[tcofflax]

I'm buying a new laptop soon and have been looking at the Powerbooks and the Dell Inspiron notebooks. I was wondering what the main advantages to buying a Powerbook over a Dell would be? Any help is appreciated.

[DKeithA]

There really is no comparison. Go handle and use a Dell for one hour then go and try out a PowerBook at the Apple Store. The differences are like night and day.

[warra]

Powerbooks use OS X, Dells use Windows. That should be reason enough.

Right now though, the latest revision of iBooks is similar to the powerbooks. You might wanna check that out since they are slightly cheaper.

From my experience, the Inspiron line isn't made too well. For example, in my i5100 i have to blow out the dust regularly from the heat sink so the cpu doesn't over heat. Powerbooks vent heat througout the whole computer, there is no specified area...no worrying about dust. Dell might have changed that with the new inspirons, but idk. If you do decide to go with a dell (hopefully not), try the latitudes. They are built better since they are the professional series, as opposed to the inspirons being the consumer series.

[CaptainHaddock]

The OS is the most important consideration, in my humble opinion. You won't have to worry about worms, viruses, spyware, or any of that nasty stuff that plagues Windows if you get a Powerbook.

If there's an Apple store nearby, do go and play with them for a bit.

[Jens Peter]

The keyboard on my powerbook are way better than the keyboard on my Dell 500m. The Dell's keyboard feels like it's made out of cheap plastic that should have been used for disposable tableware, compared to the keyboard on my powerbook.

And then of course the OS

[powerule]

Actually for the money you get more from a dell 6000 or 9300 with dedicated 64, 128 or 256mb video cards. Todays dell are very nice with the 15.4 widescreen monitors.

Virus/ Worms - Use firefox and problem solved.
Mac OSX - you like the look of osx? use Y's Dock it turns your XP to emulate OSX.

You cant compare as far as bang for buck,speed,screen quality and resolution,the centrino processor is excellent in these machines, you are comparing a 2005 notebook (dell ) with 2002 Notebooks ( powerbooks ).


But i know that apple users are on a imaginary high horse and have a certain attitude about them owning macs, like it makes them more professionals or something, but it all boils down to the user not the machine....

[budster101]

DELL:

Construction is poor at best.
The materials are low grade, and to make a comparison that many can more easily identify with:
- The DELL's materials are like something you'd expect from a gumball machine.

They break rather easily, feel like toys, and the ports are archaic as well. I mean who uses an RS232 port?
The USB ports are garbage

The Operating System:

It's clunky and often times will fight the user on the most mundane of tasks, like hooking up to the internet. I just had someone over at the house with a POS HP laptop which felt more like a DELL, and when she plugged into my network it took us 30 minutes just to get it online. It was a fight that should not be necessary, and this is commonplace. I took out my PB and then just opened it up, and I was online. All I had to do was wake it up... I then unplugged, and the plugged it back in. No problems, and no idiot dialogue boxes telling me I unplugged something.

It's as if Microsoft expects the user to be an idiot and attempts to take over the process and force issues.
It's not open source, and is suceptable (sp) to the following bits of joy:

1. Viruses
2. Malware
3. Spyware
4. Worms
5. Trojans
6. Crashes
7. Obnoxious and frequent idiot dialogue boxes
8. Crashes
9. A very non-user friendly User Interface (Contextual Menus)

Apple Computer (ie: PowerBook or iBook)

The opposite of the above.
It's a joy to use, and you meet some interesting people, most of them very nice! It's a great club to belong to. Share fun with Apple and friends, or share misery with Microsoft / DELL and friends... your choice.

[budster101]

Originally Posted by powerule

Actually for the money you get more from a dell 6000 or 9300 with dedicated 64, 128 or 256mb video cards. Todays dell are very nice with the 15.4 widescreen monitors.

Virus/ Worms - Use firefox and problem solved.
Mac OSX - you like the look of osx? use Y's Dock it turns your XP to emulate OSX.

You cant compare as far as bang for buck,speed,screen quality and resolution,the centrino processor is excellent in these machines, you are comparing a 2005 notebook (dell ) with 2002 Notebooks ( powerbooks ).


But i know that apple users are on a imaginary high horse and have a certain attitude about them owning macs, like it makes them more professionals or something, but it all boils down to the user not the machine....

