[Eug]

Originally Posted by starman 

Will current players be able to play triple-layered HD-DVDs?

Dunno.

People who went to CEDIA were told by Toshiba engineers and reps that it would work on all HD DVD player models ever released. However, they also say that format testing is only underway now.

So that means, in theory it should work, and it works on test units, but the real world is a different kettle of fish. Just because it works on a few tweaked test units doesn't mean that factory assembled machines will automatically work fine with TL51 discs after just a firmware update.

FWIW, even the first NEC drive in the Toshiba HD-A1 first generation listed TL45 compatibility. However, it should be noted that one Toshiba engineer says that while the 3rd layer should work on existing players, the 3rd layer is indeed harder to read, and thus may generate a few more errors. OTOH, he goes on to say that error correction routines would correct these and there would not be any affect on playback. However, depending on the severity of this I'm thinking that some borderline machines could run into problems, if say the disc were slightly scratched or something.

So short answer - Dunno, but techies hinting it should work on all players in theory, but real testing is only happening now.

[starman]

You do realize that if it doesn't, it'll only give the BR fans a "ha ha!" to throw back at HD-DVD fans in regards to the whole 1.1 issue.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by starman 

You do realize that if it doesn't, it'll only give the BR fans a "ha ha!" to throw back at HD-DVD fans in regards to the whole 1.1 issue.

Of course... except that if TL51 fails to test well, it will simply never be used.

Fortunately, TL51 is not crucial. BD 1.1 is.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by starman 

You do realize that if it doesn't, it'll only give the BR fans a "ha ha!" to throw back at HD-DVD fans in regards to the whole 1.1 issue.

From all indications, it sounds like they will be able to play in older players, just with less tolerance for scratches, which is expected when adding another layer.

If they don't play in older players, I don't expect anyone will use TL50, making it a non-issue. HD-DVD has been doing just fine with 30 gigs. I don't care that much about TL50.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by *TL 

You're right. They're not the best examples, given that the music and software industries are not analogous to the (often byzantine) systems used to finance, produce, and distribute motion pictures internationally.

How so? New Line's argument is that they have to use region coding, because they have deals with other publishers who want to exclusively publish the movie in those regions. So they want to use region coding to force you to buy from a specific vendor.

The music analogy is valid because music distributors have the same sorts of deals. Music has never had region locking, and yet foreign distributors have still prospered. Heck, iTunes, which tries to do region coding will STILL supply you music, tv shows and movies from out of your region, and so far, I haven't seen one upset movie, music, or tv company.

If the movie companies are going to argue that region coding is what keeps foreign distributors alive, and you eat it up... well... they'll taking you for a ride. Region coding has to be one of the most backwards DRM implementations ever done on a large scale.

[starman]

Nobody said region coding was a GOOD idea, but movies have ALWAYS had different distribution rules than music.

EDIT: You people seem to think this is something new.

And BTW: There's no DRM on CDs because at the time nobody in the world had a CD-ROM drive you could rip them with.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by starman 

Nobody said region coding was a GOOD idea, but movies have ALWAYS had different distribution rules than music.

Really? Did VHS have region coding? Laserdisc? I'm assuming the movie distribution market was complete chaos back in those days...

[starman]

Did you R-E-A-D what I wrote above?

You couldn't play an NTSC video in a PAL player. It was MUCH harder to do that back in the day, not only because of the difference in the formats but the power for the units. It was worse with SECAM. Videotape had its own region-type "coding" by having different standards in different areas.

Laserdisc had the same problems.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that the video formats had their own different refresh rates also which means that you either had to have a TV that matched, or something that allowed you to convert it to the video in your country. There was no "region-free" player like there is for DVD.

And just as a side note: films themselves, to this day, have different distributions. Star Wars was delayed 6 months in Australia because Fox wanted it to be released during THEIR summer.

You've just been schooled.

Footprints by Dish Size - Global Video Standard Map , PAL, NTSC, SECAM Standards List by Country, Example Principal Frequency Format Layouts, North American/International Television Frequencies/Channels

[goMac]

Originally Posted by starman 

Did you R-E-A-D what I wrote above?

You couldn't play an NTSC video in a PAL player. It was MUCH harder to do that back in the day, not only because of the difference in the formats but the power for the units. It was worse with SECAM. Videotape had its own region-type "coding" by having different standards in different areas.

Laserdisc had the same problems.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that the video formats had their own different refresh rates also which means that you either had to have a TV that matched, or something that allowed you to convert it to the video in your country. There was no "region-free" player like there is for DVD.

