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New Displays
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mosespatrader
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Jun 18, 2004, 02:39 PM
 
Just curious if anybody else is waiting to buy a G5 until the new displays are released.
     
Thinktank
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Jun 18, 2004, 02:50 PM
 
It's one of my main sticking points.... If the new 30" comes in at a reasonable price ($2000) I'm all over it.... unfortunately, I don't see it coming in that low....
     
365
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Jun 18, 2004, 04:19 PM
 
Yeah, I'm waiting, for no other reason than the situation with AppleCare, where you have to purchase both items at the same time to have your screen covered.
     
Socially Awkward Solo
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Jun 18, 2004, 05:02 PM
 
What is wrong with the current ones?

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Turias
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Jun 18, 2004, 05:05 PM
 
Originally posted by Socially Awkward Solo:
What is wrong with the current ones?
Nothing at all. But if new ones come out at WWDC, you will likely be able to get a bigger monitor for the same price.

It's only 10 days...
     
djohnson
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Jun 18, 2004, 05:08 PM
 
Who really needs a 30" screen????? I will be happy when I get my new 12" PowerBook.
     
memory-minus
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Jun 18, 2004, 07:26 PM
 
Originally posted by Thinktank:
It's one of my main sticking points.... If the new 30" comes in at a reasonable price ($2000) I'm all over it.... unfortunately, I don't see it coming in that low....
Or get a 23" now for $1499 (after mail-in rebate). No 30" screen will come anywhere near $2000 for a while, especially an apple one.
     
d0ubled0wn
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Jun 18, 2004, 10:00 PM
 
I'm waiting for new displays. Not that I can afford one. I just like looking at new Apple stuff.
     
nate_02
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Jun 18, 2004, 10:39 PM
 
Originally posted by Socially Awkward Solo:
What is wrong with the current ones?
They are just over a year old and are overdue for an upgrade. I really could use a 30" for video editing. However I am wating until I buy a new Power Mac to buy a new display.
-nate
     
Socially Awkward Solo
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Jun 18, 2004, 11:27 PM
 
Originally posted by nate_02:
They are just over a year old and are overdue for an upgrade.
Why?

"Laugh it up, fuzz ball!"
     
Oneota
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Jun 18, 2004, 11:38 PM
 
Originally posted by Socially Awkward Solo:
Why?
'Cause they still look like Sawtooth G4 towers. Pinstripes are sooo 2000.

And they're overpriced.
"Yields a falsehood when preceded by its quotation" yields a falsehood when preceded by its quotation.
     
nate_02
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Jun 18, 2004, 11:42 PM
 
Originally posted by Oneota:
'Cause they still look like Sawtooth G4 towers. Pinstripes are sooo 2000.

And they're overpriced.
And the 20" happens to be brighter than the 23"

I think they should all be consistent.


Can a regular video card in a Power Mac DP 1.25 support a 30" (I'd still wait till I buy a G5 if they came out with a 30)
-nate
     
The Placid Casual
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Jun 19, 2004, 07:49 AM
 
it is an issue.

I have a 17" LCD ASD to go with my G5, when combined, the desktop looks like a mess with all the different colours and designs on it.

Old style graphite of the LCD,
New style el cheapo white keyboard and mouse, (although I do use a MX700 which does improve things)
Industrial cool of the G5.

all together = Dogs dinner.

I'm going to give my 17" screen to my mother for her dual 450 and buy one of the metal Samsung numbers I think...
     
southtdi
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Jun 19, 2004, 10:11 AM
 
I am not so picky about the looks. I am waiting for the new displays so I can snag one of the older ones at the reduced cost to clear inventory. I'm sure the new ones will have me wanting one but I can deal with it.
     
mosespatrader  (op)
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Jun 19, 2004, 12:33 PM
 
I feel that the current displays are just outdated when you look at response time and contrast ratio. I would have probably bought a Samsung Syncmaster by now. However the new Syncmaster's don't have any physical controls, you have to use their softtware (even for brightness) and the software only runs on Windows. They say the Syncmaster's are mac compatible, but aren't really.
     
