Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > macOS > Prediction: Snow Leopard will be free

Prediction: Snow Leopard will be free (Page 2)
Thread Tools
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 03:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
What do normal people need ARD for? I use vnc over ssh and it works like a charm.
I'll second that.
     
JKT
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: London, UK
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 04:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by Chuckit View Post
You're assuming these are things developers need to go out of their way to benefit from. It's entirely possible that the existing system libraries could be enhanced to take advantage of the new features, in which case your claim that "no apps will support it" would be exactly backwards.
However, that takes nothing away from the complete lack of saleability to your average consumer that Grand Central will have. If Apple charge anything more than $20 for Snow Leopard (assuming that they really are not adding anything new other than what has already been announced), the uptake is going to be treacle slow. There just isn't anything in it that they can sell to consumers, especially when we're in the middle of a ****-storm of a global recession.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 04:27 AM
 
Exchange support alone is going to make quite a few machine sales.

I've seen a *lot* of business people looking to buy a home machine, but still requiring Exchange. Shelling out an extra €430 just for Exchange support is not a good proposition, so a number of people keep Outlook running in Parallels.

Snow Leopard looks like a good upgrade for them.
     
JKT
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: London, UK
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 05:47 AM
 
However, business people who will (a) be able to and (b) will need to integrate their Mac with an Exchange 2007 server will make up a tiny, tiny fraction of Apple's user base. Sorry, but 99% of consumers are not going to give a flying f about Exchange support as it is something that they just don't and won't ever need. It will help shift some copies of SL for sure, but it isn't going to be very many and it certainly won't help drive a large scale move from earlier versions of OS X in a short space of time.

$129 will be grossly over-priced if Apple is hoping to get as many people as possible using SL in short order. I know that I am not going to be remotely interested in it if they charge that much and it'll also be the first time I won't bother upgrading OS X. On the current info, it just doesn't offer me anything I truly need or, just as importantly for Apple, that they can make me think that I truly need; especially when I am having to worry about how much money I've got coming in each month and whether or not I will still have my job in a year's time. I doubt I will be alone in that sentiment, either.
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 05:55 AM
 
Originally Posted by JKT View Post
Sorry, but 99% of consumers are not going to give a flying f about Exchange support as it is something that they just don't and won't ever need.
Which is why SL will also come with a brand new and super fancy GUI to attract the '99% consumers'. Plus those 100+ new features Apple will detail on the SL web page. Apple marketing has no doubt faced greater challenges than selling SL at $129.
     
JKT
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: London, UK
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 10:31 AM
 
Unless Apple have been lying to us we already know that there are not going to be 100+ new features for the consumer in SL. There might be 100+ new features in the underlying OS, but that isn't going to sell anything to me (an advanced Mac user) or a consumer if I see no real-world benefit to it. A new UI might also shift a few boxes but there is no way that it will persuade me to spend more than a few pounds on the upgrade. £80+ is fantasy money for a coat of lipstick. A new Finder that actually works might, but yet another revamp of the shite we still have most definitely will not.

In any case, I think it is pretty much guaranteed that Apple is going to be stupid enough to charge £80+ for SL. However, I'm also quite certain that there will be far fewer mugs willing to pay it than they anticipate this time around.
     
Chuckit
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Diego, CA, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 11:47 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Which is why SL will also come with a brand new and super fancy GUI to attract the '99% consumers'. Plus those 100+ new features Apple will detail on the SL web page. Apple marketing has no doubt faced greater challenges than selling SL at $129.
I don't think so. They've already said that's not true. IMO, Snow Leopard is going to be a selling point for new Macs they're planning with 16 billion cores and five GPUs, so it really doesn't matter how many people buy the shrinkwrap version.
Chuck
___
"Instead of either 'multi-talented' or 'multitalented' use 'bisexual'."
     
Proudest Monkey
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Mini-Apple, Minnesota
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 03:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
My guess is both Snow Leopard and Win7 are both going to be paid upgrades at normal prices.
Unless Microsoft does the unthinkable and releases Win7 for free to Vista users then Apple may do the same for Leopard users and pre-Leopard users will pay the full price ($129) - not likely though.

Quicktime X, new GUI, iLife apps taking advantage of Grand Central and OpenCL - will warrant a $129 price tag.