And just as a side note: films themselves, to this day, have different distributions. Star Wars was delayed 6 months in Australia because Fox wanted it to be released during THEIR summer.

You've just been schooled.

Footprints by Dish Size - Global Video Standard Map , PAL, NTSC, SECAM Standards List by Country, Example Principal Frequency Format Layouts, North American/International Television Frequencies/Channels

And as already mentioned, NTSC and PAL are no longer an issue. So why are region codes still around?

[PaperNotes]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

I was certain he was being sarcastic. He can't be serious is he? Seriously?!?!

That two of you don't take it seriously proves your little knowledge of how many times those studios have changed hands and been bought and sold by people not that interested in film. It also goes to show how little you have seen of how much Russia and China are buying into western companies. Lenovo was acquired by the Chinese. Chelsea Football Club was bought by a Russian with a dubious history of how he became a billionaire. London has so much Russian wealth flowing into it that the UK government couldn't do much when the Russians decided to kill and leave Polonium 210 all over public places. The Bush's do business with the Bin Ladins and the Pakistanis. Americans took it up the ass on because of that. The Pakistani ISI gets away with supporting any terrorists they want. The US won't do **** about it.

You should be supporting studios, anti-piracy, region coding etc because they are running out of people who could take over the running of these companies. If they fail to make money their next purchasers could come out of Russia, China or who knows where. The more western business is tied to businessmen and regimes with histories of criminality, mafia and human rights abuses, the more we'll pay for it. We must protect our businesses and keep them in our hands. The only way that's going to happen is supporting decisions and products that keep them profitable.

It is a leap to think region coding could have something to do with global civility and security, but there you have it.

[jokell82]

The funny thing is that you think the movie studios still care about making movies and aren't simply about making money.

And with a record-setting box office this summer, I think those companies will be just fine.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by starman 

And again, people show that they'd rather go off on a tangent than directly tackle the question.

_I_ didn't bring up ripping CDs, pooka did.

True, but you linked it to piracy with regards to region codes that I brought up, which makes no sense. And then you asked why they were the same... Uh, they're not, and no one said they were.

[Montezuma58]

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

You should be supporting studios, anti-piracy, region coding etc because they are running out of people who could take over the running of these companies.

Region coding isn't necessary for the survival of western civilization. Region coding is simply the studios trying to perpetuate a business model that relied on limitations intrinsic with old technology. It is much the same as the National Association of Broadcasters fighting to nix delivery of out of market affiliates over satellite and cable. That has only served to add huge expense and loss of quality for satellite providers. Studios attempting to force customers to buy things on terms which the market doesn't demand will only hurt the studios.

[starman]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

True, but you linked it to piracy with regards to region codes that I brought up, which makes no sense. And then you asked why they were the same... Uh, they're not, and no one said they were.

pooka did.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by Montezuma58 

Region coding isn't necessary for the survival of western civilization. Region coding is simply the studios trying to perpetuate a business model that relied on limitations intrinsic with old technology. It is much the same as the National Association of Broadcasters fighting to nix delivery of out of market affiliates over satellite and cable. That has only served to add huge expense and loss of quality for satellite providers. Studios attempting to force customers to buy things on terms which the market doesn't demand will only hurt the studios.

Why do you want the movie industry to go bankrupt and be bought out by Russians and the Chinese?????

[starman]

Originally Posted by Montezuma58 

Region coding isn't necessary for the survival of western civilization. Region coding is simply the studios trying to perpetuate a business model that relied on limitations intrinsic with old technology. It is much the same as the National Association of Broadcasters fighting to nix delivery of out of market affiliates over satellite and cable. That has only served to add huge expense and loss of quality for satellite providers. Studios attempting to force customers to buy things on terms which the market doesn't demand will only hurt the studios.

It hasn't hurt DVD sales.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by starman 

pooka did.

Oh yeah? Where? You mean here where he has two separate paragraphs that aren't about the same thing?

Originally Posted by pooka 

Maybe he feels that sort of rational (protect me from myself) is a laughable position. Before you go accusing me of being common thief, I'm prepared to bust out my receipt list for the year and compare. I'm willing to bet I'm 5x the paying consumer whore that just about anyone else in this thread.

So, lets say I oppose DRM on music CDs. I would like to be able to rip my CDs and use them on my iPod, media center, etc. By your logic, not only am I a thief, I'm maliciously attempting to destroy the music industry and its artist (that it currently rapes). I know... it's not the same thing.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by starman 

It hasn't hurt DVD sales.