Rev-O
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Jun 19, 2004, 12:42 PM
 
Originally posted by 365:
Yeah, I'm waiting, for no other reason than the situation with AppleCare, where you have to purchase both items at the same time to have your screen covered.
Me too. If I'm gonna drop $3000 on a display (which is my guess at the price), I want an extended warranty! Any chance Apple will rethink their Applecare strategy and offer Applecare on Display purchases? Yah, 2 chances... slim and none!
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!
     
Eyenovation
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Jun 19, 2004, 11:26 PM
 
There is something nice to the idea of having a matching display to go w. that shiny new G5. I know I'd like to pick one up. WWDC can't come fast enough.
     
Kyosho88
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Jun 20, 2004, 01:23 AM
 
A new 30" Display will be available at the WWDC according to the Apple representative. My friend company who's an authorized Apple Dealer, the representative said a new 30" display is coming soon.
     
Eyenovation
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Jun 20, 2004, 01:33 AM
 
Assuming that's true, it remains to be seen just how soon they're available there after.
I've been waiting on this for months. Truth be told, I've heard of prototypes making their way into hands of high level employees as early as last year.

http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.p...hlight=display

I'm hearing it can't be used with anything other than a G5 (the 30")
     
Zoom
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Jun 20, 2004, 04:12 PM
 
I'm very interested in seeing new displays, and I'm very much in the market for a new flat display. Can someone help me compare these, though? You can look at the tech specs, but my feeling is that there's more to it than just brightness, viewing angle, and contrast. Can you really compare these things on paper? If so, Apple displays seem to be way overpriced - but am I missing something?

The only real way I can figure to compare two monitors is to buy both of them, hook them both up side by side, and see which one looks better.

Let's approach this more scientifically. Here are the specs on three monitors I've been looking at. Can someone analyze them with some commentary?

Apple 20" Cinema display:
- native res: 1680 by 1050
- viewing angle: 170 horizontal; 170 vertical
- brightness: 230 cd/m2
- contrast ratio: 350:1
- response time: ?
- cost: $1300

ViewSonic VP 191s:
- native res: 1280x1024
- viewing angle: 170 horizontal; 170 vertical
- brightness: 250 cd/m2
- contrast ratio: 600:1
- response time: 25ms
- cost: $720

Formac 2010
- native res: 1600 by 1200
- viewing angle: 170 horizontal; 170 vertical
- brightness: 250 cd/m2
- contrast ratio: 600:1
- response time: 15ms
- cost: $1300

Looks to me like the ViewSonic, which is a standard aspect ratio LCD, is a great deal: better specs, much cheaper. However, it's not 16:9.

The Formac looks to also be better, for the same price, and it has a 3-year warrantee.

The big diff seems to be contrast ratio. And though I can't find the Apple response time now, I recall finding it before when I was shopping and it wasn't nearly as good. Can someone confirm this?

I think they all have DVI input (the Formac even has ADC).
     
Zoom
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Jun 20, 2004, 04:24 PM
 
There's also a post in the peripherals forum (probably a better place for this thread, actually) about an HP 23" 16:9 display for $1700. Looks like a hell of a deal.
     
Talk2Angus
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Jun 22, 2004, 09:17 AM
 
New 30" HD display comes in at $2999
TALK2U Soon
Angus Pohl
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South Afica
     
Kyosho88
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Jun 22, 2004, 10:54 PM
 
Originally posted by Thinktank:
It's one of my main sticking points.... If the new 30" comes in at a reasonable price ($2000) I'm all over it.... unfortunately, I don't see it coming in that low....
I think the new 30" Apple Display will cost either $2499 or $2999.

A new Apple 23" will be release at the WWDC.
     
Kyosho88
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Jun 23, 2004, 12:30 AM
 
Originally posted by Thinktank:
It's one of my main sticking points.... If the new 30" comes in at a reasonable price ($2000) I'm all over it.... unfortunately, I don't see it coming in that low....
I think the new 30" Apple Display will cost either $2499 or $2999.

A new Apple 23" will be release at the WWDC.
     
teknik
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Jun 24, 2004, 01:52 PM
 
I quite like the look of my 17" with my G5, especially with my Creature II dark silver speakers setting next to it.

