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subego · Sep 8, 2010, 08:40 PM

I was going to do one of those "let's watch" sort of threads, but everything I wrote came out boring. Besides, I'd rather have a discussion than pontificate, so I'll throw out some observations and see what happens. I've gotten up to (but not including) Mark of the Rani.

I'm really impressed by how Baker can be so over the top, but you totally buy it. I don't think I've seen one moment where he isn't convincing.

This is in stark contrast to Nicola Bryant. Good lord. You can't give a weak actress lines like "it's called compassion". I had to slam the pause button and go smoke a cigarette. I think Baker being such an asshole works in part because Bryant is so bad I feel she's deserving.

Man, Baker is like, batshit insane. I'm really attracted to that for some reason.

Sil, from Vengance on Varos is as fantastic as I remember, and is just awesomely disgusting. A timeless creation. Despite all the good things it had going for it, I actually found the episode to be pretty dull by the halfway mark. Attack of the Cybermen before it was an absolute train wreck, but it wasn't dull.

Speaking of which, as my favorite Doctor Who monsters, seeing the fat Cybercontroller was depressing. He put in a passable performance though, which is more than I can say for the rest of the Cybermen. OTOH, this episode has a strikingly modern feel in a lot if places. All the location work helps.

As much as Bryant is the suck, I felt genuinely bad about her doing all that running in heels.

Faith Brown has enormous breasts.

Face Ache · Sep 8, 2010, 11:26 PM

I can't get past Colin Baker's clown suit.

Even enormous breasts couldn't get me past the clown suit.

olePigeon · Sep 8, 2010, 11:27 PM

Colin Baker? I usually equate him as being one of (if not the) worst doctors. It's an odd coincidence that he shares the last name of my personal favorite doctor, Tom Baker.

subego · Sep 9, 2010, 01:14 AM

Originally Posted by olePigeon

Colin Baker? I usually equate him as being one of (if not the) worst doctors. It's an odd coincidence that he shares the last name of my personal favorite doctor, Tom Baker.

Was it him specifically, the episodes from that period, the clown suit?

What made Baker better than Baker?

Doc HM · Sep 9, 2010, 02:37 AM

Baker C is pretty unfairly maligned as the worst Doctor IMHO. He got some rubbish shows to deal with, bad scripts, bad production and an assistant who was only hired for two reasons. Baker is actually a pretty fair actor and he managed quite well I thought. Certainly time has actually been kind to his portrayal, more so than Davison's era which was well liked at the time but appears bland now.

andi*pandi · Sep 9, 2010, 08:27 AM

I liked him at the time, despite the silly clown suit or umbrella dueling. Haven't seen an ep lately to compare. The hiatus and messed up stories killed his era.

Who I really didn't like was Mel. Agh. Carrot juice!

Doc HM · Sep 9, 2010, 08:34 AM

Originally Posted by andi*pandi

Who I really didn't like was Mel. Agh. Carrot juice!

Oh ******* I'd forgotten about her. Thanks for reminding me. Not.

Watch, a cable channel here in the UK has been screening older Dr Who's and I caught a few of Baker (C)'s repeats. They were quite watchable and I enjoyed his spiky portrayal. He seemed almost cruel at times and certainly aloof from "human concerns". This characteristic was carried on by McCoy's Doctor, but was probably taken to far as JNT sought to portray him as an almost godlike figure. In hindsight McCoy was probably not the actor to ask this of.

Was interesting to see Baker playing off against Patrick Troughton in The Two Doctors, especially since we had just been treated to Matt Smith channeling Troughton in his performance as the new Doctor.

[/fanboy]

olePigeon · Sep 9, 2010, 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by subego

Was it him specifically, the episodes from that period, the clown suit?

What made Baker better than Baker?

I think Doc HM summed it up pretty well. Of course, a lot of people say that your first Doctor is your favorite Doctor.

subego · Sep 9, 2010, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by Doc HM

Was interesting to see Baker playing off against Patrick Troughton in The Two Doctors, especially since we had just been treated to Matt Smith channeling Troughton in his performance as the new Doctor.

I just watched this last night. I was a bit dismayed by how little screen time they got together, but him and Shockeye were glorious. Totally unlike anything I've ever seen in the show, but it didn't matter. Hell, just Shockeye on his own.

"Religion? I am not interested in the beliefs of primitives - only in what they taste like."

andi*pandi · Sep 9, 2010, 12:19 PM

That was a good one. Had the Rani too, I think? Poor Jamie.