Proof?

I'd like to think that people who buy bootlegs of unreleased movies overseas would probably buy the official release if it were available. But region coding kinda prohibits that...

[Montezuma58]

Originally Posted by starman 

It hasn't hurt DVD sales.

Has it helped?

[starman]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

Proof?

I'd like to think that people who buy bootlegs of unreleased movies overseas would probably buy the official release if it were available. But region coding kinda prohibits that...

LOL. Good one.

[jokell82]

Wait, so bootlegs aren't a problem? Better call the movie studios quick and let them know!

[starman]

What exactly are you defining as a "bootleg"?

[*TL]

Originally Posted by goMac 

How so? New Line's argument is that they have to use region coding, because they have deals with other publishers who want to exclusively publish the movie in those regions. So they want to use region coding to force you to buy from a specific vendor.

New Line sold the international rights off to another distributor. (Cf., "for second-party acquisitions to which we don't have international rights will be day-and-date on all three formats.") Such deals create the up-front financing that help get Hollywood movies made, but they often come with strings attached that the distributors won't step on each others' toes, so to speak, by cross-distributing. Here, New Line has to keep the non-region coded discs out of the marketplace so that it doesn't violate its distribution agreements with people who paid a lot of money for the right to distribute.

Now, you can argue all you want about whether region coding works or not. That's not the issue. The issue is that New Line feels like it has to hold back on a non-region coded format so that it doesn't violate its international distributor agreements (i.e., doesn't get sued).

And BTW, the LotR films were not "second party acquisitions" either, which means that if this format war is still going on when three of the most-wanted titles of all time come out, HD DVD takes a back seat.

[*TL]

Originally Posted by goMac 

And as already mentioned, NTSC and PAL are no longer an issue. So why are region codes still around?

You're missing the point that region coding is just the latest iteration of a concept that's been around for every home video format.

Look, I don't like region coding any more than most people, but it's interesting that people seem to think that they have a natural right to buy anything they want from anywhere they want it. But there are two parties to every transaction, and if the party who owns the product doesn't want to sell it to you, it doesn't matter how much you kick and scream.

[starman]

Exactly. We don't own these movies, we own a right to show them in our homes. People seem to lose sight of that.

[pooka]

Originally Posted by *TL 

it doesn't matter how much you kick and scream.

Umm.. Yes it does. Money talks. To say consumers have no sway over the businesses they are purchasing goods from is a ****ed up world view I'd prefer to never subscribe to. Can they take their ball home if I choose not to play by their rules? Absolutely. They also have the right to wither and die like any other company that treats its customers like criminals.

[starman]

Originally Posted by pooka 

Umm.. Yes it does. Money talks. To say consumers have no sway over the businesses they are purchasing goods from is a ****ed up world view I'd prefer to never subscribe to. Can they take their ball home if I choose not to play by their rules? Absolutely. They also have the right to wither and die like any other company that treats its customers like criminals.

It's been this way for 40 years. There's no difference between shiny round discs and miles of videotape spooled into a plastic cartridge.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by starman 

What exactly are you defining as a "bootleg"?

A pirated movie for sale on the "streets" or in less than legit retailers. They're *VERY* common in parts of Asia.

Originally Posted by *TL 

Now, you can argue all you want about whether region coding works or not. That's not the issue. The issue is that New Line feels like it has to hold back on a non-region coded format so that it doesn't violate its international distributor agreements (i.e., doesn't get sued).

And BTW, the LotR films were not "second party acquisitions" either, which means that if this format war is still going on when three of the most-wanted titles of all time come out, HD DVD takes a back seat.

Luckily the LotR films wont have any of these issues as they've already been released world-wide.

Originally Posted by *TL 

You're missing the point that region coding is just the latest iteration of a concept that's been around for every home video format.

Look, I don't like region coding any more than most people, but it's interesting that people seem to think that they have a natural right to buy anything they want from anywhere they want it. But there are two parties to every transaction, and if the party who owns the product doesn't want to sell it to you, it doesn't matter how much you kick and scream.

If I buy a disc legally why should I be prevented from watching it? It makes no sense. There is no law against traveling from other regions and buying from other regions, so why put up artificial barriers to keep people from viewing their legally purchased movies?

Originally Posted by starman 

Exactly. We don't own these movies, we own a right to show them in our homes. People seem to lose sight of that.