Theres just something about being too "aluminized" it makes me feel like I'm at Chipotle!
     
Busemann
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Jun 24, 2004, 02:10 PM
 
Originally posted by Zoom:
I'm very interested in seeing new displays, and I'm very much in the market for a new flat display. Can someone help me compare these, though? You can look at the tech specs, but my feeling is that there's more to it than just brightness, viewing angle, and contrast. Can you really compare these things on paper? If so, Apple displays seem to be way overpriced - but am I missing something?

The only real way I can figure to compare two monitors is to buy both of them, hook them both up side by side, and see which one looks better.

Let's approach this more scientifically. Here are the specs on three monitors I've been looking at. Can someone analyze them with some commentary?

Apple 20" Cinema display:
- native res: 1680 by 1050
- viewing angle: 170 horizontal; 170 vertical
- brightness: 230 cd/m2
- contrast ratio: 350:1
- response time: ?
- cost: $1300

ViewSonic VP 191s:
- native res: 1280x1024
- viewing angle: 170 horizontal; 170 vertical
- brightness: 250 cd/m2
- contrast ratio: 600:1
- response time: 25ms
- cost: $720

Formac 2010
- native res: 1600 by 1200
- viewing angle: 170 horizontal; 170 vertical
- brightness: 250 cd/m2
- contrast ratio: 600:1
- response time: 15ms
- cost: $1300

Looks to me like the ViewSonic, which is a standard aspect ratio LCD, is a great deal: better specs, much cheaper. However, it's not 16:9.

The Formac looks to also be better, for the same price, and it has a 3-year warrantee.

The big diff seems to be contrast ratio. And though I can't find the Apple response time now, I recall finding it before when I was shopping and it wasn't nearly as good. Can someone confirm this?

I think they all have DVI input (the Formac even has ADC).

Well, I have the 20" and its by far the best monitor I've ever used. Once you go wide, you'll never want to use anything else.

Anyways, it also won a shootout in MacUser a while ago beating all other displays (including the Formac). I'd definitely go and buy it come next monday when they'll slash the price..
     
Zoom
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Jun 24, 2004, 03:02 PM
 
Isn't the contrast ratio difference noticeable? The Apple display is way lower than the other two. And I've heard the Apple refresh rate is awful. I don't play lots of games, but I wouldn't want it to look crappy when I do.

I definitely like the wide screen format, though.
     
Socially Awkward Solo
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Jun 24, 2004, 04:24 PM
 
Originally posted by Zoom:
Isn't the contrast ratio difference noticeable? The Apple display is way lower than the other two. And I've heard the Apple refresh rate is awful. I don't play lots of games, but I wouldn't want it to look crappy when I do.
Oh brother.

"Laugh it up, fuzz ball!"
     
Boochie
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Jun 24, 2004, 04:36 PM
 
I have the 17" Apple LCD, and it looks just fine on every first-person shooter I've played on it: MoH, Call of Duty, JKII, and others. The refresh rate may well be lower than others on the market, but the monitor looks fine to my eyes.

Originally posted by Zoom:
Isn't the contrast ratio difference noticeable? The Apple display is way lower than the other two. And I've heard the Apple refresh rate is awful. I don't play lots of games, but I wouldn't want it to look crappy when I do.

I definitely like the wide screen format, though.
     
mosespatrader  (op)
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Jun 24, 2004, 05:11 PM
 
According to ThinkSecret, they are betting new displays on Monday. That will be good news, since I ordered a dual the other day from the Apple store and now need a monitor to go with it!
     
Turias
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Jun 24, 2004, 05:12 PM
 
Originally posted by mosespatrader:
According to ThinkSecret, they are betting new displays on Monday. That will be good news, since I ordered a dual the other day from the Apple store and now need a monitor to go with it!
If you had waited you could have put the monitor on the same Apple Care plan, assuming you got one. It might not be too late.
     
hyperb0le
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Jun 24, 2004, 05:41 PM
 
I already have a G5, but I am waiting until aluminum displays are released before I buy a new display.

