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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Consumer Hardware & Components > 4G iPod

4G iPod
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lazydesert
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Jul 17, 2004, 07:57 PM
 
lazydesert
     
mrdhammer
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Jul 17, 2004, 08:13 PM
 
thanks for the credit... I've been trying to read the screen in the picture... are the menu options any different? Can you guys tell?
     
MaxPower2k3
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Jul 17, 2004, 08:14 PM
 
wow, if it weren't actually on MSNBC i'd say it were fake, but that's hard to argue with. Seems weird that Steve would pose for a picture with a product that hasn't been released yet, but i guess they wanted to make it timely. Didn't ThinkSecret say that apple would use a more unusual way to announce the new iPod?

looks like the options are:

Browse (not sure, might be Player)
Extras
Settings
Shuffle Songs
Backlight

Also, i think the date of the issue is July 25
     
ender2002
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Jul 17, 2004, 08:15 PM
 
I think the screen reads:

Music
Extras
Settings
MosFM Songs (????)
Backlight

I like the new iPod mini-style scroll wheel. i never liked the 3G ones anyway.
     
adam1185
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Jul 17, 2004, 08:21 PM
 
Steve won't be too happy about this haha
     
lazydesert  (op)
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Jul 17, 2004, 08:33 PM
 
lazydesert
     
osxisfun
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Jul 17, 2004, 08:34 PM
 
good job mrdhammer!!
     
ender2002
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Jul 17, 2004, 08:50 PM
 
"membership into an implicit society that's transforming the way music will be consumed in the future."

what?
     
Musti
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Jul 17, 2004, 09:50 PM
 
Originally posted by ender2002:
"membership into an implicit society that's transforming the way music will be consumed in the future."

what?
exactly.
     
MrForgetable
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Jul 17, 2004, 10:03 PM
 
looks like a photoshopped 3G with a silver colored iPod mini wheel
iamwhor3hay
     
stevesnj
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Jul 17, 2004, 10:38 PM
 
Originally posted by MrForgetable:
looks like a photoshopped 3G with a silver colored iPod mini wheel
Well I can bet that the wheel will light up...it probrobly translucent plastic to allow light to pass through. Otherwise why wouldn't they make the wheel white? I'll take a bet that the wheel will light up.
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Luca Rescigno
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Jul 17, 2004, 10:38 PM
 
Originally posted by ender2002:
Music
Extras
Settings
MosFM Songs (????)
Backlight
Originally posted by MaxPower2k3:
Browse (not sure, might be Player)
Extras
Settings
Shuffle Songs
Backlight
No and no.

Music
Extras
Settings
Shuffle Songs
Backlight

You need the bigger image:

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/Se...0717_COVER.jpg

     
MaxPower2k3
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Jul 17, 2004, 10:42 PM
 
Originally posted by Luca Rescigno:
No and no.

Music
Extras
Settings
Shuffle Songs
Backlight

You need the bigger image:

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/Se...0717_COVER.jpg

hey, i was closer than he was


/me squints at the small picture some more
     
Luca Rescigno
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Jul 17, 2004, 10:43 PM
 
Originally posted by MaxPower2k3:
hey, i was closer than he was


/me squints at the small picture some more
Yeah... I should have just not posted the big image, then bragged about how good my vision is compared to you guys

MosFM songs? WTF?
     
MrForgetable
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Jul 17, 2004, 10:55 PM
 
Originally posted by stevesnj:
Well I can bet that the wheel will light up...it probrobly translucent plastic to allow light to pass through. Otherwise why wouldn't they make the wheel white? I'll take a bet that the wheel will light up.
i would hope it does. kinda miss the all white though.
iamwhor3hay
     
Nodnarb
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Jul 17, 2004, 11:01 PM
 
What features do the new iPods include? Obviously the different style, and the hard drives being bigger, but other then that...? I thought they were going to wait a while to update these and make them really good. I think they need to at least be able to control airport express, but should also have video out for playing movies on tv and stuff, and a lot of other features.
But my point is, why did they update when they have made very little changes?
     
TailsToo
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Jul 17, 2004, 11:01 PM
 
Originally posted by MrForgetable:
i would hope it does. kinda miss the all white though.

Looks kind of ho-hum. (maybe they will drop the price somewhat) I know Apple just posted good numbers, but with no iMacs until Sept, aging PowerBooks and iBooks, and no major revisions to the iPod, the next quarter will be quite dismal.