That's how the movie industry wants it to be, but I don't believe it's ever been actually put to the test. You could argue that you own that physical copy of the movie and can do with it as you please, barring copyright infringements...

Originally Posted by pooka 

Umm.. Yes it does. Money talks. To say consumers have no sway over the businesses they are purchasing goods from is a ****ed up world view I'd prefer to never subscribe to. Can they take their ball home if I choose not to play by their rules? Absolutely. They also have the right to wither and die like any other company that treats its customers like criminals.

Bingo.

[starman]

That's how the movie industry wants it to be, but I don't believe it's ever been actually put to the test. You could argue that you own that physical copy of the movie and can do with it as you please, barring copyright infringements...

Do this:

Buy any movie
Rent one of those large screens and a projector
Go to your local park
Play the movie

Technically, you've just broken the law and you CAN be held accountable for showing a movie outside the legal boundries in which you bought it.

You have to understand that for a few years, I worked in this business. I'm not saying it's the smartest distribution system in the world, but it's the way it's done and nothing, NOTHING is going to change that.

If it hasn't happened in 40 years, do you really think that it's going to change now? It's gotten BETTER, but it won't change completely.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

The funny thing is that you think the movie studios still care about making movies and aren't simply about making money.

And with a record-setting box office this summer, I think those companies will be just fine.

To be fair, the movie studios have never been about making movies... they have always been in the money making industry.

Regardless of the industry, if you aren't primarily interested in making money on some level, you won't be around long (and I've worked for non-profits).

[goMac]

Originally Posted by *TL 

Look, I don't like region coding any more than most people, but it's interesting that people seem to think that they have a natural right to buy anything they want from anywhere they want it. But there are two parties to every transaction, and if the party who owns the product doesn't want to sell it to you, it doesn't matter how much you kick and scream.

Don't get me wrong. I think the movie studios have the right to do things such as tell you that the movie you've bought is for personal viewings among other things. But the idea that we have a DRM system based on physical location is completely backwards.

[pooka]

Originally Posted by starman 

Do this:
Buy any movie
Rent one of those large screens and a projector
Go to your local park
Play the movie

Technically, you've just broken the law and you CAN be held accountable for showing a movie outside the legal boundries in which you bought it.

Yes, you are correct. I could be prosecuted and driven into bankruptcy for performing such an act. Lets use another example. I buy a copy of Lord of the Rings on HDDVD (lets face it.. it'll probably look better than BluRay). Next month, after I move into my new house, I decide to have 12 of my good friends over for a house warming party. After I grill some steaks, I pop in the disc for everyone to check out my cool setup. Technically, I've just broken then law. Seeing as how I just denied New Line potential income due to my public broadcast of their intellectual property, they are fully entitled to compensation. Perhaps in the future, a technological solution can be developed to remedy this "problem". I can see Sony developing a BluRay player that detects the number of adults and children viewing a broadcast (you know, cause kids get a discount) and can charge consumers "fairly".

[starman]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Don't get me wrong. I think the movie studios have the right to do things such as tell you that the movie you've bought is for personal viewings among other things. But the idea that we have a DRM system based on physical location is completely backwards.

Why?

This is how the industry worked. It's been this way with 35mm, it hasn't changed and never will. As I said, things are getting better, but you're never, EVER going to completely get rid of the problem. It's been said in this thread that "money talks". Well, whose money? The people financing a film have much more money and much more say in how a movie is financed and distributed than you may understand and THAT is why things are the way they are. I don't like it, but that's how it is.

Mike

[starman]

Originally Posted by pooka 

Yes, you are correct. I could be prosecuted and driven into bankruptcy for performing such an act. Lets use another example. I buy a copy of Lord of the Rings on HDDVD (lets face it.. it'll probably look better than BluRay). Next month, after I move into my new house, I decide to have 12 of my good friends over for a house warming party. After I grill some steaks, I pop in the disc for everyone to check out my cool setup. Technically, I've just broken then law. Seeing as how I just denied New Line potential income due to my public broadcast of their intellectual property, they are fully entitled to compensation. Perhaps in the future, a technological solution can be developed to remedy this "problem". I can see Sony developing a BluRay player that detects the number of adults and children viewing a broadcast (you know, cause kids get a discount) and can charge consumers "fairly".

WHAT?

Two things are very wrong with that:

1) If HD-DVD and Blu-Ray use the same encoding, why would the HD-DVD version look better? Blu-Ray has more space and LOtR is a 3+ -hour film. I don't understand your logic there.