I can get more work done on my PB than anyone working on a PC/DELL (Fill in the blank POS) because of the Operating System alone. You can dress a DELL up to look like a Mac, but it's only going to be skinned like one, and nothing else. You think your browser will prevent viruses? What about filesharing? Downloading MP3s with vireses? Images? The browser isn't going to do that for them... it's funny how you use an open source browser to protect a closed system like M$.

The true test will be, how often does it crash? How much time is spent getting that 'speed demon' back up and online to get some real work done.

My 1Ghz 17" PB is better now being 2.6 years old than a brand new DELL anything to get real work done. I'll get a PSP for gaming.

'Professional' comment...

No, it boils down to the machine being better for the user. In this and any case, it's the Mac, unless you want to play DOOM 3. Then you need a PeeCee.

[budster101]

What are you looking at? Be specific and give us dollar amounts for your DELL selection(s)
I'll break it down by price as well.

[Indohottie]

I would agree with powerrule on most bang for your buck with dell with teh one qualifer ... that is how long are you planning on using the machine..

In the short term the money spent will be better with dell.. but if you keep it for 2 years plus apples will continue to out preform..

Besides.. powerbooks look so much hotter then any dell product =)

[budster101]

How is money best spent in the short term with a DELL?
Who thinks like that besides anyone working in Government or someone forced to by their company to buy something with Windows on it. I've heard it a thousand times.... I have to use this as it's what my boss told me to buy, and his/her boss got that bad information from the jerk in the IT department.

It's not true. If you want to toss $2,700 out the window in the short term, then go get the DELL. You can get a 17" PB for the same amount with a great graphics card 128mb Vram, and it will power the Apple 30" monitor out of the box.

Most Windows users are trained to buy a computer every 1 to 2 years max... and expect their hardware to fail within one year in one way or another. It's not so much the hardware as with an IBM, but with the DELL you are fighting the OS and the hardware...

[Travis Keller]

I know you are leaning twords the powerbook Why else would you be on a Mac thread asking us this? All you need is a push in the right direction

PUSH!!!! There you go now get the powerbook.





Dont I bring happiness to all?

[broxy5]

Nice to see you again powerule.

Checking out the prices of older Powerbooks leads me to believe buying a Dell, which if it's still working in 3 years, is money in the trash, or recycle bin.

[bighead]

I get far more work done with the operating system and applications on OS X than I ever did running Windows. There are some advantages to running Windows, such as the sheer number of applications available and certain niche applications that do not have a Mac equivalent. I have not encountered anything in my work, and going to school at Cal State Fullerton that would require me to run WIndows. This is a good thing, since I'd hate to sacrifice productivity to get something menial accomplished.

Still, if I was forced to buy a Windows-running portable computer, I would probably get a ThinkPad. I've always liked them, they have felt as well-made as the PowerBooks I've owned. I don't keep up on them, but I haven't seen any headlines about quality dropping off since Lenovo bought IBM's assets. I'll spend my money there if I must.

Whenever an Intel PowerBook is released, I will likely keep a minimal version of Windows on the unit as a just-in-case for emergencies, but I also have VPC installed on my machine and rarely ever use it. Who knows.

[budster101]

20,000 applications for Mac.

[Helmling]

Originally Posted by powerule

Actually for the money you get more from a dell 6000 or 9300 with dedicated 64, 128 or 256mb video cards. Todays dell are very nice with the 15.4 widescreen monitors.

Virus/ Worms - Use firefox and problem solved.
Mac OSX - you like the look of osx? use Y's Dock it turns your XP to emulate OSX.

You cant compare as far as bang for buck,speed,screen quality and resolution,the centrino processor is excellent in these machines, you are comparing a 2005 notebook (dell ) with 2002 Notebooks ( powerbooks ).


But i know that apple users are on a imaginary high horse and have a certain attitude about them owning macs, like it makes them more professionals or something, but it all boils down to the user not the machine....

No, we're just trying to make sure the guy understands the difference. It's not about looks. I don't know about Firefox, but I guess it protects you from the auto-downloading spyware (like the one that harmlessly fell onto my desktop last night--I guess Windows users don't even know this stuff is going onto their system). But take my PC experience today. A kid was trying to plug a thumbdrive into my XP-driven machine today and when he accidently yanked out my scanner cable, it crashed the whole system and I had to reboot.

