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drewm · Mar 8, 2002, 11:18 AM

Can you leave a PB on all the time (16hrs/day) like I do with my desktop? I'm thinking of switching to a PB as my main machine and wonder if it can take it. Any other caveats in making a PB your only or main machine?
thanks

Paso · Mar 8, 2002, 11:59 AM

Originally posted by drewm:
Can you leave a PB on all the time (16hrs/day) like I do with my desktop? I'm thinking of switching to a PB as my main machine and wonder if it can take it. Any other caveats in making a PB your only or main machine?
thanks

Sure, why not? My PB runs the whole day (and sometimes also the whole night) with absolut no problems. I made it my main machine and never regretted it. I can plugin a second monitor as additional working space and that was one of the most important issues for me, so now working on my Ti makes me more happy every day... (it�s true!)

C33 · Mar 8, 2002, 12:03 PM

my pismo has been my main machine for almost two years. the only time i cut it off is when it freezes up; other than that it's usually in sleep mode when not in use.

deliverator · Mar 8, 2002, 12:20 PM

As an experiment, I left my ti667 on for about a week or so, merely putting it to sleep to carry it to work and back home and so on, and I never had a single problem. I only restarted because some software update demanded I do so.

I own four computers -- the PB, an upgraded beigeG3, a win98 box, and a linux box -- and since I bought the TiBook, I don't even touch the others. With the exception of games, the powerbook is easily the equal of any machine I've ever used. In fact, the old Mac is going to a friend this weekend and a PS2 has taken precedence over the game PC. A superlative PowerBook is a good way to get rid of a lot of excess gadgetry in your life.

mrtew · Mar 8, 2002, 10:00 PM

Actually I think it's better to leave computers on all the time... PB's included. Turning them on and off lets them cool down and heat up too much and that takes it's toll. Sleep is the best way of turning it 'off'. I haven't turned my Ti off in a year... not counting restarts.

skyman · Mar 8, 2002, 10:10 PM

Originally posted by drewm:
Can you leave a PB on all the time (16hrs/day) like I do with my desktop? I'm thinking of switching to a PB as my main machine and wonder if it can take it. Any other caveats in making a PB your only or main machine?
thanks

YES!

zarvox · Mar 9, 2002, 11:22 AM

I wonder if leaving the adapter connected to wall outlet all the time will damage it or the laptop battery? Is it better to unplug the adapter when the computer goes to sleep?

tooki · Mar 9, 2002, 12:03 PM

Originally posted by John Tewksbury:
Actually I think it's better to leave computers on all the time... PB's included. Turning them on and off lets them cool down and heat up too much and that takes it's toll. Sleep is the best way of turning it 'off'.

Putting a PowerBook to sleep lets it cool down, too... thermal stress is equally miniscule for sleep and shutdown. The warming or cooling of components happens gradually -- it's not like if a cold PowerBook warms up in some spots like if it had a blowtorch in it! Even so, I put little credence in the argument that leaving the comp on (WITHOUT SLEEP, since sleep=cooling off) is better for it... I don't believe it harms it, but I don't believe it lengthens life, either. In other words, do whatever is most practical.

The only part of thermal stress that IS true (aside from staying within the temperature range listed in the manual) is that you have to be careful of condensation when bringing a cold computer into a warm room. You have to let the computer warm up before turning it on, because condensation can form on the cold metal, and you have to let it evaporate.

The ONLY thing that speaks for leaving a computer turned on (never sleeping) is the hard drive: it has a finite number of start/stop cycles (you can check the manufacturer to find out how many your drive can handle). Desktops, even with sleep, rarely approach the maximum cycles. Notebook hard drives, especially when run on battery, get spun up and down all day long, but notebook drives are designed to handle the abuse -- notebook hard drives are designed to handle several times the number of cycles. (For example, IBM's Travelstar drives are designed to handle 300,000 cycles, while their Deskstar drives can handle "only" 40,000 cycles. The Ultrastar server drives handle 50,000, for completeness' sake.)