2) How did you break the law? It clearly states that you can do a PRIVATE showing, which you did.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by starman 

This is how the industry worked. It's been this way with 35mm, it hasn't changed and never will. As I said, things are getting better, but you're never, EVER going to completely get rid of the problem.

What problem? The only "problem" that's been raised so far is NTSC vs. PAL, but today's players can play movies on both.

Originally Posted by starman 

It's been said in this thread that "money talks". Well, whose money? The people financing a film have much more money and much more say in how a movie is financed and distributed than you may understand that THAT is why things are the way they are. I don't like it, but that's how it is.

Yes, and region coding STILL doesn't make sense. Many other industries do region specific distribution without region coding.

[pooka]

Originally Posted by starman 

WHAT?
Two things are very wrong with that:

Dood, you're too serious. I was f'n with you. And no, I wouldn't say that is exactly clear. There have been cases where "Private" viewings have been challenged. That technicality aside, I would say that "right" is more of an allowance due to an inability to enforce compliance. Given your argument for content producers/owners to place any rules and restrictions on their customers, I really don't see how my vision of the future is that absurd. If anything, I'm pretty sure it'll be here before we know it.

[starman]

Originally Posted by goMac 

What problem? The only "problem" that's been raised so far is NTSC vs. PAL, but today's players can play movies on both.



Yes, and region coding STILL doesn't make sense. Many other industries do region specific distribution without region coding.

I think you're arguing just to argue.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by starman 

Why?

This is how the industry worked. It's been this way with 35mm, it hasn't changed and never will. As I said, things are getting better, but you're never, EVER going to completely get rid of the problem. It's been said in this thread that "money talks". Well, whose money? The people financing a film have much more money and much more say in how a movie is financed and distributed than you may understand and THAT is why things are the way they are. I don't like it, but that's how it is.

Mike

Before region codes, the issue of restricting films based on location was a byproduct of the format, but it was never a feature of the format. European and American TVs not being able to show the same material made the movie studios *think* they should be able to tell you where you're allowed to view a film, but that doesn't make it right.

They're just trying to protect an outdated business model that will eventually fail. The answer is worldwide simultaneous release. It's not like they don't have the resources for it...

[*TL]

Originally Posted by pooka 

Umm.. Yes it does. Money talks. To say consumers have no sway over the businesses they are purchasing goods from is a ****ed up world view I'd prefer to never subscribe to.

Good. Here's your solution: If you don't like what they're selling, stop buying it. Put your money where your mouth is. Get your friends to do the same. Start a movement. March on Washington.

Originally Posted by jokell82 

Luckily the LotR films wont have any of these issues as they've already been released world-wide.

Don't be so sure that New Line hasn't sold the international home video rights off to someone else (it was a very complicated and expensive transaction when the Weinsteins secured the film rights) who would insist that New Line honor its exclusivity through region coding. (But since this is all speculation, it's the last I have to say about it.)

Originally Posted by jokell82 

There is no law against traveling from other regions and buying from other regions, so why put up artificial barriers to keep people from viewing their legally purchased movies?

Again, you're missing the point. No, there's no law. But they don't want to sell it to you, so they make it inconvenient for you to use it. Again, the point is it takes two to tango, and you can't force someone to deal with you if that person doesn't want to.

[*TL]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

They're just trying to protect an outdated business model that will eventually fail. The answer is worldwide simultaneous release. It's not like they don't have the resources for it...

Worldwide simultaneous releases would give even more of an incentive for things like region coding because the, say, French distributor would want to make sure French viewers purchase the product from him and not the American distributor.

[starman]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

Before region codes, the issue of restricting films based on location was a byproduct of the format, but it was never a feature of the format. European and American TVs not being able to show the same material made the movie studios *think* they should be able to tell you where you're allowed to view a film, but that doesn't make it right.

They're just trying to protect an outdated business model that will eventually fail. The answer is worldwide simultaneous release. It's not like they don't have the resources for it...

Worldwide simultaneous release? Are you on crack? That can never happen.

For films, they'd want the stars there. Since we haven't perfected cloning yet, you're always going to have to premiere the actual film in different locations at different times.

For the DVD, there are different reasons to delay a film in different countries. Holidays, different peak spending periods in different regions, etc. You also have the aforementioned financial issues with distribution.

This has all been hashed TO DEATH over the years. It's not going to change. This is not the place to argue about it either. If you bring this to the Home THeater Forum, most people will /rolleyes and say "not this again".