Now Mac's aren't perfect. But that sort of nonsense is so rare.

It is, like the guy said, night and day. Using Macs is as painless most of the time as using your toaster or anything other household appliance. They work without the frustrations that Windows users assume are just part of using a computer.

That's why I'd say to you buy the PB, forget the Dell.

[audiophilia]

20 years on PCs and Windows laptops. Just switched to Mac last month. Oh man, what a difference. Stable, quick and so stylish. Great OS, too..Get a PB.

Lambo compared to a GM. Truly...

[powerule]

My #1 rule in my work with pc or mac is simple. I do music and graphics.

- Our Mac we have in the recording studio has No access to the net.
- My PC at home for digital Graphics and web design has NO access to the net.
I have a 500 dollar desktop for all my web browsing and downloading of music and file sharing.

I have a portable hard drive for file transporting in case i want to add lets say photoshop filters to my work PC from the web pC>



I never had a problem with XP. never.

[JKT]

FWIW, if you are going to get a PC laptop, why get a Dell when they aren't very good quality at all? Sony, IBM or Toshiba laptops are a better buy.

[JKT]

Originally Posted by powerule

<snip>
you are comparing a 2005 notebook (dell ) with 2002 Notebooks ( powerbooks ).
<snip>

Not that I agree with that statement, but what you are definitely getting with a Dell is a circa 1998 OS versus a 2005 OS and ultimately, it is the OS that is the most important thing on any computer.

[Maflynn]

Here's my $.02

I've got extended experience with Dell, Compaq, HP and IBM laptops, I've also been a user of iBooks and PowerBooks for a number of years.

First things first, you need to determine what platform satisfies your needs the most. While OSX is indeed superior and much more stable, does it even run the software you need. For instance, if you need a laptop to run autocad, your out of luck with Macs.

Once you determine the software is available and because OSX is better

Try out the Powerbook at a store and see if you can test drive a dell, i.e., does anyone you know own one.

I found except for the really high end Dells they are heavier and more clunkier feeling. The PB is much easier to handle. The screens are also something you may want to keep in mind. which 15" offers the optimum resolution for your eyes. For some a higher resolution at 15" may mean too small to read.

Finally take a look at the latest consumer polls, Dell has been taking a beating, they've outsourced much of their help desk and it appears to have back fired. They also closed down their forums so there seems to be less ways to get help.

Just my $02 but you first really need to see what platform runs the apps you need first.

Mike

[OSxMeistro101]

If you want to live in a bubble and not connect to the net. Get the DELL.

[powerule]

Sony - Notebooks are overpriced because of the designs, But if your notebook will be a piece of furniture for you, sure kick out 2300.00 they "look" cool.

Toshiba - They still use sdr ram. They use slow ram.

IBM - dont even make a widescreen model. (until not i think one is coming out ) I cant imagine a notebook today with a screen shaped like a perfect square....YUCK!!

Dell - for the money you get the best deal, dont listen to anyone telling you different. must of these readers loe the way the PB' s "look" or "feel" or they are sleek and the color etc etc....simply COSMETICS!! just read, the first thing you hear is a praise consisting of something cosmetic....

The Dell Inspiron I6000 is not bulky, it weight like 6.6 lb and has a 15.4 widscreen display and the screen is much better and brighter than on any powerbook, unlike the PB on the dell you dont have to sit right in font of it to see the screen, the new notebooks have better viewing angles.


ps.

You can be on the net with dell just like anything else man....People tent to belive the myth that dell, sony, toshiba etc make computers, well they DONT they just put them together and all the components come from the same companies LG, Samsung, Intel, ATI , AMD etc.
So basically the only thing made by dell is the barebone notebook case.

[OSxMeistro101]

Well, they ALL use Windows which is not safe for the net. Too many security holes.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by tcofflax

I'm buying a new laptop soon and have been looking at the Powerbooks and the Dell Inspiron notebooks. I was wondering what the main advantages to buying a Powerbook over a Dell would be? Any help is appreciated.

Dell (or any PC for that matter): More evolved hardware. A top of the line Dell will run circles around a top of the line PowerBook (that's why Apple is moving to Intel processors)

Apple: More evolved OS. Apple's OS is much easier to use and more secure (though, that's only because <5% market share makes the MacOS an unenticing target for hackers) than the Windows OS; unfortunately it is crippled by the substandard (though nicely presented) hardware used by Apple.