Color LCDs are cheap nowadays, they are all over the cell phone market. What about making something like the iTunes visuals on the small color screen? That would at least generate some interest from those who already have an iPod.
     
Luca Rescigno
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Jul 17, 2004, 11:14 PM
 
Aging PowerBooks and iBooks? They've been out for three months. That's not aging.

And the use of a color screen is not a smart idea, I think. What benefit would it give? You use the thing for listening to music. It would jack up the cost and reduce battery life by a very large margin. In order to get reasonable battery life, you'd have to resort to an unreasonable compromise, like having the display shut off (with the iPod still running) after a minute without touching the controls, or something like that. Remember that monochrome passive matrix LCDs not only draw the least amount of power, but they also look better than color passive matrix LCDs. In order to achieve good clarity, they'd want to use an active matrix color LCD, which not only draws power even faster than a passive matrix, but it also makes it more expensive.

No, there's no reason to have color LCDs on the iPods. There are only a few specialized uses - visualizer (silly on such a tiny screen, plus it might require a more power-hungry and expensive processor than the current one), photo viewing (only useful to a few people), and maybe colored song tags, which is the only thing I can think of for which a color screen might actually be useful.
     
Mr. Blur
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Jul 17, 2004, 11:14 PM
 
Originally posted by TailsToo:
Color LCDs are cheap nowadays, they are all over the cell phone market. What about making something like the iTunes visuals on the small color screen? That would at least generate some interest from those who already have an iPod.
....and reduce the battery life to about 10 mintes....
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TailsToo
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:26 AM
 
Originally posted by Luca Rescigno:
Aging PowerBooks and iBooks? They've been out for three months. That's not aging.
Most of the competiton revs their units every 3 months or so, but in any case my point was that Apple doesn't have a killer product next quarter, and that could start the doom and gloom again.

Originally posted by Luca Rescigno:
And the use of a color screen is not a smart idea, I think. What benefit would it give? You use the thing for listening to music. It would jack up the cost and reduce battery life by a very large margin. In order to get reasonable battery life, you'd have to resort to an unreasonable compromise, like having the display shut off (with the iPod still running) after a minute without touching the controls, or something like that. Remember that monochrome passive matrix LCDs not only draw the least amount of power, but they also look better than color passive matrix LCDs. In order to achieve good clarity, they'd want to use an active matrix color LCD, which not only draws power even faster than a passive matrix, but it also makes it more expensive.

No, there's no reason to have color LCDs on the iPods. There are only a few specialized uses - visualizer (silly on such a tiny screen, plus it might require a more power-hungry and expensive processor than the current one), photo viewing (only useful to a few people), and maybe colored song tags, which is the only thing I can think of for which a color screen might actually be useful.

A color screen was just a thought. Apple has to do something to keep the innovation going while they still have a huge part of the market. If they just keep re-dressing the same core iPod, then eventually someone else will come along and make something better.
     
Nodnarb
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:32 AM
 
Originally posted by TailsToo:
...and that could start the doom and gloom again.
What do you mean by that?
     
Scoo
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Jul 18, 2004, 02:09 AM
 
I don't much care for the iPod mini style scroll wheel. I love my 3G iPod for it's big buttons, MUCH easier to operate while driving, like a garden variety car radio. No buyers remorse here.
The music is not in the
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PookJP
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Jul 18, 2004, 04:05 AM
 
Originally posted by Scoo:
I don't much care for the iPod mini style scroll wheel. I love my 3G iPod for it's big buttons, MUCH easier to operate while driving, like a garden variety car radio. No buyers remorse here.
So you're basing your opinion on the new iPod on pictures you've seen and what you're accustomed to using. Gotta love that kind of data collection and analysis!
It's the devil's way now.
     
OreoCookie
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Jul 18, 2004, 06:32 AM
 
The design is disappointing.
I hoped for an iPod mini design, i. e. brushed metal in colors.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
Parky
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Jul 18, 2004, 07:21 AM
 
Here are the specs from Newsweek :-

The click wheel.