*TL made a good point: start a movement.

[starman]

Originally Posted by *TL 

Worldwide simultaneous releases would give even more of an incentive for things like region coding because the, say, French distributor would want to make sure French viewers purchase the product from him and not the American distributor.

DOH! A point I fogot.

[pooka]

Originally Posted by *TL 

Good. Here's your solution: If you don't like what they're selling, stop buying it. Put your money where your mouth is. Get your friends to do the same. Start a movement. March on Washington.

Awww, thats cute! Thanks for the inspiration and instructions on how to change the world. I'm going to ask for world peace while I'm there!

Your condensation aside, I've been spouting this **** for years. I HAVE put my money where my mouth is. Do I still purchase content from some of these douches? Yes, but very selectively.

I cancelled my satellite service. I used to pay $130/month for every channel known to man. I cancelled my cable service. Quite frankly, I've grown tired of the **** these dealers are pushing. I don't go to the theaters anymore. The experience often times doesn't warrant the cost (IMHO). I stopped buying CDs. A bunch of manufactured junk crammed onto a disc to warrant the price for overpriced plastic.

Hey, maybe you can reply with something smart like "Good for you" or "Happy fer ya". But do keep in mind that the people in the biz are starting to **** their pants a little. Coveted demographics (ie:ME) are turning away from television, theaters and music purchases in droves. Some of them *gasp* are considering rethinking how they do business. Will *I* make a difference in the grand scheme of things? **** no. But I've made my choice. I choose not to take it in the butt on these assholes terms. You're equally welcome to do what is best for you.

Enjoy Hairspray.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by *TL 

Worldwide simultaneous releases would give even more of an incentive for things like region coding because the, say, French distributor would want to make sure French viewers purchase the product from him and not the American distributor.

Highly doubtful, as it would be much cheaper and easier for the French viewer to buy from the French distributor - there'd be no need to go elsewhere.

[exca1ibur]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

Highly doubtful, as it would be much cheaper and easier for the French viewer to buy from the French distributor - there'd be no need to go elsewhere.

Thats why there is region coding though. For example The film company ! has distribution rights for the US, and company B has a contract for the same film in France. Not if there is no region coding and France doesn't get the film for 3 months you have company A getting all the money from company B. Company B is less likely to due business with company A because they have a contract for distribution, yet company A is selling to their market. Region coding helps with that, its not a perfect solution of course, but I understand the reason they do it. Its more a protection of distribution between companies. The only realistic solution is what has been stated. Global release from one company, then the region coding wouldn't make sense at all, because there are no toes to step on from cross distribution of more than one company.

[starman]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

Highly doubtful, as it would be much cheaper and easier for the French viewer to buy from the French distributor - there'd be no need to go elsewhere.

Wrong. Many times movies from other regions have different features.

[Eug]

I can't believe anyone is arguing that region coding is actually a good thing. That is the number 1 thing I hate the most about DVD, and even more than CSS.

Sure, the New Line release date discrepancy is not ideal, but I'd rather deal with that than region coding any day.

[Dakarʒ]

Region coding is dumb. If the French like features of a DVD from another region (and buy that instead), maybe the people releasing the French DVD should learn what the people they're trying to sell to want and fulfill it. That is capitalism, right?

[*TL]

Originally Posted by pooka 

I HAVE put my money where my mouth is.
....

Hey, maybe you can reply with something smart like "Good for you" or "Happy fer ya". But do keep in mind that the people in the biz are starting to **** their pants a little. Coveted demographics (ie:ME) are turning away from television, theaters and music purchases in droves. Some of them *gasp* are considering rethinking how they do business. Will *I* make a difference in the grand scheme of things? **** no. But I've made my choice. I choose not to take it in the butt on these assholes terms. You're equally welcome to do what is best for you.

Enjoy Hairspray.

Ummm... good for you? No, seriously, if they're not selling what you want, I'm glad that you're not buying it. Like I've said repeatedly, it takes two to trade.

Hairspray doesn't look like something I'd enjoy, but thanks.

[Eug]

P.S. It works both ways. Lack of region coding makes some people argue that it may delay some titles for the US. Well, one could just as easily argue (are more justifiably so) that lack of region coding brings some titles to our homes quicker.

I've had Harry Potter on HD DVD for months, because of the lack of region coding, even though it hasn't actually been released here. Similarly, I've had La Haine on HD DVD for months, because of the lack of region coding. I'd be surprised if gets released here before 2009.