You need to decide what you want: performance with some effort required to make it secure or ease of use/style/security

[madmanXwater]

Opinions, opinions...... I love threads like this!

My opinion, after using both platforms for many years:

Both are very capable, both can be very productive, safe and fun. I have a 17" PowerBook 1.33 and a HP zd8225 3.2Ghz P4. I use the HP 99% of the time simply because it is 200-400% faster than the PowerBook, in all my tests. Audio, video & graphics are what I do (as well as Web and Office tasks) and the PowerBook just can't keep up. XP can be very usable and safe. I run ZoneAlarm (free Firewall), McAfee Virus, Ad-Aware & Spybot and have never had a problem with XP. I like OS X and will seriously look at the PowerBooks when they are running Intel chips and can again compete with the performance/value of PC laptops.

If you don't plan on doing any heavy CPU based work, then the PowerBook will be fine. It runs Office and Web software just fine. It also is very important which applications you want to run. Are they available for the platform you choose? I have to keep the PowerBook around so I can run FinalCut Pro when I need to on the road.

Hope this helps,

Mike
Canada

[urrl78]

Don't know what I'd do without my Sony T250 3 lb laptop with 10.6" screen, because it is my internet choice with the Verizon Broadband/National Access card. I NEVER leave home without it and can jump on the net wherever I am in the Miami Ft Lauderdale area. No way I'm lugging around a 15"/17" Powerbook to do that. To me this is the ultimate mobility internet solution hands down, especially since prices have dropped from an outrageous $80 to a more reasonable $59 per month.

The 17" Powerbook stays home for the heavy video editing stuff, and making my own professional sounding music with Garageband is PRICELESS. My Wedding video clients are always wowed by the Powerbooks huge widescreen. So unlike some I'm having loads of fun in both worlds. It boils down to what you need to do.

Sure I've had a virus or two within a year but AVG free antivirus software detected and dispensed with them in a flash. STOPZILLA handles the spyware and pop-ups very effectively. Both are set to automatically update over the net so no worries.

[powerule]

Yeah paying a new price for a PB that is 3 years old really is a bit backwards. Just hold on for the Intel Books, i mean the IBM PowerPC chip has reached its peak in inovation as far as notebooks go, think about that...why invest in something like that, let alone paying brand new money for it...thats why mac had to suck it up bite the leather strap and ask intel to save them from the PB fading into obscurity.

[Altair]

Originally Posted by powerule

Virus/ Worms - Use firefox and problem solved.
Mac OSX - you like the look of osx? use Y's Dock it turns your XP to emulate OSX.

Firefox only fixes some of the problems with windows. Not all viruses and worms attack Internet Explorer. Many attack ports that are open on the default install of windows. Granted with XP SP2 most of this is fixed.

The problem with YDock is that none of the applications were written to support using a dock. This matters since a lot of mac applications use the dock to display useful information such as how many unread emails are in your inbox or who just sent you an instant message.

To the original poster:
Here are some real differences between the two computers:
Sleep mode: OSX's sleep mode is far superior to windows which makes a *huge* difference on a laptop. In OSX waking up from sleep is almost instantaneous.
Keyboard: The powerbook's keyboard is going to be much better to type on than the dell's
Monitor: The Dell's monitor will probably be better if it has X-brite or whatever dell calls it, otherwise the powerbook's is better.
OS: OSX is far nicer and much less annoying than windows. It also has a lot of little nicities that windows doesn't have that just make it that much better.

Be sure to check the weight of the laptop. Some laptops weight upwards of 8-10 pounds which is next to impossible to carry with you all the time. All this being said, the 600m is a nice machine but I would still choose a powerbook over it.

[Helmling]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak

Dell (or any PC for that matter): More evolved hardware. A top of the line Dell will run circles around a top of the line PowerBook (that's why Apple is moving to Intel processors)

Apple: More evolved OS. Apple's OS is much easier to use and more secure (though, that's only because <5% market share makes the MacOS an unenticing target for hackers) than the Windows OS; unfortunately it is crippled by the substandard (though nicely presented) hardware used by Apple.