The iPod keeps getting slimmer and more streamlined. While the initial version had a relatively boxy feel, subsequent versions have been curvier and smaller. This one is about a millimeter thinner and, more significantly, eliminates the control buttons that sat under the display screen. Instead, it uses a "click wheel," where the controls are placed on the compass points of the circular touchpad that lets you scroll through menus. This is an innovation carried over from the diminutive iPod Mini. "It was developed out of necessity for the Mini, because there wasn't enough room [for the buttons]," says Steve Jobs. "But the minute we experienced it we just thought, 'My God, why didn't we think of this sooner?' "

More efficient menus.

There's less thumbing required to get to your favorite stuff. "Music" is a first-level entry, and now a single click initiates the popular technique of shuffling your library for playback.

New features.

You can create multiple on-the-go playlists and delete songs from those ad hoc mixes. And audiobooks are not only easier to find, you can listen to them at normal speed, slower or 25 percent faster, without its sounding like a Munchkin.

Longer play.

Coast-to-coasters rejoice: the new iPods are rated for 12 hours of rockin' between charges—a 50 percent boost in battery life. This is accomplished, Apple says, not by a heavier battery but diligent conservation of power.

Lower price.

The top-of-the-line iPod, holding 10,000 songs (40 gigs, as geeks will tell you), now costs $399. The lower-capacity model, with room for 5,000 songs (20 gigs), costs $299. That's a $100 price reduction for each. (There's no more 15-gig model.)

Color.

Fuggedaboutit. Despite rumors to the contrary, the wide-bodies are still as pure as the driven snow.

Bottom line:

If you have yet to jump on the iPod bandwagon, it's cheaper and more attractive to do so. If you're already plugged in, the question is whether you should engage in the "iPod Bump," where you snap up the spiffy new version and pass Old Reliable to a grateful friend or family member (or the highest eBay bidder). If your music collection has exceeded your iPod's storage space, or your listening binges exceed your current iPod's battery life—or if you want to hear Bill Clinton's abridged book in 4-1/2 hours rather than six—consider the Bump this time around. Of course, if your heart went aflutter at the very sight of this year's model, you're probably in line at the Apple Store already.


I suspect the 60GB model will be here later in the year, filling the now vacant top price slot. i.e. 2 models now, then back to 3 later (20GB, 40GB, 60GB)

Ian
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joelcpa
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Jul 18, 2004, 07:49 AM
 
Originally posted by Parky:
And audiobooks are not only easier to find, you can listen to them at normal speed, slower or 25 percent faster, without its sounding like a Munchkin.
...great news for audiobook listeners
     
joelcpa
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Jul 18, 2004, 07:54 AM
 
Originally posted by PookJP:
So you're basing your opinion on the new iPod on pictures you've seen and what you're accustomed to using. Gotta love that kind of data collection and analysis!
so you're basing your opinion of this person's data collection and analysis by one forum comment?

geez, lighten up - at this point what else is someone supposed to base their opinion on? Isn't that the whole point of this thread? .. to take this info (since it's all we have at this point) and comment on it?
     
ender2002
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Jul 18, 2004, 09:02 AM
 
two words: MosFM Songs

later
     
andretan
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Jul 18, 2004, 09:20 AM
 


( Last edited by andretan; Jul 18, 2004 at 09:35 AM. )
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Krypton
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Jul 18, 2004, 09:45 AM
 
     
Parky
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Jul 18, 2004, 09:50 AM
 
I love the illuminated keys :-)

I will be ordering a 60GB as soon as they are announced.

Ian
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joelcpa
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Jul 18, 2004, 10:06 AM
 
Very nice, where do I sign up?
     
Zoom
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Jul 18, 2004, 10:09 AM
 
Okay, so we're all talking about the new 4G iPod. Looks like a minor, but welcome upgrade. Personally, I think the 3G models were just about perfect (I own one), but I did covet the Mini's wheel once I saw it - and now it's there on the regular iPods. Longer battery life is great, if for no other reason than to shut up the iPod naysayers. The price drop was also great. This was a perfect upgrade. I think I may just do an "iPod bump". Anyone want to buy my 40GB 3G model? I could be persuaded to forget to erase it!

Now, here's the other stuff I want that hasn't been discussed: cheaper, better accessories. I'm hoping that some of these have also been improved with the 4G model and for some reason Time didn't write about them...

(1) Cheap, "dumb" dock
Apple sells an iPod stereo connection kit for $79. That's too much. I want a dock with the transformer built in to the base (bypassing the need for the FW cable, the wall nugget and the added dead weight in the regular base) with a regular lamp-style power cord and the stereo output jack, and I want that for $39.

