerent from Sony saying the PS2 would do everything except give you oral sex, along with their pre-rendered presentations of things like ridge racer that never actually showed up? please, dont play this like Nintendo is the only company tht ever issues a press release, at least they dont go overboard.
btw: nintendos network is free for any nintendo 1st party game. Microsofts isnt
nintendo is getting there.

Nope, Sony is full of ****. Even MS faked lens flares in the screengrabs for the original Xbox. Difference is I am big enough to admit it, you just point the finger back. Stop being so idiotic.

[MindFad]

Wow.

[ort888]

More Revolution Specs Uncovered
Developers come forward to reveal new performance details on Nintendo's next-generation console.
by Matt Casamassina
December 6, 2005 - Just yesterday IGN Revolution launched with technical details on Nintendo's next-generation console, codenamed Revolution. And today more development sources have come forward with both clarification and even more tech specs. The latest news begins to paint a clearer picture of Nintendo's aim with its next platform.

We cannot stress this enough: Revolution is not being positioned as a competitor to either Xbox 360 or PlayStation 3. Nintendo has instead chosen to design a console that will be very affordable for consumers. For that very reason, say developers in the know, the Big N has opted out of filling the system with a massive supply of expensive RAM.
In yesterday's article, we wrote that Revolution would include 128MBs of RAM, or possibly less. Developers have clarified the makeup based on officially released Nintendo documentation. Revolution will build on GameCube's configuration of 24MBs 1T-SRAM and 16MBs D-RAM (40MBs) by adding an addition 64MBs of 1T-SRAM. The result is a supply of memory in Revolution that totals 104MBs. That number does not consider either the 512MBs of allegedly accessible (but hardly ideal) Flash RAM or the Hollywood GPU's on-board memory, said to be 3MBs by sources.

Revolution's Broadway CPU, developed by IBM, is an extension of the Gekko CPU in GameCube, according to official Nintendo documentation passed to us by software houses. The Hollywood GPU, meanwhile, is believed to be an extension of the Flipper GPU in GameCube. Since developers have not gone hands-on with the GPU, they can only go on Nintendo documentation, which is limited.

Exact clock rates were not disclosed, but one development source we spoke to had this to say of the Revolution CPU and GPU: "Basically, take a GameCube, double the clock rate of the CPU and GPU and you're done."

We presented that description to another informed studio, which clarified that the clock rates may even fall short of doubling those on GameCube.

"The CPU is the same as Gekko with one and a half to two times the performance and improved caching," said a source. "Our guys experimented with it and think they'll be able to get about twice the performance as GameCube."

"It's a gamble for the Big N," said another source. "It's not about horsepower for them -- it's about innovation and gameplay."


We've also been able to unearth firm details on the storage capacity for Revolution discs. Recent rumors suggesting that the discs can hold 12GBs of data are false. In fact, Revolution discs can store 4.7GBs of data on a single layer or 8.5GBs when double-layered on a single-side. This is a massive jump from the 1.5GB capacity of GameCube discs and more than enough storage capacity for any non-high-definition game.

Readers discouraged by Revolution's seeming lack of horsepower when compared to Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 should remember that Nintendo is not interested in competing in the high-definition gaming arena, and as a standard-definition console, Revolution is more than capable. Capcom's Resident Evil 4 remains one of the most gorgeous games this generation and it ran on GameCube, a console at least half as powerful according to developer reports.

Software houses we spoke with also waxed on the immediate advantage to Nintendo's approach with Revolution, which is, of course, system price. Every developer was in agreement that Revolution should launch with a price tag of $149 or lower. Some speculated that based on the tech, a $99 price point would not be out of the question.

Stay tuned for more as it develops.

[ort888]

Interesting strategy. If they can launch the thing at $99 they might make a good splash. I'll buy one.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by ort888

Interesting strategy. If they can launch the thing at $99 they might make a good splash. I'll buy one.