Doc HM · Sep 9, 2010, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by andi*pandi

That was a good one. Had the Rani too, I think? Poor Jamie.

Why is Jamie cited so much as a favourite companion, Frasier Hines acting is horribly wooden throughout.

While my first Doc was Pertwee (and many of his shows have stood up well) my fave was always Baker T, until Eccleston came along. He's going to be the forgotten doctor, eclipsed by the Tennant hype machine. While DT was on occasion truly staggering, it was all a bit hit and miss, while Ecclestone was just excellent.

For me the run of stories Human Nature, Family of Blood, Blink and Utopia where unquestionably the highest point the show has ever reached.

olePigeon · Sep 9, 2010, 12:47 PM

Originally Posted by Doc HM

While my first Doc was Pertwee (and many of his shows have stood up well) my fave was always Baker T, until Eccleston came along. He's going to be the forgotten doctor, eclipsed by the Tennant hype machine. While DT was on occasion truly staggering, it was all a bit hit and miss, while Ecclestone was just excellent.

For me the run of stories Human Nature, Family of Blood, Blink and Utopia where unquestionably the highest point the show has ever reached.

I agree 100%.

Eccleston is also my favorite doctor since Baker. Blink, however, is my all-time favorite episode. I also really enjoyed The Sound of Drums.

andi*pandi · Sep 9, 2010, 01:08 PM

I think what made Eccleston's tenure so good though was the writing. And it became hard to top itself in Tennant's time, especially toward the end.

subego · Sep 9, 2010, 01:18 PM

Originally Posted by andi*pandi

That was a good one. Had the Rani too, I think? Poor Jamie.

That was the one right before it.

I haven't seen many Troughton episodes. I got the feeling from The Two Doctors that Jamie was trying to play the same character, even though he was 15 years older. I didn't buy it. It felt like an adult trying to act like a kid.

andi*pandi · Sep 9, 2010, 01:51 PM

well technically, he was pulled from the past timestream and returned to it...

subego · Sep 9, 2010, 01:57 PM

More observations:

The relationship between Baker and Bryant is starting to get off-putting. I think they may be writing Peri as a stronger character, but Bryant just doesn't have the chops. When the Doctor threatens to leave her, she acts like an abused spouse.

Far worse is how almost every villain expresses interest in raping her. WTF?

Bryant does do a great accent. I heard her real voice for the first time on one of the DVD extras.

I do get a chuckle when Bryant says "all these corridors/tunnels/sewers look the same", which she's said in every episode so far except The Two Doctors.

andi*pandi · Sep 9, 2010, 02:18 PM

If you keep watching, how the doctor treats (or doesn't) Peri becomes a plot point. He's supposed to be a bully.

subego · Sep 9, 2010, 02:44 PM

Oh, I'm in it for the long haul... which is basically just Trial of a Time Lord at this point.

subego · May 5, 2011, 08:18 AM

It's taken me this long to put in disc two of "Trial of a Time Lord". Good god, it's bad. Even samurai BRIAN BLESSED is bad.

I think the only time I enjoyed myself was when Peri says "all these caves look the same".

Oh, and when Sil comes back. He's awesome.

andi*pandi · May 5, 2011, 08:56 AM

I have to dig out my old vhs and watch too. It's been so long.

Trial of a time lord was chopped up and stitched together from bits and pieces.

subego · May 5, 2011, 09:21 AM

It's something of a tough row to hoe.

I realized my fondness for the "Baker era" was based on me (by pure accident) having only seen the best episodes when they first aired. To wit:

Resurrection of the Daleks
Vengeance on Varos
Trial of a Time Lord - Part One

I'd also seen Mark of the Rani, which had great location stuff, and Twin Dilemma, which was awful, but had Baker's brilliant psychotic performance.

Everything else turned out to be either bad, depressing, or both. The whole run is shockingly misogynist. JNT's dropped a whole bunch of pegs in my peg book.

Peri being led around in a dog collar on a stick? Really? Really?

subego · May 9, 2011, 09:45 AM

Well it's finished.

Just when I think it couldn't get any worse, I get "carrot juice", and leafy, monster penises who will not shut up.

I had to watch "Robots of Death" to cleanse the palette, which was even better (and more fabulous) than I remember.

Even though there is no cure for robot baldness in the future, they make up for it in glittertastic.