[moki]

Lots of people will bitch and moan about the iPod, the same way they bitched and moaned with the introduction of the original iMac.

Apple, meanwhile, will sell a ton of them. History repeats itself.

The iPod's size, the speed at which you can upload music to it, the battery life, the huge storage capacity, the ability to use it as a generic FireWire drive for transporting files, the excellent UI, and of course, the powerful iTunes integration all make for a killer product in my book.

People who decry the price should consider this: a friend of mine bought a Nomad not a few months ago for $299 -- it has less than 1/100th the storage space, and none of the other cool features.

The biggest downside to the iPod currently is that you need a Mac in order to take full advantage of it.

I expect Apple to rectify this in the near future -- unless they decide to make this some kind of a package deal to make iBooks and iMacs more attractive to buyers.

We're used to "killer apps" in software selling computers (consumers are, after all, mostly solution-based) -- who says the killer app has to be a piece of software alone?

I bet Apple may bundle the iPod with iMacs and iBooks at some point in the future.

Ah well, time to go order one...

[MikeM32]

I find your optimism nauseating

Mike

[moki]

Compare the iPod to the Rio 800:

Rio 800 -- $249
-------

The Rio 800 128MB Digital Audio Player delivers the most advanced level of power and performance you'll ever hear. Capture, mix, and playback up to FOUR HOURS of digital music from the Internet or your CD collection on Rio's first-ever rechargeable player. Created by people as intense about music as you are. No wonder the Rio products set the standard in portable digital audio players.


* 128MB of built-in memory for up to FOUR HOURS of music.
* Upgradeable, snap-on memory backpacks. (Sold separately)
* Rechargeable NiMH battery and AC adapter
* New high-contrast LCD Display shows song/book title, artist and time.
* Supports MP3 and WMA audio formats.
* USB connection for fast music transfers

.....

iPod -- $399
----

Presenting iPod. The first MP3 player to pack a mind-blowing 1,000 songs and a 10-hour battery into a stunning 6.5-ounce package you can literally take everywhere. But iPod isn�t just a revolution in portability, it�s also a revolution in simplicity. Just plug it into your Mac and all of your iTunes songs and playlists are automatically downloaded into iPod at blazing FireWire speed. With iPod, it�s that easy to take your entire music collection with you wherever you go, in the pocket of your choice.

* 5gb of storage space, over 1,000 songs
* Rechargable Lithium polymer battery (recharges via FireWire!)
* High contrast, back-lit LCD
* FireWire connection is literally 50x faster than USB -- upload an entire CD in 10 seconds
* doubles as a FireWire hard drive
* no-brainer integration with iTunes 2

.....

It's clear to me which one I'd buy. The last feature of the iPod shouldn't be understated -- one of the main reasons I don't update my mp3 player (the Rio 500) as much as I'd like is because it's a hassle. With Palm-like "hotsynch" of iTunes playlists and music (and *fast* since it is over fire wire), I think it will be a much more usable device day to day.

[Visnaut]

Originally posted by MikeM32:
<STRONG>I find your optimism nauseating

Mike</STRONG>

Likewise with your pessimism.

Don't like it? Too bad. There are a lot of MP3 Players out there that I don't like, but I won't waste my precious time bitching about them.

[Immortal K-Mart Employee]

I agree with you moki. I love the iPod and the price is OK for what you are getting.

[dark3lf]

I'm still on the fence, I'm not sure I need a portable mp3 player all that bad, but I might warm up to the $400 price tag by the time it ships. I wonder if it's doomed for failure like the cube or the decaled iMacs.

I think they would have been better off reviving the QuickTake or Newton.

[ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: dark3lf ]

[- - e r i k - -]

Okey dokey moki (I hope all of them rhymes)...

You see. iPod is great. I want one. Moby wants one. Seal wants one. And that fat guy from Smash Mouth wants two. All of them, and probably you too can afford one (especially since I paid money for your software so you can buy one.). What is the target-market? Mac-users for starters. Mac users that can afford blowing $400 on an MP3-player. People like Moby for instance.