I'm in favor of a $69 upgrade for Leopard users and $129 for pre-Leopard
MacBook 13.3" C2D 2.0ghz 2gb/160gb
     
CharlesS
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Dec 2000
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 04:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Which is why SL will also come with a brand new and super fancy GUI to attract the '99% consumers'. Plus those 100+ new features Apple will detail on the SL web page. Apple marketing has no doubt faced greater challenges than selling SL at $129.
A brand new and super-fancy GUI didn't help Microsoft out with Vista. Just sayin'...

Ticking sound coming from a .pkg package? Don't let the .bom go off! Inspect it first with Pacifist. Macworld - five mice!
     
slugslugslug
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Durham, NC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 10, 2009, 09:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by Proudest Monkey View Post
I'm in favor of a $69 upgrade for Leopard users and $129 for pre-Leopard
I'm in favor of it, too, but it doesn't seem Apple's style. They don't tend to deal with upgrade pricing schemes that much, especially for high-volume, broad market products like the OS or iLife. It seems like it might be more trouble than it's worth to deal with verifying that people have Leopard.
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 11, 2009, 02:39 AM
 
Originally Posted by CharlesS View Post
A brand new and super-fancy GUI didn't help Microsoft out with Vista. Just sayin'...
That's correct. However, bad sales weren't about the GUI either. Vista didn't sell because it was a piece of junk. People realized they were more productive if they stayed with XP. We expect Apple OTOH to make SL even better than Leopard already is. If they manage to pull off what they're trying to do this will benefit everybody if they know it or not. And a new and fancy GUI will help sell it to those people who don't know what OpenCL stands for. But sure, if SL makes people less productive than Leopard a new GUI sure won't sell it.
     
CharlesS
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Dec 2000
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 11, 2009, 02:48 AM
 
I expected Vista to be better than XP was, even after some of the flashy features were removed - I mean, redesigned architecture, more security, less reliance on the Registry - it should have been a good release. Apple will most likely do better, but even then I doubt whether a new skin alone would cause many end users to upgrade.

OTOH, perhaps they don't need to. Like Chuckit mentioned, the greatest benefit of Snow Leopard will be the abilities it will enable on future hardware, on which SL will ship anyway.

Hell, I'm not going to pretend to be a clairvoyant. We'll see what happens when it happens.

Ticking sound coming from a .pkg package? Don't let the .bom go off! Inspect it first with Pacifist. Macworld - five mice!
     
Big Mac
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 11, 2009, 03:16 AM
 
What if SL gets pushed back another year and made into a traditional major OS X release?

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
OreoCookie
Moderator
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hilbert space
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 11, 2009, 05:42 AM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac View Post
What if SL gets pushed back another year and made into a traditional major OS X release?
That's also an option. There have been rumors of a new UI (marble) and I guess this could always happen.

Although it would make more sense if Apple has an intermediate release so that developers can start integrating next-gen technologies into their apps until they are ready for prime time with 10.7. Right now, Apple is not really forced to make a feature-centric release (as, arguably, Windows 6.1 aka Windows 7 is also a polish-centric release, nothing wrong with that).
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
OreoCookie
Moderator
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hilbert space
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 05:49 AM
 
Let's get the discussion back on track, shall we?
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
Proudest Monkey
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Mini-Apple, Minnesota
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 08:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
Let's get the discussion back on track, shall we?
We shall ...

I think the key to convincing people to switch will be 2 fold - people like us will upgrade; long time mac users, people who understand there is unnecessary code within the operating system, people craving a little more speed. We can appreciate those features.

People who may not be able to appreciate those features will need to be marketed correctly. Of course, SL will ship on all new macs and that's how most switchers will acquire SL, however, this may be many switchers first experience with a MacOS X upgrade. How do you convince them to switch? You point out the bloatware Microsoft had been pushing off on them for years by telling them MacOS X is trimming it's fat, not piling it on. This should get some switchers - fairly competent computer users but new to Macs - to upgrade.

Will all this get people like my wife to upgrade? Of course not - she will when her next computer is purchased.
MacBook 13.3" C2D 2.0ghz 2gb/160gb
     
OreoCookie
Moderator
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hilbert space
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 08:50 AM
 
I'll upgrade one way or the other, I think I have to get a new machine next year anyway
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 12:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Which is why SL will also come with a brand new and super fancy GUI to attract the '99% consumers'. Plus those 100+ new features Apple will detail on the SL web page. Apple marketing has no doubt faced greater challenges than selling SL at $129.
Another two of those 100 new 'features' were just leaked.