(2) Better earphones
I like the original ones, but I heard the in-ear ones suck. Fix that.

(3) Better wired remote
The current remote is awful, IMHO. The clip doesn't stay on anything and the button layout sucks. I'm not sure how best to change it, but it needs to be improved ergonomically.

(4) Option for a wireless remote
I've had a RemoteRemote2 on order since the day it was announced (Apr 27) and have yet to see it or even have a hard shipping date. A UF remote makes way too much sense for home stereo use... so let me amend my first request and also ask for a deluxe home stereo connection kit with a wireless (RF not IR) remote. Build the receiver into the base of the dock.

(5) Higher contrast screen
Okay, not technically an accessory, but still needed. Personally, I'd love a color screen (OLED) so I can see album art. Yeah, not really practical, but I'd still love it. And you'd need to be able to run iPhoto slide shows on it! Opens lots of doors, but I realize it would kill the battery and jack up the cost. Someday...

(6) Car adapter for everyone!
This is the single biggest complaint I have about my iPod - there are no good ways to hook it up to my stock stereo. Even with an aftermarket head unit, the only real option is aux input - which offers no control of the iPod, nor can it power my iPod. Now, I know about the BMW thing and the upcoming Alpine thing, but we need this for the masses. I realize this is nigh impossible, but I want to be able to use my iPod in my car through my stereo deck. I'll probably end up getting an Alpine.

One final note. What I really want is an Apple head unit for the car. I've been shopping for a new car stereo for many years now, and everything out there is butt ugly. This market is obviously dominated by teen boys because it's nothing but eye candy with a ridiculous amount of buttons, high res displays with little built-in movies(?!?) and motorized parts that serve little purpose and will surely break. I want a clean, simple design with a beautiful display (for text, not images), and a slot for my iPod (like an old 8-track slot). Oh, sure, add a radio, too. (I never use mine.) *sigh* Dream on...
     
TailsToo
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Jul 18, 2004, 10:12 AM
 
Hmm.. so they're not really lowing the price, they just have to wait until the 60GB drive is available in volume.

At least the battery is rated at 12 hours. That would be great if that's real world useage!
     
Zoom
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Jul 18, 2004, 10:16 AM
 
Originally posted by TailsToo:
Hmm.. so they're not really lowing the price, they just have to wait until the 60GB drive is available in volume.
It's a standard Apple upgrade - shift the models down, retain the price points (and yes, you can bet on a 60GB model soon to fill the $500 slot). But nomatter how you look at that, it's a price reduction. 40GB used to cost $500, and now it costs $400: instead of $12.5/Gig it's now $10/Gig. And they did improve it, too (smaller, longer battery life, improved wheel). That's a deal. I want one.
     
perbl
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Jul 18, 2004, 10:18 AM
 
Am I the only one who is a little disappointed?

Had hoped for a more robust design, love the metal chasing of the Mini, had hoped for something similar on the regular one, the previous ones are way to easily scratched IMO.
     
mdc
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Jul 18, 2004, 10:45 AM
 
maybe by offering the ipod in colors it would take away from some of the mini's sales. i don't know.

imo, they did a good job of the new ipod. i played with the ipod mini's wheel in an apple store and it made me want to buy one. i am hating apple right now because i really want this new ipod.
     
MilkmanDan
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Jul 18, 2004, 10:49 AM
 
I'm still very happy with my second gen 10 GIG iPod. I mean, honestly, do you really need 60 gigs for just music? I mean, I almost have 60 gigs of music on an external HD, and I honestly don't listen to that much of it in a given week. I mean, for any trip, or extended vacation, does a person need that much music? Sure, its a portable HD, but how many people will need 30 GIGs + of HD space? if you honestly wanted an external drive for files or video, there are better FASTER options to pick from.

My roomie spent $500 on a 40 GIG iPod. He puts 20 GIGs of music on it, finds the rest to be wasted space.

The only way I'm ever going to upgrade my iPod is if Apple releases a 10 GIG + mini, which won't be for a while. Lucky me.
     
imikeDotMac
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Jul 18, 2004, 11:36 AM
 
Well Apple may have figured out a way to market a new product without spending money on throwing a press conference. Get free publicity through Newsweek (gee, not Time) and have it leaked, therefore ensuring the mac faithful (us) spread the word. The saved money can be spent on more tv and print ads to reach the non-mac masses. This is better then the flat-panel iMac leak (oh, right that was Time) — at least Apple can't Blame Canada for this leak.