Now are you seeing where I'm getting at? How many new users will buy mac and then buy one? Will it sell more macs? Hardly. If this could sell to 0,1% of the total market, it would be a hit. Sadly it will only sell to max 1% of the mac-market, which doesn't count a lot.

Everyone probably wants one, but $400 for a walkman? Nah...

Truth is, there's even less a markets for this digital little pet than for the cube. And with the slowing economy too? Bad move...

[ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: - - e r i k - - ]

[neurack]

K-mart: It is obvious you are the perfect target market for Apple and the iPod. You own a Mac, and you have enough technical sense to know its advantages.

However, most of the market does not share either of these traits. I think it is a great product, but a price that is $150 above its closest competitor is its downfall. If it was completely obvious to everyone which was the better player it would stand a chance- however the Nomad Jukebox can still demonstrate a few advantages to the generic consumer: cross platform support, Windows Media [ick I know] support, and an extra gig of space.

So to the overall market, it won't be a slam dunk as it is with you.

Believe me I want it to be a success for Apple, as new mac-owner/lover I want them to win another chunk of market share so they can keep innovating like they do. I just don't see it happening on the scale any of us would like to see.

[Timo]

Yes I think the iPod will be an excellent gift to give precisely because it doesn't appear to be a hassle to use. The ability to hot sync while charging the battery is indicative: the device works for you rather than the other way around.

I think the strategy of making simple items that are easy to use -- rather than complicated items which try to be something for everyone -- is a good one. The appeal of "it just works" is worth something.

[Immortal K-Mart Employee]

Originally posted by neurack:
<STRONG>K-mart: It is obvious you are the perfect target market for Apple and the iPod. You own a Mac, and you have enough technical sense to know its advantages.</STRONG>

Go figure that I also own a Cube.

I also love the iPod as it doubles as a hard drive.

[KidRed]

Sadly it will only sell to max 1% of the mac-market, which doesn't count a lot.

Like I said in anotehr post-

1% of the Mac market share(25 million) is 250,000 people, so that would mean-

$400 x 250,000 is $100,000,000 (unless I did it wrong)

Boy, Apple is SOOOO dumb!!

As for porting it to PC, NOOOOOO. Why would you then want a Mac? This is to attract PC users to Macs, macs have cool machines, macs have cool software and now have cool devices. Porting iTunes to PC gives them no reason to buy a mac.

[ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: KidRed ]

[moki]

Originally posted by - - e r i k - -:
<STRONG>
Everyone probably wants one, but $400 for a walkman? Nah...</STRONG>

I do agree with you that the price is a bit high -- but the features are on the high-end as well. It'll be interesting to see how it goes over.

[SoClose]

I have to agree with moki that this thing will sell. However, Apple does need to do a couple critical things to ensure success:

• The price has to come down by at least $50. Maybe Apple will pull an iMac modem stunt on us. Remember when the iMac was introduced and Apple announced that it would ship with a 33.6 modem. Everyone screamed and Apple, as I believe they had planned all along, said "OK, we'll give you what you want" and "upgraded" the modem to 56kbps and made everyone happy. Like they could have done that in the three month period between the iMac intro and shipping. I would hesitate a lot less about buying this thing if it was priced at $349 and you could get it at Outpost or Buy.com for $320 - $330.
  
• They've got to come up with a Windows compatibility solution. The best move would be an iTunes lite that only plays back MP3s (no burning) and only syncs with the iPod. I'm lucky enough to be able to bring my TiBook to work with me, but if not, I'd have a Compaq Deskpro as my only computer with USB. Having USB and Firewire on the same device would probably be prohibitive in many aspects (R&D, component cost, size, power consumption, number of chips, etc.), so maybe a Windows version would help push FireWire on PCs as the iMac helped spur the USB peripheral market.