* I am currently using a Trinitron CRT with smears all over it from where I have killed bugs
     
Eriamjh
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Jun 24, 2004, 09:30 PM
 
Originally posted by nate_02:
And the 20" happens to be brighter than the 23"

I think they should all be consistent.
You must be referring to MAXIMUM brightness. Any display can be dimmed down.

Perhaps Apple uses the same cold cathode tube to light them both and since the light output is distributed across a larger area, it is dimmer.

I'm a bird. I am the 1% (of pets).
     
TiDual
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Jun 25, 2004, 05:53 AM
 
Originally posted by Busemann:
Well, I have the 20" and its by far the best monitor I've ever used. Once you go wide, you'll never want to use anything else.

Anyways, it also won a shootout in MacUser a while ago beating all other displays (including the Formac). I'd definitely go and buy it come next monday when they'll slash the price..
I have the a number of ASDs (15", numerous 17" and an "early" 22") as well as several Formacs (20" platinum, and some 19" Oxygens) in my group. I've had one 17" and the 22" ASD die on me.

The main problem with all of these is the lack of ability to set the height ... they do sit a little low for many peoples comport.

The Formac (platinum) is *excellent* for the money, and in Europe is under 1000 Euro (the 20" ASD is 1300), with 3 year on-site. Great quality, and suits the look of the G5. I'm thinking of getting a second (DVI) for a dual monitor set-up, but will probably wait to see what the new Apple displays are like. In the meantime. I think the Formac 2010 platinum is excellent quality/value (the Oxygens are not as nice, and have a weaker warranty, but are "ok") ... not saying the Apple 20" isn't good or maybe better, but not sure it's worth 300 more.
     
blakespot
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Jun 25, 2004, 09:44 AM
 
I have dual Apple 20" cinemas hooked to my dual G4 800's GeForce 4Ti, which soon will be hooked to my on-order dual G5 2.5's Radeon 9800XT.

I do a lot of gaming (HALO, Q3A, UT2K3/4, Alice, Giants, etc.) and was concerned about the 25ms refresh rate of Apple's (and most other LCDs') displays. That translates into a max full refresh of 40fps before blur starts to appear. I saw some vendors were offering 16ms and the like. I came to find, however, that these "16ms" screens need to strobe certain pixels on and off to achieve and visible average to get a color right. So while they can regresh at 16ms, you're not seeing a solid image constantly. That seems a piss-poor way to achieve a faster refresh, to me.

Having left my dual 19" Sony CRT's behind for these two 20" Cinemas I can say that, for gaming, it is a non-issue. And the games that support widescreen as a native mode (HALO comes to mind) the panorama view is exquisite. I hope DOOM3 supports such a mode.

And personally, I prefer the look of the current Cinemas to the brushed aluminum enclosures that I see in leaks / mock-ups. They seem "lighter" with the translucent plastic. Very sharp looking.



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osxisfun
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Jun 25, 2004, 10:50 AM
 
Hey. are you a lefty or something I put my menu bar / main screen on the right lcd.
     
Eyenovation
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Jun 25, 2004, 03:07 PM
 
Originally posted by osxisfun:
Hey. are you a lefty or something I put my menu bar / main screen on the right lcd.
Nice set up! He's not a lefty. Look at where his mouse is, relative to the keyboard.
How do you like the dual display setup? Any problems?
     
osxisfun
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Jun 25, 2004, 03:35 PM
 
Originally posted by Eyenovation:
Nice set up! He's not a lefty. Look at where his mouse is, relative to the keyboard.
How do you like the dual display setup? Any problems?
Doh. Yes. I should have seen that.


games. i don't play games but for kicks i will try a game demo out (and soon realize why i do not play games (i get bored)

and the resizing of the screen (640x480?) of some games will move all your windows from the outer screen to the inner and screw up window sizes etc.


desktop manager does not work on the 2nd screen so i went back to codetek's v desktop


that's all i can think of now. over all A+.
     
Simon
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Jun 26, 2004, 03:46 AM
 
I'm hoping they release a 20" wide-aspect SD with dual inputs (VGA and DVI), a built-in USB and FireWire hub, and ultra-thin bezel. If it's $999 I'd be tempted to buy two. One for at work and for my PowerBook at home.