Portable computers don't last as long as desktops for the simple reason that they get battered more... they go places, get bumped, nudged, dropped, banged, jostled. A desktop typically lives a docile life of being moved every few months, if that!

Originally posted by zarvox:
I wonder if leaving the adapter connected to wall outlet all the time will damage it or the laptop battery? Is it better to unplug the adapter when the computer goes to sleep?

No, leave it plugged in. The Power Manager carefully monitors everything power-related, keeping batteries charged without overcharging, providing clean power to the computer from battery or AC, etc. If you keep it unplugged, you not only run the risk of not having a charged battery when you need it, but if it's left unplugged for a while, the battery will drain. If the computer is asleep and the battery drains, it will shut off improperly, much like a crash. (In Mac OS 9 it will drain in about 2 weeks asleep. In OS X it only takes a few days of sleep to drain it. Turned off, the battery will drain in a few months; you lose about 2% of the charge per day.) I clearly recommend keeping it plugged, and occasionally use the battery until it is completely drained.

tooki

[ 03-09-2002: Message edited by: tooki ]

vmarks · Mar 9, 2002, 01:30 PM

There is something to be said for unplugging and using the battery until it tells you it will sleep to preserve your work- it exercises the battery, so that your battery keeps it's full life. I have had batteries from machines that were ALWAYS plugged in either fail to take a charge, or hold less of a charge. Note that this may or may not be relevant depending on whether your battery is a LIon or NiMH type of battery.

israces · Mar 9, 2002, 06:12 PM

A Ti is my main machine. It is my only machine. I leave it on all the time. I let it sleep when I'm not using it. I keep it plugged in all the time when not moving around. I have not noticed a hit on the life of the battery when I'm mobile. In fact, I have had absolutely no problems with this arrangement. Hope that helps.

andreas_g4 · Mar 10, 2002, 04:26 PM

I'm using solely portables for about four years, and I could never say it was disadvantage. And since you gan get a G4 in a powerbook, it's also no matter of speed. Except you need power power power.

craigthomas · Mar 11, 2002, 02:04 PM

I made the switch to using my Ti 500 full time about 5 months ago. It sure keeps things simple for me. One place for email. At home, I have access to all my files. At work I have my 21 inch monitor connected and I have what I always wanted, a two monitor setup - great for palets, email and other stuff that clear the big screen for what I'm working on. I could go on and on about how much I love having the dual monitor set up. Speed was a worry at first, but this rev A Powerbook works great for me. I work in Photoshop, Quark and a bunch of other design software, and seems just as fast as my G4 450 even with the dual monitor and OSX. The situation works good for types like me who like the mobility factor without wondering which Firewire disk has the latest files.

I also leave my PB on all the time while plugged in. Sometimes it's asleep, sometimes not. No problems there. I even keep it sleeping while I drive to work. Pull it out of the bag, plug in all the cables and I'm ready to work.

drewm · Mar 11, 2002, 02:25 PM

Thanks everyone for your input. I've decided that I will do it. Only question is to buy now or see if we see a speed bump @ Tokyo.
drew

andreas_g4 · Mar 11, 2002, 02:34 PM

I'm almost sure we won't see faster powerbooks, but it's your time to wait ;-)

CRASH HARDDRIVE · Mar 13, 2002, 05:33 AM

http://www.cybercoolerinc.com/nk-360.html

If you leave your PB on all the time, I highly recommend getting yourself one of these, or something similar. This thing keeps my PowerBook completly cool on the bottom, not a trace of heat even after a full day of use. The internal fan doesn't need to operate while using one of these, it never comes on.

Also, lest you think the 3 fan system is noisy, this thing could hardly be quieter...the internal fan is like a 747 taking off in comparison.