Apple has got to strive to be all-inclusive rather than just Mac-exclusive. The more people you expose to your way of life, rather than jamming it down their throat, the more they'll respect you and most likely join you. iPod could be a great "bridge" device to start getting PC-weenies to think about the Mac and the Mac OS in terms that they never thought of.

However, if we continue to have set-backs like the DVD-compatibility issues with the Star Wars: Phantom Menace disc, the Mac will always be relegated to the niche when it's just now so well poised to capture a large portion of the market.

soclose

[ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: SoClose ]

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by moki:
<STRONG>I do agree with you that the price is a bit high -- but the features are on the high-end as well. It'll be interesting to see how it goes over.</STRONG>

Well, that is why we are mac-users in the first place, right? We pay for quality, or the illusion of quality at least. iPod is a solid product at the wrong price level, and the timing couldn't be much worse. Had this been released 6 months ago at say... $300 or perhaps even 349$ it would have been a killer (perhaps).

Right now it's the wrong product marketed to the wrong people at the wrong time...

[SoClose]

Thinking about the iPod a little more made me realize something...this thing has a FireWire jack!!! FireWire jacks aren't just good for connecting it to Macs. Digital video cameras have FireWire jacks. So do most of Sony's consumer home goods. Maybe you'll be able to plug this into your home receiver at some point...record off the radio for instance. Since it holds data, in MP3 form, playlist form, etc., what's to stop this (or future revs) from being a true portable media device holding all kinds of stuff, music, digital photos, digital video, files and then being able to connect it to different devices along the way?

Use it at the office to play MP3s and transfer files.
Use it with your DV camera to hold video
Use it with your home stereo to be the ultimate DJ
Use it with your TV to display pictures and video

I think there's a large strategy here with this device that has yet to be revealed. It's name is iPod, not iDeviceOnlyForMP3s, and that's pretty significant. There's more here...anyone else agree or do I need to switch crack distributors?

soclose

[BZ]

iPod = iWantit

Do I like MP3s? Yeah, kinda. But the players are all big in size but carry very little. It is also a pain (read slow) to get things on to them.

Now the iPod.

Huge storage. Fast transfer. Easy as pie with iTunes2. What is not to like? $400? Come on. Ask for it for X-mas. Save up for a few months. I have not considered MP3s to replace my Minidisks till now.

Oh, and as for who wants one. My girlfriend who coudn't tell you what an MP3 is other than a song. And my Step Father who just bought an iBook and would wants one big time.

Why is it great?

- 20 Minute shock is great for running.
- 10 Hour Battery means it will outlast two or three times my TiG4
- 5GB means I will be dumping 1/4 of my CD collection.

Will there be an iPod2 with a 10GB for $349 in 6 months? Sure. But for now, I will own this one and enjoy the sh!t out of it.

Wish list for iPod2 (can't resist)
- Digital Optical output for hooking up to a stero
- FM receiver
- 10GB

And, no, they should not make this for the PeeCee. Let them drool. Let this, plus an iBook and OS X make them really really really consider coming on over.

Gotta luv apple. Way to go Steve! (although one that hooks up to my Home Stereo w/ Airport would have been cool too...)

[DyslexicCow]

Originally posted by Immortal K-Mart Employee:
<STRONG>I agree with you moki. I love the iPod and the price is OK for what you are getting.</STRONG>

I totally agree, this is the Mp3 player I've been waiting for...i think it could be cheaper, but whatever, I'll buy it anyway.

[Nile Crocodile]

Rio - Hooks up to my computer

iPod - Does not

[Sine]

Originally posted by Nile Crocodile:
<STRONG>Rio - Hooks up to my computer

iPod - Does not</STRONG>

Buy a new one

[absmiths]

I think the iPod is an excellent idea, and Apple has once again done a great job of wittling it down to the bare essentials by making the thing do what you want with a minimum of effort.

However, what will probably happen is Apple will sell a descent number of them, meanwhile other companies will rip off the basic design and sell millions that are only compatible with Windows XP and will utilize Copyright protection and can transfer music directly from EMI or other labels in a way that iPod can't, thereby tightening the MS noose around the necks of all non-conformers.