And please kill off ADC. A combined cable could do almost the same job, but the screen would be so much more affordable to PowerBook owners if it came with DVI. Most of the time proprietary connectors just suck.
     
:XI:
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Jun 27, 2004, 03:29 PM
 
Originally posted by Simon:
I'm hoping they release a 20" wide-aspect SD with dual inputs (VGA and DVI), a built-in USB and FireWire hub, and ultra-thin bezel. If it's $999 I'd be tempted to buy two. One for at work and for my PowerBook at home.

And please kill off ADC. A combined cable could do almost the same job, but the screen would be so much more affordable to PowerBook owners if it came with DVI. Most of the time proprietary connectors just suck.
Screw ADC eh? Yeah, I'd much rather have to connect my display to a DVI port, a USB port AND a Firewire port. Just to save YOU some money. If you can only afford a Powerbook and an Apple display you've probably got your priorities wrong.

Edited to say: If you sold some of that crap you're hanging on to it wouldn't be a problem
     
motti
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Jun 27, 2004, 03:35 PM
 
Originally posted by blakespot:
And personally, I prefer the look of the current Cinemas to the brushed aluminum enclosures that I see in leaks / mock-ups. They seem "lighter" with the translucent plastic. Very sharp looking.


blakespot
I agree! Besides, have you seen a movie about a fish lately?

What is that little box behind your right display, the one with light spots on it? Looks interesting...
AppleWatch - System Requirements: Female or male wrist | Left or right hand version | Ability to have a good time
     
Simon
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Jun 27, 2004, 05:02 PM
 
deleted
     
Nawoo
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Jun 27, 2004, 07:30 PM
 
Are the old 20 inch displays still the same price? or do they have mail in rebates like the 23inch?
     
Link
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Jun 27, 2004, 08:11 PM
 
Originally posted by motti:
I agree! Besides, have you seen a movie about a fish lately?

What is that little box behind your right display, the one with light spots on it? Looks interesting...
Yah.. the "new" displays look like HP displays on samsung bases

Apple's "unique" design has gone down the hole.
Aloha
     
memory-minus
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Jun 27, 2004, 08:31 PM
 
Originally posted by Link:
Yah.. the "new" displays look like HP displays on samsung bases

Apple's "unique" design has gone down the hole.
I thought I was the only one who felt this way... I love ADC and the current look of the Cinema Displays... who wants to plug in power, video, USB and firewire just to connect a monitor? Who needs FireWire on the display anyway -- just get an external hub. Belkin makes a tiny one. I don't own anything USB 2.0 and can't ever imagine needing it... my keyboard and USB speakers are plugged into the back of my 23" display and I like it that way!

Hopefully Apple will stay true to their ease of use concept, that which brought us the 1-button mouse and ADC. We'll find out tomorrow...
     
kcourt
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Jun 28, 2004, 08:22 PM
 
MacConnection has reduced the price of the old 20" by $100....

Kathy
     
Simon
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Jun 29, 2004, 03:26 AM
 
Originally posted by Simon:
And please kill off ADC. A combined cable could do almost the same job, but the screen would be so much more affordable to PowerBook owners if it came with DVI. Most of the time proprietary connectors just suck.
Thanks Steve.

I guess the question now is why Apple chose FW400 connectors instead of FW800? USB2 is advertised as 480Mbps - of course in real world use it does less, but that's the number most buyers will see and believe. If Apple wants to push FW instead of USB2, why don't they switch to FW800 across the board? The numbers will give it the better publicity. And buyers get maximum flexibility since FW800 can do both 800 and 400 (with a cheap adapter). I'm wondering if Apple isn't risking USB2 to oust FW just because they're too stingy to include FW800 on all hardware sold today.

I know DV cameras and the like is all FW, but what about tomorrow, when Intel asks the camera makers why they use an "inferior" interface? What will convince them to stick with the "slower" interface when the big offers come? As history shows it's not the better product/concept that wins, it's the better advertized.
     
   
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