(PS mockup)

Snow Leopard Adds Minor Often Requested Tweaks: Put Back, Stack Folder Navigation
     
CharlesS
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Dec 2000
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 12:28 PM
 
So "Put Back" actually got put back, eh? I've been wondering how long that would take.

Ticking sound coming from a .pkg package? Don't let the .bom go off! Inspect it first with Pacifist. Macworld - five mice!
     
olePigeon
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Dec 1999
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 12:30 PM
 
Rumors are that Windows 7 will be free to Vista buyers.
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Stephen F. Roberts
     
Proudest Monkey
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Mini-Apple, Minnesota
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 12:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
Rumors are that Windows 7 will be free to Vista buyers.
Source?
MacBook 13.3" C2D 2.0ghz 2gb/160gb
     
Proudest Monkey
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Mini-Apple, Minnesota
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 01:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by Proudest Monkey View Post
Source?
I came across an article that says machines purchased after July 1st will be eligible - not a bad deal actually.

http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/12/w...ails-released/
MacBook 13.3" C2D 2.0ghz 2gb/160gb
     
slugslugslug
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Durham, NC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 02:33 PM
 
Originally Posted by CharlesS View Post
So "Put Back" actually got put back, eh? I've been wondering how long that would take.
I still occasionally hit Cmd-Y when I've moved something I didn't mean to, then get all confused when the Quick Look pane shows up…
     
Super Mario
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 02:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Another two of those 100 new 'features' were just leaked.


(PS mockup)
That looks a bit like minimise in place which some of us enabled in 10.2
( Last edited by Super Mario; Jan 10, 2018 at 01:25 PM. )
     
mduell
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 03:22 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
Rumors are that Windows 7 will be free to Vista buyers.
The rumor is that new PCs purchased with some versions of Vista after July from participating OEMs will get free upgrade coupons for Win7. No real surprise there to avoid the pre-release computer sales slump.
     
byeehaaw
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: nyc
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 05:19 PM
 
yea, def. not free. they'd prolly sell it for cheaper then 129 tho
2.4ghz Unibody MBP, 32gb ipod touch 2nd gen
     
0157988944
Professional Poster
Join Date: May 2007
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 12, 2009, 06:43 PM
 
A real screenshot of SL shows that the Spaces drill-down action is a lot less impressive than the mockup. It just shows a little arrow at the top corner to go back.
     
MacNNUK
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: U.K.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 13, 2009, 10:17 AM
 
Snow Leopard will be a free software update for one week.

For anyone with Leopard.



I hope !

iMac Intel Core i5, 2.5GHz, 4GB RAM, 500GB 21.5" Monitor 10.8.3.
iMac 17" 2.0ghz Intel Core 2 Duo w 3gb memory (White one) 10.6.8.
Internal 500gb / 8x external HDD's 250GB - 3TB (4x Time Machine)
     
fisherKing
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: brooklyn ny
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 13, 2009, 10:33 AM
 
my research shows that snow leopard will NOT be free, but will in fact come with a free mac...
"At first, there was Nothing. Then Nothing inverted itself and became Something.
And that is what you all are: inverted Nothings...with potential" (Sun Ra)
     
OreoCookie
Moderator
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hilbert space
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 13, 2009, 11:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
The rumor is that new PCs purchased with some versions of Vista after July from participating OEMs will get free upgrade coupons for Win7. No real surprise there to avoid the pre-release computer sales slump.
The downside is that apparently people who want to upgrade are very much limited in their options: Windows Vista Home Premium owners can only upgrade to Windows 7 Home Premium, ditto for Pro and Ultimate.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
SirCastor
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Salt Lake City, UT USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 13, 2009, 11:04 AM
 
If Snow Leopard were going to be free, it would be a 10.5.x update (or series of updates), not a major version shift. They would split the performance enhancements from the interface and feature updates and sell the latter as it's own product (Snow Leopard).