[Mr Heliums]

Originally posted by DyslexicCow:
<STRONG>

I totally agree, this is the Mp3 player I've been waiting for...i think it could be cheaper, but whatever, I'll buy it anyway.</STRONG>

yeah, this is a winner all the way.

I'm surprised no-one has pointed out the retro looks though:
I mean, the Chicago font makes it look like System 6. I got all nostalgic for a minute there...

[IUJHJSDHE]

Originally posted by moki:
<STRONG>Lots of people will bitch and moan about the iPod, the same way they bitched and moaned with the introduction of the original iMac.

Apple, meanwhile, will sell a ton of them. History repeats itself.

The iPod's size, the speed at which you can upload music to it, the battery life, the huge storage capacity, the ability to use it as a generic FireWire drive for transporting files, the excellent UI, and of course, the powerful iTunes integration all make for a killer product in my book.

People who decry the price should consider this: a friend of mine bought a Nomad not a few months ago for $299 -- it has less than 1/100th the storage space, and none of the other cool features.

The biggest downside to the iPod currently is that you need a Mac in order to take full advantage of it.

I expect Apple to rectify this in the near future -- unless they decide to make this some kind of a package deal to make iBooks and iMacs more attractive to buyers.

We're used to "killer apps" in software selling computers (consumers are, after all, mostly solution-based) -- who says the killer app has to be a piece of software alone?

I bet Apple may bundle the iPod with iMacs and iBooks at some point in the future.

Ah well, time to go order one... </STRONG>

I agree with you 100%

5GB HD!
And it said you can store files too.

I THINK IT IS GREAT.

You right, it will sell

[ink]

Originally posted by moki:
[QB]Compare the iPod to the Rio 800:

Rio 800 -- $249
/QB]

Why not compare it to the Nomad instead?


* 6GB hard drive stores over 100 hours of CD-quality audio, or over 150 albums and thousands of personal play lists
* Compact design, the size of a portable CD player
* Weighs just 14 ounces
* EAX audio effects processing for superior audio quality playback and customization
* Support for MP3 and WAV formats
* Dual stereo line out for front and rear speakers- FourPointSurround speaker support for an enhanced music listening experience at home or at work
* Recordings can be easily ported back to your PC with the bundled Creative PlayCenter 2 software
* Keep pace with future developments, trends and improvements. Download new features, enhancements, and auto play list generators at www.nomadworld.com
* 1 year manufacturer warranty

Price? $239 at www.thinkgeek.com

[sek929]

Originally posted by Nile Crocodile:
<STRONG>Rio - Hooks up to my computer

iPod - Does not</STRONG>

Your point is?

To bad, I reeeaaally feel sorry for the fact that the iPod doesn't plug into your computer.

How long does the Rio's battery last? How many songs does it hold? Is the interface better? Just because it plugs into your computer doesn't make it better now does it?

Heres a thought, PCI Firewire card plugs into computer, iPod plus into Firewire card...problem solved.

As for the Nomad...how long does that puppy's batteries last? I'm sure you'll have to recharge a few dozen times to listen to all that music.

[ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: sek929 ]

[suprz]

Originally posted by Nile Crocodile:
<STRONG>Rio - Hooks up to my computer

iPod - Does not</STRONG>

well put!!!! again apple is behind the times to have this thing called "innovative", or a "breakthrough" there are already pocket hard drives, that are cheaper, and there are already mp3 players. why the hell do i need 1000 songs in my pocket? and then to go ahead and alienate all the mac users that dont have firewire! nice going jobs! i only have usb on my imac and i'm not going to go buy a new computer just so i can spend 400.00$ on this "innovative" and "breakthrough" device. they should have put all this effort into a new newton THAT is something i would have bought. (as long as it came with usb capabilities )

[IUJHJSDHE]

Lots of different opinions.


Well time will tell if this will be a ok selling mp3 player.

A SELLING LIKE HOTCAKES MP3 PLAYER FOR APPLE!