The 4G iPod was necessary now, even if it's not perfect for those of us who know better, the iPod needs to reach the average consumer (who has money and is slightly tech savy). Apple needs to keep revising this things often. The iPod almost over sold Mac CPUs last quarter — will it happen this quarter.

Today I was about to order an airport express, but now I have to think about getting a new iPod instead. I have an original 10gb. I prefer the scroll wheel and buttons to the 3G, but the 4G wheel/buttons would be better. As for the size, I am all about a bigger hard drive, as I do carry files around with me (mostly to school). If only Apple provided hard drive space on the internet for free.... they could call it iTools.
( Last edited by imikeDotMac; Jul 18, 2004 at 12:03 PM. )
     
hyperb0le
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Jul 18, 2004, 11:58 AM
 
Is there any chance that there will be a software update for 3G iPod owners to take advantage of some of the new features (the "Music" menu item is something I sorely need. I hate going through several "Browse" menus just to listen to my entire library.
     
Parky
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Jul 18, 2004, 12:34 PM
 
I think the 60GB will be useful for me.

I like to have al my music with me when I travel as I never know exactly what I want to listen to before I set off.

Plus it gives me room on the iPod for other things, backup of my HD, etc.

Why bother messing round with changing the contents of your iPod just take it all with you after all it's not as though it's heavier to carry.

Ian
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tooki
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:00 PM
 
Originally posted by andretan:

Hello!? Apple switched from Garamond to Myriad almost 2 years ago!

tooki
     
PeterKG
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:10 PM
 
Originally posted by hyperb0le:
Is there any chance that there will be a software update for 3G iPod owners to take advantage of some of the new features (the "Music" menu item is something I sorely need. I hate going through several "Browse" menus just to listen to my entire library.
I too hope that the improvements in the iPod menu and audible books will be in the form of a software update.
MacBook Air, Mac OS X (10.7), 1.6 GHz, Core i5, 4GB 1333 MHz DDR3, 128 GB SSD, 24" LED ACD, 1TB Time Capsule (late 2009), IOS4 ATV, 16GB iPhone 4
     
osxisfun
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:13 PM
 
off topic:

what do you think is a fair price for a used 3g 15gig. some of those firmware things are great and i would love a wheel instead of buttons...

do you think $150 is fair?
     
andretan
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:20 PM
 
Originally posted by tooki:
Hello!? Apple switched from Garamond to Myriad almost 2 years ago!

tooki
Oh yeah. Fixed.
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imikeDotMac
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:21 PM
 
That's not entirely Apple Garamond. The NewsWeek cover is also not set in Myriad (Apple's new corporate typeface). NewsWeek doesn't use Myriad, but I'm not sure what grotesque they are using (possibly a custom face).
And what's with the LOTR face!
     
BZ
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Join Date: Apr 2001
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:26 PM
 
Sign me up for a 60Gb one.

I have 20GB now of music with half of my collection, so figuring about 50GB worth when I am done. Add a little room for backup and I am good to go.

BZ
     
Randman
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Join Date: Mar 2004
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:32 PM
 
Originally posted by PeterKG:
I too hope that the improvements in the iPod menu and audible books will be in the form of a software update.
Here, here. Or should that be hear, hear. The good thing is you won't need to upgrade all of the extras (iTrip, etc) like you did after the last revision.

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SafariX
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Join Date: May 2003
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:50 PM
 
Overall, a nice, solid PREDICTABLE upgrade. Apple won't mess with the best success they have had since the original Macintosh or iMac. (cough iMac 2 shut up cough). Keep it white, keep it similar shape, just lower the price and increase battery. Thats all people want. Why try to outapple apple?
     
tooki
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Jul 18, 2004, 01:51 PM
 
Originally posted by imikeDotMac:
That's not entirely Apple Garamond. The NewsWeek cover is also not set in Myriad (Apple's new corporate typeface). NewsWeek doesn't use Myriad, but I'm not sure what grotesque they are using (possibly a custom face).
And what's with the LOTR face!
Of course Newsweek didn't use Apple's corporate font, they used theirs. My point was that in the spoofed one, the use of Garamond is completely out of place since it's not Apple's corporate font any more, and it's certainly not Newsweek's!

tooki
     
 
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