Hey I say go for it. It is not longer in the running in the same league as the other 2 systems but they don't care.

They can get the niche, this will be a souped up version of those joystiqs you can buy with the game built into it. The stuff you see in the impulse buy section.

I am not being insulting.

[deomacius]

Huh? Was there a delay in posting this article? (Mods can be delete this one.)

[deomacius]

Originally Posted by ort888

Interesting strategy. If they can launch the thing at $99 they might make a good splash. I'll buy one.

Hmmm... I saw that this morning. $99 is very appealing. With the prices that are being tossed around for the PS 3, I may have to think about waiting a year or two before taking the plunge.

[Hawkeye_a]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet

Hey I say go for it. It is not longer in the running in the same league as the other 2 systems but they don't care.

They can get the niche, this will be a souped up version of those joystiqs you can buy with the game built into it. The stuff you see in the impulse buy section.

I am not being insulting.

Quite with this "niche" bull*hit !!! if by niche you mean ppl who dont spend thousands of $$$ on videogames then you might be onto something (as that "niche includes, everyone as opposed to only geeky middle aged men), which att hat price point would'nt exclude.

If they price a console at $199 it'll sell like hot cakes. simple economics. And the good part is it'll appeal to EVERYONE(men, women and kids), not many will have to think twice because of the price tag.

From a developer standpoint(if the above is true). I reckon developers will be able to take near full advantage of the hardware from the get go(provided the have been developing for the GCN). What does that mean ? less investment into untangling the featuresets of the CPU and GPU and more time creating a game with high production values. who wins ? Developers and consumers.

If we see games thats twice as visually appealing as RE4, ill be satisified. twice as much polygonal detail, twice as much texture detail, twice as many effects (fire, fog, etc). that'll be great. And it's not a technicaly overkill and it'll keep the price competitive. thats good business (as opposed to what M$ did with the XB and what Sony is doing with the PS3).

Couple all that with a modular 3D(true) controller, and you have a true "next generation" system. As opposed to just upgrading the CPU and GPU.

All in all, i think if they have Mario128, Metroid Prime 3 and Super Smash Brothers at launch, they stand to make a lot of consumers happy and in the process make a nice profit for Nintendo. its the art of comprimise at work, and imo it will pay off for all concerned....developers, consumers and Nintendo.

Cheers.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye_a

Quite with this "niche" bull*hit !!! if by niche you mean ppl who dont spend thousands of $$$ on videogames then you might be onto something (as that "niche includes, everyone as opposed to only geeky middle aged men), which att hat price point would'nt exclude.Cheers.

You girls have always been squealing that Nintendo users are more "casual" gamers. The recent study conducted that title actually goes to PS2 users.

Sorry.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet

You girls have always been squealing that Nintendo users are more "casual" gamers. The recent study conducted that title actually goes to PS2 users.

Sorry.

Link to the study?

[Uriel]

I play fun video games, not consoles.

Sorry, I have a 360 and will probably buy a revolution. (i'd buy a PS3 but probably can't afford that for a bit). I don't understand why it has to be a case of "who's better", buy what you like.

I'm a big multiplayer fan, I like the xbox live servivce so I play Xbox a lot.
RPG's are great and I"m a big fan of final fantasy, so I play my PS2
I didn't get a gamecube yet, but we'll see

Seriously, why is it such a big deal? I love my 360 it's fun for me that's all that matters. Hopefully the other consoles will be fun too.

[meelk]

I'm extremely happy with games like zelda: wind waker, and mario sunshine. I LOVE cartoony games. Dont need 512 meg of ram for that. BRING IT ON!

[Hawkeye_a]

Developers speaking to GamesIndustry.biz this week have commented that the the Revolution console, hardware kits for which began shipping to third parties recently, is shaping up to be around 2.5 times more powerful than GameCube.