Or apple's bigest plunder since the cube.

I really liked the cube

[moki]

Compare the iPod to the Nomad Jukebox:

Nomad Jukebox -- $249
-------------

http://www.nomadworld.com/products/jukebox/features.asp

* 6GB storage space holds over 100 hours of CD-quality audio, or over 150 albums and thousands of personal play lists (now also available in 20GB for more music than ever)
* 14-ounce lightweight device (5.5" x 5" x 1.5")
* Line-In for direct stereo audio recording in WAV format from external devices
* USB interface offers fast digital transfer rates and quick connectivity and setup
* Large memory buffer for up to 5 minutes of shock protection
* DC In for separate power supply and battery recharging

.....

Apple iPod -- $399
----------

http://www.Apple.com/ipod/specs.html

* 5gb storage space
* 6.2 oz lightweight device
* Tiny form factor -- 2.43 by 4.02 by 0.78 inches
* 20 minutes of shock protection
* built-in 10 hour battery; charges automatically via FireWire

.....

For me, it's clear the iPod is worth the extra $150. The size and weight alone make it a much more useful device day to day -- you could literally fit 5 iPods in the space taken up by a single Nomad Jukebox. Would you actually take the Nomad with you when you went jogging? I doubt it. It is way too cumbersome.

Add in that FireWire is used as the way to transfer music, and you realize that this is the kind of device that is tailored to you. You don't have to sit there waiting for the songs to slowly upload -- plug it in, and bam! Everything gets uploaded in a flash.

Then there is the durability (a steel case vs. plastic), 4x the shock protection, better battery life (significantly better, charges automatically via FireWire or adaptor), and last, the killer feature: it integreates seamlessly with iTunes, so that you don't need to bother with a klunky "manager" software that the Nomad has.

This is a high-quality, low-hassle device that works as it should.

[IUJHJSDHE]

Originally posted by moki:
<STRONG>Lots of people will bitch and moan about the iPod, the same way they bitched and moaned with the introduction of the original iMac.

Apple, meanwhile, will sell a ton of them. History repeats itself.

The iPod's size, the speed at which you can upload music to it, the battery life, the huge storage capacity, the ability to use it as a generic FireWire drive for transporting files, the excellent UI, and of course, the powerful iTunes integration all make for a killer product in my book.

People who decry the price should consider this: a friend of mine bought a Nomad not a few months ago for $299 -- it has less than 1/100th the storage space, and none of the other cool features.

The biggest downside to the iPod currently is that you need a Mac in order to take full advantage of it.

I expect Apple to rectify this in the near future -- unless they decide to make this some kind of a package deal to make iBooks and iMacs more attractive to buyers.

We're used to "killer apps" in software selling computers (consumers are, after all, mostly solution-based) -- who says the killer app has to be a piece of software alone?

I bet Apple may bundle the iPod with iMacs and iBooks at some point in the future.

Ah well, time to go order one... </STRONG>

I agree with you 100%

5GB HD!
And it said you can store files too.

I THINK IT IS GREAT.

You right, it will sell

[tanhauser]

Right now it's the wrong product marketed to the wrong people at the wrong time...

Well... I'm not too sure about that.

For starters I don't think it's the wrong product at all. Music is an essential part of anybody's life.

I only own a CD player, I never bought an Mp3 player because they were painfully slow and wouldn't really hold a lot of music. For me the iPod is perfect since I keep all my Mp3 collection on my G4 at home, and none on my PB G3 at work (lack of space). With the iPod I can have all my Mp3 collection at work, listen to music while I work, or when I'm in the lab analysing samples, etc. I don't have to worry about my PB's HD getting full, or the performance of 10.1 getting slow after playing a lot of Mp3s on the PB.

Erik you might just be pissed off because this really, really cool device is most definitely NOT cheap, and I agree with you. I ain't rich either, I'm a lowly PhD student but I'm willing to save for a couple of months for this, it IS that good.