Snow Leopard for free just doesn't sound right. I am intrigued though at the Snow Leopard @ <$129
2008 iMac 3.06 Ghz, 2GB Memory, GeForce 8800, 500GB HD, SuperDrive
8gb iPhone on Tmobile
     
rambo47
Mac Elite
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Denville, NJ.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 13, 2009, 03:51 PM
 
Snow Leopard will not be free. Apple hasn't given an update away for free since the earliest days of OSX. Why would they start now? Especially with market share climbing. That means this is a revenue stream that is growing. $129 sounds right. Maybe they do offer the free QT Pro option as part of it, but expect pricing to remain the same as other past updates.

Also, Windows 7 will not be free, other than as an upgrade for those who bought a Vista-equipped machine close to the Windows 7 release date. MS has already posted the SKUs for all the different versions they plan to offer. It was going to be free they certainly wouldn't offer all those different versions, like Home Basic, Home Premium, blah blah blah. They'd just make it "Home" and "Business".
     
mduell
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 13, 2009, 06:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
The downside is that apparently people who want to upgrade are very much limited in their options: Windows Vista Home Premium owners can only upgrade to Windows 7 Home Premium, ditto for Pro and Ultimate.
Which makes sense for a free upgrade: buy the edition you want, get the new version of that edition for free.
     
OreoCookie
Moderator
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hilbert space
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 13, 2009, 07:05 PM
 
No, I wasn't speaking of people buying Vista now, I was speaking of people who are not eligible for a free update. For the, it doesn't make much sense. If you want to upgrade to another version, you have to pay full price.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
hmurchison2001
Senior User
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Seattle
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 13, 2009, 08:22 PM
 
Snow Leopard will not be $129. It may not be free but there's no way Apple is going to coax a significant amount of people into coughing up that kind of money for optimation.

I know there are the rampant complainers with every release but there were folks who couldn't see the value of Leopard and it's chalk full of new features (I don't want to compute without Quick Look ...I knew I'd love if the first time I read about it).

While this was a vocal minority I'd expect efforts to sell Snow Leopard at 130 bucks would have a more vast chorus of dectractors.

Snow Leopard is a bridge OS. Apple cut legacy and charged off into a more definitive future. They need every Intel computer to move to Snow Leopard as quickly as possible. If Apple needed the cash they wouldn't have delivered iWork sans serialization.

I expect the most difficult part is dealing with Tiger users on Intel. How do you upgrade Tiger and Leopard users without either feeling screwed?
http://hmurchison.blogspot.com/ highly opinionated ramblings free of charge :)
     
Judge_Fire
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Helsinki, Finland
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 23, 2009, 05:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by CharlesS View Post
So "Put Back" actually got put back, eh? I've been wondering how long that would take.
Hopefully it isn't limited for the Trash context only, the screenshots all seem to depict that.

Something about the original 'place things you're working on to the desktop, then put them back when done'- idea appeals to me, even if aliases soon made things more flexible.
     
MindFad
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Sep 2001
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 23, 2009, 07:17 PM
 
Originally Posted by CharlesS View Post
So "Put Back" actually got put back, eh? I've been wondering how long that would take.
Hallelujah.
     
GSixZero
Mac Elite
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Seattle, WA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 23, 2009, 11:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by hmurchison2001 View Post
I expect the most difficult part is dealing with Tiger users on Intel. How do you upgrade Tiger and Leopard users without either feeling screwed?
It's not like Leopard is brand new, it's 16 months old. If people don't feel like they've gotten their money's worth by now, they're never going to feel that way.

ImpulseResponse
     
Big Mac
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 24, 2009, 02:12 AM
 
Originally Posted by Judge_Fire View Post
Hopefully it isn't limited for the Trash context only, the screenshots all seem to depict that.
Don't worry, if that were the case I doubt the feature would be added at all.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 24, 2009, 02:53 AM
 
More leaked Leopard screenshots here.

Put Back:


Navigating folder structures in Stacks (obviously the previous PS mockup nailed it)


There's a movie of how it works here (alt-click to d/l).
     
Simon
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: in front of my Mac
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 24, 2009, 05:23 AM
 
And some more. This is 10A261 BTW.



     
 
Thread Tools
 
Forum Links
Forum Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Top
Privacy Policy
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:24 AM.
All contents of these forums © 1995-2017 MacNN. All rights reserved.
Branding + Design: www.gesamtbild.com
vBulletin v.3.8.8 © 2000-2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.,