Up until the past week or so, developers close enough to Nintendo's inner circle to have seen any Revolution hardware were working with development kits that were simply GameCube kits with mock-ups of the "wand" controller attached - a clear signal, if any were required, that the system is more about innovative control than about the hardware specs.

Now, however, Nintendo has spoken to developers in more depth about its hardware plans for the new system - and has begun shipping more advanced development kits to selected third-parties, featuring early versions of some of the chips which will appear in the final console.

An article published by US website IGN this morning revealed some details of the console, and several developers today have spoken to GamesIndustry.biz to help fill in the gaps.

The picture we're building up of the final console is as follows; the Cube will be powered by the IBM CPU codenamed Broadway, which is very similar to the Gekko CPU used in the GameCube, but runs at around twice the clock speed and offers potentially two to three times the overall performance, and the ATI graphics chip codenamed Hollywood.

While Broadway is well-understood by developers, the ATI part remains "a bit of a black box", according to one senior developer we spoke to. "We have theoretical throughput figures and stats from Nintendo, but nobody's seen the hardware yet - we're just treating it like it's a faster version of the GameCube GPU, at the moment."

How much faster exactly it will be remains to be seen, but the chip - which "seems to be an evolution of the Radeon range" according to our source - will probably mirror the CPU by running at around twice to three times the speed of the existing part.

In terms of RAM, the system is well-known to boast 512MB of Flash RAM which can be used to store save games and downloaded content, but this will not be accessible to developers, we were told. What they'll have available is 96MB of main memory, built on the same 1T-SRAM architecture as the Cube, and "a few megs here and there for other stuff" - such as 3MB of on-board memory on the graphics chip, which will be used for a frame buffer. "That's plenty, since the Revolution isn't supporting HDTV," one developer added.

As for the storage media the Revolution will use, "they're pretty much standard DVDs," we were told, with capacity similar to current PS2 and Xbox discs. "The only clever thing about the drive, really, is that you can put the little Cube discs into it despite being a slot-loading drive - I think that's the first time you've been able to do that with a slot loader."

In other words, what Nintendo is planning to ship is a system which is no more than around twice to three times as powerful as the current generation GameCube - indeed, more than one developer who has access to the hardware specs suggested "about 2.5 times the power" as the benchmark for the new system.

Although this makes the Revolution significantly less powerful than the PS3 or Xbox 360, developers we spoke to were upbeat about the machine.

"You can basically treat it like a current generation machine," one told us. "The time it'll take to ramp up to developing on this is basically nil - we can just work on a PC or maybe an Xbox, and then improve the quality of our assets when we move to the Revolution. Or even work on a Cube, in fact. The libraries are very similar."

"We could do a game for this in a few months," commented another developer. "Developing games is going to be easy, the challenge is going to be using the controller properly."

The approach mirrors Nintendo's strategy with the DS, which is far less powerful than its rival the PlayStation Portable but offers an innovative interface which has been a hit with gamers and has had major success in the mass market.

Crucially, the low specification will also allow Nintendo to score a victory in terms of pricing; speculation is already rife that the Revolution could enter the marketplace at $149 or even lower, suggesting a sub-GBP 100 price point at a time when the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 still retail for three times that price.

-Gameindustry.biz (unabridged) http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=13482

good news all around i reckon.

[ajprice]

Sounds like good news to me. I can see where Nintendo are coming from if Revolution is going to be, erm, an evolution of the Gamecube. Lots easier and cheaper to develop for because the architecture and programming basically exists already, they just turn it up to 11 and get better graphics. I have a PS2, PSP and DS, I'm not interested in a 360 like I wasn't interested in an Xbox. I'd like to get a PS3, but the price tags flying around seem a bit steep, even if it is a Blu Ray player (maybe I'll wait til Gran Turismo 5 comes out, it might be a bit cheaper by then!!). In the mean time, Revolution at the price they are talking about, with the 'fun' Nintendo games and back catalogue, looks promising.