[cpatubo]

Originally posted by moki:
<STRONG>I do agree with you that the price is a bit high -- but the features are on the high-end as well. It'll be interesting to see how it goes over.</STRONG>

This also brings up another point... do you recall how much the first walkmans (men?) were? Well into the $400-500 range. That sounds ridiculous, huh?

The price to pay to be a technological trendsetter...

[suprz]

Originally posted by moki:
[

the killer feature: it integreates seamlessly with iTunes, so that you don't need to bother with a klunky "manager" software that the Nomad has.

This is a high-quality, low-hassle device that works as it should.[/QB]

my rio integrates seemlessly with itunes, and it does it thru usb, (not everyone has firewire) so with that said, there goes your "killer feature"

[ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: suprz ]

[moki]

Originally posted by suprz:
<STRONG>

my rio integrates seemlessly with itunes, and it does it thru usb, (not everyone has firewire) so with that said, there goes your "killer feature"</STRONG>

Not to the extend that the iPod does with iTunes 2... trust me

I also own a Rio -- it's a nice product -- but it's no iPod.

[gmartin]

I like the idea of having a 5GB HD but no chance at that price or for only a FireWire connection. Must be USB to be a useful device (Mac/PC) in a tight spot. My iBook's good for another year at least iPod in this incarnation is not something that I would consider - think it's gong to be a dud, sorry Apple.

[scottiB]

By Nile Crocodile:
Rio - Hooks up to my computer/iPod - Does not
and suprz:
well put!!!! again apple is behind the times to have this thing called "innovative", or a "breakthrough" there are already pocket hard drives, that are cheaper, and there are already mp3 players. why the hell do i need 1000 songs in my pocket? and then to go ahead and alienate all the mac users that dont have firewire! nice going jobs! i only have usb on my imac and i'm not going to go buy a new computer just so i can spend 400.00$ on this "innovative" and "breakthrough" device.

Did your criticisms arise when Apple introduced iMovie, as well? No offense, guys, but at least you have a non-Apple USB solutions. Be happy with the Nomads and Rios, and let it go. You make it sound as if Apple robbed you of $400.
------

I don't know if the iPod will be a huge success, but it fits my needs because I hate using 4+ gigs of drive space on my Pismo for mp3s. I was considering purchasing a VST FW drive just for mp3s, so I could shuttle between my PBook and my iMacDV (that I bought to use with iMovie because my iMac/266 couldn't ).

Having the ability to plug in headphones and listen to them when I walk my dog is an added bonus.

A huge advantage to the iPod's success are the Apple Retail stores. Have the various players in a row (because they do carry third party players), and watch the sales reps put each through its paces by transferring the 650 MB of mp3s that come with each new Mac. I bet most would chose the iPod regardless of the extra cash. Even if not, they still bought from the Apple Store.

I bet that some iCombo deals will be evident after Thanksgiving.

[suprz]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by scottiB:
[QB]

Did your criticisms arise when Apple introduced iMovie, as well? No offense, guys, but at least you have a non-Apple USB solutions. Be happy with the Nomads and Rios, and let it go. You make it sound as if Apple robbed you of $400.
------

i dont feel robbed, i just feel ignored, alienated, and forgotten. it's like apple is saying, "ha! want this new product? well buy a newer mac or go screw!!" i mean really, would it be so hard to have usb also?? oh well, apple loses out on my 400.00$ and i keep get to keep 400.00$..