You need to decide what you want: performance with some effort required to make it secure or ease of use/style/security

I disagree. There's a difference between being "more evolved" and being faster. I'm upset about the Intel switch because one of the reasons I switched was the chip architecture. A few years ago, when I came into the Apple fold after years and years in the blackness of PC-usership, I read an exhaustive technical analysis comparing the (then) G4 to whatever x86 chip was top of the line at the time.

Those intel chips may be fast, but they're still garbage in my book. I hope my G4 Mac runs for years and years because I know the elegance on the exterior is mirrored within, with a chip that is well-designed (i.e. less prone to data log jams and errors) and not just fast.

Also, I'm in the middle of picking a laptop for my lab at work. My school district, though, has gone all-PC. So I have to buy a PC. Now I wanted this thing for portable video editing. So I need firewire, hard-drive space, good video performance and a DVD-burner. With bids from Dell, HP, and Gateway I could NOT get all those things. I'd be happy with an iBook over the piece of junk I'm going to have to order and then equip with external equipment.

So yeah, let your PC laptops "run circles" around a PowerBook as it sits in resplendence. That's all you'll be doing with those pieces of junk...running around in circles.

[powerule]

Helmling dont be mad about the Intel crossover, be mad at the fact that the IBM PowerPC chip has reached its peak in inovation as far as notebooks go, and be mad that your apple engineers are having a hard time to create the new intel book that they are hiring sony engineers for the task. think and be mad about that.[/B]


It is funny to us PC users that after years and years of bragging and knocking down the intel chip and dissing it, that apple now MUST go with intel due to the diffiencies of the powerPC chip, Like i said, POWERPC REACHED ITS PEAK!!!! cant go on any further....

[madmanXwater]

Helmling, what are you talking about? I like the Mac very much as well, but its comments like yours that make us look like idiots. "data log jams and errors"? I have worked for one of the largest agencies in the world for the last twelve years and we use both Mac and PC. None of ours PCs have ever suffered from what you describe! They just work and that's what counts, real-world use and performance. As far as not being able to find a PC laptop you can use for portable "video editing with firewire, hard-drive space, good video performance and a DVD-burner", you're joking right? That's exactly what I do all day on my HP zd8225ca. That's a PC laptop as far as I can tell :-) It has a 3.2Ghz P4 with Hyper Threading, 800Mhz system bus, 1Gig Ram, ATI X600 128 graphics, 100Gb HD, firewire, 4x USB 2.0, DL DVD burner with LightScribe, 17" 1440x900 display, WiFi, Bluetooth and a 6 in 1 card reader. All for $2199.00 Canadian, that's half the price of my 17" PowerBook and it runs my video and audio editing software 200-400% faster!!

Calling PC laptops a "piece of junk" does nothing but show your ignorance to people that use both platforms and speaks poorly for the Mac community as a whole. The mind is like a parachute, it works much better when it is open.

Mike
Canada
(Editing audio and video on a "piece of junk" in the real world)

[madmanXwater]

P.S. Sorry, forgot to mention that my HP zd8225ca also came with a dual channel TV Tuner with DVR and FM tuner. It's nice to be able to view TV and record another channel at the same time!

[Jakeypooh]

It really depends on what your using it for.... I use my mac to play WoW and record my music... and with the powerbook I do both flawlessly.

I actually bought a 2900 dollar dell and 4 months after the purchase I ended up having to format because of a filesharing program and some other "virus" that cause constant crashes.

It was really annoying, and I understand that it was my fault but with my mac I have done far more than I've ever done on my PC. And if you have airport extreme then you know the true Magic a PB can bring.

[saint_theodora]

I have had really, really bad luck with dell hardware. I bought a top of the line desktop replacement about three years ago, and when I got it, it worked really well, but it was huge and the casing felt kind of crappy. 6 months later, my motherboard and a bunch of other bits were fried when a midafternoon thunderstorm fried my highschool. (TERRIBLE hardware losses. Everyone uses laptops, only the people not plugged in were spared.) This was before Dell outsourced their Help. Everything was replaced within about a week. Another six months, the HD failed. I spent SO long on the phone with some south asian woman that did not understand that i KNEW i had a messed up hard drive, and I needed her to send a box so I could send the damn thing in. I finally got through to her. When I got it back two weeks after sending it in, the case felt like it hadn't been snapped together properly, and the screen was so lose that i had to prop the damn thing up. Then my screen fried. Then I had another bad harddrive. For the last, I spent 5 hours on hold 5 separate times. The last time I was on hold, I was on Apple's online store ordering my Powerbook.