And no, I don't work for the Cyber-Cooler company! I'd imagine any kind of cooler pad is great, this just happens to be the one I got. I picked up one of these for $15 just on a whim, and now consider it (and 2 others I got for different locales) the best money I've spent yet on my TiBook.

rhansen_x · Mar 13, 2002, 11:56 AM

I have been using a TiBook 667 for a few months now as my main computer. It travels with me from home to office to remote locations. I have yet to have a problem with shutting it down and restarting again.

I also use a Dell Latitude loaded with Solaris8. If I could get XDarwin to do multiple rlogins to different Sun Servers at the same time, I would gladly toss the Dell in the toilet.

PowerMatt · Mar 13, 2002, 09:51 PM

I will be ordering my PowerBook in a few weeks and it will be my main computer. How do i make it run dual monitors such as some of you guys use? A short (or long) instructional reply would be beneficial

rampant · Mar 13, 2002, 10:51 PM

You could do it without many problems, but the issues as I see them are:

Prone to bein stolen

Very wide, hard to carry to a cafe and lay down on a table or airplane compared to other laptops

If you are into fast paced 3d games, the G4 667 itself won't cut it, and Apple's laptop LCD supplier's screen's aren't very quick at refreshing, resulting an lots of blurring with fast motion and a lower visibly frame rate in games.

So really, if you aren't a gamer, it's downsides are results of it's upsides (sweet screen)

deathandtaxes · Mar 13, 2002, 11:39 PM

With regard to using an external monitor, it's REALLY difficult.
1-Put TiBook to sleep.
2-Plug in monitor to VGA port
3-Wake TiBook
4-Configure monitors under Display in System Preferences

Whoops. Forgot one step.
2.5-Turn on monitor!

skyman · Mar 13, 2002, 11:42 PM

Originally posted by rampant:
You could do it without many problems, but the issues as I see them are:

Prone to bein stolen

Very wide, hard to carry to a cafe and lay down on a table or airplane compared to other laptops

If you are into fast paced 3d games, the G4 667 itself won't cut it, and Apple's laptop LCD supplier's screen's aren't very quick at refreshing, resulting an lots of blurring with fast motion and a lower visibly frame rate in games.

So really, if you aren't a gamer, it's downsides are results of it's upsides (sweet screen)

>Prone to being stolen????

This would apply to any laptop not just a Powerbook.

>If you are into fast paced 3d games, the G4 667 itself won't cut it, and >Apple's laptop LCD supplier's screen's aren't very quick at refreshing, >resulting an lots of blurring with fast motion and a lower visibly frame >rate in games.

What????

I have never seen any blurring on any PowerBook screen. I have run QUAKE, UNREAL, RTCW etc.. and never experienced any blurring.

rampant · Mar 13, 2002, 11:56 PM

Try turning with the keyboard, or go in spectator mode and fly forward while looking the ground. It blurs like crazy on a PB or iBook screen.

jonC · Mar 14, 2002, 02:28 PM

prone to being stolen because-
ITS THE BEST LAPTOP COMPUTER AVAILABLE

rampant · Mar 14, 2002, 06:19 PM

Best Apple laptop, anyway.

seanyepez · Mar 14, 2002, 08:12 PM

Laptops aren't gaming machines. Only Toshiba and Dell's notebooks that have 25-millisecond LCD's really perform.

Matsu · Mar 14, 2002, 08:31 PM

PB as main computer?

At PB prices, I should hope so!

Montanan · Mar 14, 2002, 09:02 PM

I'm a fairly recent Mac convert (after years of shameful Windows zealotry), and my iBook is rapidly becoming my near-exclusive machine -- I'm madly in love with the little guy, no doubt about it. (Anyone need an out-of-favor Dell for use as a doorstop?)

Anyhow, the iBook is getting about 10 hours of use a day right now, so the longevity discussions are interesting to me. My concern, though, hasn't been so much about the battery or temperature changes -- I'm wondering how the screen will hold out. Is it reasonable to expect 10,000 to 15,000 hours out of a laptop's LCD before its performance begins to degrade significantly? Should I be unusually aggressive in my screensaver/sleep settings to prolong the LCD's lifespan?