[ 10-23-2001: Message edited by: suprz ]

[OldManMac]

My $.02. I sell Macs for a living, and there's something that's being overlooked in these posts. Apple's butt was saved last quarter by one product, the iBook . Overall sales were down 22% from the same quarter a year ago, despite a 176% INCREASE in iBook sales! In other words, Apple's got all it's eggs in one basket. They need to worry about getting their core business back on track (iMac & PowerBook sales dropped like a rock, despite the fact that they're faster and more feature laden than their predecessors), and not worry about bringing out a new gadget for the few people who have discretionary income right now. This is not a time when people are buying extra little goodies, which is what the iPod really is! Many of you think it's a real cool device, which I agree with; that doesn't mean it's going to be big hit. IMHO it is overpriced by about $100. The features are great, and I would love to have one! Music is a big part of my life, with a CD collection of 600+, a cassette collection of 150+, and a collection of albums from the 60s & 70s that numbers about 250, and several thousand MP3s. Will I spend $400 on an iPod? No. I can burn all the CDs I want, to play in my car or home stereo; I've already got that equipment. This is an overpriced toy, IMHO. I hope it sells like hotcakes, but I think it's another Cube in the making! I sure hope I'm wrong!

Originally posted by - - e r i k - -:
<STRONG>
Everyone probably wants one, but $400 for a walkman? Nah...</STRONG>

Everyone probably wants an ibook, but $1200 for a typewriter? Nah...

See my point? It's not just any old walkman or mp3 player... it's a very advanced walkman that holds 1000s of minutes of music and can copy an entire album to it in 10 seconds; it doubles as a harddrive, it has a very handy GUI and control pad and it is smaller than any "walkman."

If it was 100 bucks less i'd give it 5 starts.

[scottiB]

KarlG, I agree with you about the economy and discretionary income--times are tough all over--but should've Apple sat on this and waited until next Christmas? What if the economy isn't better? What if it's worse?

I'm trying to understand how the current Mac line would be improved, thus generating more sales, if the iPod (and future products, it seems) were never developed? Of course there is really no answer.

It could be worse. You could be selling Gateways.

[CAM]

As I said in another thread...

When seen in the context of the Apple stores (where you can see just how tiny, light, gorgeous and Mac-friendly they are), iPods will sell like crazy and will also help to sell Macs. A big part of this strategy is "adding value" to the Mac experience as a whole which this does quite well.

You can bet that a lot of folks will be getting these for Christmas (I'm one of them!)

[G Barnett]

Well, now I know what my wife's Christmas present is gonna be. She's always complaining about how the batteries in her walkman/wearable radio/you name it never last long enough while she's out jogging/biking/blading. Ten hours of rechargable lithium-polymer goodness and the ability to listen to her MP3s of Bulgarian Pop will be a big bonus, lemme tell ya.

$400? A small price to pay for added domestic bliss....


G Barnett

[iCartman]

1% of the Mac market share(25 million) is 250,000 people, so that would mean

Actually it's 1% of Mac computers that run OS9/OSX and have a Firewire port. Apple's making a statement about people who own older Mac's. That statement is that they are no longer part of the family.

[smacintush]

Actually it's 1% of Mac computers that run OS9/OSX and have a Firewire port. Apple's making a statement about people who own older Mac's. That statement is that they are no longer part of the family.

You know, sometimes you just have to move on to new technologies�

USB is a NOW and YESTERDAY technology. Apple is putting firewire on nearly every computer they make. They are thinking AHEAD. You can debate on the price and timing all you want, but IMO the firewire only thing is an asset, not a liability.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by Rampage:
<STRONG>Everyone probably wants an ibook, but $1200 for a typewriter? Nah...

See my point?</STRONG>

Actually I don't. It might double as a harddrive, but it's still a walkman. Yes, it has a nice interface. Yes, it has a gorgeous design. Yes, I would buy one if I didn't already have my TiBook.

But point is. It has a severely limited market. Current firewire-port equipped mac-owners with $400 to blow on a walkman. That's even more of a limited market than the cube had.

If it at least had ONE breakthrough feature except firewire (I call that more of an evolution than revolution). Heck, if it had at least a 10GB HD it'd be worth it. I'm also shocked that they didn't include an USB port and some rudimentary pc-software. This is truly a high-end toy and sales will show that.

Note that I'm not pissed. Not at all. I'd get one in a second if it offered a bit more. And I'll probably get a later revision of it if it proves to have a longer life-cycle. But right now I concider this as important as if they were to launch a palm-clone. Perhaps even less.