The moral of the story: Dude, don't get a Dell.

[giggs11]

*shrug*

I've had nothing but good experiences with Dell. Got two desktops and a laptop through them.

This is essentially another Mac vs. PC debate, with extremists on both sides yelling at each other and crowding out the level-headed moderates in the middle.

The only way to really decide for yourself whether you should get the Dell or the Mac is to try them both out. It's more complicated than just asking random folks on the internet, but you'll get a better answer that way as well. Like people have said, find out about the software you need to use, and see which OS can run it. If both can run it, consider the quality of the OS, reliability, and price. Good luck.

[Squelch11]

I'm a major lurker, but I would like to add something to this discussion.

I am an IT guy in the US Army, and I use Windows PCs for work. They're mostly Dells, with some HP's, and a few Gateways. I have a Dell desktop, (I don't even know what kind) and a Dell Latitude D810 that I use at work. They're both alright, but nothing to write home about. At home I have 8 computers. I have four home-built desktops in my office, (a server, a Linux box, a "work" computer, and a gaming computer) a home-built computer in my entertainment center, (media hub/internet radio/games on the 42" plasma) my wife has a Toshiba laptop, and I have two Powerbooks, (older 12" and new 17"). Of all of these computers, I easily spend the most time on my Powerbooks. I converted about two years ago, and I haven't been satisfied with a Windows machine since, except for the factor of being able to build and upgrade my own hardware. 90% of the software that I use for work I can get for the Macs.

However, when people ask me what kind of computer they should get, most folks I end up telling to get a Dell. Here are the reasons, (as well as the reason my wife has a Toshiba laptop):

1) A lot of the people I work with, when they want a new computer, they just want it to play games on, surf the internet, and send email. They already own a lot of PC games, so it'd be tough on their wallet to lay out $2500 for a PB good enough to play new games with, and then another $200 just to get the Mac version of all the games they have, (and half of the newer games aren't out for OS X yet.)

2) Most people don't want to learn a new OS. Yes, I know from experience that OS X is far more intuitive than Windows, and that it's much easier as far as installing/uninstalling applications, setting things up, and yes, "it just works". But it's DIFFERENT, therefore it's SCARY for most folks.

3) There are a lot of people out there who know something about Windows. I've been home less than half of the last three years. So I am not there to help with computer problems. But if it's a Windows machine, I know of at least two or three people that live near my wife or my family who can help with little things, like reinstalling Windows, installing new hardware, etc. I don't know anyone within a few hours of my wife or my family who can help with OS X. So any little thing that happens is going to be a major issue, because there's no readily available help at any level.

So, basically, ask yourself how computer savvy you are. If you think you're computer savvy, then go for the Powerbook. I love my PB's, and I will never buy myself a PC laptop again. Also, ask yourself what you want to do with it. If you want to play games, and you already have a bunch of games, (especially games that have come out in the last year or so) then you might not want to spend the money to get the OS X versions of all those games, (if they even have an OS X version of them). Finally, ask yourself if you're SCARED of something DIFFERENT. If so, go with the Dell. It's the same thing you've been dealing with for years. If not, go with the Powerbook. You'll never look back...

[JKT]

Just to add a little counterpoint to that last post - you are assuming that by getting a Mac, they will be getting rid of their PC. If they keep their PC (and with a potentially daunting switch like that, it would be a very sensible thing to do), then the whole games/software issue is a non-issue - they can still play there PC games and run their software just as before or get newer games for their PC or, if they preferred, newer games for their Mac. Has anyone who has made the leap from PCs to Macs really just ditched their PC straight away? I doubt it, unless they really were very computer savvy.

Btw, for the OP - it is worth knowing that the PowerBooks haven't been updated for 242 days at this point (!!) - in other words, there is likely to be a speed bump plus bonus goodies added (bigger or faster hard drives, etc) to the line in the not so distant future. I wouldn't hold my breath for an Intel PB as this really is not going to happen until mid 2006 at the earliest, but there is potential for different G4 chips to be added which may give a reasonable or significant speed boost.