Thanks ...

Mark

rampant · Mar 14, 2002, 09:21 PM

Originally posted by seanyepez:
Laptops aren't gaming machines. Only Toshiba and Dell's notebooks that have 25-millisecond LCD's really perform.

Are you sure? Last I looked on the web, it was Dell and Compaq who had the best screen ms refresh time.

Matsu · Mar 14, 2002, 09:25 PM

I think it depends on how long you plan to keep the machine. AFAIK, it's ussually the backlight that craps out (even though the LCD matrix itself is usually still fine.) I think the backlights can be replaced even on laptops. I know that they can be replaced on desktop panels. However, with a design as thin as the TiBook's, you might have to replace the whole lid -- I haven't heard of any place that the LCD apart, yet.

PowerMatt · Mar 17, 2002, 09:10 PM

Originally posted by Paso:


...so now working on my Ti makes me more happy every day... (it�s true!)

working on my PC WinMe makes me violently angry everyday!

rampant · Mar 17, 2002, 09:18 PM

Gah... winMe is horrible. It's so slow and bloated compared to 98...

PowerMatt · Mar 17, 2002, 11:34 PM

for those of you who are using the TiBook as your main machine, what multimedia speakers do you use? I was interested in the Sound Sticks (will these even work with the Ti?), but my experience with them has not been peasureful. Let me know what you think.

LH · Mar 18, 2002, 01:12 AM

I use Cambridge Sound Works "Micro Works" speakers.

They provide more than enough thump for my needs, and I'm heavy into music and iTunes. I really like them, and found them very well priced compared to comprable speakers.

Downside: not digital
Upside: Doesn't use a USB port on my machine.

LH

craigthomas · Mar 18, 2002, 03:12 AM

I just got the Sound Sticks and love them. The sound is fantastic and the cool factor is better than anything I've seen.

israces · Mar 18, 2002, 11:52 PM

Klipsch

Gene Jockey · Mar 19, 2002, 01:06 AM

Don't use MM speakers, I just hook it to the Pioneer stereo in my office

As far as using a second display with the Powerbook, with 10.1.3 you don't have to put the 'Book to sleep, just plug in the monitor and use the "Detect Displays" button in the Displays Preference Pane. The monitor will be seen and come to life. Pretty cool. Now if I could just do that and shut the LCD off once the CRT is on...maybe someday.

But I recommend the Ti for full time use. Had mine 9 months and I love it. I just sleep it at night, but that had more to do with the fact that if it's awake the HD makes little clicky sounds every once in a while and it bugs me when I'm trying to sleep

Happy computing,

--J

rhansen_x · Mar 20, 2002, 07:03 PM

Speakers and a laptop????? Come on people, the whole ideal behind the PowerBook and laptops in general is portability. I've said it before - if you want great sound, buy a stereo.

rh

BigMark · Mar 22, 2002, 05:21 AM

Originally posted by vmarks:
There is something to be said for unplugging and using the battery until it tells you it will sleep to preserve your work- it exercises the battery, so that your battery keeps it's full life. I have had batteries from machines that were ALWAYS plugged in either fail to take a charge, or hold less of a charge. Note that this may or may not be relevant depending on whether your battery is a LIon or NiMH type of battery.

Now this leads on to a question I have about my Pismo. I bought it 2nd hand and it came with a 6GB IBM hard drive.

I have to have it plugged into the power all the time- if I try and run on battery power the whole system slows right down to what feels like 100MHz. An example- i try to play a small 320x240 5Mb quicktime clip- the video & audio are immediately out of sync and with stuttered play.

This is, of course, with all the necessary Energy Saver settings set to full blast performance etc. so my question to anyone out there: WHAT GIVES? This is in no way a portable with respect to being able to use it away from a power socket.

Please help.