[Gee4orce]

Does anyone know if you can play directly from the iPod from the Mac ? I mean, use iTunes to play the music from the iPod, rather than 'synching' the files onto the local hard drive first ?

(I keep accidentally typing 'iPop' instead of 'iPod', and that's too close to 'iPoop' for comfort !)

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by Gee4orce:
<STRONG>Does anyone know if you can play directly from the iPod from the Mac ? I mean, use iTunes to play the music from the iPod, rather than 'synching' the files onto the local hard drive first ?

(I keep accidentally typing 'iPop' instead of 'iPod', and that's too close to 'iPoop' for comfort !)</STRONG>

Well, if it's mounted as a hard drive and you could see all the MP3's that wouldn't be a problem.

It says however that just the free space is mounted as a HD.

But don't lose hope yet. How do you actually sync to the iPod? Look at the commercial, it shows up as one of the "sources", and what do you do with the sources? You play from them. Library, radio and playlists are all the same, so I don't see why the iPod should behave differently. It's just a HD with battery and basic software, that's all.

[GnOm]

Originally posted by iCartman:
<STRONG>Apple's making a statement about people who own older Mac's. That statement is that they are no longer part of the family.</STRONG>

same statement they made a few years ago with USB over Serial and ADB ports. And everybody knows that Apple is dead since then...

...oh wait, they are not, hmm.


bye.

[Spheric Harlot]

check out http://www.archos.com/uk/products/product_500201.html

Capacity: 6GB Low Voltage Hard Drive (6,000 minutes MP3 at 128 Kbps)
Internal Buffer: 2 MB
Interfaces and Transfer Rate: USB (Compatible with PC and Mac)
Format Supported: MP3 (30 to 320 Kbps) Variable Bit Rate - VBR
MP3 (selectable 30 to 160 Kbps) Real-Time Encoding
Display: Graphic Backlit LCD (Up to 8 lines of characters)
Audio Specifications: Stereo Digital / Analog Line In, Stereo Line Out, and Earphone Jack.
Signal to noise ratio &gt; 90dB.
Max Output Power: 100mW Freq. Response 20 Hz - 20 kHz
Harmonic Distortion: &lt; 0.1%
Playback autonomy: Up to 10 hours on a full charge.
Scalability: Downloadable Firmware Updates from web.
Power:
Internal: 4 x AA Rechargeable NiMH Batteries.
External: AC to DC Charger / Adapter Included
Dimensions: 115 x 83 x 34 mm. (4.5 x 3.2 x 1.3")
Weight: 350 g (12.3 oz.)

Pros:
-You can get it for &lt;$300 - and even cheaper for the non-recording version.
-It has a LINE IN (important for me).
-You can easily switch in a larger HD (word on the iPod is it won't be possible, and they're very expensive drives anyway).

Cons:
-Only mp3 support, with no word if Firmware updates will include other audio formats (deal-breaker for me).
-Only USB (which makes that large a capacity a total bitch).
-design & interface are not exactly up to Apple's standards.
-only external power supply.

hm.

-chris.

[Mr Heliums]

Originally posted by Gee4orce:
<STRONG>Does anyone know if you can play directly from the iPod from the Mac ? I mean, use iTunes to play the music from the iPod, rather than 'synching' the files onto the local hard drive first ?
</STRONG>

I'm interested in that too. 5Gb is plenty capacity for my iPod, but I don't want to store the same five gigs on my iBook.

[Nebrie]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
<STRONG>Cons:
-Only mp3 support, with no word if Firmware updates will include other audio formats (deal-breaker for me).
-Only USB (which makes that large a capacity a total bitch).
-design & interface are not exactly up to Apple's standards.
-only external power supply.

hm.

-chris.</STRONG>

From what I've heard, it also seems this device very buggy, and has crappy sound.

[MrSpanky]

I think iPod is an awesome product. Apple really did their homework.

But at half the cost of an iMac, it's too expensive.

In six months when it costs $249, i may consider it.