However, it is also possible that Apple won't ever update the PBs again until the Intel versions are ready... I don't think that is very likely, but it is possible.

[Maflynn]

Originally Posted by giggs11

This is essentially another Mac vs. PC debate, with extremists on both sides yelling at each other and crowding out the level-headed moderates in the middle.

I agree, unlike zealot budster/OSxMeistro, Windows is productive and useful to many people. Yes it has more security issues, viruses and spyware. Yes, its less intuitive and I think OSX is so much superior and typically the hardware is superior. But you know what many people get connected to the net no problem at all and do there work, its kind of foolish for budster/OSxMeistro to say otherwise and unfortunitly the volume of software available is tipped heavily to the windows side.

With OSX being safer intuitive, eaier to work with, no issues with the registry, no need to blow away the OS and start over from time to time (I still have to do that with my windows machines) I think that as long as the software that you need is available, the Powerbook is the way to go.

Because of IBM's inability to produce a low voltage/cool G5 the Powerbooks have languished and that's too bad. Its been Apples bread and butter for many years.

Personally I'm not happy of the cross over, but it gives apple a quicker turn around with new products then maybe it will be a good thing.

As I previously posted Dell's seem ok by me, but their consumer sentiment/feedback has taken some major hits lately. If it were my money and I was buying a peecee (shudders) Then I'd opt for a Dell over some of the other models.

Mike

[JKT]

Originally Posted by madmanXwater

Helmling, what are you talking about? I like the Mac very much as well, but its comments like yours that make us look like idiots. "data log jams and errors"? I have worked for one of the largest agencies in the world for the last twelve years and we use both Mac and PC. None of ours PCs have ever suffered from what you describe!<snip>

Actually, every single PC you have ever used has suffered the problems mentioned, including Macs - the data log jams and errors that Helmling is talking about are those that occur at the processor level, not the OS level. Putting it in an overly simplistic way - Intel's chips and the x86 line went the route of brute force over efficiency, the consequence of which was that any errors made by the CPU were overcome by ramping up their clock cycles so that re-fetching the problem data didn't have a significant impact on the overall performance. Conversely, the PPC architecture went for greater efficiency over brute force so that less errors were made by the CPU thus leading to better performance at lower clock speeds (relative to x86). This is why an e.g. 1GHz PPC can hold its own against an e.g. 2GHz x86. In terms of CPU design, the PPC is generally considered to be a much more elegant one than that of the x86. The reality though is that it doesn't make a great deal of difference in the real world and, in effect Intel's decision turned out to be the better of the two as the brute force method won the day in the end (in terms of PCs/Macs).

[OogaBooga]

Aha! Who's the idiot now!?

[ibook_steve]

Sniff sniff sniff.

Is it just me or do I smell troll? Notice the original poster hasn't replied back at all. This smiley seems appropriate:



Steve

[madmanXwater]

JKT, thanks for the info, but I knew all that already. I was trying to say that these kinds of things mean almost nothing to the end user. What counts is how fast/well there software runs, as you have stated. I've read that the internal combustion engine only works at 35% efficiency, that doesn't mean I should ride a bike instead. It doesn't make sense to me for someone to recommend buying a 1.67Ghz G4 over a 3.2Ghz P4 because the G4 CPU is more "elegant" under the hood! I’ll think of how “elegant” the G4 is in my Powerbook next time I try to play an H.264 HD video from Apple’s own web site (http://www.apple.com/quicktime/guide/hd/) and it can’t keep up, while my HP zd8225 only hits 50% CPU and cost half as much. I must sound like a broken record (or iPod) sorry.

I agree and think these Mac vs PC threads don't add much, and I usually don't enter into the discussion. But I don't like to see someone go of the deep end and call either platform "a piece of junk". I would like to see people keep an open mind and give only accurate information to people that ask for it.

I love the Mac and OSX, but this is the Powerbook forum and I’m only trying to point out the truth about the performance/value situation as it currently stands. I’ll be one of the first to order a new Powerbook when this is no longer a problem.

Mike

[madmanXwater]

Also, I kinda wish I could go out and buy OSX for Intel to run on my HP laptop as well as XP! (not that I'm bashing XP, I'd like to run both on one laptop!)

Mike

[kitcho]

Originally Posted by tcofflax

I'm buying a new laptop soon and have been looking at the Powerbooks and the Dell Inspiron notebooks. I was wondering what the main advantages to buying a Powerbook over a Dell would be? Any help is appreciated.

because a powerbook cannot be compared to a lowly dell is why you should buy one

[albook]

Originally Posted by tcofflax

I'm buying a new laptop soon and have been looking at the Powerbooks and the Dell Inspiron notebooks. I was wondering what the main advantages to buying a Powerbook over a Dell would be? Any help is appreciated.

Simple answer:
The PowerBook supports Mac OS X, the Dell dont.

[OperaMan]

This message is being typed from a 333 mhz Powerbook G3 that's probably 5-6 years old. This thing is running Tiger perfectly, althought a bit slow because I only have 256 MBs of ram in it. Today I installed a 802.11g pcmcia card that's working perfectly. Considering that this computer was built for Mac OS 9-something and it's running Apple's latest and greatest OS offering, I think that an Apple laptop is much more of an investment than any Dell. Also, I could go on eBay right now and sell this laptop for over 100 dollars. If you were to do the same with any old PC laptop, you wouldn't be able to get much more than the combined value of the ram and harddrive, probably to put into an old 400 mhz iBook that's looking for a little boost.

[JKT]

Originally Posted by madmanXwater

Also, I kinda wish I could go out and buy OSX for Intel to run on my HP laptop as well as XP! (not that I'm bashing XP, I'd like to run both on one laptop!)

Mike

Well, when the Intel Macs come out, your wish may be granted when you can then get a Mac (as it may well be able to run Windows or windows apps too). ;-)

Wrt to the PPC v. Intel thing - maybe it would have been a greatly different story if IBM had produced low power G5s for the PowerBook by now... unfortunately, they didn't. Wrt to value - I'd say myself that buying a PB right now is not good value - they haven't been updated for two-thirds of a year! However, the next revision which is more than likely due to occur in the next month or so will hopefully use the updated G4's from Freescale and these should offer a significant speed boost to the line (IIRC, they don't suffer the limited FSB that the current G4s do which is one of the biggest bottlenecks to the performance of the current mobo's in the current PBs). Faster FSB, faster RAM, faster clock speeds and presumably better graphics cards should go some way to levelling the playing field again.

[olePigeon]

At my work we ordered close to 150 Dell laptops for the district. 8 of the Dell laptops were DOA. Granted, 2 were probably broken during shipping because the corner of the box was bashed in.

We're returning about 6 more now that have died for one reason or another. Most of them from dead wireless chips, or whatever they have in them. One had a backlight burn out.

I can't say how that compares to other companies, that's the first time I've really run into buying over 100 computers at once. But 14 dead computers out of a 150. That seems like a lot to me. That's almost 1 dead computer for every 10.

With the 30 iBooks we purchased, 0 had problems. Though to my surprise, one of them had a nicer keyboard. So somehow 1 in 30 iBooks got a free upgrade.

[itguy05]

Dell - for the money you get the best deal, dont listen to anyone telling you different. must of these readers loe the way the PB' s "look" or "feel" or they are sleek and the color etc etc....simply COSMETICS!! just read, the first thing you hear is a praise consisting of something cosmetic....

You've got to be kidding. Dell is one of the worst vendors, especially laptops. Look at PC Mag's annual survey. Dell was way behind Apple. Apple took top spot in the Desktop and Laptop category. They even mentioned how poor Dell's laptops are WRT quality than the competition.

Even the performance of a Dell is usually in the bottom-middle or bottom of the pack. That's a fact.

They are junk. We went from IBM to Dell (and now to HP) where I work. The D600 and 800's are GARBAGE compared to the Thinkpads. And they cost about the same. The Dells keyboard feels like it will break just by using it where the IBM's is solid as a rock (or my PB's).

You can pick up a Dell by a corner and watch the case flex and warp and creek. Not so with the Thinkpad or PB. Just a solid machine.

Dell makes junk, plain and simple. They cut corners any way they can to save a buck. They have to - that's the only reason to pick DELL - CHEAP. NOT QUALITY. You buy a Dell because it's disposable. You buy an IBM, Apple, etc. because it's reliable.

The 1.67Ghz Powerbook I own is quite speedy and about as fast (if not faster than) the IBM A31p 2.0Ghz P4 I'